Sequels are cool, and this gives them opportunity to iterate and make the parts of Hades that weren't great better. Namely the roguelite elements.
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Show of Hands: Are you happy that Supergiant Games broke their no-sequels rule for Hades II?
- Thread starter ScOULaris
- Start date
I like Hades a lot and I'll be there for Hades II day one, but... I can't help but be a little disappointed because I want to see whole new ideas from this studio. The criativity they have gave us Pyre, which is one of my favorite games of all time. And I will always have Hades I! But it is what it is.
I don't think it's worth trying to please everyone. Studios should always just make what they want if they have the opportunity. As fans we can support their choice. They don't miss either way.
One of my first videos I made was on this topic. I would rather something new, but also, I can not blame them one bit for going the sequel route after the success they saw with Hades and well gladly buy Hades 2. I have full faith Hades 2 will be an amazing game just like all their others.
Let's not get real. You're making assumptions here and implying they made a sequel because the first game made them the most money. I'd rather arguments were made based on some evidence. Otherwise this is baseless speculation. What if they wanted to explore more of Greek mythology? Keep building on their narrative experiments with roguelike structures? With the statement they've released, they said they want to do that and also bring the sense of novelty again for a sequel. You're disappointed they made a sequel and not an original IP in the few years after Hades. That's fine. Making cash grab insinuations is not, though.
What's the name of the character you're trying to save and the name of underworld where the game takes place?
How does "Hades" not work anymore? In addition to being a continuation of the story told in the first.
I am glad in the sense that it means they will continue as a company but each game they have made has been so interesting and unique that I won't lie in being disappointed but I get it and I am happy for them. I also got bored of Hades before I completed so I am a little bitter that my personal favorites didn't get the accolades and popularity they deserved.
Anyway, good for Supergiant, it's rough out there, happy for them.
Anyway, good for Supergiant, it's rough out there, happy for them.
OP
OP
I certainly never used a reductionist term like "cash grab" anywhere, but I don't think it's too much of a reach to assume that the massive success of Hades after their previous game had underperformed played a significant role in it becoming the first game to break their no-sequel rule. They've never outright said as much, no, but it's absolutely a fair and reasonable assumption to make.
It's also completely understandable and not at all nefarious.
But yes, I'm disappointed that they broke their rule for whatever reasons because to me their variety was a huge distinguishing factor in my eyes. Like Fumito Ueda's games are among my all-time favorites, but I would absolutely be disappointed if he decided to do a sequel to any of them instead of continuing his streak of new standalone games each time.
I'm happy for SuperGiant, but Hades was my least favorite of their games so I'm definitely bummed we're just getting more of that. But it's a game that a lot of people love and that the developers can feel confident making, both creatively and fiscally. That far supersedes any selfish notions I or others might have about preferring a new style of game from them.
No both options on the poll? Honestly I do wish they had done something new but I'm not complaining about getting more Hades. I got to the end game in both the Switch and PS5 versions and I still go back to it every so often. I'm so excited that it's going to be hell ignoring it in early access.
It doesn't matter, they can do what they want and what they feel is best for them both financially and creatively. PErsonally I'd have loved a new unique universe and gameplay style as roguelikes aren't really my thing. I enjoy roguelike modes, or like deck builders or games where there isn't really story I'm missing with the restarting (like Balatro). I liked Hades, it plays VERY smoothly with cool weapons and fun modifiers and builds but also it sucked finally "beating" it only to be told "ha, that isn't the end or the point. Keep replaying!". I liked the characters, art, dialogue and writing and everything but I kinda hate the sort of incremental progression and having to redo lots of a game that you do with roguelikes that are also telling a story or have a narrative. Like a Souls game can throw a brick wall of a boss at you and you have to run the level again, but when I beat that bastard I then progress and move on to the next thing and only have to redo that past stuff if I want to NG+.
So yeah, makes total sense for them to make a sequel to their biggest hit (critically and financially) but I do wish we got something new and not roguey. (I still think Transistor is my favourite of theirs).
So yeah, makes total sense for them to make a sequel to their biggest hit (critically and financially) but I do wish we got something new and not roguey. (I still think Transistor is my favourite of theirs).
I trust Supergiant enough to let them do whatever they want. So if they feel the need to have a sequel, then that's exciting.
I wouldn't say I'm unhappy by it (very happy to see them find great success) but definitely would be more interested in something new.
I'm a game developer with multiple released indie games as well as prior big studio experience and am well aware of how much things cost to make and how much a game like Hades would have made.
The answer to your very first question is extremely, like more than you are probably imagining by an order of magnitude.
That's why I said all things can be true, it's ok for anyone to have wanted a different thing and also for them to decide to do what they are doing because that's what they are passionate about.
I'm not hating, I'm not saying it's bad, I'm simply saying I personally felt, even if what they are doing is good.
I was okay with it at the initial announcement as it's one of their best games and had a lot of room for expansion.
Having played through the technical test they made available, I'm even more okay with it. More Hades, even with the very limited scope of the test. Main character is great too.
Having played through the technical test they made available, I'm even more okay with it. More Hades, even with the very limited scope of the test. Main character is great too.
Hades was fun. I'm glad they are making another one. Make some money and then do whatever you want after. I'm assuming that all the accolades translated to a lot of revenue. So it's in their best interest to make another.
Absolutely nothing wrong with doing a sequel so long as artistic integrity is maintained.
I sometimes get the feeling that some people poo-poo sequels just because they're not wholly original.
Like the Aeneid and Huckleberry Finn are sequels, but no one ever complains about those.
I sometimes get the feeling that some people poo-poo sequels just because they're not wholly original.
Like the Aeneid and Huckleberry Finn are sequels, but no one ever complains about those.
That's a big hypothetical. It's like if I asked: "would you rather have a new game or a sequel that is by far the best game you have ever played and will ever play?" (How can I know that?)
I mean, what makes you so sure the new game would be just-as-good? Some of the best games ever made are sequels, as the developers get to improve and expand their original idea. So, no, I don't believe a new game would be just as good as Hades 2, and I'm excited to see what the refined version of Hades will look like.
Where's the poll option for "let's wait until the game is out to answer this question?"
Until we know how much Hades II iterates on/expands the formula, I don't think there's a right answer. It could just be more of the same, or it could build on the formula in unique and interesting new ways. We don't know yet.
Until we know how much Hades II iterates on/expands the formula, I don't think there's a right answer. It could just be more of the same, or it could build on the formula in unique and interesting new ways. We don't know yet.
Yes, because I felt Hades was amazing but fell short on level, enemy and power variety. I wanted more.
To break with their own rule, they probably still had a lot of unused ideas and felt the same.
To break with their own rule, they probably still had a lot of unused ideas and felt the same.
I was pretty disappointed when they announced it.
The original game sold so much more than their others though, so purely from the perspective of longevity for Supergiant, a sequel will probably do really well for them.
I also can't be too disappointed until I actually play it!
The original game sold so much more than their others though, so purely from the perspective of longevity for Supergiant, a sequel will probably do really well for them.
I also can't be too disappointed until I actually play it!
I'm more bummed that they are continuing to work in the rogue-like framework.
Like the sequel part, of course, I can't be mad at artistic choices. But, having played all of their games to completion since day one, I just feel that their strengths are better maximized in more linear/scripted macro-structures.
Hades is their better gameplaying work. But, in my opinion, it's their least interesting 'moments' game.
Like the sequel part, of course, I can't be mad at artistic choices. But, having played all of their games to completion since day one, I just feel that their strengths are better maximized in more linear/scripted macro-structures.
Hades is their better gameplaying work. But, in my opinion, it's their least interesting 'moments' game.
i really like hades, it is probably my favorite game of theirs, but they are so consistently interesting and creative i would have preferred something new. i will still likely play hades 2. maybe ill give transistor another try. its the only game of theirs i never really got into.
I would've preferred a new IP tbh. Their games already iterate and improve based off each other.
However, Supergiant is such a wholesome developer and it's amazing watching them bask in their own success!
However, Supergiant is such a wholesome developer and it's amazing watching them bask in their own success!
This tread is proof that "gamers" don't care about new I.P.s, it's just a code for "I don't like that games this developers makes so I want them to make games that I would like to play instead"
It's Super giants choice to make Hades II and I respect that but I would have liked seeing them keep to the pattern of developing new games instead of sequels.
And Hades is awesome I spend 2 days basically just playing it and had a great time and I bet Hades II will be just as great and I will def play it.
And hey I'm 100% sure their next game will be not be a sequel but I also wouldn't mind them making a follow up to any of their previous games.
It's Super giants choice to make Hades II and I respect that but I would have liked seeing them keep to the pattern of developing new games instead of sequels.
And Hades is awesome I spend 2 days basically just playing it and had a great time and I bet Hades II will be just as great and I will def play it.
And hey I'm 100% sure their next game will be not be a sequel but I also wouldn't mind them making a follow up to any of their previous games.
Hades is my least liked game by them. Pyre > Transistor > Bastion > Hades.
I think you can figure out my answer.
I think you can figure out my answer.
Not really. There's nothing wrong with wanting a sequel to something you like, nor is it incompatible with also wanting new IPs. It'd be one thing if we were talking about Hades V or some shit, but surely you can understand how it's perfectly normal to want at least one sequel to a game you ended up really liking.
I'd much prefer something new. I felt like Hades was perfect beginning to end with no need for a sequel, so I can't say I'm happy about it. That being said, considering its enormous success, they'd be STUPID not to pursue the IP further.
So while I'll probably skip H2, I sure as hell ain't gonna fault them for trying follow-up on a success in hopes of making a bigger one, especially in these uncertain times in gamedev.
So while I'll probably skip H2, I sure as hell ain't gonna fault them for trying follow-up on a success in hopes of making a bigger one, especially in these uncertain times in gamedev.
Exactly.
If people don't like Hades and therefore would be naturally less interested in a sequel knowing it's all they're gonna be a working on for the next year, I totally get it. Even if you liked the game and feel tapped out on that world, I get it.
What rubs me the wrong way about this thread is the idea of bagging on an indie studio for having the gall to make a sequel like it's some lazy cash grab that's a betrayal to original art and all that it stands for, while 9 of our top 10 GotY are sequels, while people went to bat for the winner for reusing the same world and charging even more for it, while we're surrounded by indie sequels and the industry is what it is right now with layoffs left and right is so unserious to me.
But looking forward to the next time someone gets mad when it's suggested different studios and IP get different treatment by people.
Explain the logic in making a Pyre sequel then.
Is there a game of theirs that has more sequel potential than Hades? I wouldn't have sneezed at a Bastion 2, but let's not pretend people weren't asking for more with this game. More Gods, more boons. People wanted expansions. People modded in new Gods to Hades 1. You're just reducing it down to money and ignoring a ton of other factors.
Yeah, I agree with all of what you're saying. Like it's funny how everyone is all "I love Super Giant, so wholesome, such artistic integrity, etc etc" but then they make one sequel and that all flies out the window. The idea that a sequel could be made with the same intent as their previous games doesn't exist. Immediately it's a decision based entirely on money and everything else we know about these people and their creative process doesn't apply anymore apparently? I think they've earned the benefit of the doubt myself. Let's try not to focus on hypotheticals and jump to conclusions.
I think it's fine, I don't think they're obligated to stick to that rule, if it's one they actually made. Maybe they could have made a game in between though and let ideas accumulate over time, because I am a little worried it will just be Hades but more, which would still be fine and I'm sure many would still love, but I'd be more excited with more major changes and I haven't seen much admittedly, but I don't recall seeing something like that so far.
But really we should be fine with studios doing whatever they think is best.
But really we should be fine with studios doing whatever they think is best.
For me, it's not even benefit of the doubt at this point, they showed their game, so far everything I could've asked for and more.
I'm not the biggest Hades fan in the world, so I'd have probably rathered a new game. However, I don't think my issues with Hades were completely un-solvable, so I'll still potentially give the second one a try.
At the end of the day it's up to them really. There's plenty of games to play these days, so no worries if one comes out that might not be for me.
At the end of the day it's up to them really. There's plenty of games to play these days, so no worries if one comes out that might not be for me.
As a roguelite fan, I thought Hades did so much to give the formula a spotlight. At the same time, I always felt it erred on the weaker side in terms of content. I'm glad they're going back, I fully expect to see more fleshed out systems, ideas, worlds that will let it really shine above and beyond what the original had to offer.
Is there an actual stated by them stance that they wouldn't do a sequel? I always thought through interviews I read that sequels were never off the table. Just that if they couldn't make a follow up that challenged their creativity or let them evoke the same feeling as the previous game. They wouldn't do it.