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yogurt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,946
7 out of 10

Some really high highs, especially in the second half, but the pacing was weird, the rapping generally not great, and Miranda isn't a good actor. I wish he'd given the lead part to someone else and had an actual rapper edit the rap bits.

The highlights are mostly the non-rapping bits - Room Where It Happened, Washington On Your Side, all the King George stuff. Though I do enjoy the cabinet rap battles.
 

Kill3r7

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,505
Prefacing this with I have little to no experience with musicals. I thought it was OK. It has some really memorable parts, but overall I found it to be a bit long, and to be honest, a lot of it reminded me of 'epic rap battles of history' type stuff, like they were rapping or singing wikipedia summaries of history. Miranda's voice kind of grated after a while too, he has a bit of a whiny tone.

LMM might be genius but his voice is not his strength.
 

Zero315

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,194
It's good, seen it on D+ and the touring production.

It's one of those things where it became popular enough that the general public got a hold of it and started hyping it up to no end.

7 out of 10

Some really high highs, especially in the second half, but the pacing was weird, the rapping generally not great, and Miranda isn't a good actor. I wish he'd given the lead part to someone else and had an actual rapper edit the rap bits.

The highlights are mostly the non-rapping bits - Room Where It Happened, Washington On Your Side, all the King George stuff. Though I do enjoy the cabinet rap battles.
All I heard people talk about was Yorktown and how it was the best thing in the show. Then I finally saw and was like, y'all were really hyping this up over Satisfied?
 

Xion385

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
974
It's good, seen it on D+ and the touring production.

It's one of those things where it became popular enough that the general public got a hold of it and started hyping it up to no end.


All I heard people talk about was Yorktown and how it was the best thing in the show. Then I finally saw and was like, y'all were really hyping this up over Satisfied?
Satisfied is the best performance. Wait for It is the best song.
 

Harbinger00

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,761
I liked it enough that I think it's strange that Lin Manuel Miranda has a casual seemingly real friendship with the McElroy brothers.

yeah, there is a very old episode of mbmbam where Lin calls in as a guest expert while he was working on writing Hamilton, and they have been friends ever since.
 

Temp_User

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,714
One of the best if not the best musical i've ever watched. Right up there with Hadestown. It kindled my interest in theater particularly musicals.
 

Conciliator

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,138
It was really enjoyable and fun when I watched the Disney movie version. A couple of the lines and songs are permanently memeified into my brain.

I can't say I find it to be the greatest American work of art of all time(as was kind of the buzz when it first blew up). I'm more sympathetic to the kind of lefty critiques of it, but regardless of all that, it's fun, funny, and has some really sticky songs.
 

AnimeJesus

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,191
Tried two attempts at watching it on D+ and couldn't make it very far. The dialogue and music just did not flow well at all. I don't normally watch plays either.
 

Beren

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,550
It's a fantastic musical and really enjoyable to watch. Caught it live and had a great time.

Apparently people got hung up on the accuracy of a musical that purposefully casts minorities as white people? You'd just be demanding to be upset at that point.
 

Panicky Duck

Member
Dec 14, 2020
449
I enjoyed the music. Miranda's a talented lyricist. Apparently it's historically inaccurate. Is there anything really egregious that stands out?
 
Oct 25, 2017
28,027
I'm glad I didn't miss my shot to see it since COVID shut it down a week later

It was highly entertaining and the D+ version is even better than the production I saw in Toronto
 

Aiii

何これ
Member
Oct 24, 2017
8,211
Used to think he's the goat, but I'm pretty sure Verstappen has surpassed him.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,084
It's fucking amazing. Listened to it non-stop.

After 2016, I can't be bothered to listen to a single song from it. Hopefully, after 2024 or when a certain orange man kicks the bucket I'll be able to comfortably listen again.
 

Rats

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,117
Huge fan. Hamilton and Les Miserables are the only two musicals I've ever loved. It's funny, I actually wrote a paper on Alexander Hamilton for a college class just a few years before the show debuted. I found him to be a uniquely fascinating figure among the founding fathers, and apparently Lin-Manuel agreed.

I won't argue with the political criticism of it, but really, it's just meant to be lighthearted fun.
 
Oct 25, 2017
19,182
There are valid criticisms and conversations about it, but it's an incredible piece of art. I'm still a bigger fan of Lin's In the Heights though.
 

viciouskillersquirrel

Cheering your loss
Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,876
I would really encourage the people who dismiss the backlash and critiques as being based on some kind of contrarian impulse to find a better take.
That "better take" isn't served by the misleading headline.

The essay uses a lot of words to make the point that "colorblind casting" of white stories (e.g. period pieces about royal courts in 18th century Europe) harms visible minorities by taking up space where minority stories should be being told. It doesn't say it, but the implication seems to be that stuff like Hamilton lets white liberals pat themselves on the back for a job well done while ignoring how white the entertainment industry's overall output continues to be. That line of criticism is more of an indictment of the wider culture and entertainment industry rather than of Hamilton itself. It's a criticism of what Hamilton isn't, which, well, okay?

While it may be valid to argue that lionising slave owners and ignoring their hypocrisy on the topic of freedom causes harm, it's a musical. It treats the founding fathers less as historical figures and more as mythic figures. When putting a production about Greek myth, you can go ahead and cast a black Dionysus - it causes no harm and allows black audience members to lay claim to a piece of culture that's unmoored from the historical context of Bronze Age Greece.

Likewise with George Washington. Yes, he was a real person who lived a real life, who had real blood on his hands, who fought for "freedom" for himself and his patrician class while enslaving hundreds of people, but he is also part of the pantheon of American civic myth. The myth grinds off his rough edges and shapes his vibe to fit an ideal form of America - not what America is, but what it should be (in the eyes of the storyteller, whoever that might be). The real man should be examined, criticised and evaluated in historical work and discussion, absolutely, but there is also no getting rid of him from the civic pantheon. Until the day the US government literally dissolves and is replaced he will be there, complete with wooden teeth and his upright zeal (and even then, he may only grow stronger). The right wing everywhere understands this and propagates myth to tell the story they want to tell of a pure, righteous genesis to the country forged by larger-than-life heroes who looked a lot like the elites of today.

As a mythic figure, Washington can be shaped and moulded to tell a better story, embody a better ideal, one that includes more than just white elites and their progeny and fulfils the promise of ideals like liberty and justice for all. That's what Hamilton is, or tries to be - an American civic myth that in its telling includes and champions more than just WASPs. If it fails to do that or doesn't go far enough, fair enough, but don't mistake it or characterise it as something it's not.
 

Aleh

Member
Oct 27, 2017
16,315
Hamilton is a masterpiece, I'm even surprised it's controversial despite the fact popular things tend to have vocal complaints all the time
 

AniHawk

No Fear, Only Math
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,182
i thought it was great. it's kinder to the historical founding fathers that they deserve, but i think there's more good than harm in getting people interested in history. hopefully they look into it and find out more for themselves. that's what i did.

also the animatics it spawned were awesome.


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tg6UC0bVDS4
 

Neobunch

Member
Nov 21, 2017
225
Back when the musical was new and all the rage I came across this political opinion essay which I found very insightful. It's from the middle of 2016 so at the tail end of Obama's administration and before the fateful 2016 election. It's a very interesting read.
 

Mariachi507

Member
Oct 26, 2017
5,321
Yeah, like it's not terrible and it has somewhat of an endearing quality to it. But it kind of sounds like someone who doesn't have a good voice for singing took a lot of singing lessons. I say this as someone who can't sing though, lol.

It works and has that endearing quality just from him being the main brain behind it all. It also kind of grounds the character IMO.
 

beau_beaumont

Member
Nov 12, 2017
1,350
I wasn't ever a fan of musicals before and only appreciated their music. I saw Hamilton live and never listened to the music before hand. I was in tears by the end. Truly a masterpiece in every way.
 
Apr 14, 2024
21
As someone who loves musicals, I thought it was great. I'm not from the US, so I was actually kind of confused about what was going on throughout most of it, but hey, wall-to-wall bangers.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,072
It's a classic that will be done by local theater groups 50 years later. Which is the highest praise for a musical.
 

Sheev

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,855
I'm British and didn't catch it until it went up on D+ a couple years back so I guess I missed that initial overexposure everyone was likely sick of, but I actually really enjoyed it. I had to turn my brain off in regards to the history within the story, but its a really entertaining show with fantastic music. 'Wait for It' and 'Satisfied' are legitimate top tier musical songs and are still on my rotation, Leslie Odom Jr. and Renée Elise Goldsberry gave all-timer performances.