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Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360

There's also census data on this

so, looking for some research help here.

there are plenty of articles on brave current parents despite taboo saying they regret having children.

I'd like some hard numbers of any kind really, but especially if anyone can find anything on older/retired/people who have had kids that are now adults who definitively regret it.

I am early 30s and my wife is 35. We are pretty much at Dinks for life stage.

there are many benefits and nearly in a daily basis they surprise me. I notice my parent colleagues even in higher income brackets drive shitty cars (possibly, I'm in sales so it is at times hard to say, I tried to move into a different position at work that I would have considered a promotion but it was like a 30k salary drop lol).

Just this week I came back from a 2 week Europe trip and virtually every parent, even if they are in their late 50s/60s have never been to Europe, and then lots of things that I would consider a pretty trivial expense are considered expensive, etc.

I constantly hear it's absolutely worth it to have kids but is that just an empty justification?

Same friend coworker has expressed jealously and has said the first one was an accident. My sisters kid was an accident as well. I sometimes wonder how many kids are accidents and then people just go along with it.

Is there really something so satisfying to raising children? Like what percent is truly no regrets? Because by the same argument people seem pretty happy not having them.

edit:yeah it's honestly kind of hard to frame, by reverse information I specifically mean the reverse of people who are older who didn't have kids and don't have regrets. So I'd like to see the same information positive or Negative from older people who had them and did have kids. Preferably some kind of study.

it's perplexing to me that it seems no such study exists on a pretty existential question.
 
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Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
38,984
It took millions of years of evolution and mating to produce a creature that says "what's in it for me?"
 

Jubbe

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,779
Having kids is a personal decision and the only thing that annoys me is people implying that either side of the decision is wrong.
 

Freeglader

Unshakable Resolve - One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 13, 2017
825
i often think about these sorts of things. Is it selfish to not have kids so you can do whatever the hell you want? Or is choosing to bring children into an overpopulated and overheating planet more selfish?
 

AlteredBeast

Don't Watch the Tape!
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,768
If you don't want to have kids, no matter of convincing/ pros and cons etc from ParentERA is going to change your mind.

Exactly.

My kids (all four of them) complete me. It is amazing to pour your love and knowledge into a child and watch them grow. It has made me a better, more responsible person with a higher fulfillment in life. Traveling the world is fun and important, but I would take my kids in a heartbeat every day of the week.
 

GearDraxon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,786
If you're saying things like "wow those parents I know drive shitty cars," uh, yeah. Kids might not be for you.

This is from someone who, with his wife, has decided against having children.
 

LewieP

Member
Oct 26, 2017
18,105
I'm pretty clumsy and forgetful, so I'd constantly be worried about dropping or standing on my hypothetical child, or leaving them somewhere. Way too stressful.
 

Bigwombat

Banned
Nov 30, 2018
3,416
Your op is kind of confusing. I don't have kids and some days I regret it and others I'm completely fine with it. Most of my friends have children between 2 and 8.
 

IggyChooChoo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,230
I feel like this needs more parameters. Like, when should you expect the regret to set in? And how late to make it pay off? Like, if it only set when you were 80, that's a good deal, but if it set in at 60, it isn't. What's the over-under here?
 

Hollywood Duo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
42,077
I didn't have kids until I had lived my life for quite awhile so I think that makes a big difference. Nothing wrong with not having kids. Kids deserve loving parents who are committed to them so don't do it just cause you feel pressured by society.
 

thewienke

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,990
My wife and I don't have children but we're thinking about adoption.

Selfishly I often think of retirement and end of life situations. What if my spouse dies before me in old age? Who will I have after all the generation before me passes away? I don't have any family that I'm close with. Who will make decisions for me in my best interest should I become infirm?
 

Eegah

Member
Oct 27, 2017
652
I can see the appeal of not having kids when you are young / middle aged.

On the other hand, I've known dozens of old people with no children. As their bodies break down they don't have help. As their financial situation slowly deteriorates they don't have help. As they become lonely and depressed because their spouse died 8 years ago and they have no more family, they have no emotional support.

That's the idea that always haunts me when I think about not having any kids.
 

Avitus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,925
there are many benefits and nearly in a daily basis they surprise me. I notice my parent colleagues even in higher income brackets drive shitty cars (possibly, I'm in sales so it is at times hard to say, I tried to move into a different position at work that I would have considered a promotion but it was like a 30k salary drop lol).

Oh no, they drive worse cars. The horror. Don't have kids if this is your mindset.
 

Aureon

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,819
But i'd have to drive a shitty car?
That's your argument, really?

I can understand not wanting children of a million reasons, but "i'd have to drive a shitty car" is.. eh...

It took millions of years of evolution and mating to produce a creature that says "what's in it for me?"
Yeah.
 

Allforce

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,136
I got an 18 year old out of the house partially (college) and an 8 year old. If it wasn't for the younger one I'd be an empty-nester at 41. Now I will be at 51. Still should give me a good 20 years to fuck around and do whatever I want.

The people I really feel bad for are people my age who are JUST NOW having a child. Like man you're gonna be that 70 year old at your kid's graduation? There's always a few. I went down on move-in weekend for my daughter at college and just flat out said to her after walking around "Please just kill me if I show up to visit with gray hair in a visor, polo shirt tucked into my jeans, and white New Balances on" because that shit was EVERYWHERE.
 

Stinkles

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
20,459
Don't do it bro my daughter is a jerk and now I can't have a new video card or a motorbike
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Your op is kind of confusing. I don't have kids and some days I regret it and others I'm completely fine with it. Most of my friends have children between 2 and 8.

yeah it's honestly kind of hard to frame, by reverse information I specifically mean the reverse of people who are older who didn't have kids and don't have regrets. So I'd like to see the same information positive or Negative from older people who had them and did have kids
 
Oct 27, 2017
45,281
Seattle
i often think about these sorts of things. Is it selfish to not have kids so you can do whatever you want? Or is choosing to bring children into an overpopulated and overheating planet more selfish?

I look at it that I hope more of my peers have children, we need the next generation to try and fix this mess.

My son is already on his way to being a good steward. He is always talking about carbon footprint and palm oil farms
 

Rodan

Member
Nov 3, 2017
634
Having your first child is impossible to describe, and obviously it isn't the same for everyone, but for me, when I think about my daughter I can't imagine life without her. My own health and happiness can be damned, my priority is her health and happiness. There's something really special about that relationship that in many ways is even stronger than the one between spouses.

She's one year old. When she says "papa" and gives me a hug, nothing else in my life compares. If that sounds appealing to you, consider having children, and if it doesn't than it probably isn't for you. It's not about regrets, it's about what your priorities are in life.
 

Powdered Egg

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
17,070
Your co-workers failed to travel overseas not because they are parents, but because they lacked either funds or imagination, or both.

It's a personal decision OP. Don't do it if you don't want to.
 

WhoTurgled

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,052
My aunt broke down crying to me once because she has no kids and is afraid no one will take care of her when shes old
 
Oct 27, 2017
45,281
Seattle
I got an 18 year old out of the house partially (college) and an 8 year old. If it wasn't for the younger one I'd be an empty-nester at 41. Now I will be at 51. Still should give me a good 20 years to fuck around and do whatever I want.

The people I really feel bad for are people my age who are JUST NOW having a child. Like man you're gonna be that 70 year old at your kid's graduation? There's always a few. I went down on move-in weekend for my daughter at college and just flat out said to her after walking around "Please just kill me if I show up to visit with gray hair in a visor, polo shirt tucked into my jeans, and white New Balances on" because that shit was EVERYWHERE.

45 with a four year old daughter and 9 year old son.

I have friends that have older children in their 20s and also children in the single digits.
 

Fulminator

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,202
It took millions of years of evolution and mating to produce a creature that says "what's in it for me?"
lmao

I got an 18 year old out of the house partially (college) and an 8 year old. If it wasn't for the younger one I'd be an empty-nester at 41. Now I will be at 51. Still should give me a good 20 years to fuck around and do whatever I want.

The people I really feel bad for are people my age who are JUST NOW having a child. Like man you're gonna be that 70 year old at your kid's graduation? There's always a few. I went down on move-in weekend for my daughter at college and just flat out said to her after walking around "Please just kill me if I show up to visit with gray hair in a visor, polo shirt tucked into my jeans, and white New Balances on" because that shit was EVERYWHERE.

if I have kids i'd much rather have/adopt them when I'm 35+ (even 40) than younger

who gives a fuck if they're 70 at a graduation? what? lol
 
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Deleted member 2625

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,596
It's impossible to pin a "worth" on this in the abstract. It's a basic human compulsion. I believe parents when they tell me "everything changed" when their kid was born.

for context, I am childless by choice with my wife and don't regret it for a second.
 
OP
OP

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
I can see the appeal of not having kids when you are young / middle aged.

On the other hand, I've known dozens of old people with no children. As their bodies break down they don't have help. As their financial situation slowly deteriorates they don't have help. As they become lonely and depressed because their spouse died 8 years ago and they have no more family, they have no emotional support.

That's the idea that always haunts me when I think about not having any kids.

well see this is the shit that resonates for me but it seems like crazy selfish thinking. My brother brought this shit up to me and it was like damn so your kids are just an insurance policy?

And then your kids might be assholes anyway and you end up in virtually the same situation. Like how many times do we hear the well it's time to put mom in a home (and they aren't even assholes for doing that). Ideally it goes quickly when it gets to that point and if you don't have children theoretically you have the funding to take care of yourself. And if it gets to the point the lines are blurred on I dont even know what's going on then I'll take care of myself if you catch my drift.
 

Conmex

Banned
May 19, 2018
416
you likely wont feel it til you get older. for example i have a co worker friend who never had kids and got divorced in his 40s. he recently got into a bad car accident and hes been alone in the hospital for 2 weeks.

my dad on the other hand had a room full of grandkids after his car accident.
 

Darknight

"I'd buy that for a dollar!"
Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,858
yeah it's honestly kind of hard to frame, by reverse information I specifically mean the reverse of people who are older who didn't have kids and don't have regrets. So I'd like to see the same information positive or Negative from older people who had them and did have kids
You mention people not having traveled to Europe but one thing to consider is it's much easier to travel after you have kids when you're older than it is to have kids when you're older. My parents are retired now and they do lots of traveling so they get to do both in their lifetime.
 

HeySeuss

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
8,859
Ohio
I got an 18 year old out of the house partially (college) and an 8 year old. If it wasn't for the younger one I'd be an empty-nester at 41. Now I will be at 51. Still should give me a good 20 years to fuck around and do whatever I want.

The people I really feel bad for are people my age who are JUST NOW having a child. Like man you're gonna be that 70 year old at your kid's graduation? There's always a few. I went down on move-in weekend for my daughter at college and just flat out said to her after walking around "Please just kill me if I show up to visit with gray hair in a visor, polo shirt tucked into my jeans, and white New Balances on" because that shit was EVERYWHERE.
Yep. Empty nester at 43 and is pretty great. I planned on having kids young so that I could have fun with my grandkids when the time comes. I have a couple of friends that have single digit aged kids that are my age and that's exactly what i think. Being 68 at their graduation as their parent is frightening to me, if they even live that long.
 

Powdered Egg

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
17,070
My aunt broke down crying to me once because she has no kids and is afraid no one will take care of her when shes old
Yeah it's sad to see old lonely folks.
well see this is the shit that resonates for me but it seems like crazy selfish thinking. My brother brought this shit up to me and it was like damn so your kids are just an insurance policy?

And then your kids might be assholes anyway and you end up in virtually the same situation. Like how many times do we hear the well it's time to put mom in a home (and they aren't even assholes for doing that). Ideally it goes quickly when it gets to that point and if you don't have children theoretically you have the funding to take care of yourself. And if it gets to the point the lines are blurred on I dont even know what's going on then I'll take care of myself if you catch my drift.
It's not really selfish, it's a part of life. I sacrificed everything to raise my kids and one day I'm going to be a busted old clown. Can I at least get a ride to the doctor?
 

Chopchop

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,171
It's absolutely your decision and I think it's better to not have a kid than it is to have one and then regret it. It's a decision you can't take back, and you don't want to raise a kid who feels unwanted.

I have a kid. Life with a kid vs not having one is a bit like life with an SO vs single life. Do you sometimes miss your life living single and alone? You have a lot more freedom to do what you want, you can slack off at home if you feel like it, and you have no one to answer to. You can indulge in whatever habits you have at home without worrying about whether or not your SO would be bothered by it. It's liberating in a way, and some people like staying single because of it.

Spending quality time with your SO can give you moments that enrich your life in ways that you can't alone. It can also give you moments in life that make you feel far worse than you can alone, like a bad fight, your SO letting you down, or knowing you really fucked up somehow. Compared to single life, life with an SO brings higher highs, but also lower lows.

Life with a kid is like taking that dynamic a step further. You have less freedom and time in your life to yourself because you have more responsibilities and more people to answer to. But a kid brings more highs and lows to your life. You may have moments you're exhausted as fuck and yet your kid won't stop crying. But you also have moments when your kid figures out something before your eyes and then looks at you with a beaming "I did it!" expression. You get to see your kid figure out things with growing complexity and self-sufficiency while you still remember when he struggled to even roll over.
 
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