Opinion: The Amount of Remakes We Had Proves that Old AAA Games Are Still More Creative

[Blade Wolf]

I can just post this alone with minimal effort to show how not samey games are.

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disagree with ''samey'' but dude modern game worlds are so f*cking boring! (my main point of the thread)

The Outer Worlds has a boring ass world compared to Fallout, Sekiro's world feels more grounded than Dark Souls and Death Stranding looks cooler than it actually is.

People can freaking TELL that's it's FF7 Remake by just looking at the environments, way before the name drop, cause the world itself is just so memorable.
The same can not be said about most modern games.

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

If one day they revealed Days Gone 2 people would probably assume it's Last of Us 3 before the title drops.

 

[ThereAreFourNaan]

Why are we making an arbitrary distinction between games based on their budget? That negates a metric shit ton of very creative games for little to no reason: Outer Wilds, Disco Elysium, Baba is You, etc.

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If all somebody wants to say is 'AAA gaming is not very creative on average', then yeah, that's true, but I definitely agree that excluding smaller games is foolish because if all you play is AAA games you have nobody to blame but yourself.

 

[CrazyIvan1978]

Nah, it proves it makes publishers money, nothing more nothing less. It's not about creativity, come on now...

 

[Phendrift]

Why are we making an arbitrary distinction between games based on their budget? That negates a metric shit ton of very creative games for little to no reason: Outer Wilds, Disco Elysium, Baba is You, etc.

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Because OP made the thread about AAA games I'm guessing

 

[NotLiquid]

It's funny because, when FFVII first launched, it got a TON of flak for being "derivative" of FF6.

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That was something I recall several of Paper Mario 2's less glowing reviews criticizing it for as well; some reviews back then thought it didn't take as many steps forward from Paper Mario 64 in a presentational sense, yet nowadays it's looked back upon as a seminal title for the Mario series in terms of world building and writing.

Hindsight is a funny thing.

 

[ClickyCal']

The Outer Worlds has a boring ass world compared to Fallout, Sekiro's world feels more grounded than Dark Souls and Death Stranding looks cooler than it actually is.

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Tons and tons would disagree.

 

[Blade Wolf]

If all somebody wants to say is 'AAA gaming is not very creative on average', then yeah, that's true, but I definitely agree that excluding smaller games is foolish because if all you play is AAA games you have nobody to blame but yourself.

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I referenced and praised Automata

Tons and tons would disagree.

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None of them are truly memorable or even unique, with maybe the exception of Death Stranding.

I used to write fan fictions for games but modern game worlds just bores me to tears, like I couldn't even imagine writing a fanfiction for Death Stranding it would be so freaking boring

 

[His Majesty]

Modern AAA games can no longer deliver concepts, original ideas or characters like this.

Ideas like this can only exist ''back in the day'', or in a remake.
This level of creativity just doesn't happen anymore. Look at FFXV, would anyone even want a remake of that? It has got to be thematically the least creative RPG I've ever played.

Most games (RPG & non-RPGs) back then have the balls to go crazy with bold, new ideas that knows no boundaries.

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You have games with exceptionally good level design (Dishonored 2, Prey) that go out of their way to offer the player multiple approaches to tackle their objective. You have games which entice out-of-the-box thinking with excellent physics based systems (Breath of the Wild). There are games completely based around non-violent gameplay (Death Stranding, Animal Crossing, Minecraft). In regards to the RPG scene you have all sorts of original settings, from embracing medieval realism (Kingdom Come: Deliverance) to tackling colonization themes in a Caribbean-inspired setting (Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire). And you have games that just knock it ouf of the park in the storytelling department with incredibly well written casts of characters (The Witcher 3, Red Dead Redemption II).

So I'm not sure what you mean by that. What is so creative or innovative about FF VII that is absent in today's gaming environment?

 

[Yossarian]

If all somebody wants to say is 'AAA gaming is not very creative on average', then yeah, that's true, but I definitely agree that excluding smaller games is foolish because if all you play is AAA games you have nobody to blame but yourself.

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The money involved in AAA means companies tend to be much more risk averse, whereas smaller budget (often) creator-owned games can afford (no pun intended) to tryout what they like without necessarily having to recoup costs to publishers.

Because OP made the thread about AAA games I'm guessing

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I know. That's why I'm asking 😄

 

[ClickyCal']

None of them are truly memorable or even unique, with maybe the exception of Death Stranding.

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Yes, yes they are.

 

[Deleted member 45414]

No, absolutely not.

 

[Risev]

disagree with ''samey'' but dude modern game worlds are so f*cking boring! (my main point of the thread)

The Outer Worlds has a boring ass world compared to Fallout, Sekiro's world feels more grounded than Dark Souls and Death Stranding looks cooler than it actually is.

People can freaking TELL that's it's FF7 Remake by just looking at the environments, way before the name drop, cause the world itself is just so memorable.
The same can not be said about most modern games.

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

If one day they revealed Days Gone 2 people would probably assume it's Last of Us 3 before the title drops.

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Are you really serious right now? You are actually arguing that no modern AAA games have more interesting worlds than FF7 and other previous AAA games?

I mean, you don't need to look further away than frigging Final Fantasy XIV: Shadowbringers to see something just as creative (if not more) coming out from the same company that did FF7.

 

[mxbison]

it's just incredibly risky to do something completely new and crazy with such a high budget.

Plenty of small games that do it though.

 

[Blade Wolf]

it's just incredibly risky to do something completely new and crazy with such a high budget.

Plenty of small games that do it though.

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Agree, just look at Fallout, it gets progressively less creative & meaningful each installment.

 

[Nuclear Muffin]

Yes. Modern AAA games are shite and are designed purely with the lowest common denominator in mind.

But you keep buying and supporting them, so whatever.

 

[Shelbyville Milhouse]

disagree with ''samey'' but dude modern game worlds are so f*cking boring! (my main point of the thread)

The Outer Worlds has a boring ass world compared to Fallout, Sekiro's world feels more grounded than Dark Souls and Death Stranding looks cooler than it actually is.

People can freaking TELL that's it's FF7 Remake by just looking at the environments, way before the name drop, cause the world itself is just so memorable.
The same can not be said about most modern games.

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

If one day they revealed Days Gone 2 people would probably assume it's Last of Us 3 before the title drops.

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This is really, really bad comparison, of course a heavily stylized fantasy world is more easily recognizable than one that's supposed to look realistic, cmon now.
And how The Outer Worlds is boring compared to Fallout is beyond me as well. I cannot even comprehend thinking Fallout 3 has an interesting world.
And I liked Fallout 3 waaaaaaaaaay more than I like TOW

 

[Blade Wolf]

Yes. Modern AAA games are shite and are designed purely with the lowest common denominator in mind.

But you keep buying and supporting them, so whatever.

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I don't know who's ''you'' but I think it's possible to criticize AAA games while still buying them, I don't ''hate'' AAA games I just want them to be creative again and there ARE creative ones like Nier Automata which I love. I just wish it's not so uncommon.

 

[Deleted member 17402]

You grossly over exaggerate how many games are remakes. You have a huge dose of nostalgia, which itself is fine, but not the amount you're working with.

 

[Deleted member 4976]

Not sure I can agree when the most popular remakes in recent times (FF7, RE2/RE3) play nothing like the games they are remaking.

 

[Blade Wolf]

Not sure I can agree when the most popular remakes in recent times (FF7, RE2/RE3) play nothing like the games they are remaking.

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I was talking about the concept & world building, not the modernized game design or control.

The whole point of the thread is that old games have much more interesting and creative worlds while modern games not so much.

I used to daydream about games and their worlds, but for some reason modern AAA game worlds just don't evoke that sense of wonder.

For a long time I thought it's just me that grew out of it but with RE2R & FF7R I'm starting to fantasize again, even as an adult. That's when I know it's probably not me, but the game's creativity in general. It's not nostalgia either cause I've never played or even know much about RE2 & FF7.

 

[ps3ud0]

Massive confirmation bias...

It's safer/cheaper to do remasters and remakes for publishers than it is to do create and nurture new AAA IPs.

It is not unsurprising that cherry picked old games remade are great examples of AAA games because indeed they were cherry picked...

ps3ud0 8)

 

[johancruijff]

well if you co-

Honestly outside of the Souls games and maybe some Sony games I just don't see much creativity that's as fresh and unique as the PS1/PS2 gen.

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[Risev]

I was talking about the concept & world building, not the modernized game design or control.

The whole point of the thread is that old games have much more interesting and creative worlds while modern games not so much.

I used to daydream about games and their worlds, but for some reason modern AAA game worlds just don't evoke that sense of wonder.

For a long time I thought it's just me that grew out of it but with RE2R & FF7R I'm starting to fantasize again, even as an adult. That's when I know it's probably not me, but the game's creativity in general. It's not nostalgia either cause I've never played or even know much about RE2 & FF7.

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Just curious, what do you consider the cutoff year / generation when games stopped being as creative and started being as boring as you claim them to be?

 

[TacoSupreme]

Never played any of the originals. Never played RE2, RE3 or FF7 etc. There's no nostalgia.

Just speaking from an objective perspective that those games feels way more interesting than most things on the modern AAA market except maybe DOOM Eternal.

and also speaking from an objective perspective that many of the old classics would never be possible today.

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You can claim to be objective, but the truth is that every moment in your life has led to the very subjective opinion that older big budget games were more creative and better than modern AAA games. The fact that you think remakes of the very best that 90s games had to offer reflects the overall creativity and freedom of the era shows that you're not thinking this through from all angles. In 20 years people will look back at games like Doom Eternal, Nier, BotW, Wolfenstein: TNO, Dark Souls, etc. and say "oh what amazing creativity people had back in the day." And that's just because only those games will stick out in people's minds.

Final Fantasy VII is a significantly better game than FFXV, but I'd never say it's because FFVII was more creative than FFXV. There are so many reasons, many of which come down to lack of firm, stable management. Something FFVII probably never suffered from.

 

[Shelbyville Milhouse]

For a long time I thought it's just me that grew out of it but with RE2R & FF7R I'm starting to fantasize again, even as an adult. That's when I know it's probably not me, but the game's creativity in general. It's not nostalgia either cause I've never played or even know much about RE2 & FF7.

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Can you explain to me what makes the world of Resident Evil 2 so creative?
FF7 I get but Resident Evil?

 

[Risev]

Can you explain to me what makes the world of Resident Evil 2 so creative?
FF7 I get but Resident Evil?

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And more importantly, what makes it more creative than, say, RE7?

 

[Deleted member 42484]

I do agree with the OP.

I think in the earlier days of gaming as 3D development was maturing and budgets were lower, there was certainly more experimentation.

A game like Pikmin made now would be a massive risk. And I don't think Rockstar has the time to take risks on new IP like Manhunt and Bully when it takes them 5 years to make a game. We got two Star Wars games this gen, a multiplayer FPS and a pretty standard 3rd person action game. Not room for Rogue Squadrons or pod racing or single player FP pushing new idea ideas.

It's just harder to take risks now with more market competition and bigger budgets. There are some great innovations though like Dreams and Heavy Rain and Labo and Ring Fit Adventure and Sea of Thieves.

 

[Deleted member 4976]

I was talking about the concept & world building, not the modernized game design or control.

The whole point of the thread is that old games have much more interesting and creative worlds while modern games not so much.

I used to day dream about games and their worlds, but for some reason modern AAA game worlds just don't evoke the same sense of wonder.
With RE2R & FF7R I'm starting to fantasize again, even as an adult.

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Still can't agree with that. Sounds like nostalgia to me, which obviously wouldn't be applicable to modern games right now.

Also, ease off on the hyperbole:

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

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By forever, you mean the 10 seconds it took for the logo to show up in its very first reveal? Most didn't recognize it? Says who? The reactions paint a very different picture as soon as the firefly logo popped up.

 

[Potterson]

Market research meant less back then.

 

[Edgar]

I knew who made the thread before even clicked on it.

 

[Risev]

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

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Ok I'm sorry but I found this hilarious. Here's the live reaction of the Last of Us 2 reveal.:



Literally the first second was all it took for people to realize, and the firefly logo only confirmed what people already knew.

 

[Blade Wolf]

Just curious, what do you consider the cutoff year when games stopped being as creative and started being as boring as you claim them to be?

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The answer may not be so cut & dry, it's not like ALL games stopped being creative & crazy all of the sudden.

The first time it happened is I think the early PS3 days?
A lot of games just feels too gritty & brown & generic but that quickly ends with games like BioShock, Mass Effect & Skyrim.

and then it happens again at the early days of PS4/Xbone, where most games are just mediocre entries of a milked IP

and then we have Bloodborne, Witcher 3 and MGSV which is fantastic but even during this ''renaissance'' you start to feel like we are missing just a little bit of creative spark and original ideas in AAA games (except these three of course)

I'd say after 2016, where there're still creative concepts like Nier Automata but overall most game worlds just no longer makes me want to day dream or fantasize.

Nowadays it's pretty much all indie games doing that for me, Hollow Knight, Undertale etc.

I knew who made the thread before even clicked on it.

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your daily dose of nonsense rant on the industry

 

[Deleted member 8674]

FF7 Remake has the fingerprints of modern day Square-Enix all over it.

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This.

 

[Calabi]

I mean you are right, but I'm glad it wasn't mean that posted this because your going to get dog piled by all the people saying nuh uh. You just have to look at all the creative games in Dreams on PS4 and compare them to all the mainstream games. We aren't getting any weird silly new platformers anymore like Medievil or Spyro they could never be made now, it's all just the safest most banal concept's that are made now.

 

[Sander VF]

I think what it means is that millenials who played those games as kids are old enough to pay nostalgia dollars.

That is why these remakes are being made.

 

[ItchyTasty]

Oh yeah RE7 literally is just as cheesy and over the top at points as RE4, just in a different perspective.

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Yeah I mean Ethan gets his hand and foot cut off and just stiches them back on lol

 

[TrueSloth]

edit: nevermind

 

[Shelbyville Milhouse]

I mean you are right, but I'm glad it wasn't mean that posted this because your going to get dog piled by all the people saying nuh uh. You just have to look at all the creative games in Dreams on PS4 and compare them to all the mainstream games. We aren't getting any weird silly new platformers anymore like Medievil or Spyro they could never be made now, it's all just the safest most banal concept's that are made now.

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Mario Odyssey
Astro Bot
A Hat in Time
Snake Pass
Yooka-Laylee

 

[Risev]

The answer may not be so cut & dry, it's not like ALL games stopped being creative & crazy all of the sudden.

The first time it happened is I think the early PS3 days?
A lot of games just feels too gritty & brown & generic but that quickly ends with games like BioShock, Mass Effect & Skyrim.

and then it happens again at the early days of PS4/Xbone, where most games are just mediocre entries of a milked IP

and then we have Bloodborne, Witcher 3 and MGSV which is fantastic but even during this ''renaissance'' you start to feel like we are missing just a little bit of creative spark and original ideas

I'd say after 2016, where there're still creative concepts like Nier Automata but overall most game worlds just no longer makes me want to day dream or fantasize.

Nowadays it's pretty much all indie games doing that for me, Hollow Knight, Undertale etc.

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See I find this pretty hard to argue against not because you necessarily make a good argument, but rather because you seem to be mixing together both creative concepts / worlds and creative gameplay / design. Both are completely different arguments and I don't know which you're more hung up about.

For example in the things you've already mentioned, MGSV is fantastic when it comes to gameplay creativity, but its world is as boring as they come when it comes to concept and creativity, and yet you've mentioned it in your positive examples.

 

[Deleted member 51848]

A great game usually stays great forever. I can play Tony Hawks pro skater 2 forever.

 

[Blade Wolf]

I mean you are right, but I'm glad it wasn't mean that posted this because your going to get dog piled by all the people saying nuh uh.

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Honestly I couldn't careless about being ''dog piled'' on freaking ReserEra of all places lol

Take a look at my thread history, I LOVE making controversial topics. They are my genuine opinions, but I know they will be controversial on Era, and I love it.

Feels even better when post results shows how divided it actually is, despite all the people telling me I'm crazy and it's just me.

 

[Shelbyville Milhouse]

Still waiting for the explanation what makes RE2 so creative

 

[Sander VF]

Games like RE4 can never be done today because it would be deemed ''too crazy and over the top'' and the person who came up with the giant walking statues wouldn't even made it into the team, even if he did he would probably get fired shortly after suggesting that.

Like would anyone even be surprised if RE4 Remake end up being more ''mature'' and more ''serious'' and more ''focused''? It's the nature of the AAA industry at this point.

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What about the dude who came up with this:


Or the part where you fight this super-powered monster hilbilly in a chainsaw duel?

 

[Hazzuh]

AAA games didn't even exist in the 90s. The designator AAA is the description of a specific economic model for developing games that only really came into existence in the mid/late 2000s. The further you go back in gaming history the more ridiculous this looks, what NES games were AAA? The average hit 16-bit game had a staff smaller than many indies released today and likely a lower budget too. Excluding all modern games developed in the same conditions as the older games you want to compare to makes this an absurd comparison. The games industry is by every measure significantly larger than it's ever been and there are more good games being released than ever before.

 

[Blade Wolf]

Still waiting for the explanation what makes RE2 so creative

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Name one zombie game more creative than RE2

It starts out as a generic zombie outbreak in a city but then you get naked red monsters with super long tongues jumping all over the place, indestructible humanoid bio super weapon that's for some reason wearing a fedora, mutating parasites with huge eye on the limbs, huge f*cking alligator in the sewers, underground bio-engineering facility with deadly plant monsters, constantly evolving super organism possessing its very creator that gets stronger each time it's defeated etc.

HOW THE F*CK IS THAT NOT CREATIVE?

Look at Days Gone & Last of Us and tell me RE2 is just another generic zombie game

 

[Deleted member 8674]

A great game usually stays great forever. I can play Tony Hawks pro skater 2 forever.

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Not really. Nostalgia is a hell of a drug. Some great games of the past didn't age well at all and some of them are unplayable now.

 

[Spork4000]

disagree with ''samey'' but dude modern game worlds are so f*cking boring! (my main point of the thread)

The Outer Worlds has a boring ass world compared to Fallout, Sekiro's world feels more grounded than Dark Souls and Death Stranding looks cooler than it actually is.

People can freaking TELL that's it's FF7 Remake by just looking at the environments, way before the name drop, cause the world itself is just so memorable.
The same can not be said about most modern games.

It took people forever to spot that it's Last of Us II, and most didn't even recognize the Fire Flies logo.

If one day they revealed Days Gone 2 people would probably assume it's Last of Us 3 before the title drops.

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You should play Control.

 

[osnameless]

Honestly outside of the Souls games and maybe some Sony games

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Like I don't agree with you, but I don't know why this part kinda irked me. The idea that the Souls games and Sony games are the only current creative space in video games, when a common criticism against Sony's portfolio is the existence of a safe formula.

You can bring out the good old ''well indie games is always creative'' which is true but my point is that AAA just aren't nearly as creative as it used to be.

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But this kinda refutes your point. There are creative video games with fresh ideas coming out today.. Baba is You is an incredibly creative concept for example that is virtually unprecedented.

Even AAA games. A company that have fallen into blandness as badly as Ubisoft with all their generic games incorporates some creativity from time to time.

 

[Dever]

I do agree that AAA games are becoming homogenized, especially open world games tend to be just the same game with a different coat. But there's a lot of original games being made as well. Hell, just from last year I'd say Death Stranding and Outer Wilds are some of the most original games made in the past decade. Outer Wilds technically isn't AAA though.

But yeah I dunno if it would make sense to remake modern games in 10 years... Mostly because the fidelity is already so high. The jump from FF7 on PS1 to FF7 on PS4 is obvious and significant. A remake of FFXV on PS7 though... Well I guess it would look pretty photorealistic, but what would be the point? FFXV already looks good.

 

[Scruffy8642]

I wouldn't say there's less creativity, because there certainly is if you look for it, but that there's less opportunity to embrace it. Costs and time of development has increased massively, and with it the risks of trying something new. Gone are the days where a dev could whip out a AAA game in a year or two and we'd get yearly sequels.

It part of the reason the indie scene has been flourishing so much in recent years I think.