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User Warned: Attempted Thread Derail
bernie sanders: completely quiet on defund the police
We could make a thread about how Bernie Sanders has failed the left (and POC) over the last 12 months. I'd be fine with that. We probably should talk about it.
you know this supports their point, right? sanders is a lib
I love how "Bernie Sanders" is a common response to criticism of neoliberals on Era lmao
I love how he felt the need to dissuade looting...before strongly condemning the murder. Like the latter wouldn't have even been all that controversial or anything
He doesn't have to press on the cop, because there's an entire system he can point to as an excuse, all the while everyone who knows the system knows that the process isn't going to produce anything approaching justice. It's the criminal law version of creating a Blue Ribbon Commission to study a problem whose solution is obvious, popular, and contrary to the politician's class interests.
Looting, on the other hand, is the sort of direct action that agitates and disrupts, which makes it an incredibly useful source of trouble that creates the sort of ground-level political motivation that the justice system works to disrupt.
So, yeah, of course he's got nothing to talk about but looting, because that's the thing that's threatening to his political position. It's all about trying to paint all but the most toothless forms of protest as Beyond The Pale.
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Your average white American is in constant fear of retaliation for what they know are grave injustices. They know what they would do if it were to happen to them. That's why they're fearful, and can't sleep at night. They've created a terror all by themselves.
This exactly. This nation is still in fear of Turner's rebellion which occurred damn near 200 years ago.
It is absolutely broken, and it is so by design. We shouldn't resign ourselves to constantly accepting "bad" because the other main option is "horrible." In the here and now we can and should invest more in mutual aid, community organizing, direct action, and education of actual leftist ideas to promote liberation from that violent settler colonialist system. Solely relying on electoralism will not effect material, necessary, and lasting change for all those who need it since the system is designed to be a white supremacist capitalist hellscape that punishes, exploits, and kills.
Relying solely on it traps us in the same song and dance every election cycle where people try to shame others into voting for the lesser of two evils as the be-all-end-all method of "change" or "harm reduction" so (predominantly white) liberals can go back to brunch while we find ourselves still letting cops murder people or seeing kids remain caged or deporting immigrants or bombing other countries and committing war crimes by a military with a grossly over-inflated and ever-increasing budget or letting people starve to death because of our sanctions or denying free healthcare and education or incarcerating gross amounts of people for profit or letting land, especially Indigenous land, be exploited and polluted for oil pipelines and corporate interests or supporting coups etc. etc. etc.
Voting can be useful for sure, but we all know there's an incredibly large group of "vote blue no matter who" liberals who only pretend to give a shit about Black people or other oppressed groups when an election is happening because, hey, that other person sucks. If they win they'll go back to ignoring them, gaslighting them, hand-waving horrible actions committed by those they support, or explaining "well actually we can't do ___ right now" because of the usual excuses ("think of what the Republicans will say!" or "it's not polling well" or "we can't do it now because then we risk losing the next election!"). It's a hostage situation and it's exhausting, at best offering tortuously slow incremental "reform" built entirely upon the blood, sweat, and tears of activists who demand shit for decades before maybe being offered a crumb in return. Instead of being upset with people who don't want to vote and are disillusioned by the entire process, be more upset that they're not given anything to vote for. A better world is possible if we help each other and continue to build solidarity to dismantle this evil country to its rotten core.
Why can't a US president just preface criticisim of an incidient of police violence with something like "Look, I respect and support our forces, but events like this should never happen. We need better training to minimize lifes lost during standard police work." Or something along those lines. That wouldn't be too "radical" for the halfway senible voter in the so called middle, right? Why even put the crime in the center of your comment if it wasn't something that warranted shooting at somebody in self-defense?
This response was obvious to people who actually followed bidens politics, the democrats will keep putting capital first, just with a more careful vocabulary.
What does it matter if it was accidental?
Oh, no, I accidentally shot somebody in the face! Too bad I guess...
The standard at which law enforcement is held is truly pathetic. Teenagers have a higher bar for their conduct than police officers.
Oh, no, I accidentally shot somebody in the face! Too bad I guess...
The standard at which law enforcement is held is truly pathetic. Teenagers have a higher bar for their conduct than police officers.
This is who Biden is. He's shown us time and time again yet people still admire him here, I don't understand it. Then they're mysteriously absent in these threads despite spamming his unity tweets on an almost hourly basis
As always, fuck Joe Biden.
On the topic of Bernie, I don't think many leftists would be surprised to find some of his rhetoric only marginally better, and sometimes just as bad, under the same circumstances.
These people are not our friends and shouldn't be glorified or celebrated
As always, fuck Joe Biden.
On the topic of Bernie, I don't think many leftists would be surprised to find some of his rhetoric only marginally better, and sometimes just as bad, under the same circumstances.
These people are not our friends and shouldn't be glorified or celebrated
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I wouldn't compare him to trump, he's in his own level lol.
However, I do kinda see the point you're making. I don't usually like posting about US politics when I'm not from the country, but a friend once said to me "America is so far right wing when someone like biden is considered left" which to be honest I agree with I think. IMO the only one in recent times that I would consider truly left is Bernie Sanders, and he didn't even get a proper chance.
I mean, there's nuance and there's distrust. I think he's trying, but in the back of my mind I think back to two articles. One from 2017 and one from 2018, both before he announced he was running but setting the stage. The first was from Chris Matthews in 2017. It's not Biden directly but it's relevant:
I think Chris Matthews is a piece of shit in a way Biden is not, but Biden a year later said what is essentially the same thing with slightly different wording:
It is blatantly the same. Chris Matthews just didn't sugarcoat it. There's an othering between white and everything else. One of the major shifts was because he made a large miscalculation and it ended up being Black voters that saved him, something I am happy about because I was nervous him getting the nomination would lead to media harping about identity politics as if these weren't peoples lives.
I get being upset by people because with Trump there were loud existential threats daily. In comparison to that, anything is going to come off as an absurd exaggeration. However, there's a polite decay with Biden and shit like this is why it's hard to think he's done much to learn and challenge his views.
I'm sure he would have said the same one year ago when he just a candidate and not the president...
/s
/s
You know the USA is too far right when they conclude that UK Tory policy/stances is too left for them.
To add: It wasn't a mistake on the BART and it wasn't a mistake here, it was training to kill to go home that kicked in. I'll remind you that in both situations neither pig was in danger from whom they killed.
So sick of politicians, we don't need to hear from them right now if they're not going to do what's right for the people.
One of the things that gets lost in his response is his initial attempt to try and hedge himself by saying "maybe it was an accident?"
If we want to be outrageously generous here and say that, yes, the officer truly didn't mean to pull his firearm on Wright and meant to pull his taser, does that not speak to how important it is that officers be held accountable for mistakes here?
Let's be honest, Joe. When I make a mistake at my job, no one ends up dead. If you're going to hand someone a deadly weapon and tell them to "keep the peace" maybe we need to have a broader conversation about who can become qualified to be police officers, what kind of training they receive, etc., so that we can more readily make it so that these "accidents" don't happen.
A disproportionate response to a situation resulting in death is not something that anyone should be able to handwave away as merely an accident, nor is it something that should lend credence to the idea that the person in question should ever be allowed to carry a firearm again. Crying about how hard someone's job is doesn't give that person the right to make mistakes that kill people with impunity.
So in the midst of the George Floyd case and now this, I suppose what I'm getting at is if Biden didn't want to pontificate on the guilt of this individual officer, he could at the very least invite the conversation on police reform instead of giving the "All Buildings Matter" response.
If we want to be outrageously generous here and say that, yes, the officer truly didn't mean to pull his firearm on Wright and meant to pull his taser, does that not speak to how important it is that officers be held accountable for mistakes here?
Let's be honest, Joe. When I make a mistake at my job, no one ends up dead. If you're going to hand someone a deadly weapon and tell them to "keep the peace" maybe we need to have a broader conversation about who can become qualified to be police officers, what kind of training they receive, etc., so that we can more readily make it so that these "accidents" don't happen.
A disproportionate response to a situation resulting in death is not something that anyone should be able to handwave away as merely an accident, nor is it something that should lend credence to the idea that the person in question should ever be allowed to carry a firearm again. Crying about how hard someone's job is doesn't give that person the right to make mistakes that kill people with impunity.
So in the midst of the George Floyd case and now this, I suppose what I'm getting at is if Biden didn't want to pontificate on the guilt of this individual officer, he could at the very least invite the conversation on police reform instead of giving the "All Buildings Matter" response.
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This was always a dog whistle to get people to vote for Biden. Just a more subtle way of attempting to shame people into voting for their team without coming across as an asshole (or at least less of one).
No one even mentioned him in relation to the thread up until that point. It's like fucking clockwork and completely ignores that even supporters of Sanders don't think he's without problems.
Fuck you Biden.
Fuck you and your concern for property damages when people are being fucking killed.
This should be played on every screen in the US.
Fuck you and your concern for property damages when people are being fucking killed.
This should be played on every screen in the US.
I don't get how we didn't expect an American president not to respond in American. White people on the boards are still expecting a politician to step up and do the right thing when even on the boards with zero stakes you had hemming and hawing on specifics "accident", "he shouldnt have escalated".
Im even confused at this post, I would like to at least give Biden props for mentioning White Supremacy as a problem which is a first, but even then its not surprising since it was a few months before they literally attacked the Republic so its less about "The right thing, finally", but "These radicals are starting to affect our business as usual imperialism".
He's a reflection of what most American's think. This feels like feigned outrage, for a group that collectively helped get us here.
Im even confused at this post, I would like to at least give Biden props for mentioning White Supremacy as a problem which is a first, but even then its not surprising since it was a few months before they literally attacked the Republic so its less about "The right thing, finally", but "These radicals are starting to affect our business as usual imperialism".
He's a reflection of what most American's think. This feels like feigned outrage, for a group that collectively helped get us here.
We weren't surprised. We were upset. Then people were being dismissive and handwaved us. This is basically the same shit.
It's an awful response and we need to push Biden to do better until we can put someone better in his seat.
Trump comparisons only turn into pointless debates that do nothing to make that happen, cause they either sound defeatist 'we can never expect better' or they sound apologetic 'hey at least he isn't as bad as the last guy!'
Look at the turn this thread took because of one post comparing them. Biden is flat out wrong with this response. What 45, would or wouldn't have done in whatever hypothetical alternate hell scape where he is still president doesn't change that one bit.
Trump comparisons only turn into pointless debates that do nothing to make that happen, cause they either sound defeatist 'we can never expect better' or they sound apologetic 'hey at least he isn't as bad as the last guy!'
Look at the turn this thread took because of one post comparing them. Biden is flat out wrong with this response. What 45, would or wouldn't have done in whatever hypothetical alternate hell scape where he is still president doesn't change that one bit.
How long until white people start showing up to protests with signs that read "property matters too"?
A fuckin Cracka will always be a fuckin Cracka
Nobody who actually has to deal with this racist culling bullshit is surprised
Nothing like a killing by police that brings Crackas out. You see it in these threads, in the White House, and the PD home base of the murderer
Nobody who actually has to deal with this racist culling bullshit is surprised
Nothing like a killing by police that brings Crackas out. You see it in these threads, in the White House, and the PD home base of the murderer
Was waiting for his first attempt to handle something like this and he did not deliver. Not that I was expecting him to drastically change.
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Guys can we stop with the Trump comparisons? Yeah Biden isnt ideal and he´s a shithead on this issue and many others too, but both sides are definitely not the same. The last 4 years should have proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt, but hyperbole gonna hyperbole I guess.
It's sad he went for the looting warning. I get he wants to keep the peace but it shouldn't be the go to response for the horrible killing, there needs to be massive reform and consequences for policing then you might have a chance of turning things around but as of now status quo garbage. The kid feared for his life that cost him his life, that's unforgivable.
I think it's worth hearing the full segment, not that it's much better but he at least acknowledges more.
I think it's worth hearing the full segment, not that it's much better but he at least acknowledges more.