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Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,982
Not too long ago, we came to the conclusion that Mortal Kombat's Jackson Briggs is one of the most handsome Black men in gaming. But is he the most prolific?

Note: I did not say "most famous" or "your favorite." I said most prolific, excluding real-life people who are regulars in wrestling games, MMA sims, and the like. Or those who come from non-video game properties. One of those anime franchises has to have at least one Black regular appearing in their mountain of video game adaptations (I'm thinking Naruto's Killer B. Is he Black?). I can't think of anyone else who beats Jax in terms of playable appearances in fighting games. For a refresher:
  1. Mortal Kombat II (1993)
  2. Mortal Kombat 3 (1995)
  3. Mortal Kombat 4 (1997)
  4. Mortal Kombat: Deadly Alliance (2002)
  5. Mortal Kombat: Unchained (2006 PSP port of Deception, released narrowly after Armageddon actually)
  6. Mortal Kombat: Armageddon (2006)
  7. Mortal Kombat vs. DC Universe (2008)
  8. Mortal Kombat 9 (2011)
  9. Mortal Kombat X (2015)
  10. Mortal Kombat 11 (2019)
His closest competitors (as far as I know) are Street Fighter's Balrog ("Boxer") and Tekken's Eddy Gordo, both coming within spitting distance for playable roles in fighting games.

Balrog:
  1. Street Fighter II: Champion Edition (1992)
  2. Street Fighter: The Movie (1995) - The arcade and console versions are significantly different despite sharing a roster, so I could consider splitting them
  3. Street Fighter Alpha 3 (1998)
  4. Capcom vs. SNK: Millennium Fight 2000 (2000)
  5. Capcom vs. SNK 2: Mark of the Millennium 2001 (2001)
  6. SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos (2003)
  7. Street Fighter IV (2008)
  8. Street Fighter X Tekken (2012)
  9. Street Fighter V (2016)
Eddy:
  1. Tekken 3 (1996/97)
  2. Tekken Tag Tournament (1999)
  3. Tekken 4 (2001)
  4. Tekken 5 (2004)
  5. Tekken 6 (2007)
  6. Tekken Tag Tournament 2 (2011)
  7. Tekken 7: Fated Retribution (2017, console release)
Upon further research, I think The King of Fighters' Seth may also be a contender for runner-up:
  1. The King of Fighters 2000 (2000)
  2. The King of Fighters 2001 (2001)
  3. The King of Fighters 2002 (2002)
  4. The King of Fighters 2003 (2003)
  5. The King of Fighters Neowave (2005, PS2 port)
  6. KOF: Maximum Impact (2004)
  7. KOF: Maximum Impact 2 (2006)
Impressive showings from the others, though Jax and Eddy are the only ones to keep a perfect streak of attendance in mainline titles from their debuts onward. You'll obviously note that I'm counting one revision per game, just to avoid having to list things like KOF2002UM or Mortal Kombat Gold. Raw quantity of standalone appearances does not necessarily equate to ubiquity. Balrog showing up in just the zillion revisions of Street Fighter II would still mean a lot. But outside of that, he's seemingly not "required." Capcom certainly didn't think so in the 90s. Jax somehow stuck it out despite more lore-important fighters like Kung Lao missing games. I suppose his high number itself speaks to Mortal Kombat's ubiquity in its own corner of the fighting game universe. Midway and later NRS were generally good at pumping games out, so Mr. Briggs had an easier time racking up an impressive resume. Of course, I could say the same for other prolific developers that couldn't or wouldn't use their Black characters frequently (I don't have Lucky Glauber on this list after all).

So, who beats Jax's ten games?
 
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nsilvias

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,128
You missed mk special forces. His own game lol I know it's not a fg game but still
 

ParmeSean

Member
May 14, 2018
856
Hasnt Tekken outsold MK? I feel like Eddie would be most played considering hes the most button mash friendly
 
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Scrappy-Fan92

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,982
You missed mk special forces. His own game lol I know it's not a fg game but still
Didn't feel like diving into the weeds of other genres. There are probably a million gacha games that would inflate the counts for some characters.

Hasnt Tekken outsold MK? I feel like Eddie would be most played considering hes the most button mash friendly
As of 2021, Mortal Kombat is the best-selling fighting game franchise in the industry. The thread is to determine -- if such a thing is even possible -- who is the most frequently playable, not most frequently selected by consumers.
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,134
Never thought about it, but I guess it's possible. Mortal Kombat is fairly old as far as fighting games go and never had a major hiatus as far as I know, so it's got more surface area for a character to reappear than most fighting games. I don't think most 3D fighting game series have had enough releases even if they have a Black character in their cast consistently.

The only issue would be if Jax isn't a mainstay in Mortal Kombat, but looking at the list in the OP, I guess he is?
 

Zero-ELEC

"This guy are sick" says The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,590
MĂ©xico
Balrog:
  1. Street Fighter II: Champion Edition (1992)
  2. Street Fighter Alpha 3 (1998)
  3. Capcom vs. SNK: Millennium Fight 2000 (2000)
  4. Capcom vs. SNK 2: Mark of the Millennium 2001 (2001)
  5. SNK vs. Capcom: SVC Chaos (2003)
  6. Street Fighter IV (2008)
  7. Street Fighter X Tekken (2012)
  8. Street Fighter V (2016)
You're missing a couple of Street Fighter games where he's playable, namely:
  1. Street Fighter II': Hyper Fighting
  2. Super Street Fighter II: The New Challengers
  3. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: The Ultimate Championship
  4. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: Revival
  5. Hyper Street Fighter II: The Anniversary Edition
  6. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: HD Remix
  7. Ultra Street Fighter II: The Final Challengers
  8. Street Fighter Zero 3 Upper
  9. Street Fighter Alpha 3 Max
  10. Street Fighter IV (arcade version, since presumably you're counting the home version)
  11. Super Street Fighter IV
  12. Super Street Fighter IV: 3D Edition
  13. Street Fighter IV Volt: Battle Protocol
  14. Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition
  15. Street Fighter IV: Champion Edition
  16. Ultra Street Fighter IV
 

Seraphis Cain

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,460
You're missing a couple of Street Fighter games where he's playable, namely:
  1. Street Fighter II': Hyper Fighting
  2. Super Street Fighter II: The New Challengers
  3. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: The Ultimate Championship
  4. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: Revival
  5. Hyper Street Fighter II: The Anniversary Edition
  6. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: HD Remix
  7. Ultra Street Fighter II: The Final Challengers
  8. Street Fighter Zero 3 Upper
  9. Street Fighter Alpha 3 Max
  10. Street Fighter IV (home version)
  11. Super Street Fighter IV
  12. Super Street Fighter IV: 3D Edition
  13. Street Fighter IV Volt: Battle Protocol
  14. Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition
  15. Street Fighter IV: Champion Edition
  16. Ultra Street Fighter IV

It's right there in the OP:

You'll obviously note that I'm counting one revision per game, just to avoid having to list things like KOF2002UM or Mortal Kombat Gold. Raw quantity of standalone appearances does not necessarily equate to ubiquity.

Otherwise there would also be numerous other games OP could have listed for Jax, too. Like MK Advance, MK Gold, UMK3, MK Trilogy, etc.
 

Zero-ELEC

"This guy are sick" says The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,590
MĂ©xico
Otherwise there would also be numerous other games OP could have listed for Jax, too. Like MK Advance, MK Gold, UMK3, MK Trilogy, etc.
And they should also be counted! (I missed that bit of the OP)

But also, a couple games in my post aren't revisions of other games, rather completely new games with the same name. (Street Fighter IV Volt and Champion Edition are original Street Fighter games with CG sprites for the iOS that are only vaguely based on SFIV)
 

Vagabond

Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,376
United States
You're missing a couple of Street Fighter games where he's playable, namely:
  1. Street Fighter II': Hyper Fighting
  2. Super Street Fighter II: The New Challengers
  3. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: The Ultimate Championship
  4. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: Revival
  5. Hyper Street Fighter II: The Anniversary Edition
  6. Super Street Fighter II Turbo: HD Remix
  7. Ultra Street Fighter II: The Final Challengers
  8. Street Fighter Zero 3 Upper
  9. Street Fighter Alpha 3 Max
  10. Street Fighter IV (home version)
  11. Super Street Fighter IV
  12. Super Street Fighter IV: 3D Edition
  13. Street Fighter IV Volt: Battle Protocol
  14. Super Street Fighter IV: Arcade Edition
  15. Street Fighter IV: Champion Edition
  16. Ultra Street Fighter IV
But if we got to list all the content added versions, then we would probably have to list the 50-11 versions of MK3/UMK3/Trilogy or even the dreaded mobile versions of the later games.
 
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Scrappy-Fan92

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,982
Yes, I was clear on not double-dipping on revisions for anyone. You could make an argument for Tekken's Tag games being revisions themselves, but I'd imagine most consider them distinct enough from Tekken 3 and 6.

Never thought about it, but I guess it's possible. Mortal Kombat is fairly old as far as fighting games go and never had a major hiatus as far as I know, so it's got more surface area for a character to reappear than most fighting games. I don't think most 3D fighting game series have had enough releases even if they have a Black character in their cast consistently.

The only issue would be if Jax isn't a mainstay in Mortal Kombat, but looking at the list in the OP, I guess he is?
This is true. The most prolific of the 3D fighter originals I can think of are Virtua Fighter's Jeffry McWild (seven playable appearances) and Dead or Alive's Zack (six playable appearances).

And here are the Mortal Kombat kharacters who've been playable in more mainline entries than Jax.
  1. Raiden
  2. Scorpion
  3. Sub-Zero (if Bi-Han and Kuai Liang are counted as one entity)
That's it. That's the whole list.

And they should also be counted! (I missed that bit of the OP)

But also, a couple games in my post aren't revisions of other games, rather completely new games with the same name. (Street Fighter IV Volt and Champion Edition are original Street Fighter games with CG sprites for the iOS that are only vaguely based on SFIV)
I'll consider the phone games, but I'll need to look into them more.
 
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JusDoIt

â–˛ Legend â–˛
Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,273
South Central Los Angeles
Yes, I was clear on not double-dipping on revisions for anyone. You could make an argument for Tekken's Tag games, but I'd imagine most consider them distinct enough from Tekken 3 and 6.

This is weird. Nobody would count the Tekken Tag games the same as Tekken 3 and 6.

Ultimate MK3 is not the same game as MK3 or MK Trilogy.

SFII Champion Edition is not the same game as Hyper SFII, HD Remix, or Ultra SFII.

You clearly have a desired outcome here tho, so I'ma let you rock.
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,134
This makes me realize that 3D games might have been better at treating Black fighters as mainstays than 2D ones. I wonder exactly why that is. Obviously 3D games came later, but could it be due to western branches of the Japanese companies that made most long-running fighting games series having a stronger voice at the time of the series' establishments, for example?

Like, I don't immediately think that Zack was included to be progressive, but he's there. DOA never drops him.
 
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Oct 25, 2017
11,519
This is so sad.

Edginess and torture porn making bank. What little "humor" there was with fatalities, disappeared when the games became photorealistic.

They're still pretty funny to me. Robocop is photorealistic too and it's way more violent than any MK, but it's also really funny.
And not only are the fatalities still funny, they also have things like friendships still in the game, as seen above.
 

Thorn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
24,446
He's been so fun to play in X and 11. Something very satisfying about how his punches go TING TING.
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,787
This is so sad.

Edginess and torture porn making bank. What little "humor" there was with fatalities, disappeared when the games became photorealistic.

But on topic, good for representation… uh I guess ?
They also have a gay character if I remember well.

You're really underselling MK if you think that all there is to Mortal Kombat.
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,134

CaptainKashup

Banned
May 10, 2018
8,313
Edginess and torture porn making bank. What little "humor" there was with fatalities, disappeared when the games became photorealistic.

Eh.
MK is campy and everything is made in good fun. Torture Porn is violence meant to be purposefully disgust and shock viewers. The Human Centipede Trilogy is torture porn. MK is wacky odd-ball gore
 
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Scrappy-Fan92

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,982
Don't have time to reply to everything right now because it's super-late, but I will say that MK, while definitely possessing more than just shock value, could maybe do well to tone it down. For the developers' sake if not the audience's, given what we've heard about NetherRealm Studios.
 
Jan 11, 2018
9,910
I feel like MK is at a point where it can easily stand on its own technical merit as a fighting game and does not need the ultraviolence as a gimmick. I love the series, but I wouldn't be upset if they dropped the fatalities and just stuck to very violent fights. A lot of others probably would though.
 

lucebuce

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,906
Pakistan
Don't have time to reply to everything right now because it's super-late, but I will say that MK, while definitely possessing more than just shock value, could maybe do well to tone it down. For the developers' sake if not the audience's, given what we've heard about NetherRealm Studios.
I feel like MK is at a point where it can easily stand on its own technical merit as a fighting game and does not need the ultraviolence as a gimmick. I love the series, but I wouldn't be upset if they dropped the fatalities and just stuck to very violent fights. A lot of others probably would though.
1000% agree. I love the series but it really feels at times like its gone towards the "gore for gore's sake" direction rather than campy and funny stuff like "a lady kissing you leads to you exploding".
 

Tyaren

Character Artist
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
25,002
I feel like MK is at a point where it can easily stand on its own technical merit as a fighting game and does not need the ultraviolence as a gimmick. I love the series, but I wouldn't be upset if they dropped the fatalities and just stuck to very violent fights. A lot of others probably would though.

1000% agree. I love the series but it really feels at times like its gone towards the "gore for gore's sake" direction rather than campy and funny stuff like "a lady kissing you leads to you exploding".

This. I'm honestly glad others see it like this as well. I thought I was the only one.

MK11 was the first MK I played, because of it's art design change. I enjoyed it a lot...however the gruesome fatalities lay heavy in my stomach, and I never really got over them, always looking somewhere else at the end of a match. I'm not sure if I'll buy a new one for that reason.
I wouldn't dare to ask them to take fatalities completely away...but can't there be an option in the menu to turn them off or an option to exchange them with MK11's friendship finishers? I feel especially that last option would be funny and make it a sort of meme in the community that everyone could enjoy.

I also would like to mention Zack of Dead or Alive to Scrappy-Fan92, he was in all the DOA games from 1-6, as well as the DOA2 remake, DOA Dimensions, and even in the three DOAX games he was the island owner (Zack Island) and host of the whole thing and got some love shown.
 
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spman2099

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,897
SFII Champion Edition is not the same game as Hyper SFII, HD Remix, or Ultra SFII.
I feel like if you start going down the path of including every version of Street Fighter 2, then you should probably count every major patch update for modern fighting games as a separate entry...
This is so sad.

Edginess and torture porn making bank. What little "humor" there was with fatalities, disappeared when the games became photorealistic.
Mortal Kombat isn't my favorite fighting game series, but it is consistently irreverent and very funny. The games have a lot of fun with their storylines, and they are generally pretty far away from being "edgy".

I honestly don't understand why the fatalities would both anyone, they are all crazy over-the-top and they are oh-so-silly. It is like Loony Tunes, but with viscera. It is too goofy to take seriously (and they aren't aiming for you to take it seriously anyway).
 
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L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
50,134

Magneto

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,449
I feel like MK is at a point where it can easily stand on its own technical merit as a fighting game and does not need the ultraviolence as a gimmick. I love the series, but I wouldn't be upset if they dropped the fatalities and just stuck to very violent fights. A lot of others probably would though.
Like you said, a lot of people wouldn't be happy about that. I don't want to see Mortal Kombat lose what makes it Mortal Kombat (Same thing for the block button). There's enough choice for everyone.
 

Weiss

User requested ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
64,265
It's not even that the gore is boring (goring, if you will) it's that it's totally incongruous with the story.

MKX is a teenage coming of age story where Johnny Cage verbally insists that he loves and is proud of his daughter. That's not just more my jam than how gross Fatalities have gotten, it's in defiance of what MK seems to want to be lately.
 

TheBaldwin

Member
Feb 25, 2018
8,317
Yeah I'd jax as a mainstay character probably is. It definitely is tied between eddy gordo and balrog though

I actually feel eddy might be more well known though purely from a meme factor. Even people I know who don't play fighting games know him as the 'button mashing' guy.
 

MerluzaSamus

Member
Dec 3, 2018
1,131
I feel like if you start going down the path of including every version of Street Fighter 2, then you should probably count every major patch update for modern fighting games as a separate entry...

Mortal Kombat isn't my favorite fighting game series, but it is consistently irreverent and very funny. The games have a lot of fun with their storylines, and they are generally pretty far away from being "edgy".

I honestly don't understand why the fatalities would both anyone, they are all crazy over-the-top and they are oh-so-silly. It is like Loony Tunes, but with viscera. It is too goofy to take seriously (and they aren't aiming for you to take it seriously anyway).
Said it before, and I'll say it again, MK story modes are getting more and more closer to a violent super sentai or a Sam Reimi movie than the grimdark gorefest reputation it gets, it has always be the case, since MK devs usually like to add silly stuf and hadn't stopped since the 90s.

MK Aftermath story is just a 3 hr competition of who is going to betray who first, and then get betrayed, with everyone acting hammy while doing it. Its hard to take it as a serious affair, and they know it.
 

Sephiroth

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Oct 26, 2017
5,154
SHOULD be Lucky but SNK are cowards


latest
 

JusDoIt

â–˛ Legend â–˛
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Oct 25, 2017
35,273
South Central Los Angeles
I feel like if you start going down the path of including every version of Street Fighter 2, then you should probably count every major patch update for modern fighting games as a separate entry...

SFII is a series, like it or not. When SF30th Anniversary Collection came out, it boasted 12 titles. Five of them were SFII games. Two of the four online titles were SFII games. Capcom treated them as no different from the Alpha or SFIII sequels in that regard, because they aren't.

Champion Edition, Hyper Fighting, and Super Turbo all have their own competitive scenes with little overlap. World Warrior and Super SFII don't really have competitive scenes, because they are the weaker games in the series.

WW, CE, HF, Super, and ST being different games was obvious to anybody playing games in the 1990s. It shouldn't even be a point of debate.

Games like Hyper Street Fighter II, HD Remix, and Ultra Street Fighter II are more debatable because they are all rearrangements of Super Turbo specifically, but they are distinct and exist on different platforms as discrete products. They are also different games.

This was the reality of video game distribution before consumers had networked consoles.

SFIV is a series of two games on consoles and in the arcades: SFIV (2009) and Super SFIV. Super SFIV received several title updates, but Arcade Edition and Ultra are just patches for Super.

SFV is only one game. Season 1 through Season 5. Arcade Edition and Champion Edition are patches. One app, one disc. This is how game distribution has evolved.
 
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yogurt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,066
Like you said, a lot of people wouldn't be happy about that. I don't want to see Mortal Kombat lose what makes it Mortal Kombat (Same thing for the block button). There's enough choice for everyone.
I don't think fatalities should be removed altogether, but I do wish it was more 'stylized violence' instead of 'photorealstic gore porn.' I don't really want to see skin get ripped off of a face in a really realistic manner. I preferred MK3 where they exploded into piles of blood with 1,000 rib cages flying everywhere.

The photorealstic violence has kept me away from MK10 and 11 so far even though it was one of my favorite series when I was younger.
 

Magneto

Prophet of Truth
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,449
I don't think fatalities should be removed altogether, but I do wish it was more 'stylized violence' instead of 'photorealstic gore porn.' I don't really want to see skin get ripped off of a face in a really realistic manner. I preferred MK3 where they exploded into piles of blood with 1,000 rib cages flying everywhere.

The photorealstic violence has kept me away from MK10 and 11 so far even though it was one of my favorite series when I was younger.
Oh yeah i can agree with that, 100% ! I'd be okay with them going back to the grotesque gore from MK3. I just disagree with the whole "Let's remove the defining features of a game so we can make it like every other game" thing
 

Busaiku

Teyvat Traveler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,678
Venom has been in...
Guilty Gear X
Guilty Gear XX
Guilty Gear Petit 2
Guilty Gear Isuka
Guilty Gear Dust Strikers
Guilty Gear Judgement
Guilty Gear Xrd
Guilty Gear Strive
 

spman2099

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,897
SFII is a series, like it or not. When SF30th Anniversary Collection came out, it boasted 12 titles. Five of them were SFII games. Two of the four online titles were SFII games. Capcom treated them as no different from the Alpha or SFIII sequels in that regard, because they aren't.

Champion Edition, Hyper Fighting, and Super Turbo all have their own competitive scenes with little overlap. World Warrior and Super SFII don't really have competitive scenes, because they are the weaker games in the series.

WW, CE, HF, Super, and ST being different games was obvious to anybody playing games in the 1990s. It shouldn't even be a point of debate.

Games like Hyper Street Fighter II, HD Remix, and Ultra Street Fighter II are more debatable because they are all rearrangements of Super Turbo specifically, but they are distinct and exist on different platforms as discrete products. They are also different games.

This was the reality of video game distribution before consumers had networked consoles.

SFIV is a series of two games on consoles and in the arcades: SFIV (2009) and Super SFIV. Super SFIV received several title updates, but Arcade Edition and Ultra are just patches for Super.

SFV is only one game. Season 1 through Season 5. Arcade Edition and Champion Edition are patches. One app, one disc. This is how game distribution has evolved.
Yeah, that's fine. I don't view those 12 Street Fighter 2 titles as completely distinct games. And if a person does consider them all separate games in a discussion like this, then I think every substantial patch should count as a distinct game as well. If there are 12 Street Fighter 2 titles, then there are, at a minimum, five Street Fighter V titles (one for each season). Though, maybe even some mid-season patches should count at that point. I think that is a fair thing that deserves consideration, at the very least.

Damn, Balrog has been in, like, one hundred games. What a beast!