The New Retirement Plan: Save Almost Everything, Spend Virtually Nothing (WSJ)
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I don't really understand this. So basically forced misery during the healthiest time I've your life. You might get pancreatic or stomcach cancer by 50 and fucking die. Glad you wasted the best time of you life then I'm sure.
Basically. I'm bored at home and have no interest in traveling or any of that shit. I'll retire when I die.
A perk that comes with that is I don't have to save for retirement ayyyyyyy (yet I don't really spend my money on anything anyways so I'm actually saving for a rainy day basically)
Not really something we need to worry about as we are not remotely close to that scenario, as evidenced by this thread.
Spending $75 on groceries but $50 on eating out makes no sense. You would be better off spending $125 on groceries and not have to eat all struggle meals.
That's largely my mindset too. But I mostly love my job as a professor at a research university (and get bored with too many days at home nip working in a row) and have tons of flexibility in what I work in and my schedule and make decent money (as does my wife). I'd feel differently if I had a 9-5 that I was just begrudgingly dragging myself into like most people.
Given that, I'd rather have the nice house, nice meals, great vacations, good beer and wine, new games to play constantly, go to lots of concerts and sporting events and so on every year and retire at 65 to 70 having had a full life. I'm in good health at 40 and both sides of my family tend to be pretty long lived so I'll hopefully still have a lot of good years left. If not, no regrets as we live nice, travel internationally at least a couple times a year etc. so it's not like we're counting down the years to retirement.
It's all about balance and saving plenty for retirement at at least the standard age range whole enjoying life along the way for us. Granted, we're very fortunate to make good incomes while having careers we both mostly enjoy and find rewarding. While there was for sure luck involved in that, it was also a lot of planning and figuring out what we wanted to do at a reasonable age to be able to work and study hard to provide the opportunities to get those jobs.
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That's a weird way of looking at things. Is someone who lives on, say, 30k a year but makes more than that living in "forced misery"? I guess if you assume spending is the only metric for enjoying life.
You could die tomorrow, too. Does that mean you should spend everything you make immediately?
You may also not get I'll when you hit 50. It is not misery to save toward the future if it is what you want. The allire of having no major bills and the reduction in stress from that is very tempting.
Yeah, just noting the proposal is not a macro-level solution.
Why not just shoot yourself at 60? You don't have to worry about your retirement and you can enjoy your life instead of eating brown bananas. Hell, make it 55 or even 50 if you're worried about mounting healthcare cost later in your life. That's my plan anyway.
Do most people enjoy themselves working a regular 9-5? I mean my job is fine and I cannot complain, but there are many things I'd rather be doing.
Funny enough, many people who are making that kind of money rarely end up retiring early. A friend who was a very diligent FIRE practitioner in his 20s and early 30s stopped caring after he became a director at an investment bank. He is now part of the leadership team at a hedge fund no longer planing to retire early.
You can possibly die on any day due to a variety of circumstances ranging from car accidents to cancer. Pretty much living like a poor person in your 20's and 30's (the time your are overall the healthiest) so you have a possible good retirement is silly advice. I am not saying that you should spend all of your money during that period, of course it is good to save, but purposely living below your perceived means for a chance at a good retirement is just silly.
I counter this with...
People that spend all their money and get drunk every weekend have a major addiction/control problem.
:-P
My retirement plan is to Continue to live paycheck to Paycheck until I can't work anymore and then live in a box under an overpass and grub for quarters all day.
I was referring to her $11k-$12k a MONTH income. Of course others can do this, she's a HORRIBLE example of it in comparison to basically every other person in the country though.
My wife and I make good money, but we have 3 kids (which we would never change)...so FIRE barely would work for us. It would never be enough to drastically change our savings, unfortunately.
How to save millions by the time you're 40:
Step one: earn a shit load of money per year.
Step two: don't spend it.
Easy, everyone should do it.
Step one: earn a shit load of money per year.
Step two: don't spend it.
Easy, everyone should do it.
Source?
I tried to google that and only got this
https://www.quora.com/How-long-does-it-take-the-typical-law-school-graduate-to-pay-back-school-loans
You seem to be implying that someone paid her way through college but there's no way to know that unless an un-quoted part of the article says so. If she is the type to seek out brown bananas to save money as a working professional with a six figure salary, it seems reasonable to me that she would have been capable of minimizing expenses during college and pay down any debt aggressively afterward.
Somebody doing the FIRE thing hardcore would prioritize paying off student loans ASAP before anything else.
Vs. the average person (like my wife and I--Ph Ds rather than law degrees, but still six figure debt combined) who just pay a tad more than the minimum as we care more about living a nice life and maxing our retirement accounts up to employer matches more than getting rid of those relatively low interest loans).
fortunately life is not a binary choice between being cheapass buzzkill sober boy versus a financially irresponsible alcoholic
I don't think the choice is really as binary as "retire at 40 and be done with work forever" vs "work 9-5 every day of your life". if one really can't be bothered to be tied to an office or a regular hours work, there are plenty of options out there, from flexible working hours to freelance to whatnot.
Of course it is not binary, I am not living in abject poverty to save that extra dime either, as some people here seem to think...
Since these are usually done by people in way different income brackets it always rings hollow. They are probably leaving details out of their "plans" that makes their lives not as miserable as it sounds on paper.
I'm also laughing again at rich people leeching off others as usual with the Netflix passwords scam.😆. It's like ingrained in these people's DNA no matter how fucking mundane.
These are the type of people that think they can control everything in life. Live like misers because the accumulation of wealth is everything in their lives. Then they get cancer or die in horrible Yoga accidents in their 40's. Live life without regrets, you never know what tomorrow is going to bring.
I'm also laughing again at rich people leeching off others as usual with the Netflix passwords scam.😆. It's like ingrained in these people's DNA no matter how fucking mundane.
These are the type of people that think they can control everything in life. Live like misers because the accumulation of wealth is everything in their lives. Then they get cancer or die in horrible Yoga accidents in their 40's. Live life without regrets, you never know what tomorrow is going to bring.
People who live life like that aren't going to change when they actually retire. For many of them, there can never be enough money so they'll keep being frugal. Several of my friends who make 6 figures can't understand why I won't share my Netflix account with them. They are that cheap.
I can solve this right now. She does have student loans, and she hasn't paid them off yet. See here - https://www.journeytolaunch.com/episode47/ (Today, Sylvia has paid down a majority of her student loan debt). She just chooses to conveniently leave that part out of her budget. I also learned from this that she owns rental property, which also seems like an important detail.
I work for a University in an admin position and it is fine. I honestly cannot complain about much. Monday to Friday, 8:30 to 4:30 with a nice mix of people covering most age ranges. Happy to go to work each day as I find it low stress, enough of a challenge to keep me engaged and provides a sense of accomplishment when the job is complete.
I enjoy spending what I have on the things I like. I don't have any urge to retire young as... well... I am 30 right now, so that ship has sailed lol! Especially, not any of this frugal living nonsense.
I enjoy spending what I have on the things I like. I don't have any urge to retire young as... well... I am 30 right now, so that ship has sailed lol! Especially, not any of this frugal living nonsense.
I've been reading MMM for years. Definitely not as strict as him but it's really changed the way I think about spending and consumption. At my current spending level I'm on track to retire when I'm 39, with very conservative estimates for salary increases and investment performance. If I get married and have a kid or something I suspect it'll get pushed back a couple years though.
I'm at about a quarter of my target number, and even that feels incredibly liberating. Knowing that even if I save nothing else till regular retirement age and being set is a good feeling to have.
Exactly. This is impossible for people with kids who wants to at least enjoy life.
What level of spending per person do you believe is required to enjoy life?
Budgeting aggressively doesn't mean missing out on life it means being selective about what is truly important to you. You can often cut out a whole lot of spending without any actual decrease in quality of life. Sometimes we spend money just because or without even noticing.
Just do it halfway and retire at 50 or 55. (this is my plan lol)
People who think they would have nothing to do but browse internet all day without a job to keep them in check sound like they have no imaginations or hobbies or aspirations.
You could be taking on more financially risky but rewarding jobs/projects when you are income secure. To not be beholden to a boss/paycheque to survive so you can pursue whatever is a fine goal.
People who think they would have nothing to do but browse internet all day without a job to keep them in check sound like they have no imaginations or hobbies or aspirations.
You could be taking on more financially risky but rewarding jobs/projects when you are income secure. To not be beholden to a boss/paycheque to survive so you can pursue whatever is a fine goal.
The New Retirement Plan: Save Almost Everything, Spend Virtually Nothing, send the US economy into a permanent recession like Japan
If you want evidence that capitalism is inherently broken, people are pushing an idea that, if widely adopted, would slow down growth, just to avoid having to submerge oneself into the soul-crushing cycle of growth that drives global capitalism. This slowdown would in fact make avoiding (in this case by retiring early) that fate more difficult. The more people who do this, the more difficult it becomes, the more wealth is polarized.
If you want evidence that capitalism is inherently broken, people are pushing an idea that, if widely adopted, would slow down growth, just to avoid having to submerge oneself into the soul-crushing cycle of growth that drives global capitalism. This slowdown would in fact make avoiding (in this case by retiring early) that fate more difficult. The more people who do this, the more difficult it becomes, the more wealth is polarized.
