gay people are the most annoying trend, yep, makes sense
I don't have a problem with the topic, but I'm not gonna stop giving my input on it lmao
Let's talk about playable heterosexual women in games lacking romantic agency
- Thread starter GameShrink
- Start date
This problem of representation is basically about the protagonist not pursuing a man because it would make the typical male player uncomfortable, so this is as much about homosexual male protagonist as it is heterosexual female.
Sorry, that's not what I mean at all! I absolutely love proper representation of queer people in all media, and that's one of the reasons I actually did take issue with how LiS handled it. I feel like the whole thing was specifically put there just as a "fan service" moment for male fans.
It is sad that in spite of what I perceive to be my issues with LiS in this regard, it still stands as one of the more positive representations of homosexuality in video games; it's something the whole medium could stand to be a lot better at. I actually feel Ellie was handled really well in this regard.
Episode 5 is the culmination of the romance built up throughout five episodes. That kiss scene comes directly after the pool scene in Episode 3:
Which is followed by them sleeping in bed together, and Chloe's kiss is offered by her telling Max to "take chances." It's not subtle.
I felt like 2B wanting to kill God at the beginning of the game has something to do with the fact that
she was created to kill 9S repeatedly, and lamenting that her destiny is to continuously hurt the only person she cares about
Don't you love how we have a lot of straight men in here bitching about queer women in games? like wtf? Yeah, I'm aware a lot of them think it's hot; but there's also a fuck ton of men who are threatened by the idea that women exist who don't need them at all for anything.
Thank you!
Some of the arguments in here are so disingenuous.
It still doesn't really come across as a romantic type of love though, whereas 9S very clearly harbors romantic feelings for her, as we see while playing as him.
That's one example of the issue here; women leads very rarely are written to overtly pursue relationships with men in games, and you can bet it's largely because devs are uncomfortable making their mostly male playerbase kiss men in-game. It's bullshit.
1. The waifu-bait argument is salient, I could see that being a huge reason.
2. I feel like if you had a STRONG FEMALE CHARACTER have a male love interest, people would complain about that, too.
3. Doesn't Aloy flirt with the sun king a little, or am I misremembering that?
2. I feel like if you had a STRONG FEMALE CHARACTER have a male love interest, people would complain about that, too.
3. Doesn't Aloy flirt with the sun king a little, or am I misremembering that?
That's my point, it is not the culmination. It just comes up out of nowhere in Episode 3. Where was it ever built up in Episodes 1 and 2?
Your feeling is wrong, as evidenced by the absolutely huge following LiS has amongst queer women.
As if that's what we're saying.
No one is saying to get rid of same-sex female relationships from games, people are saying they want representation of relationships with men, be the main character a woman or a man.
Stop coming in here with a strawman.
1. Just because a character doesn't seek sex or romance does not inherently make that character asexual. Being asexual and being presented as asexual are two different things. In the context of the story told by Horizon, it doesn't seem as if she's interested in romance at that particular time. That doesn't tell us anything about her sexuality (or lack thereof).
2. There's no problem with a character being asexual, it would just be nice if that were made clear. It'd be welcome, actually, as I can't think of any asexual game characters off the top of my head.
What is this? You clearly did not read the OP.
On topic: I agree that we need more male love interests. Not at the expense of others like the poster I quoted apparently thinks you mean, but in ADDITION to female love interests.
I look forward to playing as a female pansexual in the new Assassin's Creed this year.
Like I said, I do feel like in the end, in spite of what I perceive as my issues with how the game handles things, it's one of the more positive representations of queer women in video games.
You do realize that the main reason why this happens is also why no protagonists are gay men as well right?
The Sun King flirts with her, Aloy calls him out on trying to use her to replace his dead SO.
Then he never does it again lol
Shoehorn? If anything Max and Chloe are "hella" gay. And where does the game try to titillate? What's titillating about that scene from TLOU2? Also pretty sure Aloy isn't asexual, just that every person romantically interested in her is lame AF.
Friends don't kiss each other like this.
I thought they were just good friends for the longest time. None of this romance stuff ever happened in my game. So I guess my Max was straight, just not into Warren.
I think a lot of people will have a knee jerk reaction of "straight tear, boo hoo", so i think it needs to be emphasized how the problem stems from a very homophobic mentality in which the player, assumed to be a male, will be off put by the idea of his player avatar being into dudes, it's a very childish mentality of "we cant have the female protagonist fall for a guy because our players will think that's gay!" and really undermines the power of having lesbian protagonists, as the backdrop turns it into "you see, it's cool to have two girls, because that's, like, hot."
But Seraphina isn't the protagonist, it is Killia. It is like saying Fiora has an interest in Shulk.
Back on topic, to be honest, I don't recall a game in which the female protagonist has a canon relationship with a male character.
i agree with this, however i wouldn't just say it's a problem with the representation of straight women but also of gay men - in games without player-created characters, it's quite rare to find examples of a protagonist interested in only men, i find that they are typically bisexual at most (at least as far as i remember from the games that i have played)
Hold Up. She used to Bone down with nathan Drake, the loveable dork that he is. No dudes she met up with since they became friends seemed to be her fit. The Only dude she hangs with that we know is Cutter but He feels like The Older Brother or Uncle.
I Could see her being attracted to Nathans Older Brother because he has the same wild streak she liked in nathan.
I think this is kind of the rub here
Like I know OP isn't trying to be rude on purpose and I know this is a game topic but I can't not think about how mostly everything else, female protag or not, in media has a straight romance if we're talking about relationships.
I have a hard time garnering any sympathy here because of that and also because it's pretty fucking difficult to find games I like where I can be gay too
The struggle is hardly confined to only straight women like the OP is implying here
Sun King was the one who flirted with her but she shut him down by saying she won't be Erend's Sister's replacement.
It was Varl who Aloy showed feelings for.
Really—straight or gay—our problem is that the vast majority of games are made by men, for men. For the most part I can't really blame male creators for wanting to create games that appeal to themselves, but we have a really bad chicken-egg problem with women not getting into gaming because games are so blatantly made for (straight) men, and games being made for men because not enough women are getting into gaming and growing up to be developers. I do think things are getting a bit better, but progress is so. damn. slow.
You're the one stuffing it, and the best part is I even mentioned gay men in my post which are also under-represented. You conveniently ignored that though.
But I'm stopping in here, this is just shitting up the thread for no real reason. Plus it's absolutely pointless arguing with you, you missed the point by a country mile.
That's the crux of the issue, and why publishers are seemingly averse to depicting straight female characters as playable protagonists.
User Banned (2 Weeks): Thread derailment + trolling. History of similar behaviour.
Nah.
I get y'all are trying to deflect and pretend this is about sticking up for gay dudes, but come on. Try a bit harder.
You say this, but I can think of more games that star a lesbian lead then star a hetrosexual female lead. Aesexual leads dominate both of them though.
There are increasing numbers of games being made for women I think, they're just on mobile because that's by and large where the audience is. The fact that phones aren't dedicated gaming devices helps side-step some of the chicken-egg problem.
OP isnt asking to take away gay main characters to make them straight. He's saying that even those who aren't gay (at least that we know of) developers never let them express any romantic interest towards a male. This is strictly talking about main playable characters. Of course there are a lot of straight women surrounding them but just not the main playable one. i.e. Samus, Aloy and Lara for all intents and purposes are asexual.
not shown fucking dudes on screen =/= asexual
you have not seen an asexual female protagonist in a mainstream game, period.
pretending there is asexual representation in games to make straight people into victims is comical
I think the problem as is being raised is, games have no issues making their heterosexual male protagonists or homosexual female protagonists sexually active, whereas this does not happen as much for heterosexual females or homosexual males, who generally don't star as leads that much in games to begin with.
Yes, this is something that gives me hope. I'm actually a mobile app developer (not for games at the moment, but it's something I have ambition for), and think there's potential in the app space. I just wish the space weren't dominated by free to play/pay to win dynamics.
Yeah things are slowly getting better (as we saw at this E3, shame I'm not really interested in those games though) but bit by bit. You can't really blame women for not wanting to dive into all this stuff either with how even a female protagonist is considered "controversial" these days.
This is weird. The real problem is the lack of women creatives, all these games are primarily made by men and usually for men. The industry is simply not an inclusive or motivating enough workplace for more most women yet.
Like why make it seem like the issue is that under-represented people are getting representation? What's unacceptable is that white men are still the most common playable characters in games and white men are the most represented group of people in games. The more we move away from that, the more playable women we'll get, and the better representation will be for everyone.
Like why make it seem like the issue is that under-represented people are getting representation? What's unacceptable is that white men are still the most common playable characters in games and white men are the most represented group of people in games. The more we move away from that, the more playable women we'll get, and the better representation will be for everyone.
2B isn't the bets argument.
Her feelings are a lot less clearly laid out than 9S. One oculd interpret her feelings for him, and a lot of other androids including 6O very broadly. it's clear that she deeply cares for all of them, but whether that care is romantic rather than familial. That's far harder to determine.
and make that argument.
don't pretend asexual people are represented in games
it's fucking cowardly
Episode 1:
Episode 2:
Like I said the game seriously makes zero attempts to be subtle about it.
Why does everyone want to romance some character in a video game? I honestly want to know why some people have this burning desire to romance a virtual character.
EDIT: Okay, upon a bit of reflection I need to clarify. If the story is written in a way for the character to fall in love then so be it. My question is about games like Mass Effect where the player can initiate the romance or not.
EDIT: Okay, upon a bit of reflection I need to clarify. If the story is written in a way for the character to fall in love then so be it. My question is about games like Mass Effect where the player can initiate the romance or not.
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Yes, i think problems such as the one OP highlights, as well as the general problems with representation in video games, comes down to how the gaming industry is primarily dominated either by white males (in the west) or Japanese males (in Japan).
Honestly don't bother, they're just misinterpreting the point on purpose.