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Atom

Member
Jul 25, 2021
11,654
Yeah, their pretty aggressive response on the forums towards criticism for Ar Tonelico 2 is probably why I dislike this company so much, and they haven't given us many reasons to think they've changed for the better over a number of years. Good response from you, though!

NISA is a terrible publisher and I'm always amazed at how willing people are to put up with their shit. I guess that's what happens when they have a franchise you like hostage and you have no other recourse.

This is the company after all that, with their first Falcom title in Ys VIII released a translation that was verging on sterile and machine translated at times together with a supremely shoddy port. The situation was so bad that the CEO had to apologize and they had to retranslate and report the game. Like how does a company that leads with this get so much credence?

Just recently they released ports of other games that straight up didn't work on Switch and they banned users from their twitch stream chat for trying to inform others of the problem. When CS4 came out people who preordered certain versions on PS4 couldn't get the game for days. They raised the prices of all their games on steam sometimes up to 100%, with intended effect right after a summer sale to drive fomo purchases on top of changed regional pricing. And they threw Disgaea 6 out at $70 to the worst launch the series has had on PC. I can't find it now but there was a laundry list of every shitty thing NISA has ever done with their properties and this isn't even scratching the surface.

I'll continue to support OG falcom releases and the inevitable 4chan fan translations but am happy reducing my interaction with NISA published products to an absolute minimum or going to the second hand market instead. If that kills the franchise in the west so be it. But it won't, because fan translations were never a big deal and their reaction is unjustifiably disporportionate.

I can't believe some of the excuses in this thread. The CLE port 'stole' marketshare from NISA? Basically none (like 10%, reflecting maybe < 5000 copies) of the reviews are in English. If that's a make or break chunk of users, even assuming nobody double dips, the series shouldn't by all rights be localized in the first place. It's a patch you need to find on 4chan and/or jump through hoops to use a spreadsheet. It's one platform and requires purchasing a non-English version of the game. People will pirate the game more? People who would pirate the game were likely never gonna buy a NISA release regardless and equating piracy to lost sales is just inherently flawed, especially with a fanbase as devoted as Trails where people will often double dip to show official support for the games. If anything you're more likely to see spite piracy of NISA releases from the (again) sliver of people leveraging fan translations.

The sheer contempt that NISA has for fans to not even entertain some kind of dialogue when most of their upcoming Trails slate of releases is only possible because of fans is flabbergasting. It just exposes their hypocrisy: happy to use fan translations when it makes business sense, excessively litigious as soon as they expose how frankly unacceptably poor NISAs turnaround time is compared to every other publisher out there. Even when CLE does the localization after development its far more prompt than anything NISA does. And no other company gets like this with fan TLs. When Live a Live came out, Squeenix didn't go around issuing takedown requests on the old fan TL. If that's too old, back in the day Nintendo wouldn't even go after fan Pokemon TLs ahead of the Western release. The github projects and forum threads for those games are still up! Like it's legit insane that NISA is more litigious over a more niche product than Nintendo was with fucking Pokemon.

The absolute irony of all of this is there is a trivial way for NISA to fix this and it's exactly what they're doing with Nayuta: buy the rights to distribute the Japanese game globally. Put it on Steam years ahead of the official launch with no marketing. Let fans do their fan translations regardless and don't interfere, and down the road NISA can patch in their official script + do the other console releases and the actual marketing cycle. Nayuta already has a fan translation patch available based on the PSP fan TL and NISAs script will supersede that eventually, but in the interim they're not fucking over hardcore fans that just want to play a damn video game.
 

Firima

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,493
NISA is a terrible publisher and I'm always amazed at how willing people are to put up with their shit. I guess that's what happens when they have a franchise you like hostage and you have no other recourse.

This is the company after all that, with their first Falcom title in Ys VIII released a translation that was verging on sterile and machine translated at times together with a supremely shoddy port. The situation was so bad that the CEO had to apologize and they had to retranslate and report the game. Like how does a company that leads with this get so much credence?

Just recently they released ports of other games that straight up didn't work on Switch and they banned users from their twitch stream chat for trying to inform others of the problem. When CS4 came out people who preordered certain versions on PS4 couldn't get the game for days. They raised the prices of all their games on steam sometimes up to 100%, with intended effect right after a summer sale to drive fomo purchases on top of changed regional pricing. And they threw Disgaea 6 out at $70 to the worst launch the series has had on PC. I can't find it now but there was a laundry list of every shitty thing NISA has ever done with their properties and this isn't even scratching the surface.

I'll continue to support OG falcom releases and the inevitable 4chan fan translations but am happy reducing my interaction with NISA published products to an absolute minimum or going to the second hand market instead. If that kills the franchise in the west so be it. But it won't, because fan translations were never a big deal and their reaction is unjustifiably disporportionate.

I can't believe some of the excuses in this thread. The CLE port 'stole' marketshare from NISA? Basically none (like 10%, reflecting maybe < 5000 copies) of the reviews are in English. If that's a make or break chunk of users, even assuming nobody double dips, the series shouldn't by all rights be localized in the first place. It's a patch you need to find on 4chan and/or jump through hoops to use a spreadsheet. It's one platform and requires purchasing a non-English version of the game. People will pirate the game more? People who would pirate the game were likely never gonna buy a NISA release regardless and equating piracy to lost sales is just inherently flawed, especially with a fanbase as devoted as Trails where people will often double dip to show official support for the games. If anything you're more likely to see spite piracy of NISA releases from the (again) sliver of people leveraging fan translations.

The sheer contempt that NISA has for fans to not even entertain some kind of dialogue when most of their upcoming Trails slate of releases is only possible because of fans is flabbergasting. It just exposes their hypocrisy: happy to use fan translations when it makes business sense, excessively litigious as soon as they expose how frankly unacceptably poor NISAs turnaround time is compared to every other publisher out there. Even when CLE does the localization after development its far more prompt than anything NISA does. And no other company gets like this with fan TLs. When Live a Live came out, Squeenix didn't go around issuing takedown requests on the old fan TL. If that's too old, back in the day Nintendo wouldn't even go after fan Pokemon TLs ahead of the Western release. The github projects and forum threads for those games are still up! Like it's legit insane that NISA is more litigious over a more niche product than Nintendo was with fucking Pokemon.

The absolute irony of all of this is there is a trivial way for NISA to fix this and it's exactly what they're doing with Nayuta: buy the rights to distribute the Japanese game globally. Put it on Steam years ahead of the official launch with no marketing. Let fans do their fan translations regardless and don't interfere, and down the road NISA can patch in their official script + do the other console releases and the actual marketing cycle. Nayuta already has a fan translation patch available based on the PSP fan TL and NISAs script will supersede that eventually, but in the interim they're not fucking over hardcore fans that just want to play a damn video game.

I really don't have anything to add, especially anything that hasn't already been iterated countless times in countless other venues regarding NISA's behavior, historically, although I think it's worth examining how NISA really came into their terrible own in the PSP era where people looking for quirkier-than-average Japanese games didn't really have many avenues to do so. This led to a paradigm where people could be royally pissed at them, like with the utterly gross state of the Ar Tonelico 2 release, but weren't really in a position to do much because that audience had few options for those kinds of games, so as long as NISA provided quirky Japanese localizations at a decent clip, they never had to answer for their frequently poor work. It's why we expected terribad localizations for years from that sector of the market, why we tolerated a much, much lower standard for years, why people will go to bat for them for no meaningful reason, and consequently why the CEO's apology for Ys VIII was so shocking. It's much harder to get away with things like that in this day and age, and I hope they find that out the hardest way imaginable.
 

STHX

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
273
For me the Esty Dee thing soured me on every NISA release and I'm still careful about them to this day. It's worse than the "but she is a strong whore" line from the Kuro fantranslation that was posted in this thread and it took years for the Atelier series to recover from the NISA fuckups. The idea that they changed a character name for absolutely no reason simply to make a STD joke for an Atelier game of all things and it passed editing all the way into the final product simply shows their lack of care, and I still don't like how KT never changed it back simply so they didn't have to rerecord the english voice lines for the DX releases
2nd place would be the insane amount of swearing in the PS3 Neptunia Victory translation. Like considering the overall tone of the series imagine playing that game and suddenly hearing one of the girls telling another "shut up you bitch!". The IFI Vita/PC rerelease actually retranslated and redubbed the whole game to remove all the swearing so I guess I wasn't the only one who hated it
 

shimon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,590
NISA is a terrible publisher and I'm always amazed at how willing people are to put up with their shit. I guess that's what happens when they have a franchise you like hostage and you have no other recourse.

This is the company after all that, with their first Falcom title in Ys VIII released a translation that was verging on sterile and machine translated at times together with a supremely shoddy port. The situation was so bad that the CEO had to apologize and they had to retranslate and report the game. Like how does a company that leads with this get so much credence?

Just recently they released ports of other games that straight up didn't work on Switch and they banned users from their twitch stream chat for trying to inform others of the problem. When CS4 came out people who preordered certain versions on PS4 couldn't get the game for days. They raised the prices of all their games on steam sometimes up to 100%, with intended effect right after a summer sale to drive fomo purchases on top of changed regional pricing. And they threw Disgaea 6 out at $70 to the worst launch the series has had on PC. I can't find it now but there was a laundry list of every shitty thing NISA has ever done with their properties and this isn't even scratching the surface.

I'll continue to support OG falcom releases and the inevitable 4chan fan translations but am happy reducing my interaction with NISA published products to an absolute minimum or going to the second hand market instead. If that kills the franchise in the west so be it. But it won't, because fan translations were never a big deal and their reaction is unjustifiably disporportionate.

I can't believe some of the excuses in this thread. The CLE port 'stole' marketshare from NISA? Basically none (like 10%, reflecting maybe < 5000 copies) of the reviews are in English. If that's a make or break chunk of users, even assuming nobody double dips, the series shouldn't by all rights be localized in the first place. It's a patch you need to find on 4chan and/or jump through hoops to use a spreadsheet. It's one platform and requires purchasing a non-English version of the game. People will pirate the game more? People who would pirate the game were likely never gonna buy a NISA release regardless and equating piracy to lost sales is just inherently flawed, especially with a fanbase as devoted as Trails where people will often double dip to show official support for the games. If anything you're more likely to see spite piracy of NISA releases from the (again) sliver of people leveraging fan translations.

The sheer contempt that NISA has for fans to not even entertain some kind of dialogue when most of their upcoming Trails slate of releases is only possible because of fans is flabbergasting. It just exposes their hypocrisy: happy to use fan translations when it makes business sense, excessively litigious as soon as they expose how frankly unacceptably poor NISAs turnaround time is compared to every other publisher out there. Even when CLE does the localization after development its far more prompt than anything NISA does. And no other company gets like this with fan TLs. When Live a Live came out, Squeenix didn't go around issuing takedown requests on the old fan TL. If that's too old, back in the day Nintendo wouldn't even go after fan Pokemon TLs ahead of the Western release. The github projects and forum threads for those games are still up! Like it's legit insane that NISA is more litigious over a more niche product than Nintendo was with fucking Pokemon.

The absolute irony of all of this is there is a trivial way for NISA to fix this and it's exactly what they're doing with Nayuta: buy the rights to distribute the Japanese game globally. Put it on Steam years ahead of the official launch with no marketing. Let fans do their fan translations regardless and don't interfere, and down the road NISA can patch in their official script + do the other console releases and the actual marketing cycle. Nayuta already has a fan translation patch available based on the PSP fan TL and NISAs script will supersede that eventually, but in the interim they're not fucking over hardcore fans that just want to play a damn video game.

Good post, especially the bolded part.
 

lucancel

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,395
Italy
Nothing like antagonizing your own fanbase.
Imho not that good fanbase (i would Say almost toxic lol) since It goes against the only publisher believing in the franchise on the west....but this Is Just me ...
Problem Is when we Will see kuro...2 or 3 years from now Will nisa benefit of switch sales?
but in the interim they're not fucking over hardcore fans that just want to play a damn video game.
This Is not a right of and hardcore fan lol.just a possibility if the ones buying the rights let It.
This Is a big difference.
You can buy learn japanese and buy the original game or you can buy the rights from Falcom an be a Better publisher than nisa.
 
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