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Iloelemen

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Oct 27, 2017
1,323
This isn't to say that all straight men are dismissive of pop music and of course there are women and queer people who are also dismissive of this genre of music, but it kinda feels like there's this attitude by a lot of straight men of being somewhere between dismissive to hateful of pop music, especially pop music by or for women, and even female RnB, and there's this tendency by women and queer people to be more embracing of this kind of music.

To be fair, there's less of a dismissal in pop music in today's atmosphere compared to back then (especially in the past, if you were a boy and you liked *insert pop song by female pop artist*, you were mocked as "Gay" in a negative manner and were made fun of whereas now, it's more comments of "I'm not a fan of that kind of music"). With that being said, it's common to see remarks like "pop music is garbage" and other forms of mockery towards this kind of music on the internet and on this forum.

Besides being a Michael Jackson or other artists that is liked by everyone and transcends the pop boundaries, I feel like there's a pattern in the type of pop song that straight men do like. It's usually:
  • Made by this obscure or indie act
  • A guilty pleasure (sometimes, with a touch of "all her other songs are bad and this is the only good one")
  • Song liked for ironic or memetic purposes
  • Not really common, but a non-pop cover version of a pop song.
The last one is a bit annoying because it's something like "This late 90s/early 00s manufactured Swedish pop song by pop girl is trash, but the rock/metal/acoustic/indie/1950s/cabaret cover version by *insert artist of genre* made it good".

Pop music, especially those that charted on the Billboard Hot 100 as you know gets tons of criticisms especially on the internet with regards to its lack of legitimacy, its repetitiveness and inanity, it being overproduced, it sounding like absolutely no effort is made and its manufactured nature, it all sounding the same etc. Despite these kinds of talking points, there are tons fans or as they call it, "stans" of pop music and pop artists and a lot of these stans usually have awareness of the processes and the people involved in making the so called "bops" by their so called "faves". And I might be wrong but a lot of the places where these stans gather on the internet seem to be less "straight men" and more "queer" and "women".

So why is it that despite the tons of criticisms of the quality of pop music, women and queer people seem to be more accepting of it? Why does it seem like straight men are more active in labeling pop songs as garbage?
(PS: There's this Teens react video I saw where one of the male teens was like "these female singers all sound the same" in an unflattering manner and this may or may not have inspired me to make this thread)
 

shnurgleton

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,864
Boston
Men seem to feel the need to be edgy or influential so dismissing a mass market culture product is appealing to them. It's about dick measuring and shitty ideas of what it means to be manly

Source: I used to despise pop music because it wasn't "real", and then I grew up
 

Chivalry

Chicken Chaser
Banned
Nov 22, 2018
3,894
Men often react more negatively to things that are meant for women/girls. It's not exclusive to pop music. Here's a good take on this issue:
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,247
I don't like pop-music, not to be edgy it's just not for me. With that said people can listen to what they want, no need to be a dick about it.
 

Moff

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Oct 26, 2017
4,883
is that really true? no SO I ever had listened to pop music. I think pop music is mostly aimed at children.
 

julia crawford

Took the red AND the blue pills
Member
Oct 27, 2017
36,194
What other field in which there are so many successful women are men very invested in? Other than the sex industry.
 

Fright Zone

Member
Dec 17, 2017
4,271
London
I'm a straight man and i'm just generally not a fan of sung vocals, I tend to prefer hip-hop, electronica, house/techno etc.
I like darker music, it just suits me more, i'm not a particularly upbeat/bubbly person and my taste in music reflects that.
Most pop songs tend to be about love and relationships too, often from a youthful perspective, which I generally don't find relatable.
Most of the pop songs that I do enjoy are from my youth, because they are tinged with nostalgia.
 

Xando

Member
Oct 28, 2017
28,035
Im a straight man and i do like some older (90s, early 2000s) pop music but i think most of todays pop is pretty bad.

You have good artists like Beyonce but the rest is pretty bad imo.


Dunno if it's because i'm getting older but i think a lot of todays pop artists also sound very similiar to each other.
 

bjork

Member
Oct 27, 2017
887
If it sounds good, I like it. If it doesn't, I don't. This isn't specific to any genre or artist, and even my favorites have made some stuff that doesn't click with me.
 

Zoc

Member
Oct 27, 2017
1,017
This is probably weird and going to get shouted down, but maybe for the same reason that a lot of men don't like sweet food or silky fabrics, but women do? Pop music has that same aesthetic to me.
 

Eidan

AVALANCHE
Avenger
Oct 30, 2017
8,688
I think a lot of men define their masculinity by their opposition to things they deem as being for women. They'll rationalize all day long, but in the end it really comes down to that.

I personally love Ellie Goulding.
 

ScandiNavy

Banned
Apr 13, 2018
1,551
Norway
I'm a straight man, and it would cost me zero man points to blast SNSD (thanks, PantherLotus )for me and my neighbours.

These threads points towards an overthinking OP, if anything.

And gay for playing the "wrong" music?
What is this, the 1950s?
 
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PrimeBeef

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,840
Where does kpop fit into this debate because kpop is lordly
Kpop and kpop are still pop music. It's literally right there in the name.

Most pop music does nothing for me. I'd rather listen to instrumental music in the jazz, classical, or contemporary genres. Every now and then I like something my daughter listens to, but for the most part, I don't care for it. It is not because of any insecurity or edginess, I love musicals and have been known to sing along to song for women aimed at men.

I am not hateful or dismissive. People love it and I am not on any crusade to get people to stop.
 

JealousKenny

Banned
Jul 17, 2018
1,231
What exactly qualifies as pop for you, it sounds like you are leaning toward Taylor Swift and Katy Perry type of music. As a black man I just can't relate to their music. I listen to Janet Jackson, Beyonce, Ella Mai, etc... and that is pop unless you consider that urban and it doesn't count for you. It doesn't get more pop than Bruno Mars and men listen to that.

You mentioned Michael Jackson so I'll say the majority of the black disco, funk, and R&B created by other artists during his entire run from Jackson 5 on was pop and men listened to it. Earth Wind and Fire, Cameo, Prince, etc... it's all pop. Going back further James Brown, Aretha Franklin, etc....its pop.
 
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KillLaCam

Prophet of Truth
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Oct 25, 2017
15,427
Seoul
I barely like bubbly entertainment in general, and definitely not music. I'm pretty sure I didn't even like that kind of music as a kid, it's always been annoying to me for some reason. The few pop songs I don't dislike are things I grew up hearing.

Definitely has nothing to do with it being "girly" though. Outside of Boy bands i never actually thought of pop music specifically targeting girls.



I think it's because I prefer music with minimal lyrics.


But Even if I was into that type of music, I'd never give something like K or J pop a chance though. I know too much about those industries to ever be able to like it.
 

Dali

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,184
I think you need to define the type of pop music you are talking about. I feel like you are specifically referring to stuff like boy bands and lady gaga which are marketed to women/girls and gay people. Im not a fan of either but not because of who it is specifically geared toward... it just doesnt sound good to me. Otoh, Michael Jackson was pop. Bruno Mars is pop. Cardi B is pop. I like the way they sound.
 

ahoyhoy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,327
A minority are motivated to do so by sexism, racism, or homophobia.

But I think for the rest it's just a cultural thing. They grew up being told to not enjoy pop music and so they in turn do not. Perhaps it's a strange masculinity thing.

Though I do think almost every man has a few pop acts they love, it's just the good majority doesn't seem to be their targeted demographic.
 

Deleted member 6511

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
432
I'm a straight man, and it would cost me zero man points to blast SNSD for me and my neighbours.

These threads points towards an overthinking OP, if anything.

And gay for playing the "wrong" music?
What is this, the 1950s?
That's my opinion as well.
I can listen some pop music, but mostly not. Nothing to do with masculinity or anything. Just do not like it. And I am aways trying new music (streaming services are a game changer)
 

nel e nel

Member
Oct 27, 2017
3,145
I worked at a major record label that had 3 of the biggest pop acts simultaneously at the time. I witnessed how pop music is literally engineered by a team of execs, stylists, marketers, directors and - oh yeah - producers. Then witnessing all the small frys copiously studying that method to replicate it in their bedroom studios hoping to strike it big. Our VP literally admitted that one of their biggest sellers couldn't sing but "the boys think she's hot so we ran with it."

I enjoy pop music, but when you've seen how the sausage is made it never tastes the same again.
 

h1nch

Member
Dec 12, 2017
1,909
I like pop music for what it is: Catchy-but-forgettable tracks that are almost always some combination of EDM + hip hop styles paired w/ some attractive vocalist.

What I cannot fathom is how someone can be *only* into pop music. Like how is that possible? That's like only being into MCU movies or something.
 
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Iloelemen

Iloelemen

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
1,323
What exactly qualifies as pop for you, it sounds like you are leaning toward Taylor Swift and Katy Perry type of music. As a black man I just can't relate to their music. I listen to Janet Jackson, Beyonce, Ella Mai, etc... and that is pop unless you consider that urban and it doesn't count for you. It doesn't get more pop than Bruno Mars and men listen to that.

You mentioned Michael Jackson so I'll say the majority of the black disco, funk, and R&B during his entire run from Jackson 5 on was pop and men listened to it.

I feel bad for not knowing Ella Mai, but Beyonce and Janet Jackson are pop to me.
Sidenote: I'm sad that Janet Jackson feels forgotten by today. Whitney songs (which I like) are still in the public consciousness but Janet classics have not so high streaming numbers. Janet is so highly influential, that even her influence is felt in modern kpop.
 
Oct 28, 2017
27,935
Most pop music seems shalllow and immature. It seems like teeny-bopper music which does not appeal to me. Not sure what being straight brings to the equation however, I do fancy some every now and again. I like Bruno Mars a bit but that about it.

And anime intro genre music, I like that often.
 

Carn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,112
The Netherlands
I worked at a major record label that had 3 of the biggest pop acts simultaneously at the time. I witnessed how pop music is literally engineered by a team of execs, stylists, marketers, directors and - oh yeah - producers. Then witnessing all the small frys copiously studying that method to replicate it in their bedroom studios hoping to strike it big. Our VP literally admitted that one of their biggest sellers couldn't sing but "the boys think she's hot so we ran with it."

I enjoy pop music, but when you've seen how the sausage is made it never tastes the same again.

As someone with label experience, I concur. It's a product; and the bigger the budgets, the more "designed-by-a-committee" it becomes.
That said, I do think that there are enough artists in the "pop scene" that are able to create an unique sound for themselves.
 

DryCreek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,987
Toxic masculinity.

That being said I don't like pop music either, Ive grown out of shitting on people that do like it though.
 

ninnanuam

Member
Nov 24, 2017
1,959
I like a great hook as much as the next person and but the "pop machine" kills any enthusiasm I might have pretty quick.

Styles are cycled in, interesting shit is ground down down and pulverised to fit. Then a million derivative acts seem to show up.
 

Carn

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,112
The Netherlands
but, personally speaking, I would classify my taste in music to be very diverse (from black/stoner metal, to minimal techno, and the occasional jazz and fusion), and I've always loved popmusic; and probably because of my childhood, I'm a big fan of 80's pop music. Personally, I never really cared about lyrics (no matter the genre), but I can always appreciate a well-composed catchy tune. And because of the amounts of money that is put into pop-music, sometimes the production is insane.

I think that next to some metal stuff, I mostly listened to CHVRCHES and Carly Rae Jepsen in 2018 :P
 

shaneo632

Weekend Planner
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Oct 29, 2017
29,383
Wrexham, Wales
Because straight men are rigidly told what is and isn't "manly" from a young age and it feeds into a lot of their formative tastes.
 

Mr_Zombie

Member
Oct 27, 2017
981
Poland
Why do you think there has to be any agenda behind this? Music is art, various people respond to art differently, have different tastes and that's it and look for different things.

I'm gay and I prefer rock/prog-rock music over pop. I also have many gay friends who dislike the whole diva thing and could give no shit about Lady Gaga, Madonna or what have you. Nothing in this is dictated by masculinity, lack of confidence or any other thing. It's just a taste in music.

Plus, do you have any sources proving your claim that straight men are more negative towards pop music than women/gay people?
 

Deleted member 2625

User requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
4,596
Some of it is at least a reaction to the crazy hyperbolic tone that pop fans take. "Bow down before the Queen", "greatest song ever in the history of music", and so on
 

Asbsand

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
9,901
Denmark
There's always been a vocal minority against pop. "Straight men" not liking pop is news to me though. I'm straight and I'm the only guy who don't listen to pop between my othet straight peers and everyone dances to it at parties. Don't know what it is about with female made music either?

Is that a thing now?
 

Kuro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
21,314
I enjoy plenty of pop music. I just tend to dislike popular pop music as I find it bad, stuff like Taylor Swift etc. Stuff from Carly Rae and Charli XCX is great though. Also severly dislike most Kpop especially male Kpop. Jpop used to be great but its getting harder to find good new stuff.
 
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