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Oscarzx n

Member
May 24, 2018
2,992
Santiago, Chile
The Switch gets a lot of free passes when it comes to discussion regarding its technical limitations. We literally had BotW launch on Wii U and Switch showing us the hardware capabilities and limitations right off the bat. It's no secret the system is comparable to the Wii U in terms of performance and graphic fidelity.
I'd like to see MGSV ported to Switch just to see how it compares to the PS3/360 version personally.
No MGSV but you have plenty of Switch games that were on PS360 and absolutely destroy those old versions, like Alien Isolation, Crysis 1-3, Skyrim, Darksiders 1, Red Faction Guerrilla, Dragons's Dogma, Burnout Paradise and so on. And you have stuff like Dying Light, which was cancelled for PS3 and 360 for technical limitations and just came out fine on the Switch.
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,905
In general, the only time you see a short gen is if someone's getting their ass handed to them. Xbox and Nintendo both packed it in early. Gen 7 lasted a long time because everyone was making money. R&D is expensive.

MS packed it in early.

Nitnendo gave us WII with intentions they took from various projects and wanting to realize dolphins potential. They milked that architecture what you talkin about.

Marketing, branding and packaging are everything if you can do it.
 

disparate

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,176
It's not impressive at all in 2021. We have multiple year old iPhones that have more graphical horsepower than the Switch at this point. Look at the Steam Deck, which runs circles around the Switch. Not to mention technologies like xCloud & Stadia that are increasingly making the need for packing all of that horsepower into a mobile device for gaming obsolete.
Yeah, look at the PC with 2021 hardware blowing out the 2017 $300 tablet.
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
Yeah, look at the PC with 2021 hardware blowing out the 2017 $300 tablet.
... and frankly that's why so many people have been clamoring for an update to this 2017 tablet. It's graphics were outdated when it arrived in 2017. And here we are 4 years later with no upgrade in sight. It's long overdue.
 
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Oscarzx n

Member
May 24, 2018
2,992
Santiago, Chile
It's not impressive at all in 2021. We have multiple year old iPhones that have more graphical horsepower than the Switch at this point. Look at the Steam Deck, which runs circles around the Switch. Not to mention technologies like xCloud & Stadia that are increasingly making the need for packing all of that horsepower into a mobile device for gaming obsolete.
It's a nice option but saying it's making it obsolete it's a bit too much honestly.
 

boxter432

The Fallen
Oct 28, 2017
9,520
The Switch also comes with no internal storage so you'd have to purchase storage, unlike the Deck.

... and frankly that's why so many people have been clamoring for an update to this 2017 tablet. It's graphics were outdated when it arrived in 2017. And here we are 4 years later with no upgrade in sight. It's long overdue.
switch OLED has 64GB storage. base steam Deck at $399 has...64GB storage.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,179
San Jose, Costa Rica
I am very frustrated with Nintendo right now. The N64 emulation on Switch thing finally tipped me over the edge.

But, yeah, they've made it clear they're never going to chase performance or quality. They make very tiny steps forward because they're more focused on gameplay gimmicks innovation. The Wii was barely stronger than the gamecube... but it had motion controls. The Wii U was finally HD but it was a generation behind when it launched because they cared more about the second screen thing. The Switch is basically a Wii U that can actually go fully portable.
Yes, every system IS stronger than the last in some way, but if those gameplay gimmicks are a miss for you, then it won't feel like a good step forward.

I appreciate people love the Switch for the ability to play console level games on the go.
I hate playing games handheld though, I only play it docked, so this means nothing to me.

Are...

Are you me?

I actually hope Metroid Prime does NOT come out on the current Switch, but on the successor. Because...just look at Dread: Amazing art style and design, with jaggies and low res assets everywhere.

Metroid Prime deserves more.
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
Are...

Are you me?

I actually hope Metroid Prime does NOT come out on the current Switch, but on the successor. Because...just look at Dread: Amazing art style and design, with jaggies and low res assets everywhere.

Metroid Prime deserves more.
I'd be fine with Prime coming to the base Switch at 900p/1080p docked and 4k on the Switch Pro or whatever. That'd be awesome, actually.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Fallen Guardian of Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,938
Are...

Are you me?

I actually hope Metroid Prime does NOT come out on the current Switch, but on the successor. Because...just look at Dread: Amazing art style and design, with jaggies and low res assets everywhere.

Metroid Prime deserves more.
The thing is, there's no reason to believe that Nintendo's next system is going to be up to modern standards either. They have not chased that since the Gamecube. I was hopeful for a Switch Pro but at this point I'm just done expecting that from them. The Wii and Switch have been their biggest successes while their actual steps towards modern quality (Gamecube and arguably the Wii U) did nowhere near as well. I don't know what Nintendo's next gimmick will be, but it will have one. Even if they just make a Switch 2 and do the handheld thing again, that will continue to hold back the console aspect of their hardware.

The solutions are to either deal with it or wait for fans to do it themselves with emulators and mods, like they tend to do.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,179
San Jose, Costa Rica
I'd be fine with Prime coming to the base Switch at 900p/1080p docked and 4k on the Switch Pro or whatever. That'd be awesome, actually.

But, do you really think it could reach 900 or 1080p? That's optimistic.

Metroid Prime needs to look GOOD, sub-par resolutions and baseline shadow and texture filterings as well as all of the endemic problems of the Switch hardware...actively play against that.
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,905
The thing is, there's no reason to believe that Nintendo's next system is going to be up to modern standards either. They have not chased that since the Gamecube. I was hopeful for a Switch Pro but at this point I'm just done expecting that from them. The Wii and Switch have been their biggest successes while their actual steps towards modern quality (Gamecube and arguably the Wii U) did nowhere near as well. I don't know what Nintendo's next gimmick will be, but it will have one. Even if they just make a Switch 2 and do the handheld thing again, that will continue to hold back the console aspect of their hardware.

The solutions are to either deal with it or wait for fans to do it themselves with emulators and mods, like they tend to do.

They won't be.

That doesn't mean they won't be forced on to nvidia nodes that are only available to them.

They don't need anything beefy from nvidia for dlss and decent gains from switch. They won't have a choice in another year or two. I doubt they will walk away from a device that is better at power management either. RDNA2 and Ampere are damn good if you don't go over 250watts and it's only getting better.

Never believe nintendo console pro rumors ever. Switch 2 is real they are just being shady, devs confirmed it and they have been dishonest cause souring their hot product is a stupid business move.
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,773
Philadelphia, PA
The one thing that always seems to bother me with these sorts of discussions and it's showcases being disingenuous or intellectual dishonesty.

Is for the folks to disregard for the Switch releasing back in 2017 and had the best possible mobile chipset it could have at the time within technology that was actually available at reasonable price expectations, and yet you have folks that go "It's subpar" as if there was better possible solution AT THAT FORM FACTOR and AT THE TIME.

And then there are folks that try to apply 2021 standards to hardware that wasn't released in 2021, AGAIN ignoring the fact it was the best possible handheld tech available at that form factor IN 2017 with that price / performance balance.

You have folks that say Nintendo is "cheap for the sake of it" and yet if Nintendo actually did release a high powered mobile device that veers closer to the expected necessary associated costs involved then the script is flipped the goalposts will conveniently shift.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
Nintendo loves milking tech generations post N64/PSX era where game development got a lot more expensive.

10 years in the GCN/PS2/Wii type tier.

It'll likely be 10 years in the Wii U/360/Switch range of performance.

Switch's successor which should be like a PS4/XB1 but with DLSS and a few more modern architecture features will be something they're probably content with making games on for another 10 years. Once you get to PS4 tier graphics, honestly you achieve a certain level of visual fidelity that makes just about any genre game look good so long as you have a good art staff.

Switch 2 should be able to create graphics like this, probably fairly easily at that:

ffVII_remake.jpg


For a Mario game, Kirby game, the game's are going to start to look like pre-rendered promo shots Nintendo used to use, even for games like Zelda and Xenoblade there is a pretty massive step up.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,179
San Jose, Costa Rica
The one thing that always seems to bother me with these sorts of discussions and it's showcases being disingenuous or intellectual dishonesty.

Is for the folks to disregard for the Switch releasing back in 2017 and had the best possible mobile chipset it could have at the time within technology that was actually available at reasonable price expectations, and yet you have folks that go "It's subpar" as if there was better possible solution AT THAT FORM FACTOR and AT THE TIME.

And then there are folks that try to apply 2021 standards to hardware that wasn't released in 2021, AGAIN ignoring the fact it was the best possible handheld tech available at that size IN 2017.

You have folks that say Nintendo is "cheap for the sake of it" and yet if Nintendo actually did release a high powered mobile device that veers closer to the expected necessary associated costs involved then the script is flipped the goalposts will conveniently shift.

We can rationalize the business case and the practical aspects all we want, but I always thought it looked like shit.

Back in the day I had hope that Nintendo self output would look better.

I even bought the HD gaming cable to mitigate the jaggies a bit, and it worked OK for Xenoblade 2 and Breath of the Wild but ...just look at Metroid Dread. A 2021 game with amazing art style and design, that manages to have PS3-class IQ .
 
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Danby

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 7, 2020
3,025
I understand the logic that Wii was basically a gamecube, and switch is basically a Wii U.

But are we arguing that the switch's capability could have affordably come out in some form back in 2005? Is that what we're saying?
 

digitalrelic

Weight Loss Champion 2018: Biggest Change
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,124
The one thing that always seems to bother me with these sorts of discussions and it's showcases being disingenuous or intellectual dishonesty.

Is for the folks to disregard for the Switch releasing back in 2017 and had the best possible mobile chipset it could have at the time within technology that was actually available at reasonable price expectations, and yet you have folks that go "It's subpar" as if there was better possible solution AT THAT FORM FACTOR and AT THE TIME.

And then there are folks that try to apply 2021 standards to hardware that wasn't released in 2021, AGAIN ignoring the fact it was the best possible handheld tech available at that form factor IN 2017 with that price / performance balance.

You have folks that say Nintendo is "cheap for the sake of it" and yet if Nintendo actually did release a high powered mobile device that veers closer to the expected necessary associated costs involved then the script is flipped the goalposts will conveniently shift.
I honestly just wish they'd release a full fat, truly capable $400 under-the-tv console that's at least as capable as a PS4 Pro / Xbox One X. But I know that's a pipe dream.
 

Sophistry

Banned
Jun 12, 2021
383
I thought of this yesterday while playing Metroid Dread, thinking about how good it looks but how actually it could probably run just fine on a PS3 or Xbox 360, which is somewhat depressing.
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,905
I honestly just wish they'd release a full fat, truly capable $400 under-the-tv console that's at least as capable as a PS4 Pro / Xbox One X. But I know that's a pipe dream.

I think a lot out there in nightmare reality actually want that too.

Not happening but you shouldn't really fret whatever the next major upgrade they put out will be big. We've made insane gains the last 3 years. Nintendo isn't walking away from the upscaling arms race they have patents and the best company in bed with them. You really think the next big product to come after this won't have it integrated?

I thought of this yesterday while playing Metroid Dread, thinking about how good it looks but how actually it could probably run just fine on a PS3 or Xbox 360, which is somewhat depressing.

Not really considering they have hdds that will make the streaming issues in the game worse than they are now. You are sorely over estimating their gpu capability as well which nintendo mostly leverages so you would take a hit to sub 20's with instability. Switch can leverage lighting over that generation of technology and the game you're mentioning would present performance issues so you would end up with a lesser product that runs worse.

Crysis broke that generation of games, switch doesn't have a problem with it, and crytek never bothered with it on WiiU. Certain nintendo games including lm3 or mk8 in it's current form wouldn't be possible without compromises and clear performance hit.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
The thing is, there's no reason to believe that Nintendo's next system is going to be up to modern standards either. They have not chased that since the Gamecube. I was hopeful for a Switch Pro but at this point I'm just done expecting that from them. The Wii and Switch have been their biggest successes while their actual steps towards modern quality (Gamecube and arguably the Wii U) did nowhere near as well. I don't know what Nintendo's next gimmick will be, but it will have one. Even if they just make a Switch 2 and do the handheld thing again, that will continue to hold back the console aspect of their hardware.

The solutions are to either deal with it or wait for fans to do it themselves with emulators and mods, like they tend to do.

Pretty much all Nintendo portable hardware upon full gen refresh is a full generation leap though

GB/GBC - NES-ish tier
GBA - SNES/Genesis tier
DS - N64/PSX tier
3DS - PS2/GCN tier
Switch - Wii U+/360+ tier
Switch 2 - PS4+ tier is a good bet

Nintendo is going to be able to make absolutely gorgeous looking games on hardware in the PS4 vicinity with more modern architecture and DLSS potentially.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,179
San Jose, Costa Rica
Nintendo loves milking tech generations post N64/PSX era where game development got a lot more expensive.

10 years in the GCN/PS2/Wii type tier.

It'll likely be 10 years in the Wii U/360/Switch range of performance.

Switch's successor which should be like a PS4/XB1 but with DLSS and a few more modern architecture features will be something they're probably content with making games on for another 10 years. Once you get to PS4 tier graphics, honestly you achieve a certain level of visual fidelity that makes just about any genre game look good so long as you have a good art staff.

Switch 2 should be able to create graphics like this, probably fairly easily at that:

ffVII_remake.jpg


For a Mario game, Kirby game, the game's are going to start to look like pre-rendered promo shots Nintendo used to use, even for games like Zelda and Xenoblade there is a pretty massive step up.

Lets be practical and honest here. It COULD look SIMILAR to that, but if they keep the current low-cost / hybrid model approach:

  • With lower res.
  • With more aggressive LOD for assets and shadows
  • With worse filtering overall (shadows, textures, etc)
  • At 30 fps.
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,773
Philadelphia, PA
I honestly just wish they'd release a full fat, truly capable $400 under-the-tv console that's at least as capable as a PS4 Pro / Xbox One X. But I know that's a pipe dream.

On the old forum when the Switch at the time was known as the NX and the PS4 was already on the market with the $400 MSRP, there were folks that honestly believed that if Nintendo released hardware of comparable basically all but implied that Nintendo couldn't reasonable sell it for the same MSRP despite having a similar power envelop.

That is how much the well has poisoned in these discussions over the years. It's the hardware can't be weak but it also isn't allowed to priced comparably to the competitors either. It's one thing having expectations but the arguments being pushed back then weren't any semblance of reasonable or at least being down to earth.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
Lets be practical and honest here. It COULD look SIMILAR to that, but if they keep the current low-cost / hybrid model approach:

  • With lower res.
  • With more aggressive LOD for assets and shadows
  • With worse filtering overall (shadows, textures, etc)
  • At 30 fps.

It would look better actually, the Switch is better hardware than the PS3/360 it's more like a PS3+, I would expect Switch 2 to be like a PS4+. It's going to have the advantage of more modern hardware architecture just like the Switch is able to actually run some PS4 games like Witcher 3 which the PS3 probably can't.

DLSS if included also changes a lot of things performance wise, even the PS5 doesn't have that.
 

AgeEighty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,762
... and frankly that's why so many people have been clamoring for an update to this 2017 tablet. It's graphics were outdated when it arrived in 2017. And here we are 4 years later with no upgrade in sight. It's long overdue.

No, they really weren't. Switch in 2017 was about as powerful as it could be without making sacrifices to size, battery life, price, or some combination of all three. 4 years isn't even remotely close to being "long overdue", especially when sales are proving the opposite.
 

LumberPanda

Member
Feb 3, 2019
6,501
It's not impressive at all in 2021. We have multiple year old iPhones that have more graphical horsepower than the Switch at this point. And then look at the Steam Deck, which runs circles around the Switch. Not to mention technologies like xCloud & Stadia that are increasingly making the need for packing all of that horsepower into a mobile device for gaming obsolete.
There's a reason xCloud and Stadia aren't that popular. It's neat for those who live close enough to a server, but Forza Horizon 4 was unplayable on xCloud for me (Banjo Tooie was fine, I'm assuming because the resolution/framerate/visuals were better for the compressor or something). You won't see xCloud or Stadia make handhelds obsolete until the Switch 3 or even Switch 4.

Also, the latest iPhones are definitely super impressive for the form factor but run into major problems like thermal throttling. Games like Genshin might start out at 60fps for a few minutes (good enough for the marketing team!) but then start dipping as the device starts throttling. I would not be happy with a $999 (which is the MSRP for the 13 pro) Switch 2 that performs like a 13 pro does.
 
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Oct 27, 2017
1,302
Disclaimer: What follows is not a rant about hardware specs. Instead I'm genuinely curious on what goes on in the minds of developers/artists within huge companies like Nintendo, when working within "self-induced" hardware constraints. It does not directly address the OP, but it's still related.

More specifically, I wonder how do internal Nintendo teams (artists, hardware/software engineers, etc.) feel about the system they are working on.

I mean don't artists want their art be showcased under the best possible conditions/in the best possible way? (i.e. higher resolutions, better lighting, etc.)
Don't the engineers working on physics, AI, etc. feel that the lower-spec hardware "holds them back"?
Don't audio designers wish their multi-channel mix was delivered using the latest and most advanced standards? (uncompressed, 7.1, Atmos, etc.)

Besides the fact that designing for a lower-spec device must be an attractive challenge for some, shouldn't the norm be: Let's showcase our artistic vision using the format's best methods?

It's -rightfully so- probably a dream job for most to be employed at Nintendo, but it makes you wonder how easy/hard it is to suppress your natural urge for being at the top of your game/of the industry.
Yes they continue to make high quality multi-awarded games, but at the same time it feels like even though they're true masters at their craft, their artistic vision is always compromised in some way, at least the last couple of generations.
This is an interesting point. Of course, only someone from Nintendo can truly give an answer, but here and there they drop some hints.

For example, they said Animal Crossing art style works by having a very simple art style. A tree in Animal Crossing is not really a tree, it is a "symbol for a tree" and there is "imaginary gap" between the object the avatar of the player interact with and how the player wants to interpret this interaction. Had the tree been more detailed, perhaps this effect would have been lost.

Takahashi said that many artists may hesitate to reduce the amount of information on a high-resolution screen. However, his intention with Animal Crossing's art style was to create an "imaginary gap" where players could place their own interpretation on certain game scenery.

"Because of the imaginary gap, the player tries to fill the gap by recalling information from their memory," he said. "And if you can project your thoughts on the gap, you can create goals and motives for play."

In fact, back when Wii U was announced they said something similar.

Eguchi said Nintendo has no aversion to doing technically-advanced graphics. "Now that we have a Wii in HD—the Wii U—there are games like Zelda or Metroid or Star Fox, that definitely will benefit from the ability to display those detailed graphics. But there [are] games like Mario and even Animal Crossing where those details might take away from that experience. We have to explore our options."

With Game & Wario they wondered if HD graphics were a good fit for the art style of Wario Ware.

Abe:
The WarioWare series has always had a very distinctive graphical style, and with the HD display supported by Wii U, we were rather at a loss as to how this would work with the series.

Iwata:

A WarioWare title with ultra-realistic graphics wouldn't really feel right, would it?

Sakamoto:
Well, I think it depends on the way you make use of high resolution imagery. When an entire game has these kinds of graphics, it can end up leaving a rather strange impression. I think this would be particularly true for a WarioWare title.

After all, this is the same company that created Yoshi's Island and Wind Waker, refusing the more realistic approach of Donkey Kong Country and most sixth-gen titles.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
No, they really weren't. Switch in 2017 was about as powerful as it could be without making sacrifices to size, battery life, price, or some combination of all three. 4 years isn't even remotely close to being "long overdue", especially when sales are proving the opposite.

More or less this is correct, yes. You probably have to factor in also Nintendo was likely almost assuredly trying to release the system for November 2016, but had to delay because of software issues, so they settled for basically first week March 2017.

For November 2016 there really would not be a mobile chip better than the Tegra X1 that would fit in that form factor.
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,773
Philadelphia, PA
It would look better actually, the Switch is better hardware than the PS3/360 it's more like a PS3+, I would expect Switch 2 to be like a PS4+. It's going to have the advantage of more modern hardware architecture just like the Switch is able to actually run some PS4 games like Witcher 3 which the PS3 probably can't.

DLSS if included also changes a lot of things performance wise, even the PS5 doesn't have that.

Nintendo's agreement / contract with Nvidia is supposedly for 10 years. So from 2016 / 2017 to 2026 / 2027. So whatever they have in mind is definitely going to take advantage whatever optimal offering Nvidia will have available in a mobile chip, Also since that time frame Nvidia has acquire Arm so that remains what ramifications that'll entail for the next chip the future Nintendo device will have.

I mean since Nvidia has their own graphical tech and by extension owning Arm, Nintendo could request a custom ARM based silicon whatever possible / reasonable Nvidia graphical features to be utilized in mobile form factor.

It would be interesting what the end result would be but I would think folks need to complete put it out of their mind to see something Apple M1 Pro Max level at a budget price. More modern architectural benefits in terms of engine support and rendering technologies will definitely be available though, as was the case for the Switch too having architectural improvements over the PS3 / 360 gen.
 

Leo-Tyrant

Member
Jan 14, 2019
5,179
San Jose, Costa Rica
It would look better actually, the Switch is better hardware than the PS3/360 it's more like a PS3+, I would expect Switch 2 to be like a PS4+. It's going to have the advantage of more modern hardware architecture just like the Switch is able to actually run some PS4 games like Witcher 3 which the PS3 probably can't.

DLSS if included also changes a lot of things performance wise, even the PS5 doesn't have that.

My friend, have you played The Witcher 3 on the Switch?

It LOOKS like its running on a PS3. Regardless if the PS3 can actually run it...the game IQ looks like a PS4 game down-ported to a PS3.

Ability to run something <> that something looking or performing WELL/GOOD.

The Switch is probably not going to make a very nice Metroid Prime with pristine IQ, as it couldnt even manage to make a 2D Metroid run with good IQ. The Switch successor will also not provide good IQ, compared to our future standars (And I really hope IM WRONG on this)
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
Nintendo's agreement / contract with Nvidia is supposedly for 10 years. So from 2016 / 2017 to 2026 / 2027. So whatever they have in mind is definitely going to take advantage whatever optimal offering Nvidia will have available in a mobile chip, Also since that time frame Nvidia has acquire Arm so that remains what ramifications that'll entail for the next chip the future Nintendo device will have.

I mean since Nvidia has their own graphical tech and by extension owning Arm, Nintendo could request a custom ARM based silicon whatever possible / reasonable Nvidia graphical features to be utilized in mobile form factor.

It would be interesting what the end result would be but I would think folks need to complete put it out of their mind to see something Apple M1 Pro Max level at a budget price. More modern architectural benefits in terms of engine support and rendering technologies will definitely be available though, as was the case for the Switch too having architectural improvements over the PS3 / 360 gen.

I think the chip has already been chosen (codename Dane) and has been chosen for a while. It sounds like a good chip for a mobile device.

Ultimately I think it'll be the same thing the Switch is to the PS3-PS4 ... better than the PS3, and able to port some PS4 games but it really has to sweat/compromise to get those big PS4 ports. Switch 2 hardware is probably gonna be the same, better than the PS4 when factoring in all the architectural and DLSS improvements, and probably able to handle some PS5 ports (not all) and will have to sweat hard to do so.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
My friend, have you played The Witcher 3 on the Switch?

It LOOKS like its running on a PS3. Regardless if the PS3 can actually run it...the game IQ looks like a PS4 game down-ported to a PS3.

Ability to run something <> that something looking or performing WELL/GOOD.

The Switch is probably not going to make a very nice Metroid Prime with pristine IQ, as it couldnt even manage to make a 2D Metroid run with good IQ. The Switch successor will also not provide good IQ, compared to our future standars (And I really hope IM WRONG on this)

DLSS can be game changer for image quality issues though, a game on Switch 2 that runs at the same resolution as Witcher 3 docked for example (720p?) will look a lot cleaner and will basically look like a 1440p image or something like that instead of a muddy 720p.
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,905
Switch 2 - PS4+ tier is a good bet

Nintendo is going to be able to make absolutely gorgeous looking games on hardware in the PS4 vicinity with more modern architecture and DLSS potentially.

if it ends up with DLSS it will perform higher than PS4 can with a similar image iq. That' effectively means it higher considering it's doing double the work with tech like that. DLSS is insane to gaming it took the very architecture switch on and previous and made aged gpus like the 970 viable at higher resolutions or double fps.

My friend, have you played The Witcher 3 on the Switch?

It LOOKS like its running on a PS3. Regardless if the PS3 can actually run it...the game IQ looks like a PS4 game down-ported to a PS3.

Ability to run something <> that something looking or performing WELL/GOOD.

The Switch is probably not going to make a very nice Metroid Prime with pristine IQ, as it couldnt even manage to make a 2D Metroid run with good IQ. The Switch successor will also not provide good IQ, compared to our future standars (And I really hope IM WRONG on this)

Mostly cause the devs gave you crap presets. People with hacked switches and no oc make a better looking and performing game just cleaning up the horrible job of preset fuckery that was done to the port. Also PS3 can't run it and we have plenty examples of pcs with more or less power than switch doing worse.
 

UltraMagnus

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,670
To be honest PS4/XB1 tier of graphics are "good enough" to a point where I wonder if Nintendo wouldn't just be content never going above what the Switch 2/Dane is probably going to be.

Like I'm pretty sure that level of a system could achieve graphics fairly comparable to their CG rendered images minus the real time ray traced reflections/lighting seen here at 1440p-4K DLSS on a TV:

mHP1784_1024x1024.jpg


mario-kart-8-deluxe-battle-uhd-4k-wallpaper.jpg
 

OmegaDL50

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,773
Philadelphia, PA
No, they really weren't. Switch in 2017 was about as powerful as it could be without making sacrifices to size, battery life, price, or some combination of all three. 4 years isn't even remotely close to being "long overdue", especially when sales are proving the opposite.

This is exactly what I mean when folks applying 2021 standards to a device that was the best it possibly could be at the form factor / power / price point from 2017. There was simply nothing better at the time.

It continues to prove my point.

I don't own my PS4 anymore to use as a comparison point but just look at this.

7HIysSf.jpg
'
 

Version 3.0

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,422
I wish Nintendo still used more powerful hardware, too, but come on.

First, it's approaching 5 years old.
Second, it's more like 1.5 gens, in simplest terms, and you should've learned in school to round up.
Third, it's packing decent modern tech in there.
And lastly, of course, it's portable tech by necessity.

This is like complaining how much weaker my phone is than a new GeForce card. When, in fact, the phone is arguably the more impressive tech, of the two.
 

Naner

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,085
Metroid Prime was an incredible looking game in 2002 that also ran at a rock solid 60fps. There's no way a Metroid Prime remake on Switch would hit both criteria by 2022 standards.
 

Serif

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
3,910
Mostly cause the devs gave you crap presets. People with hacked switches and no oc make a better looking and performing game just cleaning up the horrible job of preset fuckery that was done to the port.

Are you referring to the post-processing options like sharpening, motion blur, etc.? There was an update for Witcher 3 on Switch last year that added those.

I played and beat the game on both a 1080p set and 4K OLED, with the sharpening presets and I think the game looked fine, I know people have different standards of playability but I own the PC version too and ended up playing most of it on Switch for the sheer convenience lol

1080p Switch games look the best on my LG CX with regards to IQ, obviously not a native 4K image but not terrible. I'm confident that a Switch successor that can push consistent 1080p - 1440p with decent AA will look great on modern sets, and that's without taking DLSS into account.
 

Naner

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,085
Seems I've annoyed a few people with this thread, which wasn't my intention at all. I was more talking about visuals and feel than features, and I tried to be fair in the OP and acknowledge that the statement wasn't completed water tight. I'm also absolutely not complaining about the Switch and completely understand it's a handheld system. I love my Switch, and recently playing Metroid Dread, I thought it looked great. I just think it's interesting that a remake of a GameCube game, like Metroid Prime, still wouldn't get near to the visual quality of, say, Shadow of the Colossus (PS2 to PS4) or Ratchet & Clank (Ps2 to PS4). But yeah. I didn't mean to stoke any fires or piss people off. Just posted a random thought I'd had. Maybe wasn't the best idea!
Don't worry, I feel the exact same way. I'm generally against straightforward "shiny graphics" remakes anyway, and the point is completely defeated if the new graphics already look outdated. Unless this remake is a launch title for a Switch hardware revision, I feel like any straight remake of post-N64 game would look underwhelming. Not necessarily bad, but also not a substantial enough leap to seem justified.
 

Ashes of Dreams

Fallen Guardian of Unshakable Resolve
Member
May 22, 2020
14,938
Why are console wars threads like this allowed?
Criticizing a company isn't "console wars". Comparing a company to another company isn't "console wars". That term is being used inappropriately more often lately, I feel. The real question is why does it bother so many people that someone said something negative about a company?

why people keep wanting switch to be something it clearly is not
Because I love Nintendo games and I want them to run better. I want to be able to play Age of Calamity without it giving me a migraine. I want to be able to buy a Nintendo game without immediately saying "I could probably run this better on my PC though" as my Switch collects more dust. I want Nintendo to be competent enough to emulate their own games better than fan emulators from a fucking decade ago.
 
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