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MI: El Sayed, who accused opponent of money laundering, caught in campaign finance SNAFU

Armaros

Armaros

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Oct 25, 2017
4,902
daegan said:
Here's the rub: it's disingenuous at best to imply that the only reason anyone would see a candidate on the receiving end of $500k in untraceable money would be because of gender and not because it's well-reported that their campaign is going to benefit from $500k in untraceable money
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I haven't said anything about the sexism.

Im addressing Sayed's myrid of defender and their blatant hypocrisy of letting him off with nothing. His defenders cant even muster a brief raised eyebrow of his own issues. While screaming about Campaign finance issues.

Which seems to be a pattern in these elections lately.
 
daegan

daegan

#REFANTAZIO SWEEP
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Oct 27, 2017
2,948
Armaros said:
I haven't said anything about the sexism.

Im addressing Sayed's myrid of defender and their blatant hypocrisy of letting him off with nothing. His defenders cant even muster a brief raised eyebrow of his own issues.

Which seems to be a pattern in these elections lately.
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then why did you even quote my post when it wasn't doing that and I said in this very thread its not a good look for him
 
Thorn

Thorn

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Oct 25, 2017
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Armaros said:
I haven't said anything about the sexism.

Im addressing Sayed's myrid of defender and their blatant hypocrisy of letting him off with nothing. His defenders cant even muster a brief raised eyebrow of his own issues. While screaming about Campaign finance issues.

Which seems to be a pattern in these elections lately.
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While screaming about Campaign Issues? I would not have even heard about Whitmer's Shadow Money without this thread bringing it up to attack Sayed.

I bet you most Sayed voters care more about Healthcare than that issue.
 
Armaros

Armaros

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Oct 25, 2017
4,902
Thorn said:
While screaming about Campaign Issues? I would not have even heard about Whitmer's Shadow Money without this thread bringing it up to attack Sayed.

I bet you most Sayed voters care more about Healthcare than that issue.
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So you haven't paid attention to this very thread?
 
Clipjoint

Clipjoint

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Oct 27, 2017
157
Autodidact said:
El Sayed himself has said she didn't commit a crime:


The article says he may have committed a crime if they can prove coordination among his campaign, the individual donors, and the Super PAC. Just like all my posts have said.

His accusing her of committing a crime (and then retracting!) and then having possibly committed one himself is the definition of glass houses and stones.
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Can you name one thing El Sayed has done that Whitmer herself hasn't done with regards to PAC donations? One single thing?
 
Kayla

Kayla

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Oct 28, 2017
2,316
PolERA is weird, you guys intentionally post stuff like this to antagonize the "bernie bros" "omg i need to make a thread about this in OT" "Make the thread guys!"

Anyway i still like the guy's policies. Medicare for all, 15 dollar min wage. Sounds good to me.
 
Thorn

Thorn

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Oct 25, 2017
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kaylaz said:
PolERA is weird, you guys intentionally post stuff like this to antagonize the "bernie bros" "omg i need to make a thread about this in OT" "Make the thread guys!"

Anyway i still like the guy's policies. Medicare for all, 15 dollar min wage. Sounds good to me.
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And then talk shit about us in PoliERA behind our back as if we don't read PoliERA too.
 

Deleted member 22490

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Can I just point out how funny that snafu is in all caps in the title? It's so whimsical.

edit: fixed my typo SNAFU
 
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Kaitos

Kaitos

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Oct 25, 2017
14,833
I'd probably vote for Whitmer if I lived in Michigan, and have thought that for a while. I kind of think this type of thing is... stupid. I don't really care what El Sayed or Whitmer did in this instance because neither of it seems very important or interesting beyond both camps trying to get a hit on the other.
 
ebs

ebs

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Oct 27, 2017
443
Autodidact said:
Again:

The woman has for sure not committed a crime. The man may have committed one and falsely accused her of committing one. Yet people are twisting themselves to say what she did was worse because it should be illegal, or because she took more money, or because what she did is shadier.

That's a double standard. I think it's powered at least partly by ingrained cultural sexism, especially vis-a-vis women who seek power. You may think differently, but I don't see how you can deny it's a double standard of some sort.
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1. I'm not that familiar with the situation, what's the evidence that he committed a crime? I believe it's a crime if the contributor and the PAC had an agreement to transfer that money to a campaign, is there evidence which points to this?

2. I don't think there's any twisting people just have different ethical standpoints. You seem to be very duty ethicist because your posts all point to the illegality of the actions as the primary objection to them. On the one hand we have untraceable, anonymous donations through a system which circumvents the maximum amount allowed by individuals. On the other we have traceable donations through that same system which circumvents the maximum amount allowed by individuals. I think ethically it's obvious which one is worse. The fact that one is legal and the other illegal is a problem that should be addressed.
 
Cipherr

Cipherr

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Oct 26, 2017
13,529
aeolist said:
the scare quotes around progressive and centrist in the OP are ridiculous, even if el sayed were comically corrupt and whitmer were clean as a whistle their respective policy positions are accurately represented by those terms
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What's ridiculous is how many people are trying to attack the OP for bullshit like quotation marks to take the attention away from what's happened. I don't know if you realize it but its NOT WORKING. This shit is a bad look, and no amount of "Hey look over there!" is going to distract from that. I mean damn. Threw everything at the OP from "So what its 80 grand!" to "You are racist for pointing this out" in an attempt to drag the conversation into the mud.

Midnight Jon said:
this thread so far: "campaign finance violations are okay if you're sufficiently Progressive"
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Good lord, you aren't lying...
 

Deleted member 14459

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It would be easier to engage and assume good faith if the OP would not go out of his way to create a "Bernie-bros" narrative around El-Sayed. The sexism implication is ridiculous and it is not necessary for the critique put forward. El-Sayed's comments are contextualized in the dark money critique - to my understanding no-one is denying that including OP - that critique is tied to a playform issue for a lot of democratic socialists - that corporate political activity and meddling is a real issue and needs to be resisted. That policy issue is not built on sexism and if the OP does not want to back on that claim he should show more data on the claim than linking Bernie to "lock her up".

I have claimed elsewhere that you can find similar language in almost every campaign where corporate donation critique is on the platform - even using signs sharing space with criminal discourse similar to "money laundering". I will give you some examples, Cynthia Nixon recently on Cuomo
"In the corruption Olympics that is Albany, I think Andrew Cuomo is winning himself some gold medals,''
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.

Julia Salazar has called Dilan a vestige of the corrupt Vito Lopez political machine..

Corruption is a crime - does this mean that Nixon is a misogynist whatwith Cuomo being feminist " since his daughter was born"?
 
tuxfool

tuxfool

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Oct 25, 2017
5,858
Thorn said:
Would it help if I didn't particularly care about Whitners donation thing also and will happily vote for her if she she wins ?
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No.

Because some people won't. We shouldn't be OK with campaigns polluting the discourse with falsehoods, or accusations which though easily retracted stick to candidates no matter what.
 

Copper

Banned
Nov 13, 2017
666
Just to provide another point of view on the narrative, since it looks like it's needed:

https://www.politico.com/story/2018...-sayed-ocasio-cortez-sanders-democrats-762409

"Four days out, things can get heated," El-Sayed tweeted Friday. "I admire [Whitmer and] the vigorous debate we share. While I deeply disagree on health care [and] corporate money in politics, I admire her work [and] commitment to serve. We will walk in lockstep, whoever wins, to a blue wave in November."
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manchego obfuscator

manchego obfuscator

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Rupetta said:
It would be easier to engage and assume good faith if the OP would not go out of his way to create a "Bernie-bros" narrative around El-Sayed. The sexism implication is ridiculous and it is not necessary for the critique put forward. El-Sayed's comments are contextualized in the dark money critique - to my understanding no-one is denying that including OP - that critique is tied to a playform issue for a lot of democratic socialists - that corporate political activity and meddling is a real issue and needs to be resisted. That policy issue is not built on sexism and if the OP does not want to back on that claim he should show more data on the claim than linking Bernie to "lock her up".

I have claimed elsewhere that you can find similar language in almost every campaign where corporate donation critique is on the platform - even using signs sharing space with criminal discourse similar to "money laundering". I will give you some examples, Cynthia Nixon recently on Cuomo .

Julia Salazar has called Dilan a vestige of the corrupt Vito Lopez political machine..

Corruption is a crime - does this mean that Nixon is a misogynist whatwith Cuomo being feminist " since his daughter was born"?
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Any criticism from the left of establishment-aligned Democrats who happen to be women or POC is sexist and racist. Any criticism of leftist candidates who happen to be women or POC is just fine, because those candidates are on Those Evil Leftists' team.

That's how tribalism works. You don't need a coherent or well-reasoned rationale to hate the other side, because grievance and resentment is the entire point.
 
DrROBschiz

DrROBschiz

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Oct 25, 2017
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Kirblar said:
Germany Switzerland and The Netherlands all have healthcare for all.

None of them have single payer.
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The dutch system is becoming worse and worse. Majority of the public wants reform, many even back to single payer.

We only get mainstream politicians promoting things for American journalists because our rankings are still high, high because we did so well putting in the infrastructure when we were single payer. Not sure about Switzerland and Germany.
 
whytemyke

whytemyke

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Oct 28, 2017
3,798
Kaitos said:
I'd probably vote for Whitmer if I lived in Michigan, and have thought that for a while. I kind of think this type of thing is... stupid. I don't really care what El Sayed or Whitmer did in this instance because neither of it seems very important or interesting beyond both camps trying to get a hit on the other.
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This is also a really good point. The people that will actually care about this issue, I think, have probably already had their minds made up about who they were voting for in the primary for a few weeks now.

Like I said earlier in the thread-- this originally was published by the Detroit News which is the conservative paper in Detroit. It's not done to inform anyone voting in the Democratic primary; it was done to give the Republican winner something to fire off the moment they win their primary on Tuesday.

Democrats being divided by this kind of silly garbage is just playing into their hands.
 
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