Narpas Sword0

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,090
Why does he say that reys story couldn't end in 8 with her knowledge of her parents? Why should that be an end for her? Maybe in this movie she could be setting out to define herself on her own terms instead of as she relates to other people/dead men.

Maybe a woman should have written this script.
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,511
It's not, though. You even have several people saying in this thread that the answers to these questions are obvious within the movie itself.

These lazy GoT comparisons are going to become the next "subversion" complaint, aren't they? Obnoxious.
I never really like that GOT meme, in the show the problem wasn't depicted that Dany forgot but that Euron is ridiculous good at concealing his fleet, same with 'themes are for 8th graders' it's clear GOT has themes, it just sounds like sometimes D and D are people and can sometimes say clumsy things. I always cringe at the attempt to make D and D look like complete untalented morons, I think they're just middling writers who sometimes get it wrong and sometimes get it really right, but everything on the internet feels exaggerated of course lol.
 
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DiipuSurotu

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
Him referring to it as an entity that is the source of all evil in the galaxy threw me off. Sounds less like a person and more like a thing.
Palpatine reveals that when a Sith kills their master in hatred, the master transfers their soul to the successor's body. The logicial conclusion of that is that every Sith from Darth Bane to Darth Sidious are basically the same soul transferred over and over to different bodies. So yeah he's Palpatine, but he's also more than that.
 

mbpm

Member
Oct 25, 2017
24,066
I could be wrong, but yeah that would be cool. Honestly him having Leia's would be incredibly meaningful as well, just in a different way.
Yeah thats why I was just wondering. If it was Leia's it'd be like him coming home, as Ben solo once again.

Similar, but slightly different.
 

Sacul64

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,828
I mean, you could say that second sentence of yours, but it would be in incredibly bad faith.

Did you really read the interview or are just basing your posts on forum hearsays? This is the quote:



How is that wrong? Jabba's palace isn't next door to Luke's farm. Tatooine is a big planet.

Is this the guy that said Luke and Leia were never on tatooine together?

And the part of the quote that I have seen "But, the twins never got to Tatooine together" makes your argument look just as bad faith to me especially after another poster replied to me that I was correct in what I said.

Think my original question makes it clear that it is something I saw here and was unsure about. Why is " (to visit Luke's childhood farm) " in parentheses?
 

gig

Prophet of Regret
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,291
Palpatine reveals that when a Sith kills their master in hatred, the master transfers their soul to the successor's body. The logicial conclusion of that is that every Sith from Darth Bane to Darth Sidious are basically the same soul transferred over and over to different bodies. So yeah he's Palpatine, but he's also more than that.

Ah, this makes sense and is actually really cool. Explains the reasoning for the Sith rule of two as well.
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
It's not Viserion's death that is the gravest offense of that quote, it's the "Dany forgot about the Iron Fleet" part lol. She would not forget. Her

military and political advisers certainly would not forget. I can forgive a lot, but the idea that ANYONE forgot about the Iron Fleet is absurd.

Rey being a Palpatine doesn't really bother me, tbh.

Right but it doesn't change the substance of the story. It just makes the characters look dumb.

That's different from themes being retconned.


I never really like that GOT meme, same with 'themes are for 8th graders' it's clear GOT has themes, it just sounds like sometimes D and D are people and can sometimes say clumsy things. I always cringe at the attempt to make D and D look like complete untalented morons, I think they're just middling writers who sometimes get it wrong and sometimes get it really right, but everything on the internet feels exaggerated of course lol.

People should really read that quote in context. They're making a joke. They've talked about the themes of the story before anyway.
 
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DiipuSurotu

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
And the part of the quote that I have seen "But, the twins never got to Tatooine together" makes your argument look just as bad faith to me especially after another poster replied to me that I was correct in what I said.

Think my original question makes it clear that it is something I saw here and was unsure about. Why is " (to visit Luke's childhood farm) " in parentheses?
Because the twins never got to Luke's childhood farm together.
 

WonkyPanda

Member
Oct 26, 2017
876
Terrio comes off very well spoken, thoughtful, and deliberative; it doesn't seem to come through in his actual scripts, though. I think he has really good talent there, but needs a bit more of a grounded director to really make him shine. Someone as entertainment focused as JJ or Snyder may not be able to really help him flesh out these deeper meanings and sub-textual inclinations in the script/film.
 
Nov 13, 2017
9,537
Maybe it's just me, but I in no way thought Rey was planning on living on Tatooine. The track name is obviously referring to the lightsabers and a play on "A New Hope."
 

Garlador

Banned
Oct 30, 2017
14,131
Yeah, did anyone even mention Luke at all? Or his sacrifice? Seemed a lot more like Lando rallied the galaxy, not Luke.
Lando kind of was the dude who saved the galaxy last time too, now that I think about it.
source.gif

tenor.gif


Sure, Vader tossed the Emperor off a ledge, but Lando blew up the Deathstar 2.0 and absolutely crippled the empire. Lando remains the MVP of the Star Wars saga... and those self-important Skywalkers just keep taking credit for it.

I'm sure they cast felt the same as us. They were excited until they actually saw the film.
Well, it's hard for some of them to talk about the film now....
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
Ah, this makes sense and is actually really cool. Explains the reasoning for the Sith rule of two as well.

I don't mind it a lot but it had already had a good reason.

"Two there should be. No more, no less. One to embody power, the other to crave it."―Darth Bane

It's Social Darwinism to the core. The apprentice proves worthy if he can kill his master and if he can't then he wasn't worthy that way each succeeding master and apprentice is stronger than the last.

This is transforming the Sith Lords into the Avatar, lol.

But hey, that just makes Anakin even more ungodly strong if he has twice the power that the Avatar of the Sith does.
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,511
Yeah, nothing in ROS is nearly as bad as "Dany forgot about the Iron fleet". THE IRON FLEET. Like, the ONE THING they are known for having is a FLEET lol
I don't think that was shown in GOT that Dany forgot, Euron was hiding behind some islands if I remember rightly, which I think is cheesy for a different reason, lol.
 

Deleted member 9100

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 26, 2017
3,076
There's absolutely no chance that Luke's sacrifice inspired anyone. They didn't come in last jedi and Luke's sacrifice wouldn't suddenly inspire anyone considering:

-No one would know who he is. Especially since he's been a hermit the past 15 years
-Only the first order and the remains of the rebellion saw it. Who is going to spread the word?
-Most of the galaxy has no idea the force exists and would think its nonsense
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,511
Right but it doesn't change the substance of the story. It just makes the characters look dumb.

That's different from themes being retconned.




People should really read that quote in context. They're making a joke. They've talked about the themes of the story before anyway.
Oh really? I mean Thrones series 8 had enough stupidity that I don't feel there's a need to misquote them, but that's just me going off topic. Sorry.
 
Nov 13, 2017
9,537
The best way to salvage this storyline, IMO:

1. TROS home release needs to be an extended edition. On Disney+ the same day it's on Blu-Ray so people don't feel as ripped off.

2. We need special editions of TFA and TLJ that alter some dialogue to drop more hints that tie Palpatine to the ST.

I would remove Kylo's like about Rey's parents selling her for drinking money (just keep the "they were nobody" line) and I would alter some of Snoke's dialogue to allude to something bigger than all of them.

Might even help to drop a few new voice clips during Rey's vision in TFA that hint at the greater storyline.
 
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DiipuSurotu

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
There's absolutely no chance that Luke's sacrifice inspired anyone. They didn't come in last jedi and Luke's sacrifice wouldn't suddenly inspire anyone considering:

-No one would know who he is. Especially since he's been a hermit the past 15 years
-Only the first order and the remains of the rebellion saw it. Who is going to spread the word?
-Most of the galaxy has no idea the force exists and would think its nonsense
-No, Luke was a hero well before TLJ. Even Rey who comes from nowhere knew about the legend of Luke Skywalker at the start of TFA. And he was a hermit for 6 years not 15.
-Both the First Order and the Rebellion spread the word.
-Which is why it needed the contribution of Lando to actually rally the hopeful.
 

Sacul64

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,828
Because the twins never got to Luke's childhood farm together.

Or it means its literally not in his quote and you made it up.

We absolutely discussed who would be there at the end. It's not as though those Force ghosts will never appear to Rey now that she really is the first of the new Jedi. I think she has all of those Jedi behind her. J.J. was pretty clear about the idea that he didn't want to take away from the moment of Leia finally appearing as a Force ghost and the twins finally being together. This might be in the novelization, but we talked a lot about how Leia lost her home. Alderaan is gone. So, she could never take Luke to see where she grew up as a princess, but Luke could've taken Leia to see where he grew up as a farmer. But, the twins never got to Tatooine together. So, the idea of seeing the twins together after the sabers are laid to rest felt like it was something that was very moving to me and J.J.

Let's pause for a moment. It's simply not true that "the twins never got to Tatooine together" since they're both on Tatooine in Return of the Jedi to rescue Han. If he means they didn't come to Tatooine together at birth, then yes, I suppose that's true. But bringing them back to Tatooine still doesn't make a lot of sense since we never see any affection Luke or Leia has for the planet. It's a homecoming divorced from the characters' desires.

 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,511
The best way to salvage this storyline, IMO:

1. TROS home release needs to be an extended edition. On Disney+ the same day it's on Blu-Ray so people don't feel as ripped off.

2. We need special editions of TFA and TLJ that alter some dialogue to drop more hints that tie Palpatine to the ST.

I would remove Kylo's like about Rey's parents selling her for drinking money (just keep the "they were nobody" line) and I would alter some of Snoke's dialogue to allude to something bigger than all of them.

Might even help to drop a few new voice clips during Rey's vision in TFA that hint at the greater storyline.
Oh no, please no. Don't change arguably the best scene in the sequel trilogy. The pandering looked bad enough anyway because fans couldn't accept a Star Wars character having a story without a secret backstory.
 

VeryHighlander

The Fallen
May 9, 2018
6,480
Rey being a Palpatine is whatever. It could have been a cool storyline if we had some good writers. But Luke and Leia "knowing" she was a palp the whole time is SO STUPID
 

Ushojax

Member
Oct 30, 2017
5,951
There's absolutely no chance that Luke's sacrifice inspired anyone. They didn't come in last jedi and Luke's sacrifice wouldn't suddenly inspire anyone considering:

-No one would know who he is. Especially since he's been a hermit the past 15 years
-Only the first order and the remains of the rebellion saw it. Who is going to spread the word?
-Most of the galaxy has no idea the force exists and would think its nonsense

The ending of TLJ is literally a bunch of slave children reenacting Luke's appearance as one of them looks up to the stars and dreams of becoming a Jedi, wearing a Resistance ring on his finger. So the word spread.
 
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DiipuSurotu

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
Or it means its literally not in his quote and you made it up.



From your article:

Speaking THR, co-writer Chris Terrio explains


*clicks the link on "THR"* (which is literally the same link as in the opening post of this thread)

But, the twins never got to Tatooine together (to visit Luke's childhood farm).


So you seriously accusing me of making up an article on The Hollywood Reporter? How does that even work? I hacked The Hollywood Reporter?? wtf
 

The Unsent

Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,511
Rey being a Palpatine is whatever. It could have been a cool storyline if we had some good writers. But Luke and Leia "knowing" she was a palp the whole time is SO STUPID
Nah it was just fucking awful lol, the reveal is TLJ was so heartbreaking and provocative, and the last scene with a nobody kid can be a jedi was sweet, but it was like too profound so they had to fall over trying to bring in the dark family twist.

If ROTJ was made in the days of the internet, I guessthey would have done the opposite, the vader revelation went against was Obi Wan said, so they would retcon it in ROTJ and say well technically he is your father, he was the priest on Tatooine and it's actually worse, Vader didn't just kill your father Anakin, he murdered your little brothers as well. And it just feels even more stupid and unnecessary. They should have committed to the momentum of the story IMO.
 

Sacul64

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,828
From your article:




*clicks the link on "THR"* (which is literally the same link as in the opening post of this thread)




So you seriously accusing me of making up an article on The Hollywood Reporter? How does that even work? I hacked The Hollywood Reporter?? wtf

Yes because the bit in parenthesis is not part of the quote and was added by the writer of your article which is why I asked why is that part in parenthesis and why the article I posted did not have that as it is THRs commentary on the quote.

When writers insert or alter words in a direct quotation, square brackets—[ ]—are placed around the change. The brackets, always used in pairs, enclose words intended to clarify meaning, provide a brief explanation, or to help integrate the quote into the writer's sentence.
 

Deleted member 16365

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,127
"why didn't Luke realize he was training the greatest Sith in the galaxy's granddaughter?" "Hey look over there!"
 

Surfinn

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
28,590
USA
Lol. I like that Finn is basically just an anthropomorphized Fitbit for Rey.

JJ has now helmed two projects where the lead black character spends the majority of their screen time yelling another characters name.

"WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLTTTTTT!!!!!!"

"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEYYYYYYYY!!!!!!"

Like did Finn yell Rey once in TLJ?


Oh my god
 

Neece

Member
Oct 27, 2017
9,231
These explanations just make me dislike the movie more. They made some horrible decisions.
 
Oct 26, 2017
20,440


Okay, so why is Sheev's child anything like this.

The entire sequel trilogy hinges on Sheev's child doing a bunch of really weird things.
 

WonkyPanda

Member
Oct 26, 2017
876
That Andrew Todd remark is pretty stupid. First off, what Rey wanted most was not "to not be alone" but to know her place. She literally lives alone on Jakku. What fuels her desire through the films isn't, "I don't want to be alone anymore," it's "I want to know where I belong/who I am."

Secondly, how anyone interprets that she's "alone" in the end is beyond me. She's not alone, not anymore. She's found her place. She has her friends. She has her (new) family. Simply because Luke and Leia are not with her does not mean she's "alone" in a thematic sense. She's very much in a significantly better place than when she left Jakku. Somehow roping "crushing isolationism" into it reeks as another "gotcha, hot-take" snipe at JJ for no reason.
 
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DiipuSurotu

DiipuSurotu

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
53,148
That Andrew Todd remark is pretty stupid. First off, what Rey wanted most was not "to not be alone" but to know her place. She literally lives alone on Jakku. What fuels her desire through the films isn't, "I don't want to be alone anymore," it's "I want to know where I belong/who I am."

Secondly, how anyone interprets that she's "alone" in the end is beyond me. She's not alone, not anymore. She's found her place. She has her friends. She has her (new) family. Simply because Luke and Leia are not with her does not mean she's "alone" in a thematic sense. She's very much in a significantly better place than when she left Jakku. Somehow roping "crushing isolationism" into it reeks as another "gotcha, hot-take" snipe at JJ for no reason.
He's speaking in the context of the idea that Rey would be settling on Tatooine to live alone on Owen's farm (an idea which Terrio clarifies is incorrect: she isn't settling on that farm).
 

RedMercury

Blue Venus
Member
Dec 24, 2017
17,777
Maybe having a quick scene where people from around the galaxy are hearing the story of Luke Skywalker and then running to their ships or something would have been prudent.
 

Lunar Wolf

Banned
Nov 6, 2017
16,237
Los Angeles
In isolation, maybe, but man how much of the film felt like responding to forum posts? It's hard to believe this was their best creative choices.

It's JJ maybe he just has ideas that are more in touch with that side of the fandom. I believe it. He doesn't want to grow Star Wars outside of what he thinks it was when he watched when he was 11.
 

WonkyPanda

Member
Oct 26, 2017
876
He's speaking in the context of the idea that Rey would be settling on Tatooine to live alone on Owen's farm (an idea which Terrio clarifies is incorrect: she isn't settling on that farm).
Let me entertain that for a second. We are to assume that, with all contextual cues taken into account (her having the falcon, having BB-8, her seeing her new family, her smile and response of her new found place in the galaxy (i.e., being a Skywalker and the new Jedi)), that Rey at the end on Tatooine is "far from hopeful"? I can't even give that the benefit of the doubt.

EDIT: Lest we forget the iconography behind the hopeful stare into the twin suns of tatooine.
 

John Harker

Knows things...
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,432
Santa Destroy
Lol. I like that Finn is basically just an anthropomorphized Fitbit for Rey.

JJ has now helmed two projects where the lead black character spends the majority of their screen time yelling another characters name.

"WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAALLLLLLLTTTTTT!!!!!!"

"REEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEYYYYYYYY!!!!!!"

Like did Finn yell Rey once in TLJ?



I'm not knocking, but have you been in love before? Because that's pretty much how I sound all the time when my wife does something dangerous