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Irminsul

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,060
This is what the Sol system would look like today in 2256, around the time of the episode.

Disgusting continuity error, the planets aren't even aligned when approaching/departing Earth. Noobs :P
eRCM4NM.gif
Just as an aside (and Discovery just adheres to the "tradition" here, of course), I always wondered why they didn't just set a course orthogonal to the ecliptic if you can't warp inside the solar system. Your way would be free from larger objects in no time. Oh well.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
The Breen fleet was destroyed doing so, which at least implies they tried to protect Earth.

Although I guess the Borg moved to Earth after defeating a fleet of 35 ships and all that was left to defend it was the Mars defense parameter... which consisted of like 2 shuttle craft.
It's more the fact that they were able to reach the Solar system during war time without getting detected and destroyed.
 

StallionDan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,705
I'm thoroughly surprised by this thread. I clicked on it expecting a shit storm of rage over the way the season ended. Me and the few people IRL I have spoken too thought the way the war ended was laughably awful. Like, I can't understand how anyone thought that was an acceptable plot.

If the federation had kept the detonator and told the Klingons to withdraw or else, then maybe it would have been convincing. But even then, the Klingons were in a position to take out Earth so not really at a disadvantage, and if it had made them back down it would only have lasted until they diffused the bomb on Kronos (whatever), after which they would have returned with a vengeance.

But giving the detonator to the Klingons?! WTF? "we could have blown up your planet but we didn't so please leave us alone" -Fuck off.

Why the hell would the klingons all unite behind the one outcast woman just because the federation gave her the power to blow up a planet? Would they have believed her threat to blow them up? It was such a crap bluff.

And even if the Klingons did go for it, the plot also requires for the federation to rely on this happening before giving up their advantage. How could anyone have believed this would work?

I honestly can't think of a less convincing plot in anything I've ever see, it's just completely stupid.


However, the acceptance in this thread is making me think I'm missing something. Am I?

If I thought the season good such a awful finale would have probably annoyed me, but it honestly felt like most of the season, a disappointment.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
Starfleet isn't a military they just fight wars a lot. Even during the TNG era you have.

Borg attack
Cardassian war
Border Skirmishes with Romulans
Conflict with Klingons
Dominion War

They have border conflicts with every race as well

They seem to like a good fight really
 

Medalion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,203
They aren't a Military in theory, but will rise up to the occasion to be whatever needs be to protect their borders and allies.
 

rancey

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
1,703
How are they not a military? They have ranks, orders, court martials, they fight wars...they do everything I'm aware that a military does. They're the military branch of the Federation.
 

JonnyDBrit

God and Anime
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,082
They aren't a Military in theory, but will rise up to the occasion to be whatever needs be to protect their borders and allies.

I suppose it might be arguable they're more of a self-defence force, perhaps? Like they don't have the authorisation or general remit to declare war, just keep their citizens safe.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
Couldn't the Romulans beat the Federation at the start of TNG?

Don't they have a big tech advantage at the start and everyone has to catch up
 

Medalion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,203
The mighty treaty of Algeron

Federation handy capped from learning/developing cloaking technology brah
 

Screaming_Gremlin

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
72
How are they not a military? They have ranks, orders, court martials, they fight wars...they do everything I'm aware that a military does. They're the military branch of the Federation.

In reality they are a military (or at least quasi-military), but they repeatedly like to point out that they are not one. Even in Enterprise Admiral Forrest seems shocked that they would invite MACO troops on the ship. "You feel comfortable having the military on Enterprise?"

I like to think the Federation just likes to send their best and brightest scientists out to die in their constant wars without calling it a military, so that they can act smug about it to their neighboring empires... and random time travelers from the past. "Huh, we defeated you in this war and we don't even have a military. *sniff*"
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
Romulans are so much better then Vulcans it's a crime we are always stuck with them and never get a Romulan on the winning team.

We got Garak for the Cardassians now I just need a Romulan who's a Jackass to everyone
 

Medalion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,203
In DS9, I think they wanted the Romulan liason who helped with the Cloaking device on the Defiant to become a series regular
 

Screaming_Gremlin

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
72
In DS9, I think they wanted the Romulan liason who helped with the Cloaking device on the Defiant to become a series regular

I like to pretend that Sub-Commander T'Rul was on the Defiant the entire time until it blew up. Just off screen.

Earth having a terrible defence system is pretty typical of the federation from what we've seen.

How can you disparage the mighty Mars Defense Perimeter!

EhG0WRR.png
 

JonnyDBrit

God and Anime
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,082
At least by the late 23rd century they have Spacedock (which was shown as under construction this episode). Of course, Earth just happens to get attacked by things that can completely overwhelm that too.
 

Joeytj

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,686
I'm thoroughly surprised by this thread. I clicked on it expecting a shit storm of rage over the way the season ended. Me and the few people IRL I have spoken too thought the way the war ended was laughably awful. Like, I can't understand how anyone thought that was an acceptable plot.

If the federation had kept the detonator and told the Klingons to withdraw or else, then maybe it would have been convincing. But even then, the Klingons were in a position to take out Earth so not really at a disadvantage, and if it had made them back down it would only have lasted until they diffused the bomb on Kronos (whatever), after which they would have returned with a vengeance.

But giving the detonator to the Klingons?! WTF? "we could have blown up your planet but we didn't so please leave us alone" -Fuck off.

Why the hell would the klingons all unite behind the one outcast woman just because the federation gave her the power to blow up a planet? Would they have believed her threat to blow them up? It was such a crap bluff.

And even if the Klingons did go for it, the plot also requires for the federation to rely on this happening before giving up their advantage. How could anyone have believed this would work?

I honestly can't think of a less convincing plot in anything I've ever see, it's just completely stupid.


However, the acceptance in this thread is making me think I'm missing something. Am I?

Lol, we didn't think much about that either, it's a stupid and lazy solution, but liking something it isn't black and white. There were good things in the finale and the season and other pretty bad ones.

But overall, most people have liked it and are willing to give the series a chance for next season. It also seems like the writers and producers of the show have the potential to create something great if they have more time and can now gauge the reactions to the first season.
 

JonnyDBrit

God and Anime
Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,082
That first tweet feels particularly important - it implies they seized and/or made a younger wing of the fandom, which is kinda key to the longevity of the franchise.
 

Soap

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,407
I really think we'll get some spin offs if all access subscriptions drop hard. I don't see Twighlight Zone carrying the weight Trek does.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
How about one that takes place on a Space station on the frontier of Federation space
 

Medalion

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
12,203
It would make sense that younger viewers would be more open to this incarnation, than older viewers who don't like change and are stuck in their ways.

Of course I defy that demographic but I am young at heart
 

Screaming_Gremlin

Self Requested Ban
Banned
Oct 28, 2017
72
But overall, most people have liked it and are willing to give the series a chance for next season. It also seems like the writers and producers of the show have the potential to create something great if they have more time and can now gauge the reactions to the first season.

I would agree with this. I had some real issues with this season, but overall it probably was the best first season of a Star Trek show since TOS. I hope now that they can make the show their own and not have to try and pivot off Fuller's ideas that they can do something interesting with it going forward.
 

Effect

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,945
As said I fully expect we'll get something in between season 2 and 3 going forward. They're likely not going want to have this gap they're going to have now. It doesn't have to be anything as big but just something that keeps people subbed or resubbing earlier if they do cancel.
 

StallionDan

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
7,705
Yesterday's Enterprise?

Different war and different timeline.

The Klingons shouldn't even get cloaking technology until Kirk's time, the Klingons and Romulans did an exchange of technology, Klingons got cloak, the Romulans got Klingon ship design (most notably the D7).

During the Fed-Klingon war there was no cloak.

Even says this on StarTrek.com, still

http://www.startrek.com/database_article/cloaking-device-klingon

"Similar to the Romulan cloaking device, the Klingons received this technology from the Romulans circa 2268, when the two civilizations shared a political alliance."
 

golem

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,878
I am down for some spinoffs and it makes sense if they are serious about All Access. I wonder if they would be set during DISC or in another time period... I think I would prefer a concurrent time period series at this point actually to flesh out the universe.
 
Jan 29, 2018
9,457
Weird All Access stats, I don't remember giving my age when signing up but maybe I did. I'm glad the show did well. Hopefully they forgive me for unsubscribing until season 2.
 

Effect

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,945
I am down for some spinoffs and it makes sense if they are serious about All Access. I wonder if they would be set during DISC or in another time period... I think I would prefer a concurrent time period series at this point actually to flesh out the universe.
I would expect something current so they could reuse the sets. Hell I'd be down for some slice of life to flesh out the universe as you said. It doesn't all need to be focused on Starfleet. In fact it probably shouldn't be focused only on starfleet.
 

Bob_Coffee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
682
Different war and different timeline.

The Klingons shouldn't even get cloaking technology until Kirk's time, the Klingons and Romulans did an exchange of technology, Klingons got cloak, the Romulans got Klingon ship design (most notably the D7).

During the Fed-Klingon war there was no cloak.

Even says this on StarTrek.com, still

http://www.startrek.com/database_article/cloaking-device-klingon

"Similar to the Romulan cloaking device, the Klingons received this technology from the Romulans circa 2268, when the two civilizations shared a political alliance."

im guessing that's going to get retconned into T'kuvma getting the tech from the romulans and installing it into the ship of the dead, and thats how the Klingons get the tech initially.
 

Vault

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
13,667
Different war and different timeline.

The Klingons shouldn't even get cloaking technology until Kirk's time, the Klingons and Romulans did an exchange of technology, Klingons got cloak, the Romulans got Klingon ship design (most notably the D7).

During the Fed-Klingon war there was no cloak.

Even says this on StarTrek.com, still

http://www.startrek.com/database_article/cloaking-device-klingon

"Similar to the Romulan cloaking device, the Klingons received this technology from the Romulans circa 2268, when the two civilizations shared a political alliance."
I wouldn't pay much attention to a promotional page that hasn't been updated in years.

It's never said in canon how they got it.

Romulans had Klingon ship designs because it was a 60s TV and they were trying to save money.
Romulans also don't have warp in TOS, and they fight a war with out ever seeing each other.

Every war meeting in DS9 has the Romulans shitting on the Klingons and calling them dogs, the idea that they used there ship tech is funny. Lots of things were retconed in TNG.

When TOS was being written they weren't thinking of the canon police, there's stuff that happens in TOS that retcons what happened a few episodes earlier.