NPD May 2018: State of Decay 2 #1 software, PS4 tops hardware charts

Loveless · Jun 21, 2018

SpartyCrunch said:
There is no such thing as "just Xbox" when it comes to digital copies of play anywhere games. So either you look at only retail (which is dumb), or you look at digital (which includes Xbox+pc).

Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

fiendcode · Jun 21, 2018

N.Domixis said:
Xbox gain momentum because ps4 isn't competitive with price. Imagine if every single deal was matched since day 1. Especially holidays where there have been a couple where they didn't even try.

There's still Switch, whose success seems entirely independent of the PS/Xbox tug of war. I just don't see a scenario where PS4 could come anywhere close to PS2 marketshare. Or PS1 marketshare for that matter, not at this point.

khamakazee · Jun 21, 2018

Derrick01 said:
Will it be what they actually want though or are they being groomed to accept it right now by MS, who's made gamepass such an attractive offer early in its life? That's a big part of the point I'm making, what's going on right now is the training part of the plan. Easing people into the idea of "renting" these games so they get used to it and don't care when it becomes the only option. Most people will just say "well I've been using it __ years already so nothing's going to change for me" and go about their lives.

Groomed? You can still rent movies and you can still go to the theater, all while Netflix has made some great TV shows. So tell me again how this fear mongering is working for you so far? You totally ignored how software sales increased, not decreased, with State of Decay which is on Game Pass.

Aquamarine said:
Back in the day (2006) we used to LAUGH at the Horse Armor in Oblivion and mock it to no end. Now DLC and cosmetic Microtransactions are so prevalent that they're almost expected by consumers. It's always important never to underestimate how publishers can slowly but surely change consumer narrative over time. That's why I stick to old games or complete games with zero microtransactions. The industry may have moved on, but I haven't.

Now at this years E3 there seems to be a wave to remind people games don't have lootboxes and stuff. The consumers are speaking out and some have listened. It's going to be a constant back and forth of what they want to try and get away with and what they can't get away with. This has also opened up the middle tiered games like Hellblade or the thousands of indie games out there. It's not like the old days, we have lots of choice now.

SpartyCrunch · Jun 21, 2018

Loveless said:
Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

But that defeats the entire purpose of NPD, which is to give the industry sales numbers from North America which are as accurate as possible. Not to give people on message boards fodder to argue about which exclusive sells the best.

The more digital sale information that's available, the better. Regressing and going back to retail only doesn't help anyone - especially not the industry members who pay for that data.

Skies · Jun 21, 2018

Prine said:
Gamepass means millions of players for first party games, thats guaranteed, it really is a stroke of genius. I dont think anyone could have predicted sales rising because of it though, that even shocked Phil lol.

It sorta makes sense when you look at it from the angle of SOD2 and Sea of Thieves being online multiplayer titles. The more players you have invest in those experiences, the faster word of mouth spreads. I imagine many consumers are buying the game at retail because their friend(s) are playing through gamepass and they want to join in. Also, I suspect some people are using gamepass as a trail period for a game, and proceeding to purchase the full title after their free pass is over or the month is up.

I would be interested in seeing what effect gamepass would have at retail on a strictly single player title from Microsoft.

Gotdatmoney · Jun 21, 2018

Derrick01 said:
Will it be what they actually want though or are they being groomed to accept it right now by MS, who's made gamepass such an attractive offer early in its life? That's a big part of the point I'm making, what's going on right now is the training part of the plan. Easing people into the idea of "renting" these games so they get used to it and don't care when it becomes the only option. Most people will just say "well I've been using it __ years already so nothing's going to change for me" and go about their lives.

Take for example Apple Music and Spotify. The ability to basically rent a huge ass library of music hasn't stopped music from being available for purchase digitally, physically, hell even on vinyls.

You're not going to see the ability to purchase games disappear even as rental and streaming services evolve.

SolicitorPirate · Jun 21, 2018

Tigress said:
Deserved though. I spent a lot of hours on that game.

Oh definitely agreed. I think I've clocked like 140 hours so far.

But as someone who started with the very first game and remembers how niche this series was in the West, it's still really incredible

Rainrir · Jun 21, 2018

khamakazee said:
Now at this years E3 there seems to be a wave to remind people games don't have lootboxes and stuff. The consumers are speaking out and some have listened. It's going to be a constant back and forth of what they want to try and get away with and what they can't get away with. This has also opened up the middle tiered games like Hellblade or the thousands of indie games out there. It's not like the old days, we have lots of choice now.

Nope. Maybe you weren't there, but the DLC "back and forth" was won decisively by the publishers and developers. They will also win the loot box "war", gamer rage is vicious but transient. Don't expect any meaningful change to come from that group of people, the pubs and devs will eventually calibrate their approach till majority of the folks buy in. This is after all entertainment, not life and death.

Indies don't exist for all but the most core of gamers. The system movers and multi-million sellers are going to be the AAA publishers, who continue to take a ever larger share of the market, and they determine what and how millions of game-playing consumers consume.

Gotdatmoney · Jun 21, 2018

N.Domixis said:
Xbox gain momentum because ps4 isn't competitive with price. Imagine if every single deal was matched since day 1. Especially holidays where there have been a couple where they didn't even try.

That wouldn't kill the Xbox One. You're talking about what would amount to a few million or so in sales. That wouldn't do anything relative to the PS2's level of dominance. And that ignores the Switch entirely.

Derrick01 · Jun 21, 2018

khamakazee said:
Groomed? You can still rent movies and you can still go to the theater, all while Netflix has made some great TV shows. So tell me again how this fear mongering is working for you so far? You totally ignored how software sales increased, not decreased, with State of Decay which is on Game Pass.

Gotdatmoney said:
Take for example Apple Music and Spotify. The ability to basically rent a huge ass library of music hasn't stopped music from being available for purchase digitally, physically, hell even on vinyls.

You're not going to see the ability to purchase games disappear even as rental and streaming services evolve.

Competition allows those things to happen in other industries. In the game industry everyone relies on Sony and MS and if they both go this route what are people going to do just not play games anymore? Go to PC gaming? They won't have any choice but to go with whatever those 2 companies decide to do. The all digital future will ensure all of the power is in their hands to do whatever they want with. Netflix has to invest so much in originals because other publishers either started their own services or made deals with a competitor. That can't happen in gaming unless they create their own consoles or find some other way to circumvent Sony/MS.

Gotdatmoney · Jun 21, 2018

Derrick01 said:
Competition allows those things to happen in other industries. In the game industry everyone relies on Sony and MS and if they both go this route what are people going to do just not play games anymore? Go to PC gaming? They won't have any choice but to go with whatever those 2 companies decide to do. The all digital future will ensure all of the power is in their hands to do whatever they want with. Netflix has to invest so much in originals because other publishers either started their own services or made deals with a competitor. That can't happen in gaming unless they create their own consoles or find some other way to circumvent Sony/MS.

What makes you think publishers are going to let an all gamepass world exist with no revenue sources beyond micro transactions? Without any sort of physical or digital sales to help mitigate costs you're going to see publishers either release way less games or go to other avenues all together.

You really are doom and glooming here. The ability to purchase a game isn't going to disappear.

Sherbert · Jun 21, 2018

Loveless said:
Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

Imagine being so upset about seeing a game perform well that you have to perform these mental gymnastics.

RexNovis · Jun 21, 2018

Loveless said:
Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

Games on Xbox have been outperforming the industry's average for digital share for a long while now. That's by design. The company has created lots of services, perks and bonuses that incentivize digital purchases.

The Windows Store on PC however has traditionally had terrible traction in the PC gaming market. (but perhaps thats changed more recently? I haven't seen anything that would indicate that) so the idea that somehow PC Windows store sales are inflating revenue figures is just absurd. The game sold well and sold REMARKABLY well digitally going by the difference in revenue between physical and digital rankings. There is absolutely nothing to indicate that any sort of major share of that digital revenue came from the PC store and not the Xbox platform.

khamakazee · Jun 22, 2018

Rainrir said:
Nope. Maybe you weren't there, but the DLC "back and forth" was won decisively by the publishers and developers. They will also win the loot box "war", gamer rage is vicious but transient. Don't expect any meaningful change to come from that group of people, the pubs and devs will eventually calibrate their approach till majority of the folks buy in. This is after all entertainment, not life and death.

Indies don't exist for all but the most core of gamers. The system movers and multi-million sellers are going to be the AAA publishers, who continue to take a ever larger share of the market, and they determine what and how millions of game-playing consumers consume.

Then perhaps you need to look elsewhere beyond the AAA landscape. If you truly expect your $60 to carry you like it did back in 1990 then you're going to continue to be disappointed. These games are now being made by hundreds of people, sometime multiple teams collaborating at once, that are often years in the making. It's also a market with very little risk taking. But as I said, we have more selection now than ever before and most of the games I play are smaller games on the PC.

Derrick01 said:
Competition allows those things to happen in other industries. In the game industry everyone relies on Sony and MS and if they both go this route what are people going to do just not play games anymore? Go to PC gaming? They won't have any choice but to go with whatever those 2 companies decide to do. The all digital future will ensure all of the power is in their hands to do whatever they want with. Netflix has to invest so much in originals because other publishers either started their own services or made deals with a competitor. That can't happen in gaming unless they create their own consoles or find some other way to circumvent Sony/MS.

I find it amusing how you think if one succeeds the other must fail. Game Pass is not here to erode how you buy your games now. You can't even counter the arguments I put forward, it's like you're just on your own agenda here.

Gotdatmoney said:
What makes you think publishers are going to let an all gamepass world exist with no revenue sources beyond micro transactions? Without any sort of physical or digital sales to help mitigate costs you're going to see publishers either release way less games or go to other avenues all together.

You really are doom and glooming here. The ability to purchase a game isn't going to disappear.

Welcome to the internet, a place where we can be as negative as we want day after day. All while ignoring how we actually have more options to buy our games, more options of how we play our games, and more options of what we play those games on.

Bran Van · Jun 22, 2018

How do preorders get calculated? Are they just put into first day sales?

Dave. · Jun 22, 2018

Bran Van said:
How do preorders get calculated? Are they just put into first day sales?

Yes.

shark97 · Jun 22, 2018

HstrangeDreaMs said:
SoT(incomplete game), SoD2(buggy game) and PUGB(buggy and lagging game) selling too well setting a bad tone and publishers will get away releasing broken/unfinished games more in the future promising they will patch in the future. Seems like gamers does not care playing these games especially on MS consoles (may be lack of exclusives?) and I hope other publishers or at least Sony do not follow these GaaS service trend and releasing broken games.

For 4 years of people calling Destiny "broken" or "incomplete" or "no content" or whatever because they dont like it, and myself playing 3000+ hrs of the broken non content game and mostly enjoying the hell out of it, I learned it's all total lies.

Toriko · Jun 22, 2018

shark97 said:
For 4 years of people calling Destiny "broken" or "incomplete" or "no content" or whatever because they dont like it, and myself playing 3000+ hrs of the broken non content game and mostly enjoying the hell out of it, I learned it's all total lies.

Destiny unlike SOD is mechanically competent though. SOD game feel is terrible.

SK4TE · Jun 22, 2018

JetSetRadio said:
Gamepass is the best review/demo you can have I guess but then again, why buy the game even if it's 30 bucks?

The best review to me is seeing pretty much my whole friends list playing one game. With an icon next to their name that lets you know you can join their game.

TheMisterManGuy · Jun 22, 2018

ZhugeEX said:
I can echo the above. Whilst Labo may pick up during the holiday season, I think it's fair to say it hasn't performed as well as many thought it would.
Granted, Labo is a bit like PSVR in expectation vs reality.

Nintendo did say Labo was doing well for them so far. It's clear they view this differently from their other products. The most important thing, is that Nintendo continues to market and develop it as a product line, and showing people why this is a good product around the holidays. Labo's problem at the moment is that it's not an easy thing to demo to the consumer. With a typical Nintendo game, running demos at gaming conventions and Mall tours is easy as all you need to do is sit people down and hand them the controller. Labo is completely unique from that. As such, it's needs its own specialized approach.

Kelanflyter · Jun 22, 2018

RexNovis said:
Hey MatPiscatella y'all track digital sales for Bandai Namco right? If so Dark Souls Remastered not being in the top 20 at the very least seems crazy to me. I have a really hard time believing it sold that poorly given the other metrics we have surrounding the game's release. Any chance you could comment on that at all?

Nevermind I just saw this

Thats nuts. Id have assumed it sold well enough with digital included to make it at least into the top 20. With it being a budget release I'm assuming it would have made it in to the top 20 units list at the very least if its ranked at 21 by revenue.

Switch version was delayed; maybe it would have ranked above otherwise.

Lolosgolos · Jun 22, 2018

Toriko said:
Destiny unlike SOD is mechanically competent though. SOD game feel is terrible.

Edit: Correction noted

Haven't played SOT yet

Prine · Jun 22, 2018

Toriko said:
Destiny unlike SOD is mechanically competent though. SOD game feel is terrible.

[redacted]

Edit. Ok, SOD & SOT mixup!

John Bender · Jun 22, 2018

Prine said:
This is nonsense, the sailing and ship battles are captivating, its mechanially brilliant. As a pirate, that's pretty damn important.

Wait. Isn't SOD State of Decay and not Sea of Thieves?
edit.
Ah. Saw the edit. now =)

Ge0force · Jun 22, 2018

Loveless said:
Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

According to Superdata, only 7% of Sea of Thieves players played on PC. It's very unlikely that this is much different for SoD2.

shark97 said:
For 4 years of people calling Destiny "broken" or "incomplete" or "no content" or whatever because they dont like it, and myself playing 3000+ hrs of the broken non content game and mostly enjoying the hell out of it, I learned it's all total lies.

And how many times did you play the same content over and over again?

TechnicPuppet · Jun 22, 2018

Loveless said:
Yeah I meant retail numbers only, and why would that be dumb? I know we necessarily wouldn't get digital numbers for Xbox but we could just add the regular 20-30% but that would give us numbers on how the Xbox version is selling and according to MagicPork and Aquamarine, it seems not very well, seems like PC carried the game.

Its not Xbox + PC its just Xbox.

Remo Williams · Jun 22, 2018

Gotdatmoney said:
Take for example Apple Music and Spotify. The ability to basically rent a huge ass library of music hasn't stopped music from being available for purchase digitally, physically, hell even on vinyls.

You're not going to see the ability to purchase games disappear even as rental and streaming services evolve.

Of course. Whenever the market opportunity exists, someone's going to exploit it.

Penny Royal · Jun 22, 2018

khamakazee said:
If that ever happens it is because that is what consumers are demanding. Your whole comment sounds like fear mongering. Instead of supporting another option to buy games and the success it brings you want to talk 20 years down the line and act like we are all doomed unless we sign up for Game Pass.

People often ask, why does Microsoft sell Xbox machines if they are putting games on the PC? Well month after month we continue to see high growth in console software that is also on the PC. Therefore there is still demand for console hardware, pretty simple. Right now there is still large demand for physical software for those consoles. So why would Microsoft ignore them any more than Nintendo just because Game Pass is growing?

Phil was surprised at what Game Pass is doing, it is increasing software sales through it. One is actually helping the other you think is going to go away. It's a total contradiction.

Derrick01 is quite correct in saying this may be the door opening permanent rental markets in gaming software.

Digital fundamentally alters how content owners & distributors serve their product to consumers, balanced toward the distributor/owner.

It also has little to do with consumer choice. Once you reduce or remove competing distribution channels consumers have no choice but to opt for rental to access content.

Of course if you don't care about owning things none of this matters.

Fafalada · Jun 22, 2018

fiendcode said:
It was really a masterful deathblow to GC/Xbox.

It forced MS into permanent money losing situation since they matched price immediately, but I doubt market share got any more lopsided as result.

That said it's obvious they're not simply chasing unit numbers this time around.

Spinluck · Jun 22, 2018

Has Zelda left the top 10 since release? This is going to be the best selling Zelda ever either way right? I'm also glad Tropical Freeze is getting another chance on a better platform.

I expect GoW to consistently do amazing all year long. I bought Detroit but I've been holding it off because I want to play it in front of my girlfriend so I can see her get shook by the story and hate me for all the decisions I make throughout the game lol.

Also from OP:

Switch Software sees strong growth: Nintendo Switch software sales in May generated growth of 90 percent when compared to a year ago, delivering the highest software revenues for any Nintendo platform in May since the Nintendo Wii in May 2011. Please note that The NPD Group does not currently track digital sales on Nintendo platforms.

Will the Switch be ok this year or is this just another fluke? :)

Looks like Mario Tennis is coming out at a great time.

Thorrgal · Jun 22, 2018

Do we have the split for SoD between Xbox and PC? How do those numbers compare with SoT?

I ask because SoD sold very well but it didn't move hardware units, specially compared to the units that GoW is moving, so my thinking is that it sold better on PC than SoT did.

TechnicPuppet · Jun 22, 2018

Thorrgal said:
Do we have the split for SoD between Xbox and PC? How do those numbers compare with SoT?

I ask because SoD sold very well but it didn't move hardware units, specially compared to the units that GoW is moving, so my thinking is that it sold better on PC than SoT did.

There's no split its one game on one platform.

Edit: Also the best May for Xbox One console.

KORNdog · Jun 22, 2018

Thorrgal said:
Do we have the split for SoD between Xbox and PC? How do those numbers compare with SoT?

I ask because SoD sold very well but it didn't move hardware units, specially compared to the units that GoW is moving, so my thinking is that it sold better on PC than SoT did.

SOD definitely seems like more of a "PC" kind of game to me. seems all you see people play on PC are survival games and BR.

nib95 · Jun 22, 2018

Do we have any numbers for SoD2, GoW or Detroit?

Thorrgal · Jun 22, 2018

TechnicPuppet said:
There's no split its one game on one platform.

Edit: Also the best May for Xbox One console.

But being your best May you're still outsold 1.5:1 by the PS4, in the NPD. Imagine WW, the split has to be 2/3:1, regarding hardware. So I thought the reason must be more PC sales

Why is there no split you say? they only count console sales?

KORNdog said:
SOD definitely seems like more of a "PC" kind of game to me. seems all you see people play on PC are survival games and BR.

Gotcha, so there's a split but we don't have the data.

SuikerBrood · Jun 22, 2018

Thorrgal said:
But being your best May you're still outsold 1.5:1 by the PS4, in the NPD. Imagine WW, the split has to be 2/3:1, regarding hardware. So I thought the reason must be more PC sales

Why is there no split you say? they only count console sales?

Gotcha, so there's a split but we don't have the data.

The Xbox version and the pc version are the same. So only MS can see where people play, but pc and xbox people bought the same game (digital only)

jem · Jun 22, 2018

Toriko said:
Destiny unlike SOD is mechanically competent though. SOD game feel is terrible.

Well that's a complete load of garbage.

N7_Angel · Jun 22, 2018

Damn Detroit success is huge, congrats to QD for the success of their best game ever.

Thorrgal · Jun 22, 2018

SuikerBrood said:
The Xbox version and the pc version are the same. So only MS can see where people play, but pc and xbox people bought the same game (digital only)

Yeah but those numbers exist, is just that they choose not to disclose it.

I mean if the month your exclusive game comes first on the charts your hardware comes last, that has to have an explanation.

We were saying that power doesnt sell consoles, games do, when GoW made the Pro come first on units sold

Now , power doesn't sell consoles but neither do games? What does MS need to do to win an NPD?

Edit: Another explanation could be that Sony had 2 games to compete, so combined they sold more, but even so there has to be something else.

Edit 2: Like someone said mb you need console exclusive games to sell hardware, but MS is goint into another direction and doesn't care if it sells hw or not as long as they get into the ecosystem

Xeontech · Jun 22, 2018

Gratz SoD2, GoW and Detroit.

PS4 and GTAV continue to blow through the forevers. Dam son

SuikerBrood · Jun 22, 2018

Thorrgal said:
Yeah but those numbers exist, is just that they choose not to disclose it.

I mean if the month your exclusive game comes first on the charts your hardware comes last, that has to have an explanation.

We were saying that power doesnt sell consoles, games do, when GoW made the Pro come first on units sold

Now , power doesn't sell consoles but neither do games? What does MS need to do to win an NPD?

Those numbers don't mean everything since it's Play Anywhere. Someone playing on Xbox day one could be playing on pc day two. I can also imagine the amount of SoD2 pc players is around 20%, but that's a wild guess based on Sea of Thieves and the success of SoD1 on Steam.

Saint-14 · Jun 22, 2018

Aquamarine said:
Microsoft exclusives include digital PC sales which are substantive. Lists leaked by people like Magicpork are physical retail only...which excludes a large part of the market for Microsoft.

Wait, digital for MS games on PC are counted in the charts? I didn't know that.

RexNovis · Jun 22, 2018

So uhhh methinks this Fortnite PS4 bundle that just leaked is gonna be mighty successful. If y'all thought Fortnite was doing a good job of pushing hardware before hooo boy

Astandahl · Jun 22, 2018

RexNovis said:
So uhhh methinks this Fortnite PS4 bundle that just leaked is gonna be mighty successful. If y'all thought Fortnite was doing a good job of pushing hardware before hooo boy

SIEA hates bundle with games.

THEVOID · Jun 22, 2018

RexNovis said:
So uhhh methinks this Fortnite PS4 bundle that just leaked is gonna be mighty successful. If y'all thought Fortnite was doing a good job of pushing hardware before hooo boy

Might be the worst time to be pushing that bundle with all the negative press.

THEVOID · Jun 22, 2018

Saint-14 said:
Wait, digital for MS games on PC are counted in the charts? I didn't know that.

It's the same code for Xbox and PC, so yeah.

Mory Dunz · Jun 22, 2018

THEVOID said:
Might be the worst time to be pushing that bundle with all the negative press.

does it matter tho?

THEVOID · Jun 22, 2018

Mory Dunz said:
does it matter tho?

No, not really. Just find it funny is all.

Zappy · Jun 22, 2018

Thorrgal said:
Yeah but those numbers exist, is just that they choose not to disclose it.

I mean if the month your exclusive game comes first on the charts your hardware comes last, that has to have an explanation.

We were saying that power doesnt sell consoles, games do, when GoW made the Pro come first on units sold

Now , power doesn't sell consoles but neither do games? What does MS need to do to win an NPD?

Edit: Another explanation could be that Sony had 2 games to compete, so combined they sold more, but even so there has to be something else.

Edit 2: Like someone said mb you need console exclusive games to sell hardware, but MS is goint into another direction and doesn't care if it sells hw or not as long as they get into the ecosystem

How do you know it didn't sell consoles? Given it was their highest May on record? What the PS4 sold relative to it is absolutely irrelevant as to whether a game is encouraging more Xbox sales.

I don't think you really get how this works. Their aim isn't to win NPD. Just sell consoles and games and services etc....

SOD2 sold best this month. It is a little surprising but then they made a game that appeals to the Xbox gamer. And also they have said that gamepass is increasing their game sales due to the viral marketing type thing it induces within the eco-system.

lost7 · Jun 22, 2018

Saint-14 said:
Wait, digital for MS games on PC are counted in the charts? I didn't know that.

Can someone in the know actually confirm this? Because if that' the case, I assume it would have been mentioned (even though I doubt the percentage of sales on PC would be that large)

NPD May 2018: State of Decay 2 #1 software, PS4 tops hardware charts

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