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Josef Fares: Games Like Telltale’s and Quantic Dream’s Are Too Passive for Me, I Want More Control

lupianwolf

lupianwolf

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,319
Josef Fares, a Lebanese filmmaker who's been living in Sweden since he was ten years old, made its debut in the games industry with Brothers: A Tale of Two Sons, an acclaimed adventure game launched in 2013.

Now he's working on A Way Out, a game to be published under EA's Originals label that will follow in the footsteps of Brothers with an additional twist: it must be played by two people, either via local or online play. Even in the latter case,

Given the cinematic flair of his titles, Fares' work has been often compared to the creative output of Telltale Games and Quantic Dream. However, in an interview published in the latest EDGE magazine (March 2018, issue 316), Fares didn't seem to agree.
Those games are too passive for me. I would like to have more control. One could say that you control the story, but while you're doing it and affecting it, in a sense you're not, you know?

A Way Out is not about that. I think the comparison is fine from a cinematic perspective, but not the way you choose your story. This is a hand-tailored story all the way.
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When asked by the interviewer whether he also wanted to elicit feelings and emotions with his games (like Quantic Dream's David Cage), he replied:
That's not important for me. I just want to make people feel the game. If they cry or they laugh or they smile or they get angry, it doesn't really matter.
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https://wccftech.com/fares-telltale-quantic-dream-passive-me/
 
Kolx

Kolx

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Oct 25, 2017
8,505
I'm fine with it. I can see why someone would want more control tho.
 
bluexy

bluexy

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Oct 25, 2017
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But one of the best things about video games is how they limit your control.
 
Mathieran

Mathieran

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Oct 25, 2017
12,892
I don't want all my games to play like those games do but I enjoy them for what they are.

I like diversity in my games.
 
TubaZef

TubaZef

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Oct 28, 2017
3,570
Brazil
I really like Telltale games but I kinda agree with him. I feel that more "passive" games don't use all the potential that games have with interactivity, but at the same time, I think there's a lot to be learned from them in how to tell a story and express a narrative.
 

Deleted member 5727

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
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I can't know whether his game is better than those in this regard, because of course his game isn't out yet. It's easy to talk up your game when it hasn't been released yet. Not saying he's being dishonest, just that developers often make these sorts of comments, prior to release. I loved Brothers, but there weren't elements of choice there, so this will be new territory for him. We'll see.

I understand what he's saying about choice in other games. In Telltale games in particular, I often feel very funneled and boxed in. Life is Strange did it much better, imo. I didn't have much of a sense of choice in Beyond (in part because a lot of it was behind the curtains), but I did have a sense of plenty of choices in Heavy Rain.
 
jayu26

jayu26

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Oct 25, 2017
4,615
Me too, but they are what they are. People really like Until Dawn (and Life is Strange for some reason) but I merely think it's alright. These games have to absolutely nail their story to make it worth while or have significantly branching path that are all interesting. So far I haven't found one that really nails it. And I love stuff like Uncharted and The Last of Us.
 
semiconscious

semiconscious

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Nov 10, 2017
2,140
apples & oranges? why would brothers be compared to telltale/quantic games? it's a straight-forward, linear adventure, not one that presents you with forks/choices...
 
Lappe

Lappe

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Nov 1, 2017
1,651
I'm looking forward to A Way Out, but I still love these modern "adventure" games. Heavy Rain, Beyond: Two Souls, Until Dawn.... All of them, I lov em'
 
Protome

Protome

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Oct 27, 2017
15,783
I don't disagree. I was among the few people disappointed when Telltale leaned entirely into their interactive stories instead of making more adventure games. I really loved their Sam & Max stuff, their Strongbad game and hell, even their Monkey Island series was pretty good.
 
Animal Liberation Ⓥ

Animal Liberation Ⓥ

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Oct 27, 2017
5,767
I like those games when I get into modern 'gaming fatigue', and instead completely stopping, which I have done before and it then becomes a habit in itself to be reluctant to start gaming again. So they serve a purpose (for me) to break up gaming habits, and can almost be relaxing/therapeutic in a sense. Also games like Virginia, Firewatch, Vanishing of Ethan Carter, PnC adventure games, etc..

Mathieran said:
I don't want all my games to play like those games do but I enjoy them for what they are.

I like diversity in my games.
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Agreed.

Just like the disingenuous arguments of 'corridor' or 'linear' as if every damned game needs to be a tedious sandbox of repetitive fatigue.
 
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mugurumakensei

mugurumakensei

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Oct 25, 2017
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jayu26 said:
Me too, but they are what they are. People really like Until Dawn (and Life is Strange for some reason) but I merely think it's alright. These games have to absolutely nail their story to make it worth while or have significantly branching path that are all interesting. So far I haven't found one that really nails it. And I love stuff like Uncharted and The Last of Us.
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Until Dawn branches significantly with your choices which is why I consider way superior to telltale and Quantic dreams efforts.
 

Shroki

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,912
I don't mind the interactivity, but I do wish the choices actually meant something in Telltale games. Rarely are the consequences actually meaningful.

It's part of the reason Dontnod and Supermassive ate Telltale's lunch.
 
jayu26

jayu26

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Oct 25, 2017
4,615
Would Gone Home belong on similar category. It is considered walking sim. I really liked Gone Home. I still need to play Firewall.
 
Paganmoon

Paganmoon

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Oct 26, 2017
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Pet peeve time. Calling someone who's lived most of their life in Sweden, Lebanese (or any other nationality).

OT: Until Dawn and life is strange have probably been the best of genre. Not much for the telltale games.
 
petethepanda

petethepanda

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Oct 25, 2017
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Wish the full article were available. I'm assuming "hand-tailored" is referring to the player and not the author/developer, but I can't quite tell if he's talking about wanting the moment-to-moment gameplay to be more interactive, or if he's talking about the player having more of an impact on the direction of the story. (I'm not too familiar with his upcoming game so maybe I'm just missing the context.)
 
Wrath Of Exodust

Wrath Of Exodust

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Oct 27, 2017
720
I mostly agree with him. I also hesitate to lump Until Dawn in with David Cage games because Until Dawn has a lot more gameplay and control than people give it credit for.
 
Juan29.Zapata

Juan29.Zapata

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Oct 25, 2017
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Despite prefering the likes of Brothers, I still enjoy games like TWD and Batman, and Life Is Strange. Although I'm looking very much forward to A Way Out. Then again, this shouldn't be a discussion where TellTale games should stop existing, and I'm glad that he has the opportunity of making the games he wants to make.
 
Cinemikel

Cinemikel

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eXistor

eXistor

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Oct 27, 2017
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They're fine. They're a different genre: interactive stories. It makes sense for them to not have a ton of in-depth control outside of the choices you make. I really like the genre when done well (I'm completely done with Telltale's formulaic output though) and I'm very much looking forward to Detroit. They're like point 'n click adventures without the puzzles. Instead you get a more visual story and get to make choices. What's not to like?
 
KiLAM

KiLAM

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Jan 25, 2018
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I love dark souls, uncharted, the last of us, telltale TWD, heavy rain, Inside, firewatch..all of them are great if you know what you are getting into. But I will go out of my way to make time for games with actual gameplay whereas I will play these passive story games whenever I feel like it. Anyways, looking forward to A Way Out.
 
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Maxime

Maxime

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Oct 27, 2017
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Life is Strange, in my opinion (opinion of a huuuuge fanboy) is probably a really good 'compromise' between gameplay and story in the genre. The game emphasizes a lot on exploration and puzzles (even if they're rather light). The fact alone that you can turn the camera around your character makes the game more enjoyable in the gameplay department compared to what Telltale, QD and Until Dawn are doing (though that doesn't take away my love of UD, TWD S1, WAU & TftB).
 
WillyFive

WillyFive

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Oct 25, 2017
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I like Life is Strange a lot, but it's incredibly frustrating when control is taken away from you and your character does something stupid just because plot needs her too.
 
Joeyro

Joeyro

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Oct 28, 2017
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They are the perfect palate cleansers for me, but I still agree overall though, can't imagine playing two of those games in a row without feeling fatigue.
 
Dysun

Dysun

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Not all games need to be the same, there is room in the industry for interactive story based games
 
skeezx

skeezx

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Oct 27, 2017
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been playing Walking Dead New Frontier all weekend. i really like that i can just veg out with these games, i don't so much mind you're essentially mashing inconsequential QTEs in the end as long as its done right

never got around to Brothers but it's installed and next up. looking forward to its take on the genre
 

ThaNotoriousSOD

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Oct 27, 2017
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I agree with him, I just feel like tell tale games don't offer me enough gameplay/control. I wish tell tale would commit more to old school adventure like when they first started.
 
Nirolak

Nirolak

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Oct 25, 2017
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I'll make a thread in a bit, but based on Telltale's statements and job postings, they agree with him.
 
starfox

starfox

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mugurumakensei said:
Until Dawn branches significantly with your choices which is why I consider way superior to telltale and Quantic dreams efforts.
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I did a platinum run on Until Dawn at about the same time i did the same for Telltale's Game of Thrones, and both games are really similar in the way they act the episodes and "branch" the story, as all they do is show/hid parts and the main levels are always there besides the party member died or not. Both games seem to have a kick for killing people at some point, just because. In the end, even if the killing is more dynamic (all member have a big cinematic death sequence, but can die early on in stupid QTE or something like that) in Until Dawn, both try to do the same. I think what Fares tries to say is that this type of genera is cool, but the structure is way way reductive to the final experince, and yet Supermassive hit a quite decent player agency where it still tries to structure itself like some proper "linear horror game", and still is at its core a "unfolding cardboard book" type of game.
You hardly touch the joystick in Game of Thrones (or any other recent Telltale game for that matter).
 
Gundam

Gundam

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Oct 25, 2017
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Telltale games are fine IMO, the modern day version of Point and Click adventures.

Quantic Dream games suck ass though. Really excited for Josef's game.
 

tutomos

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Oct 27, 2017
2,612
Don't think he said it as a knock on the interactive drama genre. I think his style is more in line with Fumito Ueda. Brothers is a very good game and the closest thing to a Ico-like game we're gonna get.
 
element252

element252

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Oct 30, 2017
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I haven't been much of a fan with most of Telltale's recent releases, but I am really liking what they are doing with the Batman series from a story perspective. Plus I think there is more of a connection between the choices made in Season 1 and how they effect Season 2. At least much more so than the recent Walking Dead games. Guardians and Game of Thrones were disappointments. Still think TFTB is the best due to the humor and being light hearted fun.
 
Van Bur3n

Van Bur3n

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Oct 27, 2017
26,089
That's because Telltale and Quantic Dream games are Oscar bait.

And there is some actual truth in the case of the latter, in that David Cage is desperate in trying to make a movie out of a video game.
 
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