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andymcc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,638
Columbus, OH
If we're comparing to Contra and mentioning MMX7, then bringing up Contra 019 is fair game:

www.youtube.com

Contra: Rogue Corps - Fucking Embarrassing (Jimpressions)

http://www.patreon.com/jimquisitionhttp://www.thejimquisition.comhttps://www.thejimporium.comIt's almost impressive just how wrong this game is. As a Contra ...

That's not the only bad Contra game lol

But why are we bringing up Contra? I'd say it's influence is even greater than Mega Man's.
 

Lunatious

Member
Dec 18, 2018
804
Though I am not even saying Megaman games suck. I simply think people gave the series too much credit, compared to where the overall reception of the games. I even say so in my OP.

Who are "people" if overall reception isn't good? You're being contradictory. Mega Man isn't hugely popular - it's a low-to-mid budget franchise, when it's talked about it's mostly by its dedicated fanbase, or relating to its 30+ year history. Some games are critical darlings, some are considered average, some are bad. Kinda happens when you have nearly 40 major entries + several spinoffs.

The Battle Network games are amazing, but I don't count them as mainline Megaman games. The same with Legends, even though they have not played them.

Though I will say, it's pretty weird that your argument is "Mega Man doesn't have great games", then you proceed to say "the great games don't count".

Honestly, I weirdly agree with the OP. MegaMan just lives in the house Mario built. It's a cool idea, but it's not revolutionary or anything.

This is a bad take. Videogames are inherently a very derivative medium and a lot of classics rely on building upon existing formulas.

"Breath of the Wild lives in the house Skyrim built"

"The Last of Us lives in the house Resident Evil 4 built"

I could go on with similarly reductive examples. If being revolutionary"was the only metric for success then a lot of games getting praise should be considered "bad" or "undeserving".
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,417
The Megaman series is definitely overrated but not to the degree OP thinks it is nor for many of the reasons they mentioned.
 

Cheesebu

Wrong About Cheese
Member
Sep 21, 2020
6,191
OP doesn't seem to know much about the games or their impact, but yes please tell me about how unfair it is that Megaman is an extremely influential and well regarded series in both the NES and SNES eras.
 

Dyle

One Winged Slayer
The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
30,417
I think a lot of people put it on the level of Mario, Zelda, or Final Fantasy and I don't think it belongs quite at that level due to its lack of many major modern titles or a particularly smooth and lasting transition into 3D.

It's more or less the same situation as Sonic and Castlevania.
 

ZeoVGM

Member
Oct 25, 2017
77,051
Providence, RI
I think a lot of people put it on the level of Mario, Zelda, or Final Fantasy and I don't think it belongs quite at that level due to its lack of many major modern titles or a particularly smooth and lasting transition into 3D.

It's more or less the same situation as Sonic and Castlevania.

Hm, I disagree with the general idea.

I don't think many put Mega Man on that level in terms of impact on the industry. Mega Man is often a "favorite" franchise from gamers that unquestionably has a few of the best games in the genre but I think most fully recognize that its impact isn't near Mario or Zelda.
 

Hoa

Member
Jun 6, 2018
4,424
This topic has proved that Mega Man actually deserves even more credit.

Having 30+ main games in a series with only like 4 of them being truly bad is a fucking amazing stat, especially when it crosses over outside of it's originating genre with fantastic RPGs and action adventure games.

There still aren't any RPGs out there like Battle Network and Starforce besides indie games that are specifically influenced by them, and even those lack the PVP element which still has an active online community.
 
Jul 7, 2021
3,155
Strongly disagree with you OP. Mega Man was beloved for many reasons since the beginning. In fact I think a lot more people should try the latest entry in the mainline series, Mega Man 11. It's a fantastic game, and my favorite entry yet without the nostalgic feelings I have for the early entries.
 

Servbot24

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
43,539
I wish I lived in a world where MegaMan got any recognition.

I think a lot of people put it on the level of Mario, Zelda, or Final Fantasy and I don't think it belongs quite at that level due to its lack of many major modern titles or a particularly smooth and lasting transition into 3D.

It's more or less the same situation as Sonic and Castlevania.
Who on earth puts Mega Man on the same level as Zelda or Mario? Literally no one does this. It isn't even considered on the same level as Castlevania by most people.

MegaMan is 10000000x better than Sonic though.
 

Twig

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,525
respect for putting so much effort into this thread

i mean you're wrong, but respect anyway
 

NuclearCake

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
9,867
Hmmm, I don't agree. 1,2,3, and 9 from the classic series are well worth playing and they have great design. The rest of the classic series is a bit uneven but still worth a look. None of the games are truly bad.

X1-4 are also damn good too.

I think Mega Man has gotten the right amount of recognition, there are some stinker entries in this series but that can be said for any other long-running franchise. I don't think I have ever seen anyone say that the series is revolutionary though. It isn't but it doesn't have to be.
 

Spinluck

▲ Legend ▲
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
28,877
Chicago
MegaMan is great...

It ain't Metroid though.

And I'd put peak MegaMan below both peak Mario and Sonic since i saw them brought up earlier in the thread. But I don't think the recognition is underserved.
 

Musubi

Unshakable Resolve - Prophet of Truth
Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,149
I'd happily play any Megaman game put in front of me. I can't say that about many series.
 

HustleBun

Member
Nov 12, 2017
6,077
Referring to Mega Man 2, 3 and X as the "only good Mega Man games" is the most hilariously basic and uninformed thing you could say about the franchise.
 

XaviConcept

Art Director for Videogames
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
5,079
I feel like the OP is getting bashed enough but tryibg to validate his argument by bringing up MT scores and sales numbers shows a lot of ignorance.

You also are very obviously building strawmans like "many people are saying this like who the fuck are you talking about lol, your confirmation bias is way too obvious to be taken seriously. Learn that not liking something (I hate cauliflower) and something being good (cauliflower is great!) are not the same thing.
 

Billfisto

Member
Oct 30, 2017
15,542
Canada
The one thing I've always despised about MegaMan is the "pick a level" structure. Now of course if you are a master player, you might be able to finish any level you pick, but generally for most anyone this is not true and there is an "ideal" order in which you should complete levels, and especially bosses, by exploiting their weakness to a powerup gained from defeating a previous boss. Short of using a guide, you will not know what the ideal order is. What does this mean? Unless you're incredibly lucky, it means you're going to do a lot, and I mean a lot of trial and error. Enter a stage, get to the boss, discover you do not have the correct powerup, die, pick another stage, rinse and repeat. It feels like this is just there to artificially increase the game's length by deliberately making you waste as much time as possible playing through levels you can't beat yet. It's not fun. It's cheap. They purposely decided to design it like this just to waste your fucking time. Just no.

... despised?

As a kid, I always appreciated the level select. Even if I sucked at the game, at least I could still experience most of the levels it had to offer.
 

Extra Sauce

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,011
my hot take is Mega Man would be a better game if you could hold the button to continually fire the base weapon
 

theosmeo

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
773
thats really interesting that youd specify x3 as being good? imo its actually not amazing x2 x4 and x5 are all a lot stronger of entries

also imo yeah thats for sure a take to have LOL

the zero and ZX games are fantastic

The battle network games while varying in quality are also really special and unique to a lot of people

its a series with over 60 games iirc, not all of them are hits but its pretty wild to just say its pretty crap outside 4 titles
 
Nov 25, 2017
674
Finland
Yeah, you lost me at "undeserving recognition".

Certainly the blue guy has been in a heap of shitty games, more than good ones. But undeserving recognition? Are you having a bad weekend or something because that just sounds petty.
 

ARobotCalledV

Member
Aug 22, 2020
1,554
Learn that not liking something (I hate cauliflower) and something being good (cauliflower is great!) are not the same thing.

I kind of disagree. I don't think there is an inherent good to video games, personal opinion is the only thing that matters to whether you say it's good or bad. I'm not willing to say a videogame I think is bad, is good, just because a bunch of other people think it is.

What I think needs to be recognized is that your own opinion isn't of more value than someone else's. Me thinking a game is bad doesn't mean someone else is wrong to think it is good. That's why these threads or posts saying something is overrated is frustrating, you're essentially saying your opinion is the correct one for no other reason than you didn't like it.
 

Jay_AD

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,926
Generally if something is revered and a lot of people like it, it is likely that there's something to it, even if your opinion differs from that. It's probably not overrated - accept their enjoyment as genuine.

It's a good rule of thumb to live by. Makes you a more likable person.

Signed: someone who hasn't enjoyed a Mega Man game in their life, and it's not for lack of trying.
 

skeezx

Member
Oct 27, 2017
20,562
my hot take is Mega Man would be a better game if you could hold the button to continually fire the base weapon

back in the day most folk played mega man on a NES Max controller that did basically this. i think the ps2/xbox/gcn collection had an option to do this, i forget if the newer collections have this option
 

XaviConcept

Art Director for Videogames
Verified
Oct 25, 2017
5,079
I kind of disagree. I don't think there is an inherent good to video games, personal opinion is the only thing that matters to whether you say it's good or bad. I'm not willing to say a videogame I think is bad, is good, just because a bunch of other people think it is.

What I think needs to be recognized is that your own opinion isn't of more value than someone else's. Me thinking a game is bad doesn't mean someone else is wrong to think it is good. That's why these threads or posts saying something is overrated is frustrating, you're essentially saying your opinion is the correct one for no other reason than you didn't like it.

If you want to go to those lengths yes, you're correct, this is ALL opinion based and we have no real truth behind our opinion when we say that Ocarina of Time is good and Sonic 06 is not.

However, we do operate under a certain set of agreed upon "rules" when it comes to certain qualities and most artistic professions need to lean on them when they make products and want them to be perceived as good or best. Its very hard to make games, or art for that matter, with the attitude of "well thats just an opinion" There are rules for a reason and there are also reasons to bend and break those rules in order to try and achieve a yet unfound new level of quality.

Theres many games I love that I know are not very good. Its healthy to disassociate the two things! The belief of "I like this so it must be good" can be destructive because then you start associating your sense of self to thinking something is good just because you like it so if somebody doesnt like it, that means they dont like "you" either. This happens all the time in sports, in games, tv shows, this forum etc. Sometimes the two meet, Mario 64 is really good AND I really like it, and sometimes its OK to admit that NieR was kind of a shitty game and I love it regardless

This is, of course, just an opinion ;)
 

KeyChainDude

Member
Oct 28, 2017
714
Never enjoyed the main series as much, but the Megaman X and Zero series are between the best action platformers of their era. Megaman X5 and Zero 3 are my favorites.

That said, I definitely agree that when it comes to popularity, the brand recognition is not as strong as people would think in enthusiast forums.
 

nded

Member
Nov 14, 2017
10,748
So what other games should we be recognizing? A thread about giving attention to obscure but quality games would be more interesting than complaining about people liking Mega Man.
 

kamineko

Linked the Fire
Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,808
Accardi-by-the-Sea
I'm just glad we have TC to shatter the pasteboard mask that is megaman's "undeserving recognition"

that most brutal of zero-sum games, recognition
 

Ernest

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,716
So.Cal.
MM series had more great games than bad games, along with plenty of good games.
So yeah, with that track record, it should be pretty well "recognized" as an overall good franchise, better than most - certainly among those that have been around as long and have had as many games.
 

night814

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 29, 2017
15,121
Pennsylvania
Actually the opposite.

For example, the Final Fantasy community would be eager to love Final Fantasy 1. But in those same breaths, people also admit that Final Fantasy 1 didn't set the sales charts on fire, and didn't hit the mainstream a bit. FF1 sold a similar amount to many of the NES Mega Man games. The same thing applies, I feel like Mega Man fans have been somewhat accepted to be a mainstream NES game, when it wasn't big compared to its contemporaries.

I love FF1, but I am not afraid to admit it was old, archaic, and used to be quite a niche series back when it released.

In discourse in the community, I know many people are surprised of Mega Man's sales numbers, because gaming publications and fans conveyed it to be bigger than it is.
Sales especially from the late 80s-90s are such a dumb way to judge games, video game rentals were the way a ton of people played these games. They may not have owned stuff like Mega Man 1-6 or Mega Man X 1-3 but they definitely played it, at local stores and chains like blockbuster/planet Hollywood the Mega Man games were ALWAYS out similar to other heavy hitters at the time like Mario, Zelda, and Final Fantasy. The kind of games like mega man could be beat in like 1-2 hours tops so it also lended itself to being a rental instead of a buy, and this should not be used as proof whether the series is disserving of it's recognition or not.
 

HustleBun

Member
Nov 12, 2017
6,077
It's seriously "Creep is the only good Radiohead song" levels of basic
That's such a perfect analogy. Nicely done.

It's the kind of thing that someone says and you can go "got it, you're not even trying, you're just being dismissive" and immediately disregard everything else they have to say.

All the mainline Mega Man games are varying levels of good-great. A few Mega Man X games are poor but they're otherwise some level of good-great (X6 & X7 being the biggest blemishes). The Legends games and BN are considered great with some mixed opinions on 4.
 

scare_crow

Member
Oct 28, 2017
6,360
Hey now, I was actually correct in my assumption in that thread. A majority of people liked the Gameboy over the NES. Get over yourself, it's not an attack on you or anything. The reason I stopped replying, was simply because the discussion was dying down, and I didn't want to prolong and bump the thread.

We are getting way off topic now, but yeah, I just wanted to say that.

There are a lot of things, that older folks will tell younger folks in games. Megaman was influential and one of the best series on NES, SNES, ect. Even modern assumptions like, "bloodborne is amazing" to shut down criticism to people who simply don't like it.

I really like challenging the conventions of these notions and seeing whether people agree, because there is often a silent majority. Gaming has changed since you grew up, and tastes have as well. I think merely the notion that we can look at series critically, and see for example, that Megaman barely pushed the needle sales wise, and was barely existent in Europe as well is really important.

Instead of people feeling crazy for thinking the same as I do, I have seen a lot of people come up in my threads and be like, oh yeah, I feel like that. Or it challenges their notions, or people just hate me. Anyone of these responses are fine, but I think it's really important discussions to have nonetheless.
"I'm just asking questions!"

None of this is as interesting as you seem to think. "ACTUALLY, this series that a lot of people like ISN'T good!" isn't some masters level thesis.
 

Astral

Member
Oct 27, 2017
28,821
I don't understand the purpose of this thread. Undeserving recognition? That implies people shouldn't like it because actually it sucks so they're wrong and OP is right.
 

Jave

Member
Oct 30, 2017
2,863
Chile
After going through this thread I'm tempted to buy MMX Legacy Collection 2 just to see how bad X6, X7 and X8 are.
 
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