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NY Times: Y.A. Author Pulls Her Debut After Pre-Publication Accusations of Racism

BigJeffery

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,338
It is with a heavy heart that I must announce that YA Twitter is at it again:
https://www.nytimes.com/2019/01/31/...ya-author-pulls-debut-accusations-racism.html

After Delacorte sent out advance reader copies, many of the early reviews were positive — the book has a four and a half star rating on Goodreads. But a backlash began brewing this January, when some readers posted blistering critiques on social media. Some readers criticized what they viewed as racial stereotypes and careless borrowing from other cultural traditions: the novel features a diverse cast — including "a tawny-skinned minority of a Russian-esque princess; a disowned and dishonored Asian-esque assassin; an islander/Caribbean-esque child warrior; a Middle-Eastern-esque soldier," according to Ms. Zhao's description of the novel on her website.
Others objected to the way in which Ms. Zhao used slavery as a plot device.

"How is nobody mentioning the anti-blackness and blatant bigotry in this book?" one reader wrote on Goodreads. "This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."
With what seemed like lightning speed in the publishing world, where publicity and marketing plans are crafted months in advance, Ms. Zhao apologized and said she would withdraw the book, which was due out in early June.

In a note to readers, she said she intended to write the novel from her "immediate cultural perspective" and to address the "epidemic of indentured and human trafficking prevalent in many industries across Asia, including in my own home country. The narrative and history of slavery in the United States is not something I can, would or intended to write, but I recognize that I am not writing in merely my own cultural context. I am so sorry for the pain this has caused."
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The story as I understand it:

-Amélie Wen Zhao gets an unprecedented $500,000 for the rights to a trilogy of YA novels. It seems like pretty bog standard YA stuff (young girl has super powers, uses them to fight back against an oppressive regime. I assume at some point she has to make a romantic choice between two partners with vastly different personalities.

-Early copies of the book get out, and the response is pretty good from most people (4.5 stars on Goodreads, but to be fair scores on that site tend to trend on the high side in my experience).

-Some people take issue with parts of the book they see as "problematic," specifically regarding racial stereotypes and its depiction of slavery. People begin riding Zhao about it on Twitter, eventually it gets to the point that she can't take it any more and she withdraws the book (it was due out in June). Whether or not it will ever be published (perhaps after a bunch of rewrites), remains to be seen.

_____________________

I'm having a hard time tracking down actual in text examples of what parts of the book are so objectionable, so I can't really weigh in one way or the other whether or not I think the content in the book was vile enough to justify what happened. I do know that YA readers, especially the adult ones, are INSANELY reactionary, so I'm not particularly willing to give them the benefit of the doubt here.

The only reason I know about this, is because it sparked this response from another YA author on Twitter (click for full thread):


Which seems insane to me. I think some of the most significant works of fiction in ANY medium are rife with problematic material. I think conflating writing about something with endorsing something is indicative of an incredibly simplistic and shallow world view, and I don't think it's much of a coincidence that it's a perspective that seems to be majorly held by people who primarily interface with literature through the YA genre.

What do you guys think?
 

Deleted member 23212

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11,225
It's hard to really understand the full context without having read the source material itself. Are there any excerpts that we can take a look at?
 
andymcc

andymcc

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Oct 25, 2017
26,319
Columbus, OH
I mean, quoting your article above:

"This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."
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If you were being reductive enough, wouldn't this sum up the fuckin X-men?
 
sphagnum

sphagnum

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,058
"This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

X-men?
 
Elodes

Elodes

Looks to the Moon
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Nov 1, 2017
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The Netherlands
BigJeffery said:
Which seems insane to me. I think some of the most significant works of fiction in ANY medium are rife with problematic material. I think conflating writing about something with endorsing something is indicative of an incredibly simplistic and shallow world view, and I don't think it's much of a coincidence that it's a perspective that seems to be majorly held by people who primarily interface with literature through the YA genre.
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Hear hear.

At any rate, since what does and what doesn't qualify as 'problematic' or 'harmful' very often depends wildly on the reader's interpretation of the work, I'll always err heavily on the side of not forbidding a book from being published.
 
Slayven

Slayven

Never read a comic in his life
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Oct 25, 2017
93,210
I need examples, cause the bar is pretty high

12393909.jpg
 
metalslimer

metalslimer

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
9,566
Hard to have a discussion without reading the work really but from the description I dont know if deserves the categorization of racist
 
Border

Border

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Oct 25, 2017
14,859
"This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

Isn't that pretty much the entire premise of the X-Men?
 
Krauser Kat

Krauser Kat

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Oct 27, 2017
1,705
andymcc said:
I mean, quoting your article above:



If you were being reductive enough, wouldn't this sum up the fuckin X-men?
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Xmen leans on the racism and bigotry we know exists in our world by placing it within our own timeline. This made up a new world and tries to equate the two anyway. This is also a story about a single white savior to a bunch of oppressed people.
 
Weiss

Weiss

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Oct 25, 2017
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Having read the article, yeah it seems like an overreaction, especially since the author goes onto say she's basing her writing on slavery in Asia rather than America.
 
OP
OP

BigJeffery

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,338
Oheao said:
It's hard to really understand the full context without having read the source material itself. Are there any excerpts that we can take a look at?
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I've done some cursory Twitter searching, but couldn't track any down. If anyone manages to find any confirmed excerpts, I'll add them to the OP.
 
L Thammy

L Thammy

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Oct 25, 2017
50,076
The description sounds less to me like blatant racism and more like a bad analogy.
 

Deleted member 11413

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Oct 27, 2017
22,961
That whole diatribe about slavery featuring in a fictional, fantasy setting makes me think said person needs to read N.K. Jemisin's The Broken Earth trilogy.

Obviously I haven't read this particular YA novel, but that criticism would apply equally to Jemisin's work but would completely miss the point of the work, that just because someone has powers that are potentially dangerous doesn't justify denying their humanity and subjugating them to slavery.

Also slavery as a concept and as a historical and current source of trauma is not solely a Black American thing...as Zhao clearly points out in her response.
 
Cels

Cels

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Oct 26, 2017
6,781
i guess if the x-men were enslaved...

Some readers criticized what they viewed as racial stereotypes and careless borrowing from other cultural traditions: the novel features a diverse cast — including "a tawny-skinned minority of a Russian-esque princess; a disowned and dishonored Asian-esque assassin; an islander/Caribbean-esque child warrior; a Middle-Eastern-esque soldier," according to Ms. Zhao's description of the novel on her website.
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i don't really see a problem with this either
 
Zoe

Zoe

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Oct 25, 2017
14,276
Krauser Kat said:
Xmen leans on the racism and bigotry we know exists in our world by placing it within our own timeline. This made up a new world and tries to equate the two anyway. This is also a story about a single white savior to a bunch of oppressed people.
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But the lead character sounds brown.
 

Deleted member 32374

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Border said:
"This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

Isn't that pretty much the entire premise of the X-Men?
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Yes but the X-Men is ultra up front about it.

My fav magneto was a holocaust victim.
 
NewDonkStrong

NewDonkStrong

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Nov 7, 2017
1,990
I guess she could release v.1 everywhere else in the world and then have an editor cut a special America version.
 

Deleted member 14518

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,731
Someone writing from their own culture and experience pissing off someone in another. Its a tough one, but considering it is her debut and negative press could completely sink it I can understand why they would can it for "re-writes", and probably just publish it in a year or so.
 
Weiss

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Krauser Kat said:
Xmen leans on the racism and bigotry we know exists in our world by placing it within our own timeline. This made up a new world and tries to equate the two anyway. This is also a story about a single white savior to a bunch of oppressed people.
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Unless the cover is lying to me the main character isn't white.

Anyway one of the reviews quoted makes some points like how a black character makes a heroic sacrifice for the lead, or how the only disabled character is a villain.
 

Deleted member 8860

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andymcc said:
I mean, quoting your article above:



If you were being reductive enough, wouldn't this sum up the fuckin X-men?
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You really have to read the book as a whole.

Speaking generally, there are a host of problematic (and potentially problematic) pre-published (ARCs, etc.) YA novels that come through my house and posting snippets or summaries doesn't make for productive discussion of their issues with the general internet population. Thankfully review committee discussion does address these issue (to an extent; there is sometimes disagreement on the fetishization of "exotic" cultures) — and while it doesn't stop the books from being published or cause rewrites, it serves to "de-platform" the books at libraries and schools, as well as with award committees and bookstores.

BigJeffery said:
Which seems insane to me. I think some of the most significant works of fiction in ANY medium are rife with problematic material. I think conflating writing about something with endorsing something is indicative of an incredibly simplistic and shallow world view, and I don't think it's much of a coincidence that it's a perspective that seems to be majorly held by people who primarily interface with literature through the YA genre.
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I think you're selling YA readers and critics short here.
 
SageShinigami

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Oct 27, 2017
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"How is nobody mentioning the anti-blackness and blatant bigotry in this book?" one reader wrote on Goodreads. "This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

.....We can't do allegory anymore? What the fuck is going on?
 
Ralemont

Ralemont

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Jan 3, 2018
4,508
"Harmful books shouldn't be published"
"Who decides what is harmful?"
"Well, me of course and anyone who agrees with me"
 
GameShrink

GameShrink

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Oct 29, 2017
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Krauser Kat said:
Xmen leans on the racism and bigotry we know exists in our world by placing it within our own timeline. This made up a new world and tries to equate the two anyway. This is also a story about a single white savior to a bunch of oppressed people.
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If this is the case, then shouldn't the argument be "this book deserves criticism and bad reviews" instead of "this book should not exist"?

It'd be one thing if it was a pro-Nazi book written by a Nazi author that was being published by a high profile publisher, but that clearly isn't the case here.
 
bricewgilbert

bricewgilbert

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The metaphor in these stories (Xmen etc.) can often be hard to square with reality but welcome to being an adult and the possibility of shitty writing.
 
Cantaim

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Oct 25, 2017
33,384
The Stussining
Slayven said:
I need examples, cause the bar is pretty high

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Ok fuck the OP I want a thread talking about this thing. I just read the wiki for this and all I gotta say is ooph.
Each race is given a name for their station, with whites being named Pearls and blacks being named Coals. Eden spends most of her days in a research assistant position which she achieved due to her father's importance to a secret assignment, and most of her nights hoping that her boyfriend Jamal will one day choose her as his mate. She is often at odds with Bramford, a rich Coal who has hired her father, and occasionally resents the fact that she must wear dark make-up over her body to hide her skin color.
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adj_noun

adj_noun

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Oct 25, 2017
17,247
Five hundred k for your fucking first novel/trilogy

Her agent is the true superhero of this story
 
Doctoglethorpe

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Oct 27, 2017
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sphagnum said:
"This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

X-men?
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Also Dragon Age.

Sounds like a gross overreaction to a plot device that's so common it's actually fairly cliche at this point.
 
NewDonkStrong

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SageShinigami said:
"How is nobody mentioning the anti-blackness and blatant bigotry in this book?" one reader wrote on Goodreads. "This book is about slavery, a false oppression narrative that equates having legitimately dangerous magical powers that kill people with being an oppressed minority, like a person of color. This whole story is absolutely repulsive."

.....We can't do allegory anymore? What the fuck is going on?
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A common criticism of RPGs these days is the constant racism storylines about white people with pointy ears or white people that can shoot fireballs. Critics would say it would be a lot gutsier for game writers to actually tackle real racism instead.
 
L Thammy

L Thammy

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Ralemont said:
"Harmful books shouldn't be published"
"Who decides what is harmful?"
"Well, me of course and anyone who agrees with me"
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Unless I'm misunderstanding, the person who said that literally has identifying harmful books and correcting them as her job. So, uh, yes, it would be her. That's her role.
 
entremet

entremet

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If you read the entire article it seems publishing is changing and you have more editorial focus on sensitive content. It's rather interesting.

You gotta remember that these are conservative businesses, so I guess they want to avoid social media backlashes.

In this case, the author pulled the book, though.
 
OP
OP

BigJeffery

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
2,338
L Thammy said:
Unless I'm misunderstanding, the person who said that literally has identifying harmful books and correcting them as her job. So, uh, yes, it would be her. That's her role.
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I think I might be confused. Who are you talking about, and which specific quote?

EDIT: Oh it was someone in this thread, understood.
 

mrmoose

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Nov 13, 2017
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Are we sure it wasn't pulled because Marvel came after her for IP infringement?
 
SageShinigami

SageShinigami

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Oct 27, 2017
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NewDonkStrong said:
A common criticism of RPGs these days is the constant racism storylines about white people with pointy ears or white people that can shoot fireballs. Critics would say it would be a lot gutsier for game writers to actually tackle real racism instead.
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It'd be gutsier if game writers just inserted more people of color into their fantasy stories. But I don't need you to rip away the fantasy and tell a story about racism in the real world. I can turn on the news for that tbh.
 
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