The FIFA and Madden situation on Switch just feels... strange?

deathsaber · Jan 31, 2020

Its dumb because Witcher 3 on Switch proves more or less almost anything is possible for the hardware- set it on 720p, maybe concedes 30 over 60, lower the textures, etc, allow some dynamic scaling, but you will get anything running just fine and perfectly playable.

There is no reason that feature complete versions of the sports games, like Madden, shouldn't be on Switch.

And I think there is a specific audience that will buy it. A far bigger one than from when they previously took stabs with Nintendo on the Wii Days. Switch is all about bringing that full console experience to a portable and there are a lot of people who would love to run their madden franchise on the train/bus/plane or in their hotel room.

LuigiMario · Jan 31, 2020

The GaaS component of modern sports games is a bigger money maker for EA and 2K than the $60 game. They probably don't think they can get the hooks in on Switch as easily as on PS4/XBO, and likely have the data from the first 2 pretty good FIFA versions to support it. Sucks a lot but it is what is is, they won't put the effort in unless they feel like they're leaving microtransaction money on the table.

It's the same reason 2K won't port GTA5. Sure it could run it no problem, but the issue is GTA Online is the real moneymaker for the GTA franchise now. It'd take too much additional effort to get that feature parity with the current gen versions (remember, the 360 and PS3 versions of GTA Online were dropped long ago) and if they can't get that gravy train going they won't even bother.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

tutomos said:
For a smaller publisher that may be the case, but in the context of Take 2 they can afford to.

That makes no sense. You're saying Take 2's profit margin is so thin that they need to put out a Switch port of NBA2k. What if it bombs? Their thin profit margin gets even thinner. It doesn't matter if they're big or not, if their goal was to increase that thin profit margin that's a big risk they're taking.

On the other hand you're saying EA makes enough money that they don't need to port to Switch. But if you're saying Take 2 porting to Switch is a guaranteed increase in profit margin, why couldn't you say the same about EA? EA makes a lot of money but no company has ever said no to more money.

Basically your argument makes no sense.

Akita One said:
Those games have never sold well on Nintendo systems. And, while some third party AAA games have done ok, they aren't setting the world on fire. It's unlikely that a Switch version of these games would make the money back from having to "down port" them.

That's absolutely not true. Madden and FIFA both have a history of great sales on Nintendo platforms, FIFA having those on Switch even.

LuigiMario said:
The GaaS component of modern sports games is a bigger money maker for EA and 2K than the $60 game. They probably don't think they can get the hooks in on Switch as easily as on PS4/XBO, and likely have the data from the first 2 pretty good FIFA versions to support it. Sucks a lot but it is what is is, they won't put the effort in unless they feel like they're leaving microtransaction money on the table.

It's the same reason 2K won't port GTA5. Sure it could run it no problem, but the issue is GTA Online is the real moneymaker for the GTA franchise now. It'd take too much additional effort to get that feature parity with the current gen versions (remember, the 360 and PS3 versions of GTA Online were dropped long ago) and if they can't get that gravy train going they won't even bother.

There are a lot of F2P games on Switch like Fortnite and Warframe that seem to be doing well enough in microtransactions. Maybe EA has data suggesting those MTX numbers aren't worthwhile to them, but I've seen no evidence of that publicly.

cw_sasuke · Jan 31, 2020

LuigiMario said:
The GaaS component of modern sports games is a bigger money maker for EA and 2K than the $60 game. They probably don't think they can get the hooks in on Switch as easily as on PS4/XBO, and likely have the data from the first 2 pretty good FIFA versions to support it. Sucks a lot but it is what is is, they won't put the effort in unless they feel like they're leaving microtransaction money on the table.

It's the same reason 2K won't port GTA5. Sure it could run it no problem, but the issue is GTA Online is the real moneymaker for the GTA franchise now. It'd take too much additional effort to get that feature parity with the current gen versions (remember, the 360 and PS3 versions of GTA Online were dropped long ago) and if they can't get that gravy train going they won't even bother.

What "hooks"are you talking about ?

Thera · Jan 31, 2020

It isn't strange at all. I can garantee you that the next gen version will have features not available on the actual gen without any valid technical reasons.
This is how they do stuff.

LuigiMario · Jan 31, 2020

cw_sasuke said:
What "hooks"are you talking about ?

Hooks being switch players who will spend money on MTX for their games. Probably should have phrased it as "hooks on switch players" but the point stands.

They have data to support Switch FIFA owners (when they were putting effort in those ports) didn't spend as much on ultimate team as elsewhere. That is why they didn't bring more games over. I agree it's a bit silly, 3 years in and Switch has a way bigger casual audience more accepting of that stuff than they did in 2018, but that's likely the data EA is going off of and why they haven't bothered.

ShadowFox08 · Jan 31, 2020

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
The Switch is a very popular console that has sold now, in less than three years, significantly more than the Xbox One has in its lifetime. FIFA and Madden are extremely popular game franchises that don't really push technical specs to their limits or do things that couldn't be on last gen systems. And yet Madden isn't on the Switch and FIFA is a pure roster update each year with no additional resources put into it.

I don't want this to come off as port begging and I try to never do this with PS4 downports as there could be a lot of asset concerns and technical concerns for downporting and the games may not be as popular but these two just feel... very strange financially. I mean, you would think the NFL would encourage EA to at least try to see if Madden would sell well on this big Switch audience.

Call of Duty I get (especially with how much development fuckery is going on with the series), Assassin's Creed I absolutely get, Cyberpunk I obviously get... FIFA and Madden ignoring the Switch just feels super odd though.

Even cod should be doable. We got 30fps cod on the Wii back in the day. But the least they could do is port cod mobile, cod 4 remastered or any last gen ports.

tutomos · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
That makes no sense. You're saying Take 2's profit margin is so thin that they need to put out a Switch port of NBA2k. What if it bombs? Their thin profit margin gets even thinner. It doesn't matter if they're big or not, if their goal was to increase that thin profit margin that's a big risk they're taking.

On the other hand you're saying EA makes enough money that they don't need to port to Switch. But if you're saying Take 2 porting to Switch is a guaranteed increase in profit margin, why couldn't you say the same about EA? EA makes a lot of money but no company has ever said no to more money.

Basically your argument makes no sense.

Take 2 needs to boost revenue because of the low margin. They are not maxing profit like EA on other consoles so they need to explore more revenue sources. It doesn't make sense to say that the profit margin will get thinner because it's released on an extra platform. Since the margin is already razor thin, releasing on Switch may just bring another thin profit margin revenue source which doesn't hurt them.

EA on the other hand has really health profit with online services titles on other consoles, they don't have to force themselves to release titles on the Switch if they don't have a sound strategy on how to profit on it yet. If the Switch returns thin profit margin, EA could focus on other consoles that return higher margins, unlike Take 2's situation where they don't have a choice.

take_marsh · Jan 31, 2020

EA is as business oriented as Nintendo, so EA's lack of Switch catalog is par for the course. They simply don't believe in it when the main consoles are raking in plenty of money. Why risk only making a few million when you're making a few hundred million staying the course?

Akita One · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
That's absolutely not true. Madden and FIFA both have a history of great sales on Nintendo platforms, FIFA having those on Switch even.

That's not even close to being true...the same percentage of Nintendo system owners buying these games have never come close to the same percentage as people on Xbox and Playstation that buy these. You've never seen any EA game last longer than a month on any Nintendo top 20 chart...they even alluded to this on their sales call last week.

1 million is sales is definitely a flop when, without Nintendo, it is a perennial top 3 seller. And a $60 game isn't even remotely close to a F2P game.

take_marsh said:
EA is as business oriented as Nintendo, so EA's lack of Switch catalog is par for the course. They simply don't believe in it when the main consoles are raking in plenty of money. Why risk only making a few million when you're making a few hundred million staying the course?

BINGO. This is a human resource issue...it's not worth the manpower, when those same devs can be helping on another game or expediting development on the next Madden/FIFA feature.

Herb Alpert · Jan 31, 2020

LuigiMario said:
Hooks being switch players who will spend money on MTX for their games. Probably should have phrased it as "hooks on switch players" but the point stands.

They have data to support Switch FIFA owners (when they were putting effort in those ports) didn't spend as much on ultimate team as elsewhere. That is why they didn't bring more games over. I agree it's a bit silly, 3 years in and Switch has a way bigger casual audience more accepting of that stuff than they did in 2018, but that's likely the data EA is going off of and why they haven't bothered.

I thought there wasn't even ultimate team on switch ?

Gnorman · Jan 31, 2020

Soapbox Killer said:
By every available metric it is reasonable to assume there are now more Switches in the hands of gamers than Xbox Ones .The thinking that Nintendo fans don't play or invest in these games is laughable. Switch is a potential 100 Million seller but EA doesn't believe it is a profitable endeavor for certain titles and shame on them for that.

I'm guessing there's a very good chance that EA have more data than you to back up their decision.

Maximus · Jan 31, 2020

I don't get this either. The system would be great for these games. I'm still annoyed that NHL hasn't made an appearance on the system.

LuigiMario · Jan 31, 2020

Herb Alpert said:
I thought there wasn't even ultimate team on switch ?

Every version (including the legacy versions now) of FIFA on Switch has had ultimate team.

Gotdatmoney · Jan 31, 2020

There is no technical reason these games cannot be on the Switch. Lol stop people.

EA doesn't want to support the Switch. That's just the reality of it not in their strategy

Jiraiya · Jan 31, 2020

Gotdatmoney said:
There is no technical reason these games cannot be on the Switch. Lol stop people.

EA doesn't want to support the Switch. That's just the reality of it not in their strategy

Because technically they don't think it's worth it?

VariantX · Jan 31, 2020

ItWasMeantToBe19 said:
Bethesda and Activision release plenty of games on Switch, IDK.

Yep. 3rd parties have been putting in good effort on the switch.

Gotdatmoney · Jan 31, 2020

Jiraiya said:
Because technically they don't think it's worth it?

Hence EA doesn't want to support the Switch. This isn't hardware capability lol.

Pryme · Jan 31, 2020

We'll keep getting these threads as long as people keep pretending they don't know what the issue is.

Most EA games run on Frostbite. Frostbite doesn't run on the Switch and porting isn't an easy feat thanks to how low powered the Switch is. It would take a lot of resources to get the engine port done, and It seems EA still needs convincing that that's a sound financial bet.
Nintendo could do a whole lot more to help. Microsoft sent engineers to help with the PUBG Xbox One port, for example. How much help has Nintendo extended to help fast track the Frostbite port from EA, or even a Snowdrop port from Ubisoft?

there are trade offs for the form factor the Switch has adopted. This is one of them.

Soapbox Killer · Jan 31, 2020

Gnorman said:
I'm guessing there's a very good chance that EA have more data than you to back up their decision.

I'm sure they do however, knowledge in the hands of the incompetent makes for foolish moves.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

Akita One said:
That's not even close to being true...the same percentage of Nintendo system owners buying these games have never come close to the same percentage as people on Xbox and Playstation that buy these. You've never seen any EA game last longer than a month on any Nintendo top 20 chart...they even alluded to this on their sales call last week.

1 million is sales is definitely a flop when, without Nintendo, it is a perennial top 3 seller. And a $60 game isn't even remotely close to a F2P game.

You said those games "have never sold well" on Nintendo systems. They don't have to sell as well as they do on other systems to still sell well and be profitable. Madden and FIFA have sold very well on Nintendo consoles in the past.

And I'm not sure what you're responding to when you bring up F2P games.

SkoomaBlade · Jan 31, 2020

As other users have stated, it's a technology thing. I can imagine the current version of Frostbite doesn't exactly scale easily on the switch so the cost to EA to do such a port probably isn't worth it from a financial point of view. It's a bummer EA forced Frostbite across most of it's studios as I remember being excited for the Ignition engine that originally powered it's sports games at the beginning of this gen.

cw_sasuke · Jan 31, 2020

LuigiMario said:
Hooks being switch players who will spend money on MTX for their games. Probably should have phrased it as "hooks on switch players" but the point stands.

They have data to support Switch FIFA owners (when they were putting effort in those ports) didn't spend as much on ultimate team as elsewhere. That is why they didn't bring more games over. I agree it's a bit silly, 3 years in and Switch has a way bigger casual audience more accepting of that stuff than they did in 2018, but that's likely the data EA is going off of and why they haven't bothered.

Why would they spent money on a subpar FIFA version ? lol
First FIFA on Switch didn't even let you play with friends.

Once they deliver feature parity and the sales don't follow through - then they can complain. Not before that.

MisterR · Jan 31, 2020

Shibata100 said:
1m sales is not a flop. EA should be aiming to grow the Nintendo user base

EA should do what they think is the best way to invest their money, if they don't feel that the return on investment is there for FIFA or Madden on the Switch, then they should continue to ignore it.

Jiraiya · Jan 31, 2020

Gotdatmoney said:
Hence EA doesn't want to support the Switch. This isn't hardware capability lol.

The capability of the hardware is what got Nintendo here with ea.

Gnorman · Jan 31, 2020

Soapbox Killer said:
I'm sure they do however, knowledge in the hands of the incompetent makes for foolish moves.

Perhaps the devs that would be used porting games to switch make EA more money on PS4 / Xbox projects.

Brinbe · Jan 31, 2020

not worth it to them. ea did the same thing with psp/vita ports too.

2k20 is a pretty good port at least

night814 · Jan 31, 2020

Tron1 said:
COD?

It's really one of the only outliers now, a lot of it probably has to do with the dev shake ups they have been having. They should port mobile to Switch.

Akita One · Jan 31, 2020

skittzo0413 said:
You said those games "have never sold well" on Nintendo systems. They don't have to sell as well as they do on other systems to still sell well and be profitable. Madden and FIFA have sold very well on Nintendo consoles in the past.

And I'm not sure what you're responding to when you bring up F2P games.

The point isn't to be profitable, those employees could be making more money for EA developing almost anything else. They didn't buy the NFL and FIFA licenses to make pennies.

The F2P comment was your comparison to Fortnite and Warframe "doing well".

Deleted member 36708 · Jan 31, 2020

night814 said:
It's really one of the only outliers now, a lot of it probably has to do with the dev shake ups they have been having. They should port mobile to Switch.

And that won't happen just to show you how they view switch. No other Activision offering matters to me. It's silly really. The sales and momentum mean nothing in the eyes of Big AAA pubs.

Skittzo · Jan 31, 2020

Akita One said:
The point isn't to be profitable, those employees could be making more money for EA developing almost anything else. They didn't buy the NFL and FIFA licenses to make pennies.

The F2P comment was your comparison to Fortnite and Warframe "doing well".

You don't know that the time and budget it takes to port a game like that could be spent on something much more profitable. 1M+ games sold at $60 is not pennies, that's ludicrous.

And my F2P comment wasn't in response to you, it was in response to someone saying there aren't Switch games that make much money on microtransactions.

Deleted member 7462 · Jan 31, 2020

I thought that EA and its shareholders, like Activision's, were generally more interested in spending time and money to make massive revenue. So, making 15M in revenue isn't worth the time even if they take a significant amount of that as profit, but making 150M in revenue is.

Kinda like movie studios who ignore those mid-range budget movies because they'd rather roll the dice budgeting for a 400M dollar movie that could make a billion at the box office than a 40M dollar movie, even if they make a profit on the 40M dollar movie.

I'm pretty sure that I've heard or read that from people who would know about EA's profit strategies, but I could be wrong.

fiendcode · Feb 1, 2020

LuigiMario said:
It's the same reason 2K won't port GTA5. Sure it could run it no problem, but the issue is GTA Online is the real moneymaker for the GTA franchise now. It'd take too much additional effort to get that feature parity with the current gen versions (remember, the 360 and PS3 versions of GTA Online were dropped long ago) and if they can't get that gravy train going they won't even bother.

According to the insider who leaked GTAV Switch was put on hold, the reasoning was due to storage (at the time only 16GB cards were available). This was same insider who leaked L.A. Noire fwiw.

KINGOFSHIBUYA Ltd. · Feb 5, 2020

Now that I'm addicted to Madden 20, I would pay full price for a Switch version.
It seems odd that they would leave such a mainstream money maker on the table like that.

The FIFA and Madden situation on Switch just feels... strange?

deathsaber

LuigiMario

Skittzo

cw_sasuke

Thera

LuigiMario

ShadowFox08

tutomos

take_marsh

Akita One

Herb Alpert

One Winged Slayer

Gnorman

Maximus

LuigiMario

Gotdatmoney

Jiraiya

VariantX

Gotdatmoney

Pryme

Soapbox Killer

Skittzo

SkoomaBlade

Chicken Chaser

cw_sasuke

MisterR

Jiraiya

Gnorman

Brinbe

night814

One Winged Slayer

Akita One

Deleted member 36708

Skittzo

Deleted member 7462

fiendcode

KINGOFSHIBUYA Ltd.