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miscellaneous houseplant

self-requsted ban
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
306
Maybe I am not thinking this out. So there is nothing, but as the universe goes it creates somthing. Like if i leave the boundary of the universe I would cease to exist because there are no rules there that says I can exist?
There is no boundary of the universe, as I understand it. If you were to look out from any point in the known universe, you would believe you were in the center of the universe, since all parts of the universe are moving away from all other parts of the universe. You can't leave the universe - nothing can (presumably). As others have said, the space between particles/clusters of matter is increasing, driven by dark energy/matter.
 

smurfx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,587
We can't reach any other galaxies at the moment, local or non local. We can barely leave the solar system using probes, and it takes us many years to do that.
i know that but i don't think humans can ever reach other galaxies beyond our local group even if we get up to half the speed of light. we can still reach galaxies in our local group but it will take thousands of years.
 
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DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,499
but it cant be destroyed

everything that was at the beginning will be at the end.

with a different shape

Well


you know what I mean.... Life will be destroyed lol

Big crunch is very unlikely given current observational data and theory.

So we expand infinitely forever?

Just seems weird to me to not have a closed loop but for now we just have to take the universe as it presents itself to us
 

EchoChamber

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
2,489
Big crunch is very unlikely given current observational data and theory.

NOtSkd3.gif
 

Yataran

Member
Jul 17, 2018
439
Copenhagen, DK
i know that but i don't think humans can't ever reach other galaxies beyond our local group even if we get up to half the speed of light. we can still reach galaxies in our local group but it will take thousands of years.
Yes. Unless we develop some amazing science fiction level technologies, humanity will be physically stuck to a very limited volume of space...
 
Oct 27, 2017
487
To be clear, when they say faster than expected, they mean that the direct measurement of the recession gives a faster rate than the more indirect (but highly accurate) rate determined by doing a fit of a cosmological model to the measurements of the details of the cosmic microwave background that is remnant from the Big Bang. This has been known for a while, but now there is less chance that it is a fluke. There's of course already dozens of papers proposing new particles and interactions that can solve this discrepancy, but it will be a while before any of these models can be experimentally tested.

What is it expanding in? Like if i pour water into a glass, the water is expending and filling up the glass.
Either space is infinite or if you keep going in one direction you eventually go back to where you started, like the surface of the Earth (observations favor the first option). An actual "edge" is very unlikely.

Are we being pushed apart by momentum from the big bang or Dark Matter expanding?

Could that same dark matter also contract at some point bringing us all closer together again? Like a balloon inflating and deflating infinitely over aeons (ok am i describing infinity theory here or not I cant remember)

Initially people thought it was just the "initial momentum" as you say, in which case, since gravity is attractive, the expansion would decelerate and could eventually reverse. At the beginning of this century, it was found that not only it is not slowing down, but actually accelerating, which is only possible if there is an energy density in empty space that repels gravitationally, instead of attracting, which was called the dark energy. It makes up about 70% of the total energy of the Universe right now, and nobody really knows what it is made of. If this dark energy is unchanging in time, the universe will expand forever. In some models, which don't look very likely right now, however, it can slowly weaken, in which case, the expansion could one day slow down and reverse.
 

Deleted member 7130

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,685
Space-time is expanding everywhere including in between the atoms in your body right now. Gravity and other forces keep close things from pulling apart. Once you get to the distance of galaxies that aren't on collision paths there is literally more space appearing in between them on a constant basis where nothing is strong enough to pull them closer, and so they are effectively drifting away from each other
 
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DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,499
I only like the big crunch theory since it solves the paradox of... where did the singularity of the big bang come from

Instead... it was always there. There was never nothing. Something infinitely recycles forever and ever

Then matter is never created or destroyed. Everything makes sense.
 

DrROBschiz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,499
To be clear, when they say faster than expected, they mean that the direct measurement of the recession gives a faster rate than the more indirect (but highly accurate) rate determined by doing a fit of a cosmological model to the measurements of the details of the cosmic microwave background that is remnant from the Big Bang. This has been known for a while, but now there is less chance that it is a fluke. There's of course already dozens of papers proposing new particles and interactions that can solve this discrepancy, but it will be a while before any of these models can be experimentally tested.


Either space is infinite or if you keep going in one direction you eventually go back to where you started, like the surface of the Earth (observations favor the first option). An actual "edge" is very unlikely.



Initially people thought it was just the "initial momentum" as you say, in which case, since gravity is attractive, the expansion would decelerate and could eventually reverse. At the beginning of this century, it was found that not only it is not slowing down, but actually accelerating, which is only possible if there is an energy density in empty space that repels gravitationally, instead of attracting, which was called the dark energy. It makes up about 70% of the total energy of the Universe right now, and nobody really knows what it is made of. If this dark energy is unchanging in time, the universe will expand forever. In some models, which don't look very likely right now, however, it can slowly weaken, in which case, the expansion could one day slow down and reverse.

If we assume Dark Energy and Matter also experiences Entropy... does this change things?
 

Omegasquash

Member
Oct 31, 2017
6,217
outside of our local group right?

Not even. The closest known galaxy to the Milky Way (that I know of...don't think we've found anything else) is 42,000 light years from the Milky Way center, and 25,000 light years from our solar system. Since we aren't approaching light speed, it'd be a very, very long trip.

Andromeda is commonly referred to as the closest, but I think it's the closest spiral, at a few million light years away.
 

Damerman

Banned
Jun 9, 2018
850
I only like the big crunch theory since it solves the paradox of... where did the singularity of the big bang come from

Instead... it was always there. There was never nothing. Something infinitely recycles forever and ever

Then matter is never created or destroyed. Everything makes sense.
lol, I feel safe and cradled after reading ur post.
 
Oct 27, 2017
487
If we assume Dark Energy and Matter also experiences Entropy... does this change things?
The law of ever increasing entropy is respected by all physical theories. The final state of the Universe, would be a maximum entropy state, in which nothing changes and all energy useful to do work is completely diluted, called the state of "heat death". I suppose you're asking if the dark energy can decay in time, inwhich case, in the simplest models, it cannot. It's a constant amount of energy per volume, such that the more space expands, the more of this stuff is created. This energy cannot be extracted to do any work, though.
 

Droidian

One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Dec 28, 2017
2,391
No wonder I am getting fatter.

I laughed out loud on that one.

Wasn't it reported that the Galaxy's were actually bound to collide ?

This stuff is so profound considering the things unseen to the human eye out there. Gasses and space stuff.
Does earth contain every element in the multiverse?

This is just the one of the verses we are in as well.

4.6 billion stars in our Galaxy.... Really insane.
 

Damerman

Banned
Jun 9, 2018
850
I laughed out loud on that one.

Wasn't it reported that the Galaxy's were actually bound to collide ?

This stuff is so profound considering the things unseen to the human eye out there. Gasses and space stuff.
Does earth contain every element in the multiverse?

This is just the one of the verses we are in as well.

4.6 billion stars in our Galaxy.... Really insane.
yeah, but that has to do with them(the galaxies) rotating like the particles within galaxies and particles within solar systems... not cause they are expanding.
 
Oct 27, 2017
487
What was before the big bang?
Nobody really knows because you can't extend the theory to the instant of the Big Bang, it breaks down there. There are exotic proposals where there is no initial singularity, so you could hypothetically have a previous phase of contraction, then the current expansion, but they are highly speculative.

I laughed out loud on that one.

Wasn't it reported that the Galaxy's were actually bound to collide ?

This stuff is so profound considering the things unseen to the human eye out there. Gasses and space stuff.
Does earth contain every element in the multiverse?

This is just the one of the verses we are in as well.

4.6 billion stars in our Galaxy.... Really insane.

I think you mean the Milky Way will collide with Andromeda, which is the nearest galaxy. Every now and then, nearby galaxies that are close enough can attract gravitationally each other and fuse, but on the average, they are all receding from each other.
 

smurfx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,587
Not even. The closest known galaxy to the Milky Way (that I know of...don't think we've found anything else) is 42,000 light years from the Milky Way center, and 25,000 light years from our solar system. Since we aren't approaching light speed, it'd be a very, very long trip.

Andromeda is commonly referred to as the closest, but I think it's the closest spiral, at a few million light years away.
it's still reachable though. i think everything outside the local group can't ever be reached even at light speed.
 

Omegasquash

Member
Oct 31, 2017
6,217
Well there must have been something in order to have big bang happen.
There is still zero explanation to what started the Big Bang besides "it just did"

I think we can do little more than speculate, since space and time as we know and/or understand them didn't really exist.

That's the point where anything goes. Could be too much pressure and the entirety of matter within the universe just couldn't be compressed any further, could be God pushing the play button on the VCR, could be the flying spaghetti monster, could be my mom.
 

Forerunner

Resetufologist
The Fallen
Oct 30, 2017
14,711
Well there must have been something in order to have big bang happen.

No, not necessarily. Human's like to think about cause and effect, however causality only happened because of the big bang. Before that we don't know much because everything we understand all breaks down. We might never know because we aren't capable of that level of thinking.

A short video that explains this and some other theories.

 

Unknownlight

One Winged Slayer
Member
Nov 2, 2017
10,605
expanding is a misnomer. why don't they say spreading out? when they say expanding it makes people think that the edges of the universe are expanding, rather than the stars and galaxies are spreading out into space.

Unless I've misunderstood everything (which isn't unlikely) they're referring to spacetime expansion, which isn't limited to the speed of light. "Spreading out" would be a misnomer because it implies that the stars and galaxies are moving through space, when what's actually happening is that the space between galaxies is getting bigger (like stretching a rubber sheet).