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Ready to have your mind blown? The entirety of the North Pole melting would raise sea levels by about.. ZERO.

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Mukrab

Mukrab

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Apr 19, 2020
7,663
EDIT in the first sentence so people actually read it: IM SORRY FOR CHOOSING THE WRONG WORDS. WHAT I REALLY MEANT WAS FLOATING ICE OF ANY KIND LIKE THE VAST MAJORITY OF THE NORTH POLE. FORGIVE MY IGNORANCE.

EDIT:2

onadesertedisland said:
nsidc.org

Melting of floating ice will raise sea level

nsidc.org nsidc.org
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Thank you. I gladly correct my mistake. I chose the wrong example for something cool I had learned by going for the most mind-blowing example. Big mistake. Should have just gone with the ice in a glass example instead.




Facts.

So how this works is that we know that water expands in solid form. By about 10%. That 10% is the part of the ice that is above the water. But the water that the other 90% is displaying, already is the exact amount for the entirety of the ice to fit in that gap when it melts because it will shrink by 10%.

Sorry but global warming is still a big deal, but the reason the sea levels will rise is because of the ice that is on land that will melt, not the ice caps. This blew my mind, maybe its common knowledge, idk.

EDIT: Okay my bad i shouldnt have said ice caps. I should have said the north pole. Which has no land underneath as far as i know.
 
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mf.luder

mf.luder

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,676
Maybe you're wrong, maybe you're right but I did wonder the same thing pretty much. If something is frozen, it takes up more space, so if it thaws won't it displace less space?

I've never actually followed up and read about it but I probably should.
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586
Where is that Era dude who wanted to make a giant hole in Kansas to fill up melting ice caps
 
Hey Please

Hey Please

Avenger
Oct 31, 2017
22,824
Not America
Mukrab said:
Facts.

So how this works is that we know that water expands in solid form. By about 10%. That 10% is the part of the ice that is above the water. But the water that the other 90% is displaying, already is the exact amount for the entirety of the ice to fit in that gap when it melts because it will shrink by 10%.

Sorry but global warming is still a big deal, but the reason the sea levels will rise is because of the ice that is on land that will melt, not the ice caps. This blew my mind, maybe its common knowledge, idk.
Click to expand...
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Do you know the difference between sea ice and land ice?
 
Punchline

Punchline

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,151
That doesnt sound right but i dont know enough about ice caps and global warming to dispute this
 
RetroRunner

RetroRunner

Member
Dec 6, 2020
4,945
Why do people post threads about important shit they've done clearly no research on? Next thing you know we'll have threads about how the Earth isn't round because it's not perfectly uniform in diameter.
 
AlgusUnderdunk

AlgusUnderdunk

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Dec 30, 2020
15,356
Mukrab said:
I corrected my mistake of saying ice caps. I chose the wrong word. Should have said north pole i guess
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Unfortunately, it still would. in the Arctic it's not just ice, but sediment and structures resting on permafrost layers that would also fall ibto the ocean. Also keep in mind that not all icy bodies are freely floating, some are attached to masses that lessen the amount of ocean they'd be displacing.

Please avoid melting the Arctic whenever possible.
 
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Mukrab

Mukrab

Member
Apr 19, 2020
7,663
mf.luder said:
Maybe you're wrong, maybe you're right but I did wonder the same thing pretty much. If something is frozen, it takes up more space, so if it thaws won't it displace less space?

I've never actually followed up and read about it but I probably should.
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You can test this by having a cube of ice in a glass and fill it with water till it cant take even a single more drop and it will spill. You will have 10% of the ice even above that which would make you think that it would spill when it melts. it wont.

RetroRunner said:
Why do people post threads about important shit they've done clearly no research on? Next thing you know we'll have threads about how the Earth isn't round because it's not perfectly uniform in diameter.
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You seem to think that im denying climate change or something. Im not. This doesn't change anything. This doesn't change the math on how much sea levels will rise. Scientists know this and never maybe the mistake in the first place. I made a mistake in the title by saying polar caps but i assume you didnt read the thread because otherwise you would have seen the edit. I should ahve said this only applies to the northern pole.
 
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Mukrab

Mukrab

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Apr 19, 2020
7,663
Dardan Sandiego said:
Feels like we're witnessing the birth of a new conspiracy movement.
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Please explain to me what conspiracy? What are you thinking im trying to claim? Am i claiming science is wrong on global warming? No. Am i claiming they are wrong on by how much sea levels are gonna rise? No. Whats the conspiracy theory?
 
Whide

Whide

Member
Oct 27, 2017
49
Finland
Tobor said:
My biggest fear is what is in the ice. Some ancient virus is lurking in there, waiting to come out.
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4168-o.webp
 
AlgusUnderdunk

AlgusUnderdunk

Member
Dec 30, 2020
15,356
Mukrab said:
Please explain to me what conspiracy? What are you thinking im trying to claim? Am i claiming science is wrong on global warming? No. Am i claiming they are wrong on by how much sea levels are gonna rise? No. Whats the conspiracy theory?
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By the bye, see my post regarding trapped methane gasses in the Arctic ice, and reconsider your position with regard to the densities of various chemicals trapped in said ice.
 
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Mukrab

Mukrab

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Apr 19, 2020
7,663
AlgusUnderdunk said:
By the bye, see my post regarding trapped methane gasses in the Arctic ice, and reconsider your position with regard to the densities of various chemicals trapped in said ice.
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Whats your point? Am i saying that there is no downsides about arcitc ice melting? No. All i was trying to say is that free floating ice doesn't increase sea levels when it melts. Granted i did a poor job at explaining it.
 
AlgusUnderdunk

AlgusUnderdunk

Member
Dec 30, 2020
15,356
Mukrab said:
Whats your point? Am i saying that there is no downsides about arcitc ice melting? No. All i was trying to say is that free floating ice doesn't increase sea levels when it melts. Granted i did a poor job at explaining it.
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Ah but it DOES. Escaping methane exerts pressure, and LARGE amounts of it, which is what's in the Arctic right now, exerts sufficient amounts for tsunamis.

www.livescience.com

Massive Blobs of 'Fire Ice' Lurks Beneath the Ocean. We Know Almost Nothing About Them.

There's a huge cache of flammable ice under the ocean's surface, and it plays a key role in climate change. Scientists are only now beginning to understand what it looks like.
www.livescience.com www.livescience.com
 

Atom

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Jul 25, 2021
11,615
RetroRunner said:
Why do people post threads about important shit they've done clearly no research on? Next thing you know we'll have threads about how the Earth isn't round because it's not perfectly uniform in diameter.
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But it's not tho right? Like I'm pretty sure there were historical surveying experiments to try and figure out if the earth was squished more along its NS axis or along the equator.
 

Deleted member 8593

User requested account closure
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Oct 26, 2017
27,176
Mukrab said:
Please explain to me what conspiracy? What are you thinking im trying to claim? Am i claiming science is wrong on global warming? No. Am i claiming they are wrong on by how much sea levels are gonna rise? No. Whats the conspiracy theory?
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It's not much of a wrong claim as it is a dumb one, giving this thread that conspiracy theory vibe. People have written about the knock on effects of what this would cause. So while water "set free" by the arctic melting might not directly cause a rise in sea levels, it would definitely affect it.
 
LorentzFactor

LorentzFactor

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Oct 25, 2017
701
I feel this is what happens when rather than having humility about your ignorance, you take on the mantle of trying to preach something you just learned about.
 
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Mukrab

Mukrab

Member
Apr 19, 2020
7,663
AlgusUnderdunk said:
Ah but it DOES. Escaping methane exerts pressure, and LARGE amounts of it, which is what's in the Arctic right now, exerts sufficient amounts for tsunamis.

www.livescience.com

Massive Blobs of 'Fire Ice' Lurks Beneath the Ocean. We Know Almost Nothing About Them.

There's a huge cache of flammable ice under the ocean's surface, and it plays a key role in climate change. Scientists are only now beginning to understand what it looks like.
www.livescience.com www.livescience.com
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That doesn't meantion sea levels but regardless i guess i know what you're trying to say. Im gonna try to clarify once again what im trying to say. Im not talking about side effects. The Water that makes up floating ice does not increase sea levels in liquid form. It takes up the same space. Even if previously 10% of it was above water. Does that make sense?

Dardan Sandiego said:
It's not much of a wrong claim as it is a dumb one, giving this thread that conspiracy theory vibe. People have written about the knock on effects of what this would cause. So while water "set free" by the arctic melting might not directly cause a rise in sea levels, it would definitely affect it.
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Im sorry if it appeared that way. That was not my intention.

The Water that makes up floating ice does not increase sea levels in liquid form. It takes up the same space. Even if previously 10% of it was above water. Does that make sense?
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This was essentially all i was trying to say but failed miserably.
 
AlgusUnderdunk

AlgusUnderdunk

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Dec 30, 2020
15,356
Mukrab said:
That doesn't meantion sea levels but regardless i guess i know what you're trying to say. Im gonna try to clarify once again what im trying to say. Im not talking about side effects. The Water that makes up floating ice does not increase sea levels in liquid form. It takes up the same space. Even if previously 10% of it was above water. Does that make sense?


Im sorry if it appeared that way. That was not my intention.



This was essentially all i was trying to say but failed miserably.
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I am keenly aware of how displacement works. But the point is you didn't introduce a scenario with a simple ice cube in a glass. You brought in the entirety of the North Pole. It's a bad argument that overly simplifies the science. Please reconsider your statement.
 
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