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ToddBonzalez

The Pyramids? That's nothing compared to RDR2
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
15,530
RATM are the real deal. They were rapping about fascism, corporatism, and police brutality back in the '90s. Zack de la Rocha the vocalist is a socialist activist and POC. Unfortunately their music goes so damn hard that they pulled in assholes like Paul Ryan who never listened to the lyrics. Similar to what happened with Nirvana when they got big.
Well you can only hope that this type of thing gives at least a few chuds out there an "Are we the baddies?" moment of reflection.
 

Kernel

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,981
RATM are the real deal. They were rapping about fascism, corporatism, and police brutality back in the '90s. Zack de la Rocha the vocalist is a socialist activist and POC. Unfortunately their music goes so damn hard that they pulled in assholes like Paul Ryan who never listened to the lyrics. Similar to what happened with Nirvana when they got big.

Or the idiots who listen to "Born in the USA" missing the point of the song.
 

Roytheone

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,231
Just so people not familiar with French politics know: Macron party are the same people who refused to even entertain the idea of including abortion in the constitution twice in 2018 and 2019. Not that it isn't a good thing that they changed their stance on the subject, but never be fooled by these people. They're partially responsible for the current success of the far right (who are obviously as anti-abortion as you can get) here.

It's also incredibly hard to modify our constitution, unfortunately.

Sorry for the derail.

I hope this opens the eyes of people willing to protest vote on alt right parties in countries, that it could lead to your rights being stripped away very quickly, and that that scares people from being idiots and protest vote. And give ammunition to non insane parties to point towards America and say that this will be the countries future if you elect the alt right.
 

Nola

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
8,184
I gotta say your generalisations of the democratic party here are so wildly over the top, that it makes me not want to engage with you at all. Having different wings of a political party is normal in most democratic political systems and not necessarily a bad thing, as long as they can work together on the important matters. You don't need to burn something down because you don't agree with everything they stand for. And yes I do agree there are bad people in the party and people that have simply been there too long and are not fighting like they should. But that doesn't mean the whole platform should change.

What you want will both give republicans free reign to do whatever they want while the Democrats fight amount themselves and make sure the party doesn't actually have a fighting chance of standing up to republicans in elections.

You need moderates to win, this has been true for years and is even more so now that the republican base is getting more and more radicalised. You are never convincing any of those people, so you need to convince people on the fence to go out and vote against them. A highly progressive platform will simply not be able to actual win big elections, 100+ years of American culture and a generally broken system have made sure of that. The only way to get there is slow and steady strides and sticking together against a common enemy.

In my mind what actually needs to happen is that the whole system, constitution and all, gets thrown away and built up again, but that probably can't happen without a literal war, so this is the best option. Democrats fighting among themselves while their country turns into a prototype fascist state is one of the worst.
I feel like you didn't read a single thing I said and just decided to respond to some caricature of leftist criticism in its place

My entire post, and my entire point has little to do with leftist ideology and entiriely to do about party organization improvement vis a vis shuffling out geriatric leadership and breaking away from the outdated thinking and ways of doing things that have been so unsuccessful

In some cases, like +25 districts, yeah, that should mean putting more AOC's in those seats instead of endlessly propping up 60- 70 year old establishment dinosaurs. But it's not all one size fits all, most people recognize that. But there are your Beto's and Millennial moderates out there that have energy, speak to a broader and younger audience, are more in touch with politics of today instead of endlessly trying to govern and run the party like it's 30 years ago.
 

Kill3r7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,713
Kavanaugh is saying abortions should only be available to certain classes of people, I'm not being dramatic with this read right? The absolute piece of shit

Not that he deserves a more charitable reading, but he is saying States cannot prosecute abortion across State lines. This is an important legal principle because when a red State passes legislation criminalizing abortion in another State, that section will be quoted as grounds to find said law unconstitutional. This is what allows all these companies to pay for their employees to go to another state to have an abortion. All that said, it is classist as shit.
 

julian

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,891
Boy... hard to not imagine people looking to "celebrate" 4th of July as kinda disgusting. Like... it's been a joke for years, but man.
I was annoyed enough when my wife's uncle gave my kids American flag hats last week. Now I'm disgusted.
I agree, I feel like a better term is pro-birth, as they only care about the fetus until birth, then want nothing to do with it.
Ehhhhh. That sounds oddly positive as a term. I prefer something more obviously negative like pro-death since this will directly lead to women dying. I haven't thought too hard about a perfect term though.

You're welcome France?

Who is this piece of shit?
 
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
I was annoyed enough when my wife's uncle gave my kids American flag hats last week. Now I'm disgusted.

Ehhhhh. That sounds oddly positive as a term. I prefer something more obviously negative like pro-death since this will directly lead to women dying. I haven't thought too hard about a perfect term though.

You're welcome France?

Who is this piece of shit?

Ah. The tweet I saw about it referred to her as a congresswoman.

Close enough lol
Since just calling her a state rep feels inadequate, her name is Karianne Lisonbee. Name and shame her.
 

loco

Member
Jan 6, 2021
5,570
Whatever you do, do not watch fox News today. Couldn't stomach it after 10 minutes but wanted to see what levels of celebration and gloating were going on over there.
 
Feb 14, 2018
3,083
Yep. The Supreme Court cannot enforce their rulings, there is no enforcement element to the judicial branch. It relies on the executive.

If the executive tells them to fuck off it can be done. But that's not what's happening right now, sadly.
There's also no enforcement mechanism for the Executive to force states to not ban abortion. And FDR had at least the appearance of having the Legislative branch behind him. Biden cannot convincingly threaten the SCOTUS that he will pack the court because there are more than 50 Senators on the record against it and he has no ability to simply ignore the decision because it is not constraining the Federal government; it is removing constraints on state governments.

Also, the ruling is finished. It's too late to threaten the Court with packing even if that could be done.
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
Yep. The Supreme Court cannot enforce their rulings, there is no enforcement element to the judicial branch. It relies on the executive.

If the executive tells them to fuck off it can be done. But that's not what's happening right now, sadly.
…the executive office isn't enforcing shit with this ruling, this line people keep trotting out doesn't make any fucking sense.

The Supreme Court was, previously, forcing states to allow abortions. They are now not forcing anything. It is the states that are outlawing abortion.
 

Greg NYC3

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,567
Miami

This is what confuses me, I really don't understand what the downside is here for Biden to buck this court. It's obvious to everyone what the conservative justices on this court are, they are maybe one jurist and five GOP activists. Why does he continue to pretend that they're just a normal court? What is the risk in countering them? There hasn't been a liberal majority court in my lifetime so he can't think there's a danger of setting some precedent the next GOP president can exploit.
 

Thorn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
24,446
This is what confuses me, I really don't understand what the downside is here for Biden to buck this court. It's obvious to everyone what the conservative justices on this court are, they are maybe one jurist and five GOP activists. Why does he continue to pretend that they're just a normal court? What is the risk in countering them? There hasn't been a liberal majority court in my lifetime so he can't think there's a danger of setting some precedent the next GOP president can exploit.
Establishment Dems fear the destruction of "norms" above all else.
 

Deleted member 43

Account closed at user request
Banned
Oct 24, 2017
9,271
This is what confuses me, I really don't understand what the downside is here for Biden to buck this court. It's obvious to everyone what the conservative justices on this court are, they are maybe one jurist and five GOP activists. Why does he continue to pretend that they're just a normal court? What is the risk in countering them? There hasn't been a liberal majority court in my lifetime so he can't think there's a danger of setting some precedent the next GOP president can exploit.
I mean, of course that's a danger. Once you ring that bell it can't be unrung, if Biden packs the court, the next Republican will just pack them further, and on and on it will go.

But it's an academic discussion either way, because Biden can't do this on his own, and there is not nearly enough support in the Senate to do such a thing.
 

GoldenEye 007

Roll Tide, Y'all!
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
13,835
Texas
This is what confuses me, I really don't understand what the downside is here for Biden to buck this court. It's obvious to everyone what the conservative justices on this court are, they are maybe one jurist and five GOP activists. Why does he continue to pretend that they're just a normal court? What is the risk in countering them? There hasn't been a liberal majority court in my lifetime so he can't think there's a danger of setting some precedent the next GOP president can exploit.
Look at how many Dem senators were there in the 1930s. Also consider many progressive demands to get passed required effective exclusion of minorities.

Biden could go on TV and threaten to expand the court. Minutes later, Manchin/Sinema/others will issue a statement saying "lolno." And we're back where we started.
 

Thordinson

Member
Aug 1, 2018
18,293
It amazes me that people think Biden making impotent threats would be helpful.

He doesn't have to make impotent threats. He can do what he did on gun legislation, at least. Call for Congress to expand the Court so he can put folks who care about the right to choose or call for Congress to eliminate the filibuster so they can codify Roe. He's asked Congress, publicly, to do things before. He should now.

Does that mean they will? No. But he should try.
 

hyouko

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,264
Yep. The Supreme Court cannot enforce their rulings, there is no enforcement element to the judicial branch. It relies on the executive.

If the executive tells them to fuck off it can be done. But that's not what's happening right now, sadly.
The Supreme Court doesn't have to enforce anything in this case. They aren't telling the federal government to do or not do anything; they are telling state governments that they can do something. There is no federal law that the executive branch could try to enforce at the state level to counteract this.

In the ways that they can tell the Supreme court to fuck off, the executive branch is doing so - you see that with the Pentagon here:

www.axios.com

Department of Defense vows to maintain abortion access after Roe v. Wade's end

Women make up around 20% of the military's 1.3 million-member active-duty force.

But what they will be able to do is limited to supporting the people who work for the federal government. And if we lose the executive branch in the future even that could change.
 

Greg NYC3

Member
Oct 26, 2017
12,567
Miami
Establishment Dems fear the destruction of "norms" above all else.

I mean, of course that's a danger. Once you ring that bell it can't be unrung, if Biden packs the court, the next Republican will just pack them further, and on and on it will go.

But it's an academic discussion either way, because Biden can't do this on his own, and there is not nearly enough support in the Senate to do such a thing.

Look at how many Dem senators were there in the 1930s. Also consider many progressive demands to get passed required effective exclusion of minorities.

Biden could go on TV and threaten to expand the court. Minutes later, Manchin/Sinema/others will issue a statement saying "lolno." And we're back where we started.
This is another aspect that makes Machin and Sinema so irritating. In the past it wasn't necessary for the Dems to actually follow through on stances like packing the courts or eliminating the fillibuster because the threat alone was generally enough to put the GOP in their place. Why undercut this threat when it's the only weapon the Dems have? They're just the worst.
 

onyx

Member
Dec 25, 2017
2,540
Can't threaten to pack the court if your senate says no before you even try.

Anyqay, the FDR post is BS to once again shift the blame away from Republicans, because Democrats could've stopped this at anytime somehow. Y'all keep falling for it but laugh when Republican voters get played for fools.

It amazes me that people think Biden making impotent threats would be helpful.

What amazes me even more is that couple times Biden played the tough guy this board had members complaining about it.
 
Oct 29, 2017
6,320
Can't threaten to pack the court if your senate says no before you even try.

Anyqay, the FDR post is BS to once again shift the blame away from Republicans, because Democrats could've stopped this at anytime somehow. Y'all keep falling for it but laugh when Republican voters get played for fools.

Seriously. The Dems had a 20+ seat majority in the Senate when FDR was in office. Biden doesn't have that kind of leverage and likely never will.
 

ragolliangatan

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Aug 31, 2019
4,552
Tbh, America is heading for a generation of upheaval, the broken system is doing exactly what the founders designed. A system built where a small group push their wishes on the majority. It just happens to be made worse by the fact that one party is catering to religious extremism.
 

Captain_Vyse

Member
Jun 24, 2020
6,837

FDR had a huge majority in the Senate.

75th Congress (1937–1939)

Majority Party: Democrats (76 seats)

Minority Party: Republicans (16 seats)

Other Parties: 2 Farmer-Labors; 1 Progressive; 1 Independent


Total Seats: 96

Biden only has 50 Senators and two of them are Manchin and Sinema.

Not even close to the same scenario.
 

Rainy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,837
I did a deep dive on the Supreme Court last night, things I hadn't really went through since high school. The Warren Court was absolutely amazing in retrospect....
 
Dec 9, 2018
21,570
New Jersey
FDR had a huge majority in the Senate.

75th Congress (1937–1939)

Majority Party: Democrats (76 seats)

Minority Party: Republicans (16 seats)

Other Parties: 2 Farmer-Labors; 1 Progressive; 1 Independent


Total Seats: 96

Biden only has 50 Senators and two of them are Manchin and Sinema.

Not even close to the same scenario.
FDR really was a lightning in a bottle's moment in this country's history. The only time radical action could actually happen was through some historical aberration that gave one party immense control.
 

Tobor

Member
Oct 25, 2017
28,870
Richmond, VA
FDR had a huge majority in the Senate.

75th Congress (1937–1939)

Majority Party: Democrats (76 seats)

Minority Party: Republicans (16 seats)

Other Parties: 2 Farmer-Labors; 1 Progressive; 1 Independent


Total Seats: 96

Biden only has 50 Senators and two of them are Manchin and Sinema.

Not even close to the same scenario.

Yep. It's a garbage take, but what else would I expect from some rando on Twitter.