It doesn't matter either way. At worst the second act is a bit overlong but having seen the movie 3 times now it becomes less and less of an issue.man, canto bight last likes 15 minutes in an 2hour plus movie.
its not a "third" of the movie at all
Ah, the "you didn't get it" approach. Why can't people just think it's a mediocre movie with some incredibly dumb story beats?
No, see, the reason the Holdo Maneuver was never used before was because of the advanced deflector shield technology it had that made it possible!Ah, the "you didn't get it" approach. Why can't people just think it's a mediocre movie with some incredibly dumb story beats?
No, see, the reason the Holdo Maneuver was never used before was because of the advanced deflector shield technology it had that made it possible!
you'd know this if you'd read the novelization!
I wish we had gotten all the snoke backstory. Remember when they did that with Palpatine and it was soooooooooo good?
Hey now, it worked because no one in the star wars universe had ever though to carry out a sneak attack.No, see, the reason the Holdo Maneuver was never used before was because of the advanced deflector shield technology it had that made it possible!
you'd know this if you'd read the novelization!
The problem with this snark is that Palpatine was a perfectly simple to comprehend character based on context, while Snoak was just puzzling because we don't know where a second Emperor figure came from. However, this really goes back to one of the weirdest elements of TFA—that it doesn't give any real insight into its central conflict and leaves that stuff up to books to answer.I wish we had gotten all the snoke backstory. Remember when they did that with Palpatine and it was soooooooooo good?
Palpatine is one of the best characters in the prequelsI wish we had gotten all the snoke backstory. Remember when they did that with Palpatine and it was soooooooooo good?
I mean you're right because mostly I love what they did to Snoke.
But I mean come on.
Sheev and Palpatine stuff are easily the best parts of the prequels.
Hey now, it worked because no one in the star wars universe had ever though to carry out a sneak attack.
I didn't need the backstory, and I do wish it could have been improved, but I'll be damned if McDiarmid isn't an exciting villain!
The loss of life in the OT would have been significantly smaller had they just done this trick once, not to mention the unbelievably of not having auto pilot do this OR having droids do it.I didn't need the backstory, and I do wish it could have been improved, but I'll be damned if McDiarmid isn't an exciting villain!
Are we really asking why good guys don't go on Kamikaze missions? I'm pretty sure Americans could have done that in WWII, but they didn't.
I still don't really understand how it's a complaint. What should happen when a ship goes into light speed and collides with other ships?
So I assume this is another sarcastic take? Because the movie explicitly sets out why it worked in that one situation.Hey now, it worked because no one in the star wars universe had ever though to carry out a sneak attack.
The loss of life in the OT would have been significantly smaller had they just done this trick once, not to mention the unbelievably of not having auto pilot do this OR having droids do it.
See my above post making fun of this idea.So I assume this is another sarcastic take? Because the movie explicitly sets out why it worked in that one situation.
If the rebels had this tech and didn't use it to stop the empire/resistance then yeah, why not?
I think in time TLJ will be remembered fondly but having multiple directors is a recipe for these kind of tribalistic attacks. It introduces alternate timelines that'll make the Snyder cut pale in comparison.A film can be good/decent but also be the wrong film in a series of films.
Johnson needed to be given his own series of films or a spin-off that he could've made his own, this whole "relay race" style of storytelling is what the problem is.
So while TLJ isn't a poorly made film per se, it's also not the right movie to be Episode VIII.
If the rebels had this tech and didn't use it to stop the empire/resistance then yeah, why not?
I did, so the answer is "no" you missed the explanation.
Except that was the first movie of a trilogy. If he was ready what the hell he would do in the other 2 movies?
It is not good storytelling if the character reachs his destianation too soon.
Themes of growth and sacrifice is literally what last jedi do to finn. He is literally ready to sacrifice himself for a cause and then understands when to better use it
I can't really argue, because you're right that those things are subjective. I liked all of it, and I liked seeing a different aspect of the Star Wars universe that's not grinding poverty or military. If that stuff didn't land for you, I won't try to fault you for it.
Ive argued with virtually every explanation provided in plenty of threads. But go on and explain it to me what I missed.
Velocity impacts the crash. I also don't have any EU knowledge and would never use that stuff as a threshold to explain writing in the movies so no worries.How would that blow up something the size of a small moon?
ROTJ has a super star destroyer crashing into the Death Star and it largely does nothing. They only blow up the core to kill the thing.
EDIT: I haven't read much EU stuff in the explanation of what a deflector shield does and doesn't do. Most of the time I find it being technological jargon in the films and doesn't really ever mean anything.
Velocity impacts the crash. I also don't have any EU knowledge and would never use that stuff as a threshold to explain writing in the movies so no worries.
Ok so even if people can somehow justify why Holdo's kamikaze doesn't break the lore, can anyone tell me why she needed to be on the ship?
If you go back the impact was rather small in size despite being able to take out multiple ships in its path. On the super star destroyer it only cuts a wing in half.
The Death Star is the size of a small moon so obviously a lot of nerdy math would need to be done to figure out how far into the death star it would ultimately go and whether or not it would go all the way thru.
Basically I don't think it would be as wide spread of a use in the universe simply because it means destroying something of yours in the process and if it was regularly used both sides would be decimated quickly. It's probably a rule of war to not just let it happen.
You could use the same logic as to why we don't just drop nukes on every country that is a threat.
You certainly can have that view, but it's frankly rare that it's not the other way around, i.e., people seemingly not being able to understand what the movie is going for.Ah, the "you didn't get it" approach. Why can't people just think it's a mediocre movie with some incredibly dumb story beats?
If ISIS had nukes, they'd probably be using them. Also rules in war is just nonsense, especially when you're a resistance.
Ending wars quickly would be a net positive tho.If you go back the impact was rather small in size despite being able to take out multiple ships in its path. On the super star destroyer it only cuts a wing in half.
The Death Star is the size of a small moon so obviously a lot of nerdy math would need to be done to figure out how far into the death star it would ultimately go and whether or not it would go all the way thru.
Basically I don't think it would be as wide spread of a use in the universe simply because it means destroying something of yours in the process and if it was regularly used both sides would be decimated quickly. It's probably a rule of war to not just let it happen.
You could use the same logic as to why we don't just drop nukes on every country that is a threat.
EDIT: To pile on if the Rebels did that they wouldn't have people on their side for very long. Politics exist in this universe and a lot of people are happy with how the Empire run things.
She was going to abandon too but DJ shared the resistance plans with the FO. The escape pods were being shot out of orbit.Ok so even if people can somehow justify why Holdo's kamikaze doesn't break the lore, can anyone tell me why she needed to be on the ship?
Yup all of that was fantastic.Is this mostly about Luke? Because that and Rey/Kyle was the only part of it I enjoyed.
You seem to be having an issue with someone explaining things to you.
Rian couldn't figure out that compelling thing you all wanted so this was most likely the best option. Get rid of Palpatine 2.0
Yes your criticism of not getting what you want instead of criticizing whether or not the movie did what it set out to do.
I have stated problems I have with the film in this very thread, I don't think it's above criticism and there are no issues with the movie just with the people watching it but you have a massive misunderstanding of things in the film.
Snoke wasn't set up at all in the previous film with any kind of mandate, or crusade mission, or ultimate final goal. He ruled the New Order and was trying to get more sith (like every other big bad in the star wars franchise.)
Rian didn't create or come up with Snoke. He was handed Snoke and realized ugh... again?
I feel the way Snoke was used was hokey. I feel that Rian made him an Emperor clone at best (and even spectacularly failed to live up to that), when he didn't have to be. I don't understand why we can criticize JJ for his TFA retreads, but Rian's Snoke is magically off limits.
We realized Snoke was dumb in TFA and we wanted him fixed. We wanted "Yes, and" not "No, but"
If you don't have a misunderstanding of the movie your certainly have one on the sequence of events.
We don't know what a Rian TFA would even look like and whether or not it would contain Snoke.
Ultimately you'll never agree and I most likely won't agree with you either. We can move on.
Once again, you can like what they did with Snoke. But I don't have to.
They are not talking about the resistance (who did do the move.) They are asking about the Rebels.
And are you saying the Rebels are the same as a terrorist organization who has no regards to human life and would rather just have a society destroyed (meaning everything in the empire should be destroyed?)
None of the apologists have accounted for why half of the movie is a disjointed and pointless side quest.
and the final condescension. Your goal was to lecture me until I could "think right". You wanted us to agree. And you assume I wanted the same thing. That I wanted to lecture you until you agreed Snoke was mishandled.
I did not want us to agree. As stated before
My purpose was to make it clear that I (and others) can dislike how Snoke was handled in TLJ without being incompetent, uncultured, myopic, entitled or close-minded. If you can agree with me on this, then you are correct, we can move on.
Otherwise I will continue to defend myself when I'm called an idiot for not revering a messy movie
If you go back the impact was rather small in size despite being able to take out multiple ships in its path. On the super star destroyer it only cuts a wing in half.
The Death Star is the size of a small moon so obviously a lot of nerdy math would need to be done to figure out how far into the death star it would ultimately go and whether or not it would go all the way thru.
Basically I don't think it would be as wide spread of a use in the universe simply because it means destroying something of yours in the process and if it was regularly used both sides would be decimated quickly. It's probably a rule of war to not just let it happen.
You could use the same logic as to why we don't just drop nukes on every country that is a threat.
EDIT: To pile on if the Rebels did that they wouldn't have people on their side for very long. Politics exist in this universe and a lot of people are happy with how the Empire run things.
i think it ultimately comes down to whether or not youre just ok with not questioning the larger implications of actions like this in the movie and not being ok with that. The fact we have to get into the specifics about why this is or isn't problematic is why its an issue for some people. Ultimately if it didn't bother you or effect your enjoyment, I totally get why. For myself and others that sort of thing bothers us. I feel like that can break down the majority of fighting about the movie right there.Would it end the war tho? Just launching your ships into one another?
Wars can be messy and I'm not saying that people wouldn't resort to that from time to time. Just I don't think it would be a widespread thing that is the answer to ending wars in the universe.
Certainly I see your point tho that it seems like an easier solution than getting into a drawn out battle when you can just aim a ship at another and send it into hyperspace destroying the other completely.
I just think that there's probably some logical understanding between the beings in this universe that doesn't make it as big of an issue.
i think it ultimately comes down to whether or not youre just ok with not questioning the larger implications of actions like this in the movie and not being ok with that. The fact we have to get into the specifics about why this is or isn't problematic is why its an issue for some people. Ultimately if it didn't bother you or effect your enjoyment, I totally get why. For myself and others that sort of thing bothers us. I feel like that can break down the majority of fighting about the movie right there.
Ahahahahah oh man!If I need a +30 min explaining why this movie is rich in story telling it's probably not that rich in story telling. It's a garbage movie, don't understand the rabbid defense force here.
Disney is happy to announce, now on Disney+, "Snoke's Summer Adventures - A Star Wars Story", that details his growing up, his first love Cynthia, and his Quinceanera
Totally, were in the same headspace. And honestly this has been one of the best conversations ive had with someone who i disagree with about the movie while remaining civil and i thank you for that. Its been great.I think its great to have talks like that. It's the best part of star wars lore when something like this comes along. Does it work? Does it not? How does it fit in the context of previous battles and stuff.
It just kind of has a built in history thing to it you know?
For Marvel movies it's how the bits and pieces all fit together and mostly everyone is in agreement (who are fans of course.) But in Star Wars the lore is fun to bicker about.
I never thought we would both reach the same conclusion on this matter just fun to go thru the logic of it all, instead of you know trying to figure out the logic of Trump's brain.
You are just making up everything that I have said. At no point did I say you were anything except not understanding something like the sequence of events when it comes to Snoke.
You take what I said and then turn it into me calling you an idiot or dumb or whatever persecution you want to have in this scenario.
I think you have a vast mis understanding of how this talk is going and if you think that means your dumb that sounds like a personal problem to me.
How is that the fault of TLJ? Blame Disney/JJ for tricking you.This is some disingenuous shit tbh. I said I was hyped for a black male protagonist with a light saber. You tried to gotcha me with Mace Windu, who is nowhere even close to the realm of what could be considered a protagonist.
Totally, were in the same headspace. And honestly this has been one of the best conversations ive had with someone who i disagree with about the movie while remaining civil and i thank you for that. Its been great.
Snoke wasn't set up at all in the previous film with any kind of mandate, or crusade mission, or ultimate final goal. He ruled the New Order and was trying to get more sith (like every other big bad in the star wars franchise.)