Xbox is pretty big in Mexico and Brazil..
Which is weird consdering Sqaure seems to want more Gaas, and Hitman was the perfect example of one.
I fancied flinging some petrol on the fire this afternoon, lol
I think he was being a bit sarcastic here. It's not easy at all to 'just find' developers like Naughty Dog out there - If it would be, you can be sure publishers would immediately try to sign them up. Naughty Dog has been in business for over 20 years, time they used to hone their skills, their pipelines, their studio culture and their tech, etc. If you build a new studio, you can't expect that studio to just be what Naughty Dog is from Day 1. Similarly, it's incredibly hard to find top talent out there. The industry is still incredibly small. If you've worked in the games industry for a while, you usually know the folks that 'matter', the folks that really push games so that they can actually get released. If making games would be simple and everyone could do it, we wouldn't see so many cancellations year in and year out (the majority of which never even reaches the public).
On top of that, some studios out there are very specialized. Some studios are good at a very specific thing, so asking them to make a new IP or even continue an existing IP and deliver an amazing single player experience while also delivering an amazing multiplayer experience while also being able to actually make an IP matter... well, good luck with that. Talent really matters, which is why it's often weird to me that gamers don't understand why a certain studio that used to be great in the 90s can't just make 'one of their old games on the same level of quality' anymore. I always use this example: Say you manage The Beatles. Now after 15 years of them making amazing shit, all the original members leave the band, but you still own the brand. So you hire new folks. John, Paul, Ringo and George are gone and instead you've now got Billy, Jim, Bob and Frank. Would you expect them to just be able to pick up where the original members left things? No, of course not. Talent matters, experience matters. A single person in a studio leaving can drastically affect the quality of what the studio is making. It's a very volatile thing and that's also why publishers promote the company, not individuals, cause the general public finding out that someone that mattered left cold dramatically affect sales. Very few of the geniuses in the games industry are actually known for exactly that reason.
At least he's making clear acknowledgement here that 1P is the one remaining missing link. And I don't think anyone could argue with that. So, it seems like that's where the focus lies now that X is out.
I don't think he's saying that. He's saying that he's happy with where they are at with 3 out of the 4 areas, but acknowledges that 1P is still a gap.What I get from this tweet is that the hardware was stopping them from investing in first party, does that even make sense? How are the two teams even related?
Really? I'd imagine each division have a separate budget
There is no separate division.
But it doesn't really make sense, why did the work on first party start now that the hardware is improved? Did Sony stop making games when they were making the Pro?. All I'm saying is that you can work on all aspects together, it doesn't have to be one at a time like Microsoft is doing.I don't think he's saying that. He's saying that he's happy with where they are at with 3 out of the 4 areas, but acknowledges that 1P is still a gap.
And the weak hardware has been a major issue with XBO, both in terms of providing strong 1P game experiences (just look out how poor H5/G4/QB run on XBO compared to X) and also in attracting talent to develop for the platform. The hardware proposition was an issue from day one, with XBO being way behind PS4 - and then even further behind when you consider Sony has had Pro out for a year too.
Actually even without any change, this year will be their best 1P line-up in a few years (not difficult I realise), providing everything hits as expected - we're bound to get FH4 and Halo 6 (or some variant) at the end of this year too, in addition to Sea of Thieves, Ori 2, State of Decay 2, Crackdown 3, and whatever other smaller stuff they might unveil.
I'm not sure what you mean, hardware team certainly are not the same as first party.
There is one pot of money for the entire Xbox/entertainment devices division. How you distribute that is another matter, and more of that pot will have gone to the hardware team.But it doesn't really make sense, why did the work on first party started now that the hardware is improved? Did Sony stop making games when they were making the Pro?. All I'm saying is that you can work on all aspects together, it doesn't have to be one at a time like Microsoft is doing.
I'm not sure what you mean, hardware team certainly are not the same as first party.
But it doesn't really make sense, why did the work on first party started now that the hardware is improved? Did Sony stop making games when they were making the Pro?. All I'm saying is that you can work on all aspects together, it doesn't have to be one at a time like Microsoft is doing.
Are you really saying they blew most of their budget on hardware so now they are waiting for the pot to replenish to invest in games? Just how low are their budget that they can't support both? Why doesn't that happen with other platform holders? That explanation really doesn't make sense to me.There is one pot of money for the entire Xbox/entertainment devices division. How you distribute that is another matter, and more of that pot will have gone to the hardware team.
And Phil hasn't said that work on 1P has only just started. If that was the case, they wouldn't have any 1P games releasing this year. They do.
There is one pot of money for the entire Xbox/entertainment devices division. How you distribute that is another matter, and more of that pot will have gone to the hardware team.
And Phil hasn't said that work on 1P has only just started. If that was the case, they wouldn't have any 1P games releasing this year. They do.
But it doesn't really make sense, why did the work on first party started now that the hardware is improved? Did Sony stop making games when they were making the Pro?. All I'm saying is that you can work on all aspects together, it doesn't have to be one at a time like Microsoft is doing.
I'm not sure what you mean, hardware team certainly are not the same as first party.
But it doesn't really make sense, why did the work on first party started now that the hardware is improved? Did Sony stop making games when they were making the Pro?. All I'm saying is that you can work on all aspects together, it doesn't have to be one at a time like Microsoft is doing.
I'm not sure what you mean, hardware team certainly are not the same as first party.
No, I'm not saying that at all!? I've just said, and I repeat:Are you really saying they blew most of their budget on hardware so now they are waiting for the pot to replenish to invest in games? Just how low are their budget that they can't support both? Why doesn't that happen with other platform holders? That explanation really doesn't make sense to me.
all those first party games have been announced 1-2 years ago, I wouldn't count them as an example of investing in first party
All the games releasing on PS4 next year were announced 1-2 years ago too. That's not really the point, without knowing everything MS has in the pipeline. For example, they haven't even announced Halo 6 but we know it must be in the works for 2 years now. So if that hasn't been announced, then they're obviously no longer feeling the need to announce things as early as they have done previously.And Phil hasn't said that work on 1P has only just started. If that was the case, they wouldn't have any 1P games releasing next year. They do.
It does make sense when you consider the primary differences between Xbox and Playstation; namely that Xbox has fewer internal FP studios and so the desired additional "games" investment would have to go to 3rd party exclusivity deals and/or the establishment of new studios (all of which are rather expensive).
Clearly, Microsoft Game Studios didn't just stop making games while they were investing the majority of their budget on developing the XB1X hardware. The known in-house devs continued making Halo/Forza/Gears and they continued funding the established indie and third party studio partnerships, e.g. for games like Cuphead.
What I understand Spencer saying is that now the HUGE hw investment is out of the way, they can sink the majority of their next few year's budgets into opening new studios, funding 3rd party exclusives etc..
It's easy to look at Xbox and Spencer's statements and think, "well Sony has been able to invest in both software and hardware", but that ignores the fact that MS is starting off from a majorly disadvantaged position of needing to burn millions in capital expenditure, opening new studios, to widen their FP games production pipeline, whereas Sony with their stable of veteran studios merely has to cover ongoing studio overheads to deliver a consistent and stead stream of quality FP games.
MS will have to spend an inordinate amount of money to match Sony's FP output, and so that spend will have to compete with the literal billions that is required for hardware development investment.
(Curiously, I wonder whether this will impact their hardware dev schedule for the next-box? We may end up seeing a PS5 launch a full year ahead of XB4)
They haven't stopped making games they've just had the perfect storm of delays, closures and cancellations hit them all in the same time frame. I think what Phil is alluding to here is that when he got the gig as Xboss he had three pillars to focus on: Hardware, Services and Games. The first two are now in the bag and now the last part of the jigsaw is the games. Looking at what Phil and the team have done with the S, the X, the Eltite controller etc and also with things like BC, refunds, gifting,UI overhauls etc I think they have deserved the time to show us what they got! :)
No offense, but this explanation is still really hard to swallow, what is stopping them from using all the budget on the next Xbox again? This generation is coming to an end and platform holders are surly working on the next console now.
No, I'm not saying that at all!? I've just said, and I repeat:
All the games releasing on PS4 next year were announced 1-2 years ago too. That's not really the point, without knowing everything MS has in the pipeline. For example, they haven't even announced Halo 6 but we know it must be in the works for 2 years now. So if that hasn't been announced, then they're obviously no longer feeling the need to announce things as early as they have done previously.
Why have you put that in inverted commas, when I didn't say that. "More of " != "Most of"No offense, but this explanation is still really hard to swallow, what is stopping them from using all the budget on the next Xbox again? This generation is coming to an end and platform holders are surly working on the next console now.
Also, I don't really think anyone is doubting there will be another gears, halo and forza, when I hear Microsoft is investing in first party more I think of new IPs not ongoing franchises.
Edit: pswii60 "most of that pot will have gone to the hardware"
Yes indeed I fully agree. Any new IP will likely not be released in any Fall, so the earliest we could expect is Q1 2019. But I expect we'll see a more 1P announcements next year than we've had for some time.Let's just say this now: Microsoft probably has a lackluster fall 2018 lineup if you are hoping for new IP or unexpected games. We'll definitely get FH 4 and potentially get Halo 6 (though I'm not convinced). Spencer said in a pre-E3 interview with IGN that he would announce new IP earlier than established IP so that they can generate hype. If we take that quote to mean "Halo gets announced and released in the same year" but "new IP gets announced in year 1 and released in year 2" then we can't expect any new AAA IP to be released next year.
The hardware changes could have also included costs associated with turning a discrete hardware into an ongoing platform with backward and forward compatibility. That's probably not cheap.
Jesus dude, what difference does it make? Yes I used a wrong word, my bad, but the point still stands, you're saying hardware team gets more money than first party.Why have you put that in inverted commas, when I didn't say that. "More of " != "Most of"
Inverted commas are used when quoting somebody, so make sure the words inside those inverted commas are identical to what was said.
They only release established IP in the Fall this year though, the new IP and less sales games are all releasing in first half of 2018 (Sea of Thieves, State of Decay 2, Crackdown 3) so I think it's still very possible they have a new IP set for Spring 2019 to be revealed at E3 2018 (perhaps Studio Gobo's partnership game they teased in April?)Let's just say this now: Microsoft probably has a lackluster fall 2018 lineup if you are hoping for new IP or unexpected games. We'll definitely get FH 4 and potentially get Halo 6 (though I'm not convinced). Spencer said in a pre-E3 interview with IGN that he would announce new IP earlier than established IP so that they can generate hype. If we take that quote to mean "Halo gets announced and released in the same year" but "new IP gets announced in year 1 and released in year 2" then we can't expect any new AAA IP to be released next year.
Actually, this is not actually a thing.
The original XB1's OS already runs in a virtualized environment, so in terms of the software engineering costs associated with virtualizing the Xbox platform, those costs have already been sunk at the beginning of the gen.. MS' forward thinking approach in this regard, means that they can pretty much leverage much of their OS code on subsequent Xbox hardware, because they will only be required to re-write the OS abstraction layers to get everything (including games) running on newer hardware.
Either way, I don't believe that MS' approach with regards to forward compatibility will differ from Sony's next-gen. Both will do BC, however, for MS it would be considerably easier since most of the software heavy lifting is done already.
They only release established IP in the Fall this year though, the new IP and less sales games are all releasing in first half of 2018 (Sea of Thieves, State of Decay 2, Crackdown 3) so I think it's still very possible they have a new IP set for Spring 2019 to be revealed at E3 2018 (perhaps Studio Gobo's partnership game they teased in April?)
You're kinda contradicting yourself there. Saying they haven't had any 1st party games then in next sentence listed some?Here is the thing. Do to poor luck and delays, Microsoft hasn't had any first party games this year. They had Forza, Halo Wars 2, a downloadable platformer and some remasters.
No offense, but this explanation is still really hard to swallow, what is stopping them from using all the budget on the next Xbox again? This generation is coming to an end and platform holders are surly working on the next console now.
Also, I don't really think anyone is doubting there will be another gears, halo and forza, when I hear Microsoft is investing in first party more I think of new IPs not ongoing franchises.
Edit: pswii60 "most of that pot will have gone to the hardware"
For goodness sake, I obviously don't know that, it's a hunch. It might be the case that the Xbox division got bigger investment overall, so the hardware team's additional allocation of the pot had no impact on 1P.Jesus dude, what difference does it make? Yes I used a wrong word, my bad, but the point still stands, you're saying hardware team gets more money than first party.
Your post is far too calm and rational :)Say's who? They just released a premium conosle a few weeks ago lol
And of course we're getting a new Halo, Gears and Forza just like there will be a new Mario Kart, Smash, Zelda, Uncharted, Gran Turismo, God of War hitting the market. But we're still going to be getting new IP and resurrected or forgotten franchises as can be seen with Ori, Crackdown, Sea of Thieves etc.
Games are coming, one's we know about and one's we don't. Studio's will be built and some will be aquired. Exciting isn't it :)
No offense, but this explanation is still really hard to swallow, what is stopping them from using all the budget on the next Xbox again? This generation is coming to an end and platform holders are surly working on the next console now.
Also, I don't really think anyone is doubting there will be another gears, halo and forza, when I hear Microsoft is investing in first party more I think of new IPs not ongoing franchises.
Edit: pswii60 "most of that pot will have gone to the hardware"
I wouldn't rule out the possibility, but I would be bitterly disappointed if the case were true.Thanks for the explaniation. I do however expect that the Xbox One X will be the lower level platform when the Xbox 2 comes out.
You're kinda contradicting yourself there. Saying they haven't had any 1st party games then in next sentence listed some?
They've done a decent amount this year. Whether you like the games and updates or or not is a different story but here's what was released and what budget was spent on:
- Halo 5 development of additional content updates
- Gears 4 content updates/DLC
- Forza Horizon 3 DLC/updates
- Killer Instinct Season 3 DLC/updates, also STEAM release
- Forza Motorsport 7 and DLC
- Phantom Dust
- Halo Wars Definitive edition - also STEAM release
- Halo Wars 2 release and DLC/content
- Pixar Rush Remaster
- Disneyland Adventures Remaster
- Zoo Tycoon Remaster
- Minecraft content updates on mobile platforms, PC, consoles, releases on 3DS/Switch
- Rise of Nations extended edition on Windows Store
- Microsoft Ultimate Word Games
- Microsoft Solitaire on additional mobile devices
- Minecraft Story Mode
- Halo: Recruit
- Paying for updates to enhance various 1st party games for XB1X
- Super Luckys Tale
- PUBG
- Recore Definitive Edition
- Cuphead even though they didn't publish, spent money on development
Again, you can say some of those are minor and such, but it's not like they just didn't release anything. MS Studios was actually fairly busy.
It doesn't make any sense, but apparently that's how they're doing it. It seems quite reactionary, which means ultimately they will probably continue to only have middling success with the brand.
Are you really saying they blew most of their budget on hardware so now they are waiting for the pot to replenish to invest in games? Just how low are their budget that they can't support both? Why doesn't that happen with other platform holders? That explanation really doesn't make sense to me.
all those first party games have been announced 1-2 years ago, I wouldn't count them as an example of investing in first party
Sunset Overdrive was a great game that drowned in the negativity around the XB1 at the time.
People seem to not understand that Xbox does not have Microsoft's money. Microsoft gives them a pretty small budget for new games, Phil Spencer cannot just ask for a budget of $15B and build a bunch of games with it. That's why ReCore and other games seem low budget. Because they are. Phantom Dust was cancelled because the studio couldn't do what Microsoft wanted them to do with their budget.
I would also like to point out that Don Mattrick and Phil Spencer have both said that Microsoft gave them a $1 billion budget for making new Xbox One games for the first few years.
Sony's games budget is likely much bigger. Also, two games made using the budget (Phantom Dust and Scalebound) were cancelled.
The Xbox One X being finished must free up some of the extra budget to use on more games which I think is what he's saying. And since he's a higher up at Microsoft now (he still has to report to Satya Nadella but that's much better than reporting to three different people plus Nadella), HOPEFULLY he can convince them to increase budget.
There was loads of positivity for SO, the fanbase just didn't buy it.
Sure. https://www.technobuffalo.com/2013/05/31/xbox-one-games-budget-1-billion/ Microsoft gave Xbox $1B to make 15 games. Phantom Dust was cancelled because Microsoft wanted things that they couldn't make with their budget but Microsoft refused to raise it so they cancelled it. Also it's very likely most of that money went towards Halo and Forza because it looks and plays much higher quality than the other games they made.Not that I find the number to be hard to believe, but do you have a link to this?