If sales are still a relevant metric for a game being shadowdropped on Game Pass day 1, then it's clear they literally have no clue what they're doing. It goes against any reasonable and natural logic.
Sarah Bond dodges questions on Xbox studio closures
- Thread starter Joule
- Start date
No I'm surprised at the level of disbelief people are showing at the news that's it.
And so you're demanding proof of things like which awards they won and sales numbers...because? You clearly have an agenda beyond stating you're surprised. Are you trying to convince everyone that they should have been shut down?
It's not hard to understand why, though. Hi-Fi Rush was Xbox's most successful game in years, having won an award at pretty much every award show in the past year, and it has a strong word of mouth. Even if you don't believe what Xbox executives say, you have to at least acknowledge that. Microsoft then proceeded to say they need more games like Hi-Fi Rush, despite shutting down the studio behind it. People are in disbelief because there is seemingly no winning with Xbox and they will shut down studios regardless of whether they are currently doing well or not.
Again, I knew about the awards it won but that doesn't give us the whole picture as people are trying to paint this thing.
Who am I to convince anyone of anything when I myself don't have any new inside-info lol.
They very frequently say nothing about rumours or speculation - they just ignore it. That's the normal behaviour. Certainly this wasn't even on the same planet as an important news story that would move the stock price at the time, necessitating an immediate response, but they chose to speak publicly and make statements that it succeeded by their metrics.
I have no reason to doubt that, because the budget was quite modest, far smaller than most of Microsoft's games, it got great reviews, great community buzz, and it posted decent sales numbers on Steam for a game that launched day and date into a subscription service. As a point of reference, Forspoken was a much more expensive project which also had a day-and-date PC release on Steam, and they both launched around the same time, and Hi Fi Rush posted not just higher sales numbers but also outperformed it by revenue on the platform, no small feat when Forspoken had over 2x the RRP. People have also compared it earlier to Forza motorsports - another much more expensive game that Hi Fi Rush pulled more sales numbers than on the platform.
Why would Greenberg go out of his way to comment on a rumour just to tell a very direct lie? The most parsimonuious explanation is that Hi Fi Rush did pretty decently, met Xbox's commercial expectations, and exceeded their critical expectations.
We already had Schrier come out and clarify that one of the factors in shutting the team down was not that it was singularly unprofitable and unsuccessful, but simply that they were required to make harsh cuts and Tango Gameworks happened to be one of the farthest teams from releasing anything. Hi Fi Rush didn't do so overwhelmingly well that it saved the studio, but that doesn't mean it didn't do pretty well for what it was, a mid budget title.
Couldn't be him. He just said he doesn't buy into corporate marketing speak like Game Pass increases game sales.
Yes, if it wasn't clear to you when you went up digging my post history lmao. GP is best-value deal in gaming to me, what of it ?
Yep, it's one of their freshest and most original games in years. And maybe it didn't set the charts on fire with sales, but it was a new IP that reached 3 million + players. There is value in continuing to expand that brand so one day it can be profitable. Do a collaboration with an animation studio to do an animated series, merchandise, comics, hell, a sequel that is actually marketed properly!
And what do they do, piss it down the drain.
It is infuriating that they FINALLY have a game that looks like its gonna be really fucking good and they are telling noone about it.
Critically and in terms of awards and general sentiment, yes. But games like Grounded and Starfield were played by far more people.
I agree with what you're saying and I'm as upset and angry about Tango as anyone, but I think saying that it was the most successful Xbox game in years is not fully accurate.
Oh yeah ? Is that what you managed to infer from all this ? That I hate devs ?
Bad doggy, go back to licking your balls maybe.
"success" has a lot of meanings
Xbox had/has a narrative problem
that they don't have games BELOVED
oh hey, hi-fi is BELOVED
let's capitalize on that press!
aaaaaaaand ya fuvkin CLOSED
You're very eagerly using unit sales to justify the closing of a studio and the resulting job losses having less than two months ago mocked those who question the profitability of Game Pass, a service on which their last game appeared day one in a shadow drop announcement.
This enthusiastic defence of a trillion dollar company when it does the obscene is gross.
There's only so much that can be read into Tango's closure. I mean, the circumstances surrounding it are shitty as all hell, but if devs like Insomniac and Naughty Dog aren't immune to layoffs, then who is?
Fuck, I cannot believe she didn't expect such question, how the hell can you answer that?
when this eventually creeps up on Nintendo this shit is gonna get
extra fucking depressing
Japanese labor laws are pretty strict about mass layoffs. I think Nintendo will adjust their output before they consider mass layoffs.
Not talking specifically about Hi-Fi Rush here, but not everyone who plays games on Game Pass would buy those games if they didn't launch on Game Pass. I'm sure some would, but it's entirely possible that even fewer people would experience the games and then you have fewer people talking about them and evangelising them.
I was defending "gamepass the service as it holds value to me" there not the company behind it and I couldn't care less whether its profitable or not.
I AM NOT DEFEDNING MS/XBOX FOR TANGO CLOSURE FFS
Yeah you have been.
You even posted debunked bullshit about Mikami leaving Tango and gutting the studio on his way out as justification for their closure.
Imagine having a "long-term business strategy" when you can burn it all down for short-term metrics.
If having critically-successful, "smaller" games to add value to Game Pass is no longer an aim, I have to wonder how soon the other shoe will drop on GP as whole.
maybe read that again, it was just speculation. I even started that with " I might be wrong...." lmao
So mikami left and nobody else did with him and that left the studio in no worse state than before right ? Ok, I take it as a fact if it's fact now, happy?
I just want to know what happens when the next Xbox sells 15 units, because they have tanked any reason for anyone to own one
They have a showcase next month, which they're now going into with a cloud over them
It's just unforced error, after unforced error
I have no idea what their grand plan looks like, as it seems like they want to sabotage Game Pass with price hikes and studio closures ensuring they have fewer games coming to the service
They want to tank their hardware by putting out all their exclusive games on other systems
They want to tank their own first party titles by putting them all on GP day 1 so that anyone can play them for a tenner in the first month, and then shut studios down when those games don't make millions and millions
It's just an endless descending spiral of poor choice after poor choice
They have a showcase next month, which they're now going into with a cloud over them
It's just unforced error, after unforced error
I have no idea what their grand plan looks like, as it seems like they want to sabotage Game Pass with price hikes and studio closures ensuring they have fewer games coming to the service
They want to tank their hardware by putting out all their exclusive games on other systems
They want to tank their own first party titles by putting them all on GP day 1 so that anyone can play them for a tenner in the first month, and then shut studios down when those games don't make millions and millions
It's just an endless descending spiral of poor choice after poor choice
Also, far be from it me to defend a corpo, but sticking Sarah Bond with the hard questions while the rest of Microsoft fucks off is lame.
Dina did say "I know you're not the studios chief" (which is obviously Booty) but yeah.
I understand who says that compenies don't care about winning awards and just want their games to sale, it makes perfect sense, but the problem is their strategy.
I if want best-sellers, why did they greenlit HiFi Rush to begin with?
Hellblade sold 1 million copies in one year on ps4 and PC, basically nothing for a company like Microsoft, why did they acquire Ninja Theory to make them develop Hellblade 2?
I if want best-sellers, why did they greenlit HiFi Rush to begin with?
Hellblade sold 1 million copies in one year on ps4 and PC, basically nothing for a company like Microsoft, why did they acquire Ninja Theory to make them develop Hellblade 2?
You've been quick to question a good number (20K +) of overwhelmingly good reviews about a game that was sold (probably one of the best Microsoft games released on steam ever), you're curiously always giving the benefit of the doubt towards the studio slayer first.
To be fair, it doesn't seem like the leadership knows, either.
Thanks for the timestamp. What a terrible response to the question.
I really fear for Ninja Theory, they are about to release a game that will likely review well and have good numbers on Gamepass but I cannot see it lighting up the sales charts. They then pitch another game that will take 5 or 6 years to release.
I think the issue is MS keeps changing their long term grand strategy every 6 months, so when those games were greenlit, they were part of what MS wanted to do. Build a strong first party and produce lots of good games that bring value to GP
That's clearly not the plan anymore
It's not like every Microsoft executive wasn't coached ad nauseum on what to say publicly and had a list of talking points to pull from. You can see the mental gymnastics going on as she pulls a rehearsed response that was carefully written by legal and the PR team. Sarah, Booty, Phil would all be saying the same things.
Plus, and I hope this doesn't come across bad, but she went to Yale and Harvard - I think she is completely capable of handling this situation just fine on her own.
The grand plan is clear: become Activision, focusing entirely on blockbuster franchises and channelling development resources into getting them out more often and onto every platform.
They don't want to be in the console hardware business.
Their buisness model is something that makes game sales a near pointless metric though. Like you buy a bunch of studios, most of which didn't have big sellers consistently despite the high quality. MS can't be shocked when they don't sell particularly well still when they are terrible at marketing the games and release on 2 platforms, 1 of which the majority of the spending userbase can get their games day 1 for no additional cost.
It's a bad interview and she does look completely drained.
On the other hand it could have been a lot worse, I feel the interviewer didn't even attempt to follow up for an actual answer once.
I do wonder if this was scheduled before this decision was made, and they couldn't back out of it.
On the other hand it could have been a lot worse, I feel the interviewer didn't even attempt to follow up for an actual answer once.
I do wonder if this was scheduled before this decision was made, and they couldn't back out of it.
Right right.
Still feels like she pulled the short straw this time.