I dont think there is a breakfast place anywhere in the Carolinas that doesnt serve grits and biscuits and gravy.
I mean, you could use the title once and refer to the child as "the baby," unless there is more than one baby in the film, I guess. If I was telling someone I read Tom Sawyer, I probably wouldn't refer to Jim as "Nigger Jim."I'm not defending OP's boss but how would you say the title of this image:
This is just factually wrong.Why y'all keep saying she didn't use tar baby in a racial context?
It's a racial slur for black children. It has no other context.
It should go without saying that referring to a black person as a tar baby is blatantly racist. But there's nothing racist about the term itself or the story behind it.Variations on the tar-baby legend are found in the folklore of more than one culture. In the Journal of American Folklore, Aurelio M. Espinosa examined 267 versions of the tar-baby story.[1] The next year, Archer Taylor added a list of tarbaby stories from more sources around the world, citing scholarly claims of its earliest origins in India and Iran.[2] Espinosa later published documentation on tarbaby stories from a variety of language communities around the world.[3]
A very similar West African tale is told of the mythical hero Anansi the Spider. In this version, Anansi creates a wooden doll and covers it over with gum, then puts a plate of yams in its lap, in order to capture the she-fairy Mmoatia (sometimes described as an "elf" or "dwarf"). Mmoatia takes the bait and eats the yams, but grows angry when the doll does not respond and strikes it, becoming stuck in the process.
In The Bahamas, the Tar-Baby story was published by The Journal of American Folklore in the year 1891 in Some Tales from Bahama Folk-Lore by Charles Lincoln Edwards. Edwards had collected the stories from Green Turtle Cay, Abaco in the summer of 1888.
In the tale, B' Rabby refused to dig for water, and didn't help grow the field. He tricks B' Lizard and B' Bouki while they were standing watch by the water and the field. The other animals got tired of his tricks, got together and created a Tar Baby. B' Rabby was caught by Tar Baby and the other animals who wanted to throw him into the sea but he talked them into throwing him into a bush. They threw B' Rabby into the bush and he got away.[4]
In a variant recorded in Jamaica, Anansi himself was once similarly trapped with a tar-baby made by the eldest son of Mrs. Anansi, after Anansi pretended to be dead in order to steal her peas.[5] In a Spanish language version told in the mountainous parts of Colombia, an unnamed rabbit is trapped by the Muñeco de Brea (tar doll). A Buddhist myth tells of Prince Five-weapons (the Future Buddha) who encounters the ogre Sticky-Hair in a forest.[6][7][8]
The tar-baby theme is present in the folklore of various tribes of Meso-America and of South America: it is found in such stories[9] as the Nahuatl (of Mexico) "Lazy Boy and Little Rabbit" (González Casanova 1946, pp. 55–67), Pipil (of El Salvador) "Rabbit and Little Fox" (Schultes 1977, pp. 113–116), and Palenquero (of Colombia) "Rabbit, Toad, and Tiger" (Patiño Rosselli 1983, pp. 224–229). In Mexico, the tar baby story is also found among Mixtec,[10] Zapotec,[11] and Popoluca.[12][13] In North America, the tale appears in White Mountain Apache lore as "Coyote Fights a Lump of Pitch".[14] In this story, white men are said to have erected the pitch-man that ensnares Coyote.
According to James Mooney in "Myths of the Cherokee",[15] the tar-baby story may have been influenced in America by the Cherokee "Tar Wolf" story, considered unlikely to have been derived from similar African stories: "Some of these animal stories are common to widely separated [Native American] tribes among whom there can be no suspicion of [African] influences. Thus the famous "tar baby" story has variants, not only among the Cherokee, but also in New Mexico, Washington [State], and southern Alaska—wherever, in fact, the pine supplies enough gum to be molded into a ball for [Native American] uses...".
In the Tar Wolf story, the animals were thirsty during a dry spell, and agreed to dig a well. The lazy rabbit refused to help dig, and so had no right to drink from the well. But she was thirsty, and stole from the well at night. The other animals fashioned a wolf out of tar and placed it near the well to scare the thief. The rabbit was scared at first, but when the tar wolf did not respond to her questions, she struck it and was held fast. Then she struggled with it and became so ensnared that she couldn't move. The next morning, the animals discovered the rabbit and proposed various ways of killing her, such as cutting her head off, and the rabbit responded to each idea saying that it would not harm her. Then an animal suggested throwing the rabbit into the thicket to die. At this, the rabbit protested vigorously and pleaded for her life. The animals threw the rabbit into the thicket. The rabbit then gave a whoop and bounded away, calling out to the other animals "This is where I live!".
Disney definitely knew Song of the South was racist when they were making it. They hired screenwriters to tone it down. And when it released in the '40s, it was met with protests and backlash for its racism.
Isn't the context that it was said in the same timeframe as a complaint about things being too pc?
I hear you, like I said I'm not defending the boss because there is clearly something fishy. But to say there is no context where using it isn't racist is false. It's a proper noun AND a racist slur.I mean, you could use the title once and refer to the child as "the baby," unless there is more than one baby in the film, I guess. If I was telling someone I read Tom Sawyer, I probably wouldn't refer to Jim as "Nigger Jim."
Sounds like he was racist as well....Brer Rabbit is a figure from African American folklore. He has no known author or creator.
Brer Rabbit waspopularized by Joel Chandler Harris though, who ostensibly created the Uncle Remus character found in the frame story of Song of the South.
Interesting, I hadn't heard any of that. I do know that the film has a very complicated history (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Song_of_the_South#Release) including its release in segregated Atlanta.Disney definitely knew Song of the South was racist when they were making it. They hired screenwriters to tone it down. And when it released in the '40s, it was met with protests and backlash for its racism.
The film is most problematic because it sugar coats plantation life and tries to make a fairy tale out of Civil War era America. Technically it's set after the Civil War and Uncle Remus is free, but there are still strong allusions to the master/slave dynamic even if they don't explicitly say that. Personally, I don't fault people that grew up with it and not understanding the racial implications. American schools did (and still do) a horrible job of depicting the harsh realities of slavery. For them, Song of the South is just another typical day on the plantation where blacks and whites coexisted harmoniously.
But I do think Disney should release this film. It's a historical piece of cinema and animation, and it serves as a lesson for the dangers of minimizing the effects of slavery and why it's important to teach history with all of its harsh realities and human travesties.
This is just factually wrong.
It should go without saying that referring to a black person as a tar baby is blatantly racist. But there's nothing racist about the term itself or the story behind it.
Look at this review:
If the name is so meaningless, why do people fight tooth and nail to say it? This whole situation is like when people cry about not being able to rap along to the n-word.
There's nothing racist about the term "monkey" but it is clearly racist to call a black person a monkey.If there's nothing racist about the term, why is it racist to call a black person a tar baby?
Make sense
i think it's more "hi racism is wrong, but we don't want OP to to get fired for going to HR when his probably racist boss said questionable, most likely racist things, but in a roundaway enough way that if you squint and look at it from a certain angle, it can be seen as not racist, which gives management plausible deniability to give OP trouble for making the complaint."
Huh, interesting. I grew up with this children's book and always remembered it as one of my favorites when I was younger:
This is literally the first time I've ever heard of it being used (or thought of) in a racist way. The point of the story (to me) wasn't that the tar was black, but that it was sticky.
Reminds me when my boss referred to rap and rnb as "black music", gasped because she said it post-1970, then doubled down with justifying herself.
It should be pointed out that the creater of the tar baby character was created by a white man who apprenticed on a slave plantation.This is just factually wrong.
It should go without saying that referring to a black person as a tar b
This is just factually wrong.
It should go without saying that referring to a black person as a tar baby is blatantly racist. But there's nothing racist about the term itself or the story behind it.
aby is blatantly racist. But there's nothing racist about the term itself or the story behind it.
How can you look at this and not see the racist imagery? Blows my mind of the ignorance on display.
I hear it used quite a bit by my in laws. I don't consider them racist.
tar ba·by
noun
informal
- 1.
a difficult problem that is only aggravated by attempts to solve it.
Sentences like this show how it isn't just a bit of a whistle, but the best, most effective type.
Guess what? If people tell you something is a whistle, and your first thought is how it could be but it might not be in specific situations, then you have fallen for it.
No it wasn't. This character predated both the author and the movie.It should be pointed out that the creater of the tar baby character was created by a white man who apprenticed on a slave plantation.
If there's nothing racist about the term, why is it racist to call a black person a tar baby?
Make sense
Until this thread I had no idea "Tar Baby" was used as a slur. I've only ever heard of it in context of the Brer Rabbit story. (Grew up near DC)Hello resetera, I feel like I really need to talk about this, in my office yesterday somehow the subject of children's films came up and my direct superior mentioned how she loved Disney's "Song of the South." When asked about the plot she only explained the "Brer Rabbit and the Tar Baby" portion. In this explanation she used the phrase "tar baby" atleast 30 times and complained about how she Hate's the the world is "too PC" for it to be rereleased. I really couldn't believe what was happening. I really don't know why I'm bringing this up but I have to tell someone, I mean what should I do?
I'm not sure how progressive you can expect someone born in like 1846 to be, though there is plenty of debate as to whether or not the Uncle Remus frame stories are intended to subvert traditional white Southern values or merely reinforce them. Remus often presents alternative viewpoints or perspectives that would have otherwise been scandalous to audiences of the time.Sounds like he was racist as well....
https://www.google.co.uk/amp/deepso.../the-ironic-life-of-joel-chandler-harris/amp/
The problem in that case is with the usage, not necessarily the term. You could say the same thing about the term "watermelon lover" or whatever racists think is clever these days.If there's nothing racist about the term, why is it racist to call a black person a tar baby?
Make sense
Wait.. Are you saying this image is racist? I might be ignorant, but could you explain how?
This seems to perfectly fit the only definition of the term I ever encountered, I believe in(or while looking up something encountered in) Neil Gaimans "Anansi Boys". A humanoid made of tar, used as a trap for someone picking a fight with it, so the person gets more stuck the more they fight.
It's also a 70 (seventy!) year old movie. Yes its very problematic but its far from the worst racist thing a major Hollywood studio ever did. There are cartoon shorts from around that time that were more racist than Song of the South ever was.Song of the South is hot trash though. You gotta be a special kind of racist to enjoy that.
In modern usage, tar baby refers to any "sticky situation" that is only aggravated by additional involvement with it.
It's also a 70 (seventy!) year old movie. Yes its very problematic but its far from the worst racist thing a major Hollywood studio ever did. There are cartoon shorts from around that time that were more racist than Song of the South ever was.