MGSV is the best controlling third-person shooter ever made. Nothing comes close.
- Thread starter vestan
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i don't like the shooting in mgs5 either but from some gameplay trailer thet i watch the shooting in wildlands looks like shit.
a couple of pre-canned animation when you hit the enemy, bad ragdoll etc.
never heard of anyone praising the shooting in that game tbh...
These topics are always weird to me because so many people keep listing games that have BAD or unresponsive controls.
The one thing that Metal Gear Solid V did well was that its transitions between stances were very nice and did not interrupt movement.
But it does so many important things wrong:
Though perhaps less-so than previous Metal Gear Solid games, the controls are still very convoluted. I installed the game again to check that my memories of it were correct, and I had to stop and look up how to get into first-person mode, and how to roll.
The game does not support mixed gamepad + mouse input. You either have to deal with the doubly complex keyboard binds for control if you want to use a mouse for aiming, or you're stuck using an analog stick to aim.
Aiming sensitivity varies depending on the weapon you are using, and whether you are aiming or zooming. Sensitivity is also linked to frame rate.
Resident Evil 6 has no way to disable mouse acceleration, and I haven't played it enough to know if there's anything else it gets wrong.
I don't know how people can say that a game is a good third-person shooter when the most basic of all things—the aiming controls—are completely unreliable.
No, wait, this is.
There are still many situations in MGSV where it feels like you're being held back by or locked into animations though, which is a big part in why I generally dislike third-person games.
Gears has the player glitching out by magnetizing between two walls back and forth. Maybe it takes skill to look that stupid, but it still looks stupid.
Unfortunately Remedy's newer games don't play like that at all, and Quantum Break was a huge disappointment to play on PC.
Great post though. It makes me think that I should get around to playing Splinter Cell: Blacklist some time.
The one thing that Metal Gear Solid V did well was that its transitions between stances were very nice and did not interrupt movement.
But it does so many important things wrong:
Though perhaps less-so than previous Metal Gear Solid games, the controls are still very convoluted. I installed the game again to check that my memories of it were correct, and I had to stop and look up how to get into first-person mode, and how to roll.
The game does not support mixed gamepad + mouse input. You either have to deal with the doubly complex keyboard binds for control if you want to use a mouse for aiming, or you're stuck using an analog stick to aim.
Aiming sensitivity varies depending on the weapon you are using, and whether you are aiming or zooming. Sensitivity is also linked to frame rate.
Mouse input is completely broken in Vanquish, with forced acceleration, multiple sensitivity sliders, and each weapon having its own sensitivity, so it's disqualified by default.I love how MGSV controls, Vanquish though:
For me personally the tightest controls in a TPS.
Resident Evil 6 has no way to disable mouse acceleration, and I haven't played it enough to know if there's anything else it gets wrong.
I don't know how people can say that a game is a good third-person shooter when the most basic of all things—the aiming controls—are completely unreliable.
That's the jankiest player movement I've ever seen.
No, wait, this is.
That's a demonstration of how the animations blend nicely without really limiting player control/responsiveness too much in MGSV.
There are still many situations in MGSV where it feels like you're being held back by or locked into animations though, which is a big part in why I generally dislike third-person games.
Gears has the player glitching out by magnetizing between two walls back and forth. Maybe it takes skill to look that stupid, but it still looks stupid.
I think the first two Max Payne games still feel great to play today because they are nearly entirely focused on input priority rather than animation priority, and play a lot more like a first-person game than most third-person shooters do now.
Unfortunately Remedy's newer games don't play like that at all, and Quantum Break was a huge disappointment to play on PC.
Great post though. It makes me think that I should get around to playing Splinter Cell: Blacklist some time.
Alan Wake marked a strange turning poing for Remedy where it felt like their games were being designed in a way that de-emphasized aiming to an absurd degree. It was like you were playing darts, and then someone replaced the whole game with those giant foam darts on a velcro board. I really hope Control brings back some of that crispness of Max Payne 2.
You should def. appreciate the Gears 3 wallbounce -
However bad this stuff may look to you, it's an example of designers prioritizing control over slick looking animation, which makes Gears fun to play.
It's definitely skillful for multiplayer bouts, but as far as single-player goes, it's absolute garbage and shows a clear lack of fine-tuned balance between immersion and gameplay.
Lol what? You're going to fault the game because you had to look at/forgot the controls? And knocking it because you can't play with a controller in one hand and a mouse the other? Lot of straight up bizzare points and hyperbole to unpack here.
It's not even really applicable in SP. You don't need sweaty movement like that to avoid enemy AI as they can't get confused by unpredictable movement patterns like a human controlled enemy would. But even then, I'll take control of my character over prioritizing animation for immersions sake any day.
MGSV does it infinitely better though, you have perfect control of your character without breaking immersion and sliding on some invisible ice skates like a morron.
I was late getting a PS4, so my initial MGSV experience was on the PS3 -- loved it but once I picked up a PS4, I picked up Ground Zeroes and Phantom Pain for it and it is like night & day -- 60 fps is a game changer in the way the game controls and plays.
That's not about "control" - it's abusing the game mechanics to pinball off the walls by breaking the cover system because it snaps the players to walls at unrealistic speeds.
I've already acknowledged that it may take skill to do, but it's absolutely ridiculous looking, and is not indicative of the type of "control" that people are talking about.
If you can't see the difference between Gears' glitched wall bouncing and the Metal Gear Solid V videos posted earlier in this topic, which demonstrate how the game lets the player run around like crazy, but still manages to blend animations smoothly without taking control away from the player, I don't know what to tell you.
The key binds are so bad that I had to look them up to find out what they were because I could not figure it out.
The way to enter first person mode is to hold down the right mouse button and press '3'.
3, which switches to your third weapon slot when pressed, or apparently also brings up the binoculars when held. And 'V' is the key they use to switch zoom.
The gameplay controls and its menu interface are a complete mess like that. With a controller, the binds make a lot more sense, but they're still very convoluted.
As for gamepad + mouse input, no I am not holding a gamepad in one hand and a mouse in the other - though it's certainly viable with a Joy-Con or PlayStation Navigation Controller.
Gamepad + mouse input is used for gyro input with a Steam Controller, DualShock 4, Switch Pro Controller, or the Steam Controller's touchpad.
Without it you have to emulate an analog stick - which typically means less responsive controls, acceleration, limited turning speeds, limited precision, auto-aim, and more.
MGSV is an excellent game, perhaps one of the best ones ever made. And a lot of it is down to the game mechanics and how it controls, but to say it's a better shooter than MP3 is something I completely disagree with. It being 60fps does make the movement even more fluid, but there's nothing more satisfying than filling enemies with lead in the Max Payne 3.
This is an interesting take, but I'm certainly not going to question it. Personally, I think in terms of a "shooter" the simplicity of Splatoon makes it pretty good.
I mean Vanquish was made for a controller and as someone who always prefers using a controller when possible (except FPS) it feels like a dream and is the best in the genre next to MGSV. Cant expect M and K to be the default best way to play any game with aiming even if it sacrifices accuracy because the game was designed with that in mind but obviously you cant not have M and K included for a PC port.
It's a third-person shooter with broken aiming. Maybe the movement feels really good with analog sticks, but I don't see how anyone can claim that it's a good third-person shooter when the aiming is broken.
I have repeatedly agreed with you that it takes skill to pull off wall bouncing. Where I disagree is that you seem to think it is a good mechanic, and don't seem to think that it looks completely broken.
Just because they have embraced it as part of their gameplay does not change that it looks completely broken with the character model bouncing off invisible walls.
Did you read what I said? Its not broken it was made for a controller, you should try it on controller and see how good it feels. The game was affected badly by the pc port in many ways but I get what you mean, I guess Vanquish has the best gameplay loop of any tps and MGSV has the best controls.
Analog sticks are inherently bad for aiming, and if a game only works with those it does not control well.
the alt control scheme was in 2 as well iirc
i think og gow1 was the one that didnt have it
It is about control. Even if you think wallbouncing is a glitch or exploit, it demonstrates that the cover system of the Gears games is fast, responsive, and most of all consistent enough for the player to a trust their input will result in their character moving where they want them to. Just because you don't like the lack of animation blending for a tactic only useful in MP (where immersion and realism don't matter) doesn't mean it's not valid to say it shows the precise control the game gives you.
