Mr. X

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,495
Didn't think she'd be a good candidate anyway, this just makes my initial impression justified.
 

NoName999

One Winged Slayer
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,906
We can do a lot better than the person she's running against. And I personally find the prospect of the first trans woman in congress being a progressive important and exciting.

As I said earlier, I'm mostly concerned with her policy positions, not a random party. But you guys can pick candidates however you like. I think it's a mistake to tear people down this fast.

Wait you already think she's a better choice even though you know jack shit about her policies?

f5yiWCl.gif
 

Kitsunelaine

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Oct 25, 2017
6,382
Not trying to double post but is this serious? LBGTQ people do not have a hive mind and shock horror many either vote or support politics that go against their interests on some base levels, or indeed they don't think they go against their interests at all. Or don't care. Look at any African American republican, or people like milo or even Caitlin Jenner supporting trump.

I don't think we should talk about Milo in this way. Everything about his public persona feels like a fake constructed identity to "own the libs for generalizing".
 

Deleted member 1120

user requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
1,511
It's possible being with the alt-right and their stance on white supremacy is more important than trans issues.
 

House_Of_Lightning

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Oct 29, 2017
5,048
Are liberals really going to sink so low as acussing Chelsea of colluding with people who deny her very self and identity and most likely than not would like her dead?

Disgusting.

The reaction to Contra Points when she specifically went to a conference to confront the Alt Right was pretty disgusting, some of it mimicking the language that the Alt Right itself uses.

I wouldn't be surprised at any reaction I see to this situation.
 

sphagnum

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
16,058
What I'm mostly upset about isn't literally that Chelsea is a dumbass, because she's just one person, but that she's blowing it for all the causes that look up to her.

It's like if Bernie turned out to secretly be a Russian stooge it would have such a hugely negative impact on advancing more left wing policies, because people would just go "See?! You can't trust the left!". That's what's going to happen here.
 

Deleted member 2426

user requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
2,988
Not trying to double post but is this serious? LBGTQ people do not have a hive mind and shock horror many either vote or support politics that go against their interests on some base levels, or indeed they don't think they go against their interests at all. Or don't care. Look at any African American republican, or people like milo or even Caitlin Jenner supporting trump.

Her positions are not that, according to what she says.

If you agree she fucked up then what are you even arguing on this thread? Lol.

Whatever, just disregard my post. I had a knee jerk reaction due to my complete disbelief and disappointment that Chelsea would associate with these individuals.

What a shame.
 
Nov 4, 2017
2,203
Wait you already think she's a better choice even though you know jack shit about her policies?
I actually didn't say that. I said her candidacy is exciting, and I'm awaiting her revealing her actual policy positions, because that's what is important to me.

I also said being better than the guy she's trying to unseat is a pretty low bar to clear. He's one of the most unremarkable senators in existence with barely any accomplishments to speak of.
 
OP
OP
excelsiorlef

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
74,234
i'm curious if the popular internet folks who mischaracterized and lambasted contrapoints as "a traitor" when she debated against right wing opponents out of some misplaced "concern" that she would be unable to hold her own and end up providing ammunition for the alt-right are responding to chelsea in the same manner now

i don't know if this is a generalizable take, but my own twitter feed seems to be a poor showing so far

Big difference is the debate was public. Manning is hanging out with these people in private. Well that and one was a debate and the other was an escape room.
 
Oct 25, 2017
16,738
Any person that parties and hangs with ANYONE associated with the Alt Right is a person that shouldn't get to represent any decent folk. Plain and simple. Regardless of what good she did.
 

spam musubi

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,482
i'm curious if the popular internet folks who mischaracterized and lambasted contrapoints as "a traitor" when she debated against right wing opponents out of some misplaced "concern" that she would be unable to hold her own and end up providing ammunition for the alt-right are responding to chelsea in the same manner now

i don't know if this is a generalizable take, but my own twitter feed seems to be a poor showing so far

Contra debating and taking down right wingers isn't comparable to Chelsea partying with them. Maybe you should let go of your salt and think about the situation a bit more critically.
 

Deleted member 2620

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As I said in PoliERA:

Yeah, I'm not too happy about this. If she was palling around with, say, an awful but "normal" capitalist like Paul Ryan I would find it bizarre but brush it off as a quirk. There's no justification for trying to make nice with alt right figures.

Moments like this always hurt but you get over it and move on. A good reminder not to have heroes. History already steels you for that anyway.

Trust historic forces, not individuals.

Yeah, this is how I'm feeling right now.
 

Yams

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,369
Someone close to Wikileaks and thought fondly of by Russia is cool with the alt-right? Why I never...
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,705
Big difference is the debate was public. Manning is hanging out with these people in private. Well that and one was a debate and the other was an escape room.

yeah, and yet i'm (personally) seeing a lot more defense of manning despite the fact that contra was actively trying to do good in that case

though it could be a case of a poor sample set on my part

Contra debating and taking down right wingers isn't comparable to Chelsea partying with them. Maybe you should let go of your salt and think about the situation a bit more critically.

Is that how the new age escape rooms are solved these days? Through debate?

that's my point (though i think it probably isn't apparent what i think a "poor showing" is means to those not inside my head, so i'll make that post more clear)

from what i've seen (which could not be a representative sample), people who were harshly critical of contra seem to be either fully defending manning or being a lot more charitable - despite contra having the far more noble intentions
 
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Deleted member 2426

user requested account closure
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Oct 25, 2017
2,988
The reaction to Contra Points when she specifically went to a conference to confront the Alt Right was pretty disgusting, some of it mimicking the language that the Alt Right itself uses.

I wouldn't be surprised at any reaction I see to this situation.

I am not surprised either (because that's what liberals do: obliviously adopt messages and language from the far right to attack the left) but there's no denying here that this is a situation she shouldn't be involved in. She has the weight of a whole movement behind her that tries to resist liberalism and then she goes to party with neo nazis and ethno-statists. I don't have enough cynicism to defend her tbh.
 

Ketkat

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
4,727
Much easier to learn to tolerate it as a white person because you much more likely to have a trans or gay relative than a minority one.

That's not my experience with it all honestly. Like, I need to see some proof that the alt-right are actually not that hateful against trans people when literally everything I've seen is the opposite of that.
 

Jom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,490
i'm curious if the popular internet folks who mischaracterized and lambasted contrapoints as "a traitor" when she debated against right wing opponents out of some misplaced "concern" that she would be unable to hold her own and end up providing ammunition for the alt-right are responding to chelsea in the same manner now

i don't know if this is a generalizable take, but my own twitter feed seems to be a poor showing so far - what's the cause in the disparity of responses?
Is that how the new age escape rooms are solved these days? Through debate?
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,705
Contra is a youtuber, Manning is for the lack of a better phrase a rock star.
that's a good point - manning has a more "popular" personality behind her and is more consistently upbeat

and i appreciated manning's attitude a lot! i'm disappointed in seeing this, though i don't want to firmly draw too many conclusions beyond manning having poor judgement yet
 

Armaros

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,952
that's a good point - manning has a more "popular" personality behind her and is more consistently upbeat

and i appreciated manning's attitude a lot! i'm disappointed in seeing this, though i don't want to firmly draw too many conclusions beyond manning having poor judgement yet

Well considering she doesn't have any positions beyond 'law enforcement shouldn't exist'

There isn't much to go on besides her judgement and character
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
52,007
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.
 

Kirblar

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
30,744
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.
She didn't, a reporter covering the Cernovich party heard she was there and spotted her, getting quotes from people about her presence.

Chelsea then tweeted about "Crashing" it.

Then this picture from a month ago came out.

She wasn't making any noise about this event publicly till her hand was forced.
 

atimbre

Member
Oct 25, 2017
484
Yup, this is a bad look. Not hanging out with popular fashy kids is a low bar to meet, especially considering the positions she's claimed since being released.
 

CeeCee

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,118
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.

There's also the escape room she attended with them, which is rather harder to explain.
 
Oct 25, 2017
1,705
Well considering she doesn't have any positions beyond 'law enforcement shouldn't exist'

There isn't much to go on besides her judgement and character

i agree - she is a poor candidate

i wouldn't go as far as to label her as "white nationalist co-conspirator", but i think she is far more ambivalent towards social issues than she initially tried to present
 

L Thammy

Spacenoid
Member
Oct 25, 2017
52,007
She didn't, a reporter covering the Cernovich party heard she was there and spotted her, getting quotes from people about her presence.

Chelsea then tweeted about "Crashing" it.

Then this picture from a month ago came out.

Ah, well so much for that theory then. Malice it is, I guess.
 

The Adder

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,353
Can I pose two questions:

1. How many non-far leftist liberals have we caught hanging out with neo-nazis in their spare time?

2. Why the fuck does the far left find it so fucking difficult to say "we were wrong about this person" and cut them the fuck off without the constant need for equivocating and playing the victim? Because, in my experience, liberal shitstains get the boots put to them but quick.
 
Oct 25, 2017
11,972
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.
I thought her tweets came after other tweets revealing her to be at the party.
 

konka

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,856
I guess even Chelsea Manning cannot withstand the purity test of the modern left.

I'm mostly just awaiting her actually revealing some of her policy positions. But she remains one of the most exciting Senate candidates I've seen in a while. Already demonstrated great character and bravery.

She went to schmooze at a Nazi event.
 

Trojita

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,721
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.
She tweeted much later after the news broke she was there.
 

Miracle Ache

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,413
If you hang with Nazis, you are a Nazi.

She always seemed fake with her overly positive bullshit. A lot of people got played, and many won't even accept it.
 

xbhaskarx

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
5,143
NorCal
How does anyone involved with WikiLeaks (buddies with Putin, the alt-right, Nigel Farage, and Donald Trump Jr) have any credibility, let alone enough to be considered a non-joke Democratic candidate for the Senate?
 

House_Of_Lightning

Self-requested ban
Banned
Oct 29, 2017
5,048
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.


I just think she's trying to parlay her social and political capital into a position as a socialite.
 

Jom

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,490
Can I pose two questions:

1. How many non-far leftist liberals have we caught hanging out with neo-nazis in their spare time?

2. Why the fuck does the far left find it so fucking difficult to say "we were wrong about this person" and cut them the fuck off without the constant need for equivocating and playing the victim? Because, in my experience, liberal shitstains get the boots put to them but quick.
Because by nature us liberals tend to be bleeding hearts and want to try to think well of people.

I mean usually until they're going to escape rooms with modern day nazis anyway.
 

Tfritz

Member
Oct 25, 2017
14,616
How does anyone involved with WikiLeaks (buddies with Putin, the alt-right, Nigel Farage, and Donald Trump Jr) have any credibility, let alone enough to be considered a non-joke Democratic candidate for the Senate?

She says imperialism is bad (and it is!) and in many online circles that's enough.
 

tuxfool

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,861
This could be a case of Hanlon's razor. "Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't Chelsea Manning the one who revealed Chelsea Manning's alt right connection? She willingly and without prompt decided to tweet that she was "crashing" this party. If she was some kind of alt right or Russian double agent, I can't imagine the reason for her playing that card. At least not this early.
She isn't particularly bright or bestowed with good decision-making skills. But ultimately these Pied Pipers doing things for their own gratification or at the behest of others, makes little significant difference to the outcome. Gullible fools enamored with cults of personality at the exception of any reason will stir the pot in a counterproductive manner.