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texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,331
Indonesia
Yes, the Grand Prix has so many issues, but this is the most glaring one for me by far.

So basically, by participating in the race you can gain tokens, which ultimately you can exchange with a $5 discount voucher for 15k tokens. For a lot of people, this is their main target in this Summer Sale event as you can use multiple of these vouchers in your purchase so they stack up nicely if you have lots of tokens in your account. The problem is, as we all know Steam supports regional pricing for various currencies, including my region (Indonesia). So instead of getting a full $5 conversion, I got $1.7 from the voucher. Yes, people may say that it's totally fair because games are cheaper here. However, it's not really the case anymore these days. Lots of games, especially those from big publishers don't get as good regional pricing anymore as in the past (or it was just never good). From my observations, the publishers are slowly leaving regional pricing behind over the past few years. Previously, I can regularly get $60 games for $30, even lower in some cases. But today, it's becoming a pretty rare occurrence for big games. Some examples are (converted from IDR to US$):
CDPR
The Witcher 3: $38
Cyberpunk 20877: $50

Bethesda
The Evil Within: $28
The Evil Within 2: $58

Rocksteady
Mortal Kombat X: $27
Mortal Kombat XI: $49

SquareEnix
Just Cause 3: $27
Just Cause 4: $48

Deep Silver
Metro Exodus (2018) : $27
Metro Exodus (2019): $48

Activision
COD Black Ops III: $40 (2015)
COD Black Ops III: $55 (2017~now)
Yes, you read that right, Deep Silver increased the price while it's still in pre-purchase phase and Activision increased the price 2 years after the game is released. And after that, all of their games are almost full $60 here. Meanwhile, Bandai Namco and Ubisoft never exactly followed the regional pricing guideline that well, buat at least they've been pretty consistent with their $45-$50 pricing. And there's SEGA that consistently priced their Japanese games at full US$ conversion here. I could give you more examples, but it's mostly the same the same story for big publishers. That said, there are publishers who still honor it, such as Capcom who still regularly price their newest games at $35. Mid-tier publishers are also still quite generous and I won't deny that fact.

e9d2BGA.png


Anyway, as previously stated, all I'd get from the 15k tokens is 25k IDR discount voucher, which is barely $1.7 from this event. That means that I'm getting 1/3 of the full reward compared to NA/EU regions. Even with the way pricing worked for my region in the past, most games only got like 50% price cut at most with the regional pricing. I've asked around people from various regions who regularly get regional pricing, and their rewards are also not that far off from my region (i.e. it's $1.6 in Russia). So yeah, combined with the dumpster fire of the event in general, this main reward just pretty much confirmed that this is the worst event in Steam history for me. I've submitted a ticket to the support with more or less similar message as this OP. Hopefully they can give us a good explanation, but I'm not holding my breath.

Oh and by the way, what about Valve games regional pricing? Turns out they've completely abandoned their own guideline too.
TI9 Battle Pass: $10
Artifact: $21
 

Xavi

Member
Oct 27, 2017
14,778
Lightning for Smash
Yep, noticed this with Octopath Traveler but SPECIALLY with Castlevania collection. The game is supposed to be $20

http:///hZ2d.jpg

That's around fucking $54. KONAMI can fuck off with this shit. So glad I have a switch, bought it there instead.
 

Catshade

Member
Oct 26, 2017
2,200
I wonder if this is publishers getting greedy or Valve provided data that raising regional price in some countries didn't adversely affect revenue from those regions?
 

dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,919
Unfortunately that is on publishers and developers. Valve did right approach with scaling but unfortunately devs and publishers are getting more and more greedy so yeah...

I wonder if this is publishers getting greedy or Valve provided data that raising regional price in some countries didn't adversely affect revenue from those regions?

I don't think that Valve shares data that directly, they use that data to show default regional pricing but devs and publishers often ignore those and set their own prices.
 

ChippyTurtle

Banned
Oct 13, 2018
4,773
Echoing the others, I feel like the data feeding back to them is that the higher pricing isn't affecting profits...and so up they go. How is the currency exchange looking these days, could that be affecting stuff?
 

Kaivan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
1,390
I've checked mine and it's a similar story. I don't use Steam that much though.

Unfortunately that is on publishers and developers. Valve did right approach with scaling but unfortunately devs and publishers are getting more and more greedy so yeah...

I don't think that Valve shares data that directly, they use that data to show default regional pricing but devs and publishers often ignore those and set their own prices.
But Valve themselves have completely abandoned it judging by their recent output...
 

dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,919
But Valve themselves have completely abandoned it judging by their recent output...

That's their decision. Artifact failed so it's not like it worked for them (that is not only reason why it failed but still). There are still devs that do regional pricing right or close to that. But again I live in low income country with no regional pricing so I could be out of touch :D
 
OP
OP
texhnolyze

texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,331
Indonesia
Echoing the others, I feel like the data feeding back to them is that the higher pricing isn't affecting profits...and so up they go. How is the currency exchange looking these days, could that be affecting stuff?
The exchange over the years does affect the prices, but they're increasing slowly and gradually according to the exchange. For example, Bethesda games used to be IDR 780k in 2015, and now they're IDR 800k (yes, they're the worst and up there with Koei Tecmo). The exchange has been mostly the same, with occasional ups and downs.
 

Classy Tomato

Member
Jun 2, 2019
2,534
Yeah, I'm bummed knowing we only get 25K for the event. The fact that the Grand Prix is confusing to participate only makes it even worse.


Anyway, welcome back Tex!
 
Oct 25, 2017
4,846
The Artifact issue is more complicated because the game was meant to use the Steam item marketplace for transactions. If they had cheaper pricing for Artifact in other countries, it would affect the included card packs' pricing in NA/EU. Only way to fix it would be to region lock the Steam market for that game.

I think the Dota 2 battle pass also includes tradable items?
 
Oct 28, 2017
1,951
Doesn't the publisher set regional pricing at the product deployment page?

There was even notifications from Valve to everyone about setting/correcting the regional prices for the products on store.
 

eonden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,133
That's their decision. Artifact failed so it's not like it worked for them (that is not only reason why it failed but still). There are still devs that do regional pricing right or close to that. But again I live in low income country with no regional pricing so I could be out of touch :D
Artifact regional pricing (or more like lack of it) is caused by the internal economy of the game, where cards are supposed to be able to be sold and purchased through the marketplace, and the original price is only the pricing of the starter pack. Regional pricing (or discounts like being in the "Valve bundle" which Artifact is the only Valve game that isnt in there), would crater the in-game economy.

Basically:

The Artifact issue is more complicated because the game was meant to use the Steam item marketplace for transactions. If they had cheaper pricing for Artifact in other countries, it would affect the included card packs' pricing in NA/EU. Only way to fix it would be to region lock the Steam market for that game.

I think the Dota 2 battle pass also includes tradable items?
 

finalflame

Product Management
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
8,538
At the end of the day publishers will set prices based on whatever data they have about elasticity/purchasing power. Some will do so better than others and with more nuance. Whether that's changing or not for any particular region is on a case by case basis. Generally speaking, and without getting into specifics, the vast majority of revenue for most game companies comes from the EU/RU/NA, and CN if they are published there. That's where companies are likely to invest most of their research on pricing.
 
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texhnolyze

texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,331
Indonesia
The Artifact issue is more complicated because the game was meant to use the Steam item marketplace for transactions. If they had cheaper pricing for Artifact in other countries, it would affect the included card packs' pricing in NA/EU. Only way to fix it would be to region lock the Steam market for that game.

I think the Dota 2 battle pass also includes tradable items?
Artifact regional pricing (or more like lack of it) is caused by the internal economy of the game, where cards are supposed to be able to be sold and purchased through the marketplace, and the original price is only the pricing of the starter pack. Regional pricing (or discounts like being in the "Valve bundle" which Artifact is the only Valve game that isnt in there), would crater the in-game economy.
Right, thanks for the clarification on Valve. I think someone has already mentioned this to me before, but I kinda forgot.

I found some data from 2017 Battle Pass, and it was a full $10 conversion too. So yeah, I guess there's more to it when it comes to BP.
 

dex3108

Member
Oct 26, 2017
22,919
In the end things are simple, devs and especially big publishers want to get as much money as possible. We can see that outside of regional pricing. They don't care about long term issues, they want it now. Subscription services is obvious example where every company is creating their own.
 

Sean Mirrsen

Banned
May 9, 2018
1,159
Yeah, I don't think this is one you can pin on Valve. They're doing pretty good with setting regional price guidelines. The problem is that they're guidelines, not rules, and publishers can set their own prices at will if they see the need - i.e. if the existing prices are somehow exploited.
 

EeK9X

Member
Jan 31, 2019
1,072
At the end of the day publishers will set prices based on whatever data they have about elasticity/purchasing power. Some will do so better than others and with more nuance. Whether that's changing or not for any particular region is on a case by case basis. Generally speaking, and without getting into specifics, the vast majority of revenue for most game companies comes from the EU/RU/NA, and CN if they are published there. That's where companies are likely to invest most of their research on pricing.

RU, really? I had no idea. I know prices in that region are incredibly cheap, but then you have situations in countries with similar economies, like Argentina and Brazil, where the latter gets games at much higher prices, even though Argentina has a much smaller market (more sales at lower prices would make more sense).
 

Golvellius

Banned
Dec 3, 2017
1,304
Strange. From threads about the EGS I gathered that regional pricing is one of Steam's outstanding features the Epic have to match.
 

JCG

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,548
Yes, this is silly. I've earned six discounts with tokens but instead of receiving $30 dollars off, I was only given about $10. Which doesn't match the recent regional price scaling trends at all. I am still glad about the discount itself, of course, but this is clearly unbalanced.

Many Triple A publishers are increasingly just directly matching the U.S. price with their newest Steam releases but some especially greedy or negligent publishers are acting even worse than that and overcharging.

Like the 505 Games folks with Bloodstained, who are charging almost $50 dollars for their game in various regions on Steam. If I hadn't already supported the Kickstarter back in the day, I actually would have saved a lot of money by purchasing the game from GOG or even Humble, not Steam.

Strange. From threads about the EGS I gathered that regional pricing is one of Steam's outstanding features the Epic have to match.

Regional prices are good...when they are consistent and rational. If they aren't, then what's the point?
 
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Mivey

Member
Oct 25, 2017
17,943
Strange. From threads about the EGS I gathered that regional pricing is one of Steam's outstanding features the Epic have to match.
Having regional pricing is amazing, and the default values Valve provides are adequate for each region/market (meaning, what's the equivalent of 20$ for market X, what's the equivalent of 60$ for market Y).
If someone like Konami comes along and just multiplies all those values by 30, yeah, that's no longer such a great thing.
 

Deleted member 27751

User-requested account closure
Banned
Oct 30, 2017
3,997
I mean we've had to deal with that here in Australia for many years, and even now we are getting double dicked with shops likes Epic Game Store who charge regional pricing AND USD conversion rates. One day publishers and devs will realise that by simply pricing a $1 = $1 no matter where you live you'll suddenly make far more on your title sales digitally. There shouldn't be any inferred increase on a digital product when data costs fuck all and the effort to upload is literally button presses.

Strange. From threads about the EGS I gathered that regional pricing is one of Steam's outstanding features the Epic have to match.

See my comment. Plus the OP is saying regional pricing is good, but when devs/pubs increase that price for no particular reason it is then bad.
 

HangryJacks

Member
Apr 3, 2019
129
IMO the discount should always match whatever the formula that determines the regional pricing. If publishers manually adjusted the regional price then its gonna be hard for Valve to keep the summer event fair to everyone.
 

linnus

Member
Oct 25, 2017
366
The same thing is happening here in Brazil. Usually the PC (AAA) releases were R$99, now they are R$199 or R$249.

The sale voucher here is R$15 (U$3.8)
 
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texhnolyze

texhnolyze

Shinra Employee
Member
Oct 25, 2017
23,331
Indonesia
IMO the discount should always match whatever the formula that determines the regional pricing. If publishers manually adjusted the regional price then its gonna be hard for Valve to keep the summer event fair to everyone.
True. It's probably still in the realm of possibility, but it's gonna be a colossal task. So many data and variables need to be assessed to make things fair for everyone.

But still, I don't like the direction of PC gaming is going in lots of more unfortunate regions at this rate. It's going back to the previous decade when the industry is only catering to NA/EU/Japan.
 

Kurt Russell

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,514
I wonder if this is publishers getting greedy or Valve provided data that raising regional price in some countries didn't adversely affect revenue from those regions?

It's publishers getting greedy. Valve's suggested pricing is still pretty great, but more and more big publishers have decided that they don't actually care. You can see it with Ubisoft and CDProjekt Red on EGS, they have the same regional pricing (or lack thereof) that they have on Steam.

I've checked mine and it's a similar story. I don't use Steam that much though.


But Valve themselves have completely abandoned it judging by their recent output...

Valve's games are online only things that give you something that can be traded/sold in the market in exchange for your purchase. That's why both Artifact and the Dota 2 Battle Passes don't have regional pricing. It's unrelated.