DanGo

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,797
I'm beginning to believe a lot of you don't know what flat means or what cheap films look like. There's nothing flat about the lighting in any of these sequences. There's an abundance of contrast, specifically color contrast, to these images. The movie looks expensive. You won't find a small budget movie that looks as crisp as this.
I'm convinced Marvel and other comic book movies have broken some people. They've been beaten into submission by those bland assembly lines.
 

KillstealWolf

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
16,568
It's fun to compare this trailers use of White Rabbit to the last film trailer I remember to use it.

 

Doggg

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Nov 17, 2017
14,715
I'm beginning to believe a lot of you don't know what flat means or what cheap films look like. There's nothing flat about the lighting in any of these sequences. There's an abundance of contrast, specifically color contrast, to these images. The movie looks expensive. You won't find a small budget movie that looks as crisp as this.

"Flat and cheap/looks like TV" is like the "lazy devs" of film criticism here (and itself often a lazy, meritless criticism).
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,767
I'm convinced Marvel and other comic book movies have broken some people. They've been beaten into submission by those bland assembly lines.

Some really seem to be too used to Marvel's non-existent contrast, dull-ass dynamic ranges and absolutely uninspired use of color.

ODv07Yk.jpg


Is there anyone in those threads talking about what a giant visual turd the latest Hollandman movie looks like?

Matrix Resurrections comes out with an unsually bright and colorful palette for movies of this sort and a few people can't take it lol. They think it's shot wrong. Like, what would happen if Speed Racer released today after over a decade of eyes being massaged by a neverending stream of blockbusters all looking like the same depthless graded-down muck. I imagine the reaction would be even worse than it was in 2008.

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MY EYES

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mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,362
Everytime I see a Speed racer thing my eyes are surprised. Really was a crazily fun shot film
 

Wrexis

Member
Nov 4, 2017
21,902

DMczaf

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,292
Las Vegas, NV
Some really seem to be too used to Marvel's non-existent contrast, dull-ass dynamic ranges and absolutely uninspired use of color.

ODv07Yk.jpg


Is there anyone in those threads talking about what a giant visual turd the latest Hollandman movie looks like?

Matrix Resurrections comes out with an unsually bright and colorful palette for movies of this sort and some people can't take it lol. Like, what would happen if Speed Racer released today after over a decade of eyes being massaged by a neverending stream of blockbusters all looking like the same depthless graded-down muck. I imagine the reaction would be even worse than it was in 2008.

vp8V2AC.png


aLrOc5Q.png


wo6EA6w.png


MY EYES

raiders-of-the-lost-ark-face-melt.gif

It just all feels like green screen BS

In terms of dialogue scenes.
 

Aselith

Member
Oct 27, 2017
8,707
It's an underground city.

I don't know what else they could have done.

A lot imo. Like, these are people happy to be free but no freedom of movement. Where's the decoration and creativity that you'd imagine they want to exercise? You can make pigments and pastes from mud. They should have walls decorated, sculpture, etc. Their city should be using scavenged items in art to represent the freedom that they all believe in fighting for. Instead, it's a boring industrial hellscape like a factory. It's like another machine but they have the capacity to make it actually human.

Why are they raving and then no one makes any art?

People made art from text punctuation, for god's sake.
 

TrashyPanda

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,948
A lot imo. Like, these are people happy to be free but no freedom of movement. Where's the decoration and creativity that you'd imagine they want to exercise? You can make pigments and pastes from mud. They should have walls decorated, sculpture, etc. Their city should be using scavenged items in art to represent the freedom that they all believe in fighting for. Instead, it's a boring industrial hellscape like a factory. It's like another machine but they have the capacity to make it actually human.

Why are they raving and then no one makes any art?

People made art from text punctuation, for god's sake.

Yeah but have you seen how hard they party? No time to make art when you're literally just out here partying harder than Andrew W.K.

They out here fucking, not sculpting.

Edit: I'll never understand the complaints about how the real world looked boring. It's supposed to be unappealing compared to the Matrix. It also looked fantastic from a special effects and set design standpoint.
 

Axon

Banned
Mar 9, 2020
2,397
Some really seem to be too used to Marvel's non-existent contrast, dull-ass dynamic ranges and absolutely uninspired use of color.

ODv07Yk.jpg


Is there anyone in those threads talking about what a giant visual turd the latest Hollandman movie looks like?

Matrix Resurrections comes out with an unsually bright and colorful palette for movies of this sort and a few people can't take it lol. They think it's shot wrong. Like, what would happen if Speed Racer released today after over a decade of eyes being massaged by a neverending stream of blockbusters all looking like the same depthless graded-down muck. I imagine the reaction would be even worse than it was in 2008.

vp8V2AC.png


aLrOc5Q.png


wo6EA6w.png


MY EYES

raiders-of-the-lost-ark-face-melt.gif

I mean the main appeal of the Marvel movies is that they are created for the lowest common denominator - they look bland by design. So its not surprising that people that are big on the MCU would have a problem with more intricate cinematography.
 

signal

Member
Oct 28, 2017
40,456
Where is this:

Rdjpc2o.jpg


It looks like a massive human building, but it seems like that's natural light coming. In the Matrix, the sky has been blotted out and humans have been forced to live underground for who-knows-how-long. So what is this?
This was the weirdest thing in the trailer imo. The light makes no sense whether it is an above-ground pre-war city, or an older destroyed Zion.
 

liquidtmd

Avenger
Oct 28, 2017
6,178
I mean the main appeal of the Marvel movies is that they are created for the lowest common denominator - they look bland by design. So its not surprising that people that are big on the MCU would have a problem with more intricate cinematography.

I'd say this is too harsh. There is artistry running throughout the MCU, and 'some' of the art is gorgeous in several of the movies

Even if this Resurrections movie itself is ass, this trailer does absolutely make the No Way Home trailer and it's ilk seem uninspired though. From the music choice, to story framing, to the shots used - it feels gloriously alive. No Way Home feels like...the visuals are good but the artistry and craft behind is merely workman-like

Beyond the excitement for seeing Maguire, Garfield and Holland bouncing off each other, I really do not rate the director for Holland Spidey movies and have low expectations for it as a project, but that could well be in line that he's bringing exactly what the Marvel execs want him to do and he doesn't have to clout to make his own mark

Very interested to see Strange 2 in this regard, as I'm a lifelong fan of Raimi's career
 
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mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,362
I'm going to choose to believe that neo in this version is an independent filmmaker living in LA.
 

cognizant

Member
Dec 19, 2017
13,757
Shower thought of the day: I would like it if the real world machines are not even the threat in this movie. In fact, they did Neo and Trinity a solid by bringing them back to life, perhaps out of respect for him saving them from destruction. The villains would actually be both humans and programs who want to manipulate the powerful (but apparently clueless) Neo to their own nefarious plots, risking yet another war.

Basically I like more nuance from the machines, the kind we saw in the latter half of the trilogy. Rather than straight up "muhahaha!" evil, we get moments like "There are levels of survival we are prepared to accept", Rama telling Neo programs can fall in love, the babyface machine 'leader' acting petulant, and the reverent way they dragged Neo's body away (and choosing not to liquefy him or Trinity).

As much as I like good/bad dynamics in stories like Terminator/Alien, I also appreciate what the trilogy tried to do and give us something different. Rather than give us an enemy to hate (especially during the manic height of the Iraq war), it wanted to have us understand an adversary and give context for their side. Even Smith, the madman, had a compelling motivation throughout the trilogy.
 
Oct 27, 2017
4,198
New HBO Max version is the correct original version.
The Blu-ray release from went overboard with the color grading and green tint when it released 12 years ago.



BRAAH lol glad i have the bluray set... what the fuckkk... 4k remaster looks terrible.


still sad the new movie doesn't look like the 1999 one...

digital film...
jim-carrey-cringe.gif
dont think ill ever like the look of it over film.
 

Vonocourt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,678
sHCf8Qw.gif



i just couldn't believe how clear 480p was ...watched it on my 27 inch 4:3 tv and was amazed... watched 480i most of the time..or worse.
the current gen will never know how good they got it lol
They'll never know the pain of moire effect when someone wore a striped suit.

Or the stair-stepping on glasses with thin arms.
 

S1kkZ

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,566
people seem to overthink the possible story again, just like in 2003 before revolutions hit. and then the movie delivered the most basic* story resolution possible.

*compared to all the rumors and expectations.
 

Doggg

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Nov 17, 2017
14,715
A blast from the past

When Merovingian shows up to face Neo, Trinity and Morpheus… Trinity and Morpheus take off after the Keymaker and NEO is going to handle Merovingian and his team of old programs / allegedly supernatural beings.

Instead we just get another martial arts battle with weapons that only seem to really affect solid inert objects. Though they've opened the door to Vampires, Werewolves, Zombies and what not… We're not getting them. We just get more kung fu. They fucking opened the door to things cooler than kung fu and all they give us are Wraiths for Trinity and Morpheus to deal with, meanwhile Mr. THE ONE is left to deal with a bunch of pansy ass Red Shirt Kung Fu fools that apparently might be Angels and Demons and things beyond imagining… Oh… but we're not going there? God forbid one of them AKIRA's out… or does anything beyond Wire Fu.

They suggest that it might be coming, then don't go there? FUCK THAT! This film features about 5 fights of Neo fighting folks Kung Fu fashion… BIG FUCKING DEAL, we got the idea at the end of the last one, that he could tear an Agent apart from the inside. But now… well now he's very limited by his mind. He seems to have built fences all around it. Just as the Wachowski Brothers seem to have built around their own imaginations.

I wouldn't be ranting about not having the Vampires and Werewolves and Angels and Demons and what not had they never suggested it, but they did. They said it could happen, then they gave us Kung Fu… Again… against the one character in this film that we know you don't fuck with with Kung Fu.

 

cognizant

Member
Dec 19, 2017
13,757
Idle love for all things Matrix:

The throat punch is the greatest move in the trilogy. I love how this video keeps cutting back to it haha:



This scene is the most tragically short fight scene in the history of cinema. I remember my pals and I almost hyperventilating in excitement when the sword becomes unsheathed, and then deflating when Morpheus got in the car lol.



Wachowskis made up for it though with the greatest moment of Morpheus's career. Pure anime.




haha, I remember that. I was on that site for an unhealthy amount of time before calling it quits. God, what an idiot that guy was. Dude was ultimately just a shill in a home overflowing with gifts from studios lol.
 

Axon

Banned
Mar 9, 2020
2,397
Shower thought of the day: I would like it if the real world machines are not even the threat in this movie. In fact, they did Neo and Trinity a solid by bringing them back to life, perhaps out of respect for him saving them from destruction. The villains would actually be both humans and programs who want to manipulate the powerful (but apparently clueless) Neo to their own nefarious plots, risking yet another war.

Basically I like more nuance from the machines, the kind we saw in the latter half of the trilogy. Rather than straight up "muhahaha!" evil, we get moments like "There are levels of survival we are prepared to accept", Rama telling Neo programs can fall in love, the babyface machine 'leader' acting petulant, and the reverent way they dragged Neo's body away (and choosing not to liquefy him or Trinity).

As much as I like good/bad dynamics in stories like Terminator/Alien, I also appreciate what the trilogy tried to do and give us something different. Rather than give us an enemy to hate (especially during the manic height of the Iraq war), it wanted to have us understand an adversary and give context for their side. Even Smith, the madman, had a compelling motivation throughout the trilogy.

Perfect post. The machine-war was resolved perfectly in Resurrections, it would be disappointing if it just goes back to that. I want something more nuanced.
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,767
BRAAH lol glad i have the bluray set... what the fuckkk... 4k remaster looks terrible.


still sad the new movie doesn't look like the 1999 one...

digital film...
jim-carrey-cringe.gif
dont think ill ever like the look of it over film.
I think it looks quite nice, especially in HDR, although you can't see it in screenshots. They haven't taken the green away, just applied it in subtler and more dynamic ways.

the_matrix_4k_21-1.png


the_matrix_4k_37-1.png


The Matrix footage in that video is messed up, taken from the remastered blu-rays where they somehow screwed up with overblown whites and odd color timing when they toned it down from HDR to SDR.

Anyway, the 1999 DVD had this brown-ish pass. The 2008 blu-rays had a green-ish pass. And the UHD master for me just has richer look to it.

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I never liked the overbearing green in the previous master, it's just really distracting.
 
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Axon

Banned
Mar 9, 2020
2,397
I think it looks quite nice, especially in HDR, although you can't see it in screenshots. They haven't taken the green away, just applied it in subtler and more dynamic ways.

the_matrix_4k_21-1.png


the_matrix_4k_37-1.png


The Matrix footage in that video is messed up, taken from the remastered blu-rays where they somehow screwed up with overblown whites and odd color timing when they toned it down from HDR to SDR.

Anyway, the 1999 DVD had this brown-ish pass. The 2008 blu-rays had a green-ish pass. And the UHD master for me just has richer look to it.

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I never liked the overbearing green in the previous master, it's just really distracting.

I have to say, I dont really understand what the point is of changing the color-grading in new releases of older movies. They should take a look at how the original cinema projections looked like and approximate that as closely as possible. I dont agree with changing movies like this later down the line, it gives me Star Wars special edition vibes - the original color-grading was done with intent, and that intent should be preserved.
 

jett

Community Resettler
Member
Oct 25, 2017
44,767
I have to say, I dont really understand what the point is of changing the color-grading in new releases of older movies. They should take a look at how the original cinema projections looked like and approximate that as closely as possible. I dont agree with changing movies like this later down the line, it gives me Star Wars special edition vibes - the original color-grading was done with intent, and that intent should be preserved.
Bill Pope, the cinematographer of all three movies, was in charge of the new remastering process for the trilogy. This is his intent, I guess. lol. He actually re-timed all three movies. They look genuinely great.

A lot of early days DVD and even Blu-rays aren't accurate to the source material. Who's to say the 1999 DVD is what was intended? We know however that in 2004 they remastered it and purposefully color-timed it to make it look more inline with the sequels, which is what was used in the 2008 Blu-rays.

Color timing is a complicated subject, especially when it comes to preserving older movies. The negative might not be in good condition, there might not be solid reference prints available. Or the people responsible don't care to be involved, or are retired or just don't care. Or they are involved in the new process but are decades removed from the original production so they don't even remember what their original intent was or their particular tastes have changed (you can see this in the last remasters of Blade Runner and T2, with both Ridley Scott and James Cameron applying a teal push over the picture). Or are long dead.
 

Vonocourt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,678
Jesus christ buying the 4K blu-rays is a pain, eighty dollars for all of them, or sixty-some-odd bucks to get them individually, but then you have to conscientiously buy Revolutions...
 

RadioHeadAche

Member
Oct 26, 2017
1,551
I went to YouTube to watch the trailer and had to sit through an ad of the trailer I was trying to watch, so thanks machines?