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FINAL FANTASY VII REBIRTH - Spoiler Thread

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Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
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dglavimans said:
What I think yeah, and I do kinda get the why but I don't know in all the others I can kinda shove if on real Cloud shining thru. With Tifa date I feel because their connection is so deep rooted there is too many things unresolved for it to make sense right now and it kinda hurts the highwind?

Like, we kinda get the whole game placing distrust towards Tifa really, the boat scene 'don't let her fool you', the one where he almost slashed her dead.. they just had some sort of progression in that talk afterwards


Yeah they are full of fanservice that totally but for me at least all make some logical sense for it to warrant the fanservice.

Barret the dyne stuff with Cloud,
Yuffie and Cloud is just Yuffie calling her out and Cloud being big bro
Nanaki with the paw which was set up bit earlier in the game
Aerith where setting straight it's not about Cloud being Zack but Cloud being Cloud

With Tifa tho.. idk idk..

At the end they are all fan service ofc and the devs said as much, but at least for Tifa and Cloud there is so much left to discuss and do before we could have gotten to a kiss imo. I know it's not romantic at all but I really would have preferred them hugging and saying they will work thru this together and saving the kiss or something.
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At the end you are all right ofc the dates are fan service and fans have been waiting loooong for this moment. So might be just be me overthinking, but a first time kiss you can only do once. And it is now in an optional scene. And idk..
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Eh its not like they didn't almost kiss in both Remake and right after Gongaga in Rebirth.

The physical chemistry has been there from the start so it didn't feel out there so much as Cloud's confidence in the scene was surprising. The scene was them resolving some of that sexual tension that had been building up. Although tension in general is a lot higher at the end of Rebirth between the two with Cloud brusquely brushing off Aerith's death in his denial.

This also reminds me that they chased the T rating for fuck all considering the sales drop. They really should just go for the M rating for part 3 so they don't have to censor or hold themselves back on a bunch of stuff. Really odd decision from them.
 
dglavimans

dglavimans

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Nov 13, 2019
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Kuro said:
Eh its not like they didn't almost kiss in both Remake and right after Gongaga in Rebirth.

The physical chemistry has been there from the start so it didn't feel out there so much as Cloud's confidence in the scene was surprising. The scene was them resolving some of that sexual tension that had been building up. Although tension in general is a lot higher at the end of Rebirth between the two with Cloud brusquely brushing off Aerith's death in his denial.

This also reminds me that they chased the T rating for fuck all considering the sales drop. They really should just go for the M rating for part 3 so they don't have to censor or hold themselves back on a bunch of stuff. Really odd decision from them.
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Can I say I would really have prefered it to be at Gongaga then as it's not optional? But then again it also doesn't really feel okay with the heartfelt talk they just had.. ugh

Idk. That sexual tension was building up but idk if that was the right scene to resolve it honestly at the Saucer

It just feels too big for me this one to be optional. Cause a big part of Tifa and Clouds dynamic from what I see from fans is them being bonded since childhood. That is a lot of years and it's one of the bigger story beats in the game their relationship/dynamic.

I fell a few days ago about the optional stuff and was corrected validly on it being not that important story beats. but on this one I stand a bit more firm that I believe it shouldn't have been optional by how important it is, a first kiss is a first kiss and is now given.
 
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hydrophilic attack

hydrophilic attack

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dglavimans said:
From an outsider pov where it feels like the game actively tries the whole love triangle it does feel weird for me Tifa gets the kiss in the Saucer scene. It feels like a payoff for under the highwind rather then something here already.

Where the game then afterwards gets very Cloud/Aerith focused because… Well, Aerith dies and we get that closure date :')

Giving what the fans want I guess.. But logically it doesn't make very much sense to me personally because.. Cloud and Tifa didn't really get intimate like that before and the highwind kinda is a scene of two lovers first time together? Which.. Happened now. Before both really had any resolve in personal issues within themselves or against each other

In an optional scene even

I guess the highwind still has the first time Tifa and Cloud have had the good talk in LS and real Cloud is there tho fully

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It's the one date which kinda felt weird to me in which stuff shot from 0 to 100 with too much unresolved stuff going on between the two. Which might be simply because i'm kinda asexual in that sense, kiss can happen anytime I guess?
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they may do more than kiss under the highwind
 
MegaSackman

MegaSackman

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Oct 27, 2017
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Wait, people believe that Cloud and Tifa's kiss was out of nowhere? Really? I guess you went to the kitchen for a sandwhich in... Multilple scenes since Remake.
 
Mephissto

Mephissto

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Mar 8, 2024
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Uzumaki Goku said:
Just beat it.

So… Aerith and Sephiroth are playing chess against each other?

I have no idea what just happened
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Yeah, kinda. They are both manipulating the stuff that happens in the game, move the white/black materia around etc.

The currently "most accepted" theory is that Aerith died though and that Cloud is delusional about it. Only he is seeing Aerith in the end while the rest of the party doesn't. He is basically seeing Aerith from the Lifestream and thinks she is actually there. So when he realizes in P3 that he actually lost her his breakdown will hit even harder.

What exactly happened when Cloud parried the Masamuke is not clear. It is possible that Aerith "survived" in one of the doomed pocket dimensions through Cloud's actions and that will play a role later. It could be that Cloud only imagined saving her. It could be that Cloud did save her but since Sephiroth is merging worlds she died regardless.

Basically nobody knows :P
 
dglavimans

dglavimans

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hydrophilic attack said:
they may do more than kiss under the highwind
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Well. Probably that is what the OG implied anyway

But that is not what I mean. It's the first time they resolve this sexual tension that has been building as another poster say. It's a big payoff in their dynamic since childhood even, cause they never ever kissed, at an optional scene

MegaSackman said:
Wait, people believe that Cloud and Tifa's kiss was out of nowhere? Really? I guess you went to the kitchen for a sandwhich in... Multilple scenes since Remake.
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Not my point it's out of nowhere, my point it's too important of a payoff to have as optional

Uzumaki Goku said:
I am so glad getting the alternate date scenes is so much easier than Remake
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Sure, and I gladly accept that with the other dates. But for the whole Cloud and Tifa dynamic I would have wanted it as non optional myself
 
hydrophilic attack

hydrophilic attack

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dglavimans said:
But that is not what I mean. It's the first time they resolve this sexual tension that has been building as another character say. It's a big payoff in their dynamic cause they never ever kissed, at an optional scene
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having it be optional is kind of in the spirit of the original, because the way the highwind scene plays out in the original is determinant on your relationship score with tifa
 
dglavimans

dglavimans

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Nov 13, 2019
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MegaSackman said:
Well they did say the dates are kinda non canon or something like that.
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Which seems fair with every other date for me too tbf but with this particular one it feels too much as a big payoff moment to not entertain the idea it's too big

hydrophilic attack said:
having it be optional is kind of in the spirit of the original, because the way the highwind scene plays out in the original is determinant on your relationship score with tifa
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It is? I need to look up what is different cause I got the whole scene thing and when I went back Cid or something joking what they where doing there? Or something along those lines
 
hydrophilic attack

hydrophilic attack

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dglavimans said:
It is? I need to look up what is different cause I got the whole scene thing and when I went back Cid or something joking what they where doing there? Or something along those lines
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if your relationship score with tifa is high, she becomes very embarrassed when she finds out the other people stayed as well, whereas otherwise she shrugs it off
 
Uzumaki Goku

Uzumaki Goku

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Mephissto said:
Yeah, kinda. They are both manipulating the stuff that happens in the game, move the white/black materia around etc.

The currently "most accepted" theory is that Aerith died though and that Cloud is delusional about it. Only he is seeing Aerith in the end while the rest of the party doesn't. He is basically seeing Aerith from the Lifestream and thinks she is actually there. So when he realizes in P3 that he actually lost her his breakdown will hit even harder.

What exactly happened when Cloud parried the Masamuke is not clear. It is possible that Aerith "survived" in one of the doomed pocket dimensions through Cloud's actions and that will play a role later. It could be that Cloud only imagined saving her. It could be that Cloud did save her but since Sephiroth is merging worlds she died regardless.

Basically nobody knows :P
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So was this the first Avatar bet thread to end with no one winning since it's ambiguous? Lol
 
Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
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I think its clear someone at CS1 is terrified of explicitly showing that type of intimacy during canon non-optional scenes. It will always just tip toe the line and leave it up to the player if they want to go all the way (although only one character gets that option in the OG). They will continue to leave things vague enough for enough doubt to avoid getting harassed - which leads to the hilarity of Advent Children where Cloud and Tifa are essentially married with children but they had to be wink wink about it.

This wasn't a problem with FFX which also had an affection system. Kitase, Toriyama, and Nojima were involved with both games and in X as producer, director, and writer but there's one person who had less involvement outside of character design who has a lot more involvement in the VII project. That same person directed Advent Children. I wonder who it could be...

KH2 was the same silliness with metaphors about Tifa being Cloud's "light" and how he must defeat Sephiroth in an emo solo fight before he can return to her.

Maybe part 3 they will go all out finally. Kitase keeps saying he wants it to be the definitive end. They don't have all that much to lose considering the game could be on track to sell even worse than Rebirth if its still tied up in an exclusivity contract.
 
SweetJohnnyCage

SweetJohnnyCage

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Nov 13, 2017
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Was going through the game on hard mode and noticed that the clocks in the terrier universe have no hands. Has this been discussed before?

gtgHLKM.jpeg


ro5uucv.jpeg
 
Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
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It would be funny if it was just the general bad asset quality/geometry squash that Remake's custom UE4 does instead of meaning anything lol
 
SweetJohnnyCage

SweetJohnnyCage

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Nov 13, 2017
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Zoe said:
I wanna say people have found clocks in Beagle that didn't have hands either...
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Yea now I gotta check all the damn clocks. I know the big clock in the haunted hotel has hands, but never actually looked at a desk clock before. Might even be time to fire up Remake to see if these are reused assets in Aerith's house.

Kuro said:
It would be funny if it was just the general bad asset quality/geometry squash that Remake's custom UE4 does instead of meaning anything lol
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I swear that door better appear in the credits of Part 3.
 
Uzumaki Goku

Uzumaki Goku

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So they kinda shut down the whole "Aerith is Zack's girl" since Zack is supportive of Aerith liking Cloud
 
SweetJohnnyCage

SweetJohnnyCage

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Uzumaki Goku said:
So they kinda shut down the whole "Aerith is Zack's girl" since Zack is supportive of Aerith liking Cloud
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TBF, Zack went missing for 5 years and was presumed dead by Aerith. I'm only halfway through on this playthrough so I can't remember if he even addresses them being together, but I imagine he's really confused since, to his knowledge, Cloud has been with him the entire time.
 

Slacker247

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Oct 27, 2017
4,074
Freaking what, I have to do the crap mini games on Hard just to unlock Zack VR missions. F-ing what? Just let me have the Hard mode instead of the Rank I-III crap. Seriously made me switch the game off with that rubbish.
 
Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
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Uzumaki Goku said:
So they kinda shut down the whole "Aerith is Zack's girl" since Zack is supportive of Aerith liking Cloud
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That doesn't shut down anything. It just shows what a good guy Zack is. We still haven't got a direct scene with Zack and Aerith in the Remake project. We still don't actually know Aerith's inner thoughts about all this other then Tifa mentioning "its complicated" and Aerith still looking for Zack in Gongaga (or in Cloud) or having a very particular reaction on the boat ride in Cosmo Canyon.

I think they have been laying the groundwork for an emotional reunion of sorts there.

edit: I mean damn even Marlene says "its because you weren't there" as silly as it is that they used Marlene for that whole ridiculous exposition dump.
 
Uzumaki Goku

Uzumaki Goku

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Kuro said:
That doesn't shut down anything. It just shows what a good guy Zack is. We still haven't got a direct scene with Zack and Aerith in the Remake project. We still don't actually know Aerith's inner thoughts about all this other then Tifa mentioning "its complicated" and Aerith still looking for Zack in Gongaga (or in Cloud) or having a very particular reaction on the boat ride in Cosmo Canyon.

I think they have been laying the groundwork for an emotional reunion of sorts there.

edit: I mean damn even Marlene says "its because you weren't there" as silly as it is that they used Marlene for that whole ridiculous exposition dump.
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Well, in that book set after Aerith dies, they do have a reunion and it says Aerith loves Cloud more than she ever loved Zack.
 
Zoe

Zoe

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Oct 25, 2017
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Kuro said:
edit: I mean damn even Marlene says "its because you weren't there" as silly as it is that they used Marlene for that whole ridiculous exposition dump.
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That's just a throwaway dad joke, BTW (literally: he didn't see it because he wasn't there to see it). Each localization did something different.

In Japanese it's something like,

Zack: You mean like, <wolf whistle>?
Marlene: <wolf whistle!>
 
Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
21,157
Zoe said:
That's just a throwaway dad joke, BTW (literally: he didn't see it because he wasn't there to see it). Each localization did something different.

In Japanese it's something like,

Zack: You mean like, <wolf whistle>?
Marlene: <wolf whistle!>
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That's a ridiculous translation change. Either way, Zack being the good person he is doesn't shut down anything when we still don't really get Aerith's side of things and all the ambiguity around her talking about different type of "liking" among all the other strange stuff like the final "date" being a retread of the one she had with Zack.
 
Kuro

Kuro

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Oct 25, 2017
21,157
Uzumaki Goku said:
Well, in that book set after Aerith dies, they do have a reunion and it says Aerith loves Cloud more than she ever loved Zack.
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Oh boy not that book again. I would not take that nonsense as canon. It was written by someone from the walkthrough book company that had nothing to do with the original game's production.

That same one wrote Zack like a fucking weirdo. They also wrote Aerith like a weepy pathetic damsel in distress too.
 
ScOULaris

ScOULaris

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Oct 25, 2017
9,862
Just finished it. Overall I really liked it and was often astounded by how well they pulled off the PS1-era scale but with AAA presentation here, but damn if the story didn't really drop the ball.

I mean even in totality the whole story is a mess of sloppy multiverse logic with abhorrent pacing, and I can't stand the way Sephiroth is portrayed and utilized here. I legitimately don't like him as a villain in this Remake trilogy.

But that ending... I can't believe they kept Aerith's death intact but managed to completely sap it of all the impact it had in the original. Just a really deflating ending that I'll admit did sour the overall experience a bit for me.
 

Spagward

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Apr 24, 2024
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ScOULaris said:
Just finished it. Overall I really liked it and was often astounded by how well they pulled off the PS1-era scale but with AAA presentation here, but damn if the story didn't really drop the ball.

I mean even in totality the whole story is a mess of sloppy multiverse logic with abhorrent pacing, and I can't stand the way Sephiroth is portrayed and utilized here. I legitimately don't like him as a villain in this Remake trilogy.

But that ending... I can't believe they kept Aerith's death intact but managed to completely sap it of all the impact it had in the original. Just a really deflating ending that I'll admit did sour the overall experience a bit for me.
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I overall like the story but even then I'm not thrilled with all the Zack involvement. To me he has become the Poochie of the franchise. In the OG he was just some guy who was part of some key events in the backstory and bowed out. It's very workmanlike and feels like a tragic missed connection. Now he's everywhere. He gets his own game, a remaster of said game, gets to chill in the life stream with Aerith, and now he gets to do alt universe shenanigans and fight the final boss with Cloud.

I've been doing some thinking, and I got some ideas to improve the game.
I got it right here.
Uh, one: Zack needs to be goofier, friendlier, and have access to interdimensional travel.
Two: Whenever Zack's not on screen,
all the other characters should be asking, "Where's Zack?"
 
Reedirect

Reedirect

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Oct 27, 2017
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ScOULaris said:
But that ending... I can't believe they kept Aerith's death intact but managed to completely sap it of all the impact it had in the original. Just a really deflating ending that I'll admit did sour the overall experience a bit for me.
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I felt the same immediately after finishing, but it's been slowly growing on me over the last couple of weeks, mainly thanks to all the crazy theories people have been coming up with for Part 3. That will determine if they really got something here or they just plain fumbled.
 
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