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Bayouswampman

Banned
Oct 27, 2018
99
If Sony really wanted to set an example they'd tell the music division to start censoring Fate Grand Order and all the animes they license for the same content they censor on Playstation.

But FGO makes over $1 billion each year so of course they wont that would be idiotic to murder one of your biggest cash cows.
 

Deleted member 6730

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,526
So sony has a problem with sexual content, but are ok with someones head shooting out of their ass?
Someone ripping your face off isn't going to happen. Perving and abusing underage girls is a thing that happens everyday. Nobody takes issue with cartoony violence because it's just that, cartoony. Jerking off to underage girls isn't.
 

neilyadig

Member
Nov 13, 2017
588
I find this a fascinating discussion. FYI, if you guys receive the WSJ 10-Point newsletter, they have asked for comment on this article today:
Question for tomorrow's 10-Point:
What are your thoughts on Sony's efforts to crack down on sexual content in PlayStation 4 videogames? Email us your comments, which we may edit before publication, to [email protected], and make sure to include your first and last name and location.

I think the comments should be published tomorrow.
 

HardRojo

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,145
Peru
What is your point? I don't even know what you're trying to say regarding my reply. And that part I mention with Cawai is the scene from that post you quoted. The scene in detail shows Roshi not falling for his previous shit again, but I won't elaborate because I don't like that part of his, like any other same adult would by now.
 
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Yukari

Member
Mar 28, 2018
11,714
Thailand
What is your point? I don't even know what you're trying to say regarding my reply. And that part I mention with Cawai is the scene from that post you quoted. The scene in detail shows Roshi not falling for his previous shit again, but I won't elaborate because I don't like that part of his, like any other same adult would by now.

sorry i forgot her name is cawai (too many character on this arcs)
but I throught early nosebleed joke show that he still easy falling after the training
 
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Sep 14, 2018
4,628
I attempted to read through this thread but the arguments were so stupid I gave up. God forbid Trish's crack gets lensflared lol. Interesting how many users were up in arms about this censorship (of depictions of underage characters in sexual situations). Equating sexualization with violence, blaming puritanism etc. I understand concerns about censorship but this really isn't where you sound the alarm, I know I'm talking to a bunch of banned people but it seems you place a bit too much importance on these depictions and you should do some looking inward as to why that is.

And no, poor Trish's buttcrack getting unfairly swept up in this "wave of censorship" is not a good reason to oppose anything lol.
 

RM8

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,906
JP
Every. Single. Time. Do they mention it in any thread with violent gifs or games with violence? nope. Threaten to take their titties and pedo groping games away though and suddenly violence is the concern!
Lol, so true. I've yet to see someone complaining in Mortal Kombat threads. But threads condemning Touch the Toddler Kawaii Version? Then it becomes very important to point out games are very violent.
 

Yukari

Member
Mar 28, 2018
11,714
Thailand
I never got much into the various dragon balls. How old is bulma
This is Character Poster From Latest Movies which happend 6 years after defeat Kid Buu.

2VfVfqhl.jpg


Bulma - 47 (she use dragonball wish to make her look young)
Goten - 13
Trunk - 14 (same age f.trunk from short story)
 

Inuhanyou

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,214
New Jersey
I would hope that Sony comes out and makes explicit their stance on what is accepted and what isnt. This isnt going to make Nintendo and MS suddenly decide to change their ways on allowing such content, just give them a competitive advantage like Sega and Sony against Nintendo back in the day.

Do games like Guilty Gear get banned for sexy content? Or the next DOA? does catherine not get released? well i wasnt buying that anyway due to its regressive stance on LGBTQ, but i feel like its way too prone to abuse without a strict general guidline that devs can abide by.
 

Inuhanyou

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,214
New Jersey
Always interesting how certain users who never or barely ever talked much about violence in video games before suddenly become very concerned about it whenever these kind of threads pop up.

I did bring up mortal kombat, but only in the context of it being something that is kind of hypocritical if we're banning games on the premise of "destroying the moral fabric of society". John Libermann already argued this decades ago. I don't really follow that argument much, its the people arguing for censorship of certain games that are arguing that mindset.

But i would not call anyone out over that. If you care about censoring things you think nobody should see, then that's fine, but there's obviously a rabbit hole that can be gone down and i just think that..if we're talking of censoring things on the basis of what we find personally morally repugnant, we should be a bit careful and selective on what we chose to focus on. Because that can have an adverse effect on what is allowed.

I think regressive content EXCPLICITLY targeting minors and such in games is fair game for sony to want to regulate because its fairly open and shut, but they have to have some sort of limitation on "sexual expression" or else it can be taken to an extreme that doesnt really end anywhere.

I'm not a person who throws out the term "SJW" or concern trolls, so don't worry. This is all real concern of what exactly Sony's stance is.
 

Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,393
Comparing to violence is as whataboutist as it can get, and is most of the time used in disingenuous ways, but violence is VERY real in the real world. Please.
Not cartoony violence like MK.

You'll notice that more realistic violence like what was shown in TLoU2 is considered more disturbing and typically comes under greater scrutiny.
 

Deleted member 6730

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
11,526
Comparing to violence is as whataboutist as it can get, and is most of the time used in disingenuous ways, but violence is VERY real in the real world. Please.
Didn't say it wasn't. But generally speaking violence and video games tends to lean on being way more cartoony and unrealistic than not. And those that don't tend to get their fair share of controversy (see No Russian).
 

Normal

Member
Oct 26, 2017
6,296
I'm getting a laugh of the irony of someone having a Dragon Ball avatar and saying another show is disgusting for having sexual content. Most examples would not be postable here and I'm still iffy on if the following one would be allowed, so I leave it to mod discretion if it should be removed (since there isn't any actual nudity).

giphy.gif


And if you are going to say But but but DBZ! Roshi was still up to his perv shit in DBZ. Even up to the Android Saga he was still doing shit, to Android 18 even.
How many people watch DBZ for Roshi and his antics instead of the fights. And how many people watch Kill la Kill for the fan service. I don't think many people are watching Kill la Kill for the plot or fights.

You trying to call him out for his Vegeta avatar is hella stupid. Lmao
 

GymWolf86

Banned
Nov 10, 2018
4,663
Well, censoring a 18+ games like DMC5 isn't helping anyone. It's a game for MATURE people, the protagonists are MATURE, we should be able to see their breasts or even any parts if it was justified by the mood/art/story of the game... Hell you all are saying that "VGs are arts", ok, then why excluding nudity of it? In movies or TV Shows (hello GoT) seeing nudity is perfectly fine, but in games... No? Why that?

I am more than 18yo, if I buy content for 18+ people I'd be pissed to see it getting censored. Censorship is just wrong. If a game is "too violent for you" or "I hate nudity" then just Don't buy it but Don't make it impossible to buy from other people...

And seriously what's wrong with you people? Fatalities in MK are fine, Killing hundreds of people in games like God of War or COD, is perfectly fine for you, but "oh my Gosh, are those boobs? Ewwwww"... Seriously?

Let people enjoy the content they like, as long as it respects the law (like not underage bullshit).
Nothing to add.
 

HBK

Member
Oct 30, 2017
7,989
Didn't say it wasn't. But generally speaking violence and video games tends to lean on being way more cartoony and unrealistic than not. And those that don't tend to get their fair share of controversy (see No Russian).
Of course.

But some of the shit that's targeted by Sony's stance is also "cartoony and unrealistic".

So if you dismiss VG violence with that argument, then why disgusting shit like "VG anime groping" (if not awfully worse) shouldn't be dismissed using that very same argument?

Don't mistake my post for what it isn't. Comparisons to violence make little sense in this thread. That's simply unrelated to the topic at hand. There's just a strong desensitization to violence and these kind of threads emphasize that badly. MK fatalities are shockingly gruesome to a lot of people. I'm pretty sure some sensitive people may have nightmares about them.

So my point is, don't try to invoke questionable (IMO) double standards when the violence whataboutisms can simply be dismissed as off-topic.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
Well, censoring a 18+ games like DMC5 isn't helping anyone. It's a game for MATURE people, the protagonists are MATURE, we should be able to see their breasts or even any parts if it was justified by the mood/art/story of the game... Hell you all are saying that "VGs are arts", ok, then why excluding nudity of it? In movies or TV Shows (hello GoT) seeing nudity is perfectly fine, but in games... No? Why that?

I am more than 18yo, if I buy content for 18+ people I'd be pissed to see it getting censored. Censorship is just wrong. If a game is "too violent for you" or "I hate nudity" then just Don't buy it but Don't make it impossible to buy from other people...

And seriously what's wrong with you people? Fatalities in MK are fine, Killing hundreds of people in games like God of War or COD, is perfectly fine for you, but "oh my Gosh, are those boobs? Ewwwww"... Seriously?

Let people enjoy the content they like, as long as it respects the law (like not underage bullshit).

I think this sort of censorship only applies to the underage crap. I don't think many take issue with nudity in games otherwise, depending of course on its use.
 

Crocodile

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,093
Lol, so true. I've yet to see someone complaining in Mortal Kombat threads. But threads condemning Touch the Toddler Kawaii Version? Then it becomes very important to point out games are very violent.

FWIW I think the fatalities in MK are gruesome and pretty disgusting and I say that as someone who has taught and worked in a medical school where I worked on human cadavers. I just don't go into MK threads to complain about it because what would that achieve? LOL

I think this sort of censorship only applies to the underage crap. I don't think many take issue with nudity in games otherwise, depending of course on its use.

That's kind of the thing. The title of the thread makes it out like Sony's policy here is super clear and well detailed but as has been brought up over and over again in this thread...it kind of isn't. I feel like a lot of people are letting their (justified) hate of loli crap blind them to some actual reasonable concerns. Of course there are some trolling and disingenuous concerns raised as well but that seems hard to avoid when a topic gets super huge :P
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
That's kind of the thing. The title of the thread makes it out like Sony's policy here is super clear and well detailed but as has been brought up over and over again in this thread...it kind of isn't. I feel like a lot of people are letting their (justified) hate of loli crap blind them to some actual reasonable concerns. Of course there are some trolling and disingenuous concerns raised as well but that seems hard to avoid when a topic gets super huge :P

Have any non loli or non youthful sexualised content/looking character games been blocked or banned?
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
I think that there's been at least one that wound up not releasing outside of Japan on PS4, but by and large, they're still coming to the console.

Are you able to link to this one game? Does this game not feature any questionable underage looking sexualiation? Be interesting to see what about this game was deemed against their ToS.
 

Crocodile

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,093
Have any non loli or non youthful sexualised content/looking character games been blocked or banned?

Post #366 goes into my qualms about the issue surrounding the current topic. I'm not really worried about mass censorship or some other hyperbole so much as vague guidelines resulting in collateral damage, some weird logic used by Sony and the high degree of subjectivity that defines the proverbial "lines". Usually it's damn obvious but sometimes it's not.
 

Candescence

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,253
One of the big problems that needs to be overcome when it comes to reducing the amount of underage gross stuff is overcoming the cultural clash between what folks in the west expect out of sexual young adult fiction and what the Japanese expect. Normally when you imagine late teens partying and fucking, you imagine college/university, but for a variety of reasons, tertiary education isn't remotely glamorised in Japan, as far as I know - high school is the one last period where students can actually have fun before they end up in the grind of the demanding university system and then the workforce.

Do correct me where I'm mistaken, though, but I'm pretty sure the gist is about right. High school settings are overplayed, anyway. I'm legitimately surprised the western-style tertiary education system isn't the basis for more game settings.
 
Are you able to link to this one game? Does this game not feature any questionable underage looking sexualiation? Be interesting to see what about this game was deemed against their ToS.
Oh, I think I read that wrong in the first place. Stupid sinus infections!

As far as anything recent, I don't think it's come up for sexually charged content involving characters of a clearly legal age, but as a fan of the game, I am reminded years ago of the audio censorship that Sony imposed on Killer7, as the moaning of Samantha during an otherwise non-explicit sex scene was muted in every version of the PS2 release. Granted, the nature of that scene being entirely consensual is up for debate, but it's a strange occurrence.

The Japanese version of the PS2 also saw more edits for the more violent scenes, but I'm fairly sure that they were left intact when it came to the west and are otherwise identical to how they played out in all GCN versions.
 

nib95

Contains No Misinformation on Philly Cheesesteaks
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
18,498
Post #366 goes into my qualms about the issue surrounding the current topic. I'm not really worried about mass censorship or some other hyperbole so much as vague guidelines resulting in collateral damage, some weird logic used by Sony and the high degree of subjectivity that defines the proverbial "lines". Usually it's damn obvious but sometimes it's not.

The guidelines were always going to be vague for this sort of thing. Anything too detailed and Sony open themselves up for more issues. Point is, until a game gets unjustly banned or blocked or whatever, this is all much a do about nothing, and yet another example of people jumping the gun on something that really should be commended.

The less underage sexualiation, the better. If this policy gets abused and games get wrongly blocked or banned or whatever, then there could be a better conversation about its effectiveness or over stepping of creativity or whatever, but till then, it's a step in the right direction.
 

supkid

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,760
Dublin, Ireland
The less underage sexualiation, the better. If this policy gets abused and games get wrongly blocked or banned or whatever, then there could be a better conversation about its effectiveness or over stepping of creativity or whatever, but till then, it's a step in the right direction.

I honestly don't understand people being up in arms over this, we all know what type of games are going to be potentially censored, and if anything this has taken Sony too long to act on. It's obviously just at a stage now where the hit to the brand is greater than the financial incentive to keep those games around.

I saw someone else in another thread try to paint this as a win for Nintendo and MS as well? I honestly despair..
 

Scarlet Spider

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,759
Brooklyn, NY
I saw someone else in another thread try to paint this as a win for Nintendo and MS as well? I honestly despair..

Ah I believe it was due to this and them rejoicing that Nintendo will be home to these types of games;

"Nintendo said it doesn't regulate sexual content beyond requiring game makers to obtain a rating from national bodies. It said its game systems allow parents to restrict content based on the rating. Microsoft declined to comment."
 

SpaceCrystal

Banned
Apr 1, 2019
7,714
As I said in the other thread we had on this topic, this is mainly a ratings board issue that Sony has only half-heartedly tried to solve. Pretty much all of their attempts to cull this have only marginally improved the affected games. Their use of light rays and steam doesn't really hide the nature of these games. They clearly want smut on their platform but it cannot be too smutty. If this was actually important to them, they'd demand more radical cuts, ban those games altogether or use their clout to influence the ratings boards to affect real change. This is just weak shit.

I agree. And correct me if I'm wrong, but if 3rd party publishers have to go back & edit stuff into their games, that shit actually cost 3rd party publishers money, & that's not something that a lot of smaller Japanese 3rd party publishers can take (I'm not defending sexualized children, by the way; Just giving a theory).

All that Sony is doing, is just giving more firepower to Nintendo & PC gaming as a whole as more smaller Japanese publishers/developers & their fans start moving towards those platforms.
 
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Psykodoughboy

Banned
Dec 17, 2017
782
I agree. And correct me if I'm wrong, but if 3rd party publishers have to go back & edit stuff into their games, that shit actually cost 3rd party publishers money, & that's not something that a lot of smaller Japanese 3rd party publishers can take (I'm not defending sexualized children, by the way; Just giving a theory).

All that Sony is doing, is just giving more firepower to Nintendo & PC gaming as a whole as more smaller Japanese publishers/developers & their fans start moving towards those platforms.
Good I don't want interact with people that fantasize about having sex with children.
 

neilyadig

Member
Nov 13, 2017
588
Here are the responses from WSJ readers, published today:
Today's Question and Answer

In response to our question on Sony's efforts to crack down on sexual content in PlayStation 4 videogames:

J.W. Burk, California
Is the aim of such regulation to "protect" and control what people think, how they behave and what they should look at? Do people need a "safe place" from the nefarious displays they paid for and then show on their gaming screens? Lord save me from the fantasy and display of buxom women and bloodthirsty men!

Veronica Ruffin-Ellis, New York
These games are played across wires with strangers interacting with one another. Sexual influences significantly influence one's mindset, actions and reactions, such as bullying. Social media's impact on unfortunate circumstances is a force to be reckoned with. Clearly games are included. Thank you, Sony, for cracking down!

Craig Isaacs, California
Will history repeat? Sony refused to allow "adult content" on its Betamax platform—and lost the format war to VHS.

Elizabeth Carlson, Michigan
Yes, Alex, for $200, the question is: Why don't women play most videogames?

Rich Irwin, Ohio
I can remember when the dirtiest thing on gaming consoles was "Leisure Suit Larry." The problem in keeping sexual content out of the kids' hands is it can't be done. Any kid determined to get that kind of software will find a way. Sony's efforts in this area are welcome, but it is going to take a combined effort by Sony and the parents to reduce demand. One solution: Have the boys play a game where it's the guy who's the lust object and see how they like being portrayed that way.
 

Senki Dala

Banned
Nov 26, 2017
218
Well I'm not gonna debate again about how this censorship shit is stupid (except for pedo content obviously), I just have a question.

Does anyone knows if, for the exemple of the DMC5 case, changing the region of the console removes the censorship? The "censorship patch" is tied to what? The disc itself? If not then, setting the region to "Japan" on any PS4 should remove it, no?
 

Deleted member 48897

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 22, 2018
13,623
Craig Isaacs, California
Will history repeat? Sony refused to allow "adult content" on its Betamax platform—and lost the format war to VHS.

People keep saying this but over time I've grown to believe that it's not even close to a primary reason beta failed in comparison to being less well-suited to home taping use cases.
 

xxracerxx

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
31,222
Well I'm not gonna debate again about how this censorship shit is stupid (except for pedo content obviously), I just have a question.

Does anyone knows if, for the exemple of the DMC5 case, changing the region of the console removes the censorship? The "censorship patch" is tied to what? The disc itself? If not then, setting the region to "Japan" on any PS4 should remove it, no?
The censorship is not even in the game anymore. All regions.
 

Yukari

Member
Mar 28, 2018
11,714
Thailand
One of the big problems that needs to be overcome when it comes to reducing the amount of underage gross stuff is overcoming the cultural clash between what folks in the west expect out of sexual young adult fiction and what the Japanese expect. Normally when you imagine late teens partying and fucking, you imagine college/university, but for a variety of reasons, tertiary education isn't remotely glamorised in Japan,

I always Imagin Highschool. Thank to first American pie (didn't there a scene that one teen have sex with hot friend mom ?) and Teen Slasher Horror movies.


as far as I know - high school is the one last period where students can actually have fun before they end up in the grind of the demanding university system and then the workforce.

Do correct me where I'm mistaken, though, but I'm pretty sure the gist is about right. High school settings are overplayed, anyway. I'm legitimately surprised the western-style tertiary education system isn't the basis for more game settings.

Third Years on Highshool in japan (or asia in general) is about Study Study to enter famous college than what they really want to do.
There many news that teens get sucide because their fail or grade down.
 

Deguello

Banned
Jan 14, 2019
269
While the conflation of violent content with sexual themes is a false equivalence, I feel it's mainly being reflexively pointed to due to the stated motivation behind Sony's... let's be neutral and say content edition policy. They say they are doing this to protect children, and yet they see no issue risking small or pre-adolescent children from seeing horrific images of violence, which can trigger night terrors that can take a lot of therapy to undue (I say this from personal experience.) However apparently Sony is willing to risk a child having nightmares for the artistic merit of the expression of violence on their platform. Furthermore if they are to cite the #metoo movement as a reason, they might want to scrub their games of depictions of violence against women, as that is a bigger issue in the real world than whether a few borderline sexual content games are "teaching" pedophilia. Considering that in Mortal Kombat, 11 one can vivisect a wide variety of female characters over and over, it seems that Sony is fine with violence against women. And yes I know the context of the violence against women in Mortal Kombat is that they are all on a mystical island with a fight tournament going on, but the violence is happening regardless of context, and it seems little hollow to use such implausible contexts to support of depictions of violence against women while denying equally implausible contexts for suggestive/sexual content.

Speaking of implausible contexts...

Rich Irwin, Ohio
I can remember when the dirtiest thing on gaming consoles was "Leisure Suit Larry." The problem in keeping sexual content out of the kids' hands is it can't be done. Any kid determined to get that kind of software will find a way. Sony's efforts in this area are welcome, but it is going to take a combined effort by Sony and the parents to reduce demand. One solution: Have the boys play a game where it's the guy who's the lust object and see how they like being portrayed that way.

If I'm not mistaken, is this not the plot behind the Gal Gun series? Is this not the basis of several harem anime? Isn't Tenchi Muyo sort of like this, and more recently that Yuuna series? Are there not several dating sims, sexual or otherwise, where an unwilling or hesitant male character is being pursued by several female characters is the entire basis of the plot, up to and including women in positions of power or authority entering into romantic relationships with underage or borderline underage male characters? I feel this desire has been met, but not it a way that might satisfy the conveyance of sexual objectification of small children that this person desires.

Ultimately, The issue I have with Sony's heavy handed approach is not knowing how capricious they are going to be with it. It's obvious that bigger publishers won't be subject to the same guidelines if their profile is big enough, and more recently Red Dead Redemption II allowed player characters to hogtie women, and especially sex workers, and drag them off into the woods (for the purpose of teaching various rope escape techniques, I'm sure). Yet I feel Rockstar and 2K won't have to be subject to the same policies as smaller developers, even smaller publishers. If these are major content guidelines being laid down, it's important that every publisher be subject to them, and I would applaud Sony if they stood up to the bigger ones, if they are in fact doing this out of a need to protect children.
 
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Morrigan

Spear of the Metal Church
Member
Oct 24, 2017
34,393
Considering that in Mortal Kombat, 11 one can vivisect a wide variety of female characters over and over, it seems that Sony is fine with violence against women. And yes I know the context of the violence against women in Mortal Kombat is that they are all on a mystical island with a fight tournament going on
And that context is precisely why this isn't "violence against women". It's just violence between equal combatants, it's not explicitly gendered violence.
 

Deguello

Banned
Jan 14, 2019
269
And that context is precisely why this isn't "violence against women". It's just violence between equal combatants, it's not explicitly gendered violence.

Now hold on, wait till the tier lists come out before assuming everybody's equal. :D

But anyway I still see this as a weak justification. One can have a fighting tournament without extreme violence against women. Street Fighter does it all the time. It seems that the fine folks at NetherRealm Studios must really enjoy seeing men rip women's faces off and cut them into small pieces while using the justification that "they're willing participants and equals in in mystical fighting tournament." Now if it seems a bit annoying that I'm deliberately removing context in order to claim the moral high ground, it shows that the context-free approach makes demons of us all and filth of every piece of art.
 
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Kasey

Member
Nov 1, 2017
10,822
Boise
I'm kind of at odds with myself here because I want to give a detailed explanation as to why Sony is in the right here, but I don't know what I'm talking about because I don't consume this kind of stuff. I feel like I should watch some of this to give specific criticisms, but it's so fucking icky my skin crawls when watching it.

So my opinion is still burn it all.
 

LiK

Member
Oct 25, 2017
32,113
Not really sure of how they'll review certain subject matter like a popular series that takes place primarily in high school and depicts its female characters in some skimpy outfits and lewd poses at times. I guess we'll see down the line how it'll affect some games and how they interpret those scenes within the context of the stories. Not like I care if they ban it outright.
 

Pancracio17

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
18,814
The women in DMCV didnt look underage at all to me.

These guidelines arent explicitly written down right?