Kenai

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,436
And this is why games will never be "art" its always been a commodity.

The problem with this take is thinking this action was purely altruistic, it will always be weaponized to any idea not in the white cis wheelhouse.

You cant just bully artists into doing things you like. Sony absolutely fucked up by pushing a release early and basically removing access to this game by requiring it. The order of operations was wrong and forced them into this outcome. Which is great for the consumers.

Games aren't "just" art. This is also the entertainment industry. The only way they are being "bullied" is if you feel the business is entitled to money for products the customer does not want (they are not) or that the (former) need for a PSN account is some type of artistic decision (it is not).

While you are 100% correct in that things not in the generic white cis male wheelhouse are more prone to smear campaigns and review bombing for nefarious reasons, this is not one of those times. If anything, this proves the merit of user reviews when used with their intended purpose. Sony is not some innocent victim here. They were content to throw a lot of users in countries not acknowledged by PSN under the bus.
 
Last edited:

Kyougar

Cute Animal Whisperer
Member
Nov 3, 2017
9,431
I don't get this. All games that require a login are perfectly as playable without such systems. What's the point of this argument? The login is just that: a login, it doesn't make or break the game itself. It just stops you/players from accessing (mostly) the MP content for several arbitrary reasons.


So the sole issue, at least from your perspective, is that it wasn't working day 1. Otherwise I guess people wouldn't have minded, just like they don't mind with other games. Good to know!

Because:

1. Only 69 countries could legally play HD2 if it was enforced from day 1.
2. Anyone who doesn't like to link to PSN wouldn't have bought the game in the first place. (Or refunded in the 2 hour period when they saw they needed to link it when trying to play the game)

changing this a few months after people who don't like linking or have no legal path to play this game in their country is the issue here.
 

Lashley

<<Tag Here>>
Member
Oct 25, 2017
60,582
www.pcmag.com

Nvidia's Gaming Revenue Takes Another Hit, Falls 46% Despite RTX 4000 GPUs

Demand for the company's GPUs slumps even with the arrival of Nvidia's first RTX 4000 graphics cards during last year's holiday season.
www.techradar.com

Why aren't people buying GPUs? Nvidia has the answers to its own problem

Nvidia’s CEO just took a hefty pay cut

Do I need to look for more articles and statistics that you could easily find yourself or is this enough
😂😂😂
 

Mukrab

Banned
Apr 19, 2020
7,712
This is a slippery slope, so now when gamers decide they don't like something they'll just review bomb companies into doing what they want?
Ideally yes? certainly a democratic approach by customers is better for the customer than the lets make all the money approach from shareholders.
I don't disagree with you.

However, In this scenario the government would be Sony, not Arrowhead. I would be fine with the negative reviews staying there if they were left at Sony.com.
The PSN account requirement was for steam. It makes sense to leave them on steam.
 

JBoogieG

Member
Aug 2, 2022
3,451
SW Virginia
Yeah, but not really. Losing the same 5 minutes setting up said login 3 months in or at launch seems trivial to me.

But you do you I guess.
I think part of the problem people had was PSN being unavailable in so many places + Sony having 'make an account in a place you don't live a risk for a ban' in their TOS. It made things pretty weird in that regard.
 

ternarybanana

Member
Apr 5, 2024
68
There must be some sort of technical reason that stops them from rolling out WW. Refuse to believe they don't want to have a presence in these countries, especially after the whole "We need more growth" shtick they've been doing the last couple of years.
I think it depends what you mean by technical. They probably weigh the market size and the percentage of users they will capture through unofficial means (accounts in other regions) against the cost of officially clearing any regulatory/legal hurdles.
 

Det

Member
Jul 30, 2020
13,231
Thanks for the explanation. So were they hoping to boost the PSN MAU with this change? IF they have PC PSN integration as optional and less hardline, probably not a big deal. I don't know if their other SP games have it since I don't play on PC.

PSN MAU is a big one, but other functionality is tied to it like the overlay for GoT (trophies, PSN friends list, chat etc.), hopefully cross-progression soon. Their single-player games don't need it, you can play GoT without it but the MP legends mode requires it (and the PS overlay features).
 

prophetvx

Member
Nov 28, 2017
5,375
Good that the requirement was removed. I still don't understand the level of hatred levelled at Arrowhead or even Sony to some degree. It was clearly an oversight that PSN wasn't available in many countries, certainly on AH's part. They then took a week to discuss and revise, in the meantime de-listing in impacted countries.

With that said, it'd be nice if we could avoid third party accounts in games entirely unless cross-progression matters to you.
 

Hitokiri03

Member
Oct 25, 2017
979
The not supported regions thing probably caught them off guard, this is why they reverted.

I hope there is some improvement on how they handle regions.
 

Risev

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,453
Some people here are clearly seething that Sony listened to the demands and they should honestly have a conversation with themselves as to why they feel this way.

Because you guys do realize it's not normal to feel this way, right?
 

Beje

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,806
With that said, it'd be nice if we could avoid third party accounts in games entirely unless cross-progression matters to you.

Fortunately that's the lesser evil we have to endure after making Ubisoft and EA understand that we weren't going to their store to buy their crap and they ended up caving in and re-listing all their stuff back on Steam after pulling it thinking they were being business geniouses.

And I still get pissy when Bethesda games try to force their account down my throat to play a single player game although you can usually sidestep it by adding the executable to Windows' firewall blocks.
 

thepenguin55

Member
Oct 28, 2017
11,951
I think the delisting of the game in some places is ultimately what did it. The fact that they were planning this from day one but sold it in territories where PSN wasn't available means that someone in the chain wasn't thinking this through. Still, I hope PSN account linking comes as an option. I really want cross-progression.
 

xmonkeyofevil

Member
Jun 9, 2019
490
Obviously my point won't apply to the countries where PSN isn't supported, but I do think there's an important takeaway here in that a games store page saying an account is required shouldn't be ignored.

The implementation was handled in the worst possible way by AH/Sony (they never should have made it skippable) but this also wasn't the total "surprise!" that some were making it out to be.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,922
An idiotic own goal in the making but a late save.
Just let your extremely popular, good game do it's thing. Feels like execs make decisions just to say they do things sometimes (most of the time).
 

Klyka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
18,788
Germany
well, the healing has begun
arlP10y.png
 

JoeInky

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,519
The constant insinuation that leaving a negative review on something is so extreme, pathetic and over the top when it takes less time than signing up for a PSN account which is supposed to be no big deal is another thing I don't understand about this situation.

People acting like not supporting something that they don't see as a big deal is some kind of monumental task that takes all of your energy and you must be absolutely seething with rage
 

SFLUFAN

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,507
Alexandria, VA
This is all very well and good, but it does nothing to address the root cause that the PSN infrastructure appears to be unprepared/inadequate to support GAAS as a significant business initiative.
 

Beje

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,806
...It's really not that big a foul.

The overreaction some people are making over an email sign-in from a publisher (something done countless times prior) is something.

The countries PSN wasn't available in was the real issue.

It's though a good reminder that asking nicely not only does not work, it will also get you a very snarky "haha fuck off" or "stop being poor" reply from these corporate ghouls ("we have a product for that, it's called the 360 yadda yadda")
 

Dunlop

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,551
This is a slippery slope, so now when gamers decide they don't like something they'll just review bomb companies into doing what they want?
That has been happening for a long time.

In this case people who legally purchased the game were going to lose access. This was much more than just not liking something
 

prophetvx

Member
Nov 28, 2017
5,375
It's though a good reminder that asking nicely not only does not work, it will also get you a very snarky "haha fuck off" reply from these corporate ghouls ("we have a product for that, it's called the 360 yadda yadda")
It likely has very little to do with the negative reviews. They sold it into markets that would not have access to it, that's a much bigger problem than negative steam reviews.
 

Coyote Starrk

The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
53,765
Exactly. I left a bad review and I have no reason to change it. Going back on it doesn't erase what was done. Live with it.
This is so ridiculous. Especially considering that Arrowhead themselves are the ones that was pushing the community to speak up.


Luckily your take doesn't seem to be a common one.
 

BearBobomb

Member
Jun 3, 2022
1,411
Earth
The constant insinuation that leaving a negative review on something is so extreme, pathetic and over the top when it takes less time than signing up for a PSN account which is supposed to be no big deal is another thing I don't understand about this situation.

People acting like not supporting something that they don't see as a big deal is some kind of monumental task that takes all of your energy and you must be absolutely seething with rage
Eh i'd say this situation is just more of the outlier, in most cases review bombing is a bad and done disingenuously
 

holpye

Member
Jan 5, 2024
14
Edit: I've misinterpreted steamdb, they didn't reverted, sorry.
 
Last edited: