Game of Thrones S8 |OT3| Best season evar. (FULL SPOILERS) (See Staff Post)
- Thread starter Deleted member 2802
- Start date
- OT
I would argue that while you had the Meereen teasing moments on Dany going full dark, they didn't actually do enough still. Sure there are discussions and she does some shit to the the slavers but I really would have liked her to raze another city in Essos. Would have at least shown her using more brutal tactics to maybe potentially innocent people instead of her just being threatening but ultimately not doing that.
The "Stay A Thousand Years" (vocal version of "Truth", the Jon/Dany love theme) track wasn't even used in the show ... it would've worked great in the throne room scene.
It's so much more emotional than the actual scene, lol. Ramin really brought it for the final season.
Right in the books I think she comes back, wins the battle of Mereen, then the pale mare rages on and she stops trying to save the sick and burns them all.
I'm so bummed this wasn't used in the show, it's absolutely stunning.
I fail to see how this is congruent with murdering countless innocents for no reason instead of going straight for the person that holds the throne she views as hers by right.
Sure there's a tinge of ruthlessness in admitting you're a conquered. She's never not had that, but it's not nearly the same thing as what happened in season 8. It could lead there with other actions, sure. But these are just words and words that are nowhere remotely close to what she ended up doing.
This is also still before she gains much real power and maybe it hints at something (really just ambition) but the characterization can't overcome what she becomes when she gains real power, which is mostly a benevolent ruler, at least compared to others we've seen in universe. Is she ever perfect? No. Definitely not. No one in this series really is.
If that conversation is supposed to be a hint toward committing the absolute worst most evil act in the entire show, then really anyone could have and would have because almost everyone here has bigger "hints."
Sure. Just in a far more logical and well written turn of events.
No doubt Daenerys will have the same faith as in the series..
I think that's obvious. Though I've seen some say that D&D decided to make Bran king to try and "surprise" people.
Yeah people are a bit too invested in certain characters, i'm afraid.
To me this reads: "George told them that Bran would be involved in two things in the books, so that is literally the only thing they gave Bran to do in the last couple of seasons." Which, yea that makes sense based on what we got.
Well yeah. They told them about 2 things:
1. About the Hordor thing and his role in that
2. That he would become King.
But GRRM didn't tell them about everything in-between.
The whole point is that he comes off as bitter and unlikable at first but is ultimately a righteous and legitimate king who only wants the throne because it is his duty.
GRRM's own words:
"And it is important that the individual books refer to the civil wars, but the series title reminds us constantly that the real issue lies in the North beyond the Wall. Stannis becomes one of the few characters fully to understand that, which is why in spite of everything he is a righteous man, and not just a version of Henry VII, Tiberius or Louis XI."
Last edited:
It's even more frustrating if they knew all along that they'd have to make Bran King and they did nothing to make it narratively make sense.
This is my biggest pet peeve with the criticisms.
It's clear as day the main issue with season 7 and 8 isn't the events the unfolded but the execution of those events.
However it seems like every other critique is like "How could you pick Bran you idiots, Jon or Dany or BOTH deserved to be king!"
The worst is the people who thought Dany going dark is somehow against her character and she was always a beacon of light and goodness.
Just to provide a counterpoint, I rewatched seasons 1 through 5 over the past few months (as I had stopped watching the show back at the end of the fifth season mainly because I was hoping that the Winds of Winter would be released soon). I definitely did not witness any implicit or explicit foreshadowing that suggested that Dany would eventually ruthlessly murder a whole city of innocents.
There's ruthlessness and ambition on display, of course, but that's a whole different beast that's entirely separate from the awful character development in the 8th season.
There's ruthlessness and ambition on display, of course, but that's a whole different beast that's entirely separate from the awful character development in the 8th season.
Bran getting picked as king and Dany destroying Kings Landing after she's won is EXACTLY the problem you describe, they're both poorly executed twists. They're not "outside the realm of possiblities" in any shape or form, they are simply poorly executed and aren't given any breathing room whatsoever.
That's because the writers of the show failed completely at making Bran an interesting character or build him up as a realistic candidate for the throne. They skipped him for a whole season and after he came back in S6 his highlight was the Hodor moment and nothing ever since. He should be a key part in the Battle of Winterfell, he did nothing other than being bait. All of his scenes were so uninteresting that everyone thought that he must be hiding something, but it all led to nothing. I'm (almost) sure the books will make that moment feel earned like earlier twists in the story.
Yup, for me the "problem" with Bran becoming king was that it made me feel nothing. Because the character for the last couple seasons made me feel nothing too, well maybe slightly confused. Definitely not against him being the king, but I was expecting some impact on me when the ruler resolves.
I like him so much because of how funny he is in the books. If you think I'm being sarcastic then you missed all of his jokes.
You miss my point.
I agree with you that the execution and build up was horrible.
My issue is the people that seem personally attacked their favorite character didn't do X Y Z
Yeah Stannis has some hilarious dialogue in the books especially book 5.
And you miss my point. If the execution and build-up were appropriate and Bran was a well-developed character then he would be one of people's favorite character too.
Hell, personally I would've even preferred Cercei on the throne, that would make more sense.
Jon and Stannis both had all their snark and humour (also Jon's brains and Stannis's not-being-a-piece-of-shit) surgically amputated during the adaptation process, it's very sad
No what I am saying is people don't give a damn about the botched execution. They wanted Jon or Dany. That's it. I've literally heard that as a criticism. "They spent all series building up Jon and Dany to take the throne and they didn't! BS! I was Team Dany!!!"
Yeah, and I am saying that they should have spent same amount of time to build up Bran. :) To me "execution" and "build up" is not just the last 2-3 episodes but should have started years ago. Especially so if they'd heard from GRRM himself such a long time ago. But even if they decided to start promoting Bran this season they failed again, they gave him zero interesting material. Even in the battle with the Night King he just warged away and did nothing else! Unbelievable how this script got the clear to go to shooting and nobody dared to raise red flags about it.
People preferring characters that have been properly built up over the course of the show as opposed to characters that have just served as an extra at worst and convenient plot device at best for several seasons now... who would've thunk.
People can be upset at both that and the horrid execution, its not mutually exclusive
Lol right
I think you would have always had people get upset that their characters didn't reach their ideal endpoints. Unfortunately for GOT, alot of characters had endings that didn't ring true because they never built up to it and it comes off as rushed, which no one likes. Like hell, I still want to know how Sam Tarly was like a failed maester to a grand maester in a couple of months lol.
I meant more about her quest to basically conquer the world in a ruthless manner. Having some of this foundation established so early on was something I didn't realize on my first watch. As I said, the execution was poor.
That was really just fanservice, just like Bronn being master of coin. Why put qualified no-names when they can put familiar faces? Screw logic and consistency, we gotta have the fan favourites!
If D&D knew Bran was the endgame, maybe they could have, you know, not removed him from entire seasons and made him likeable?
A couple of months? You can't rebuild an entire castle in a couple of months.
The people running this show have never had any idea how to show the passage of time.
If you asked 10 different people how much time had passed from X event to Y event, you'd get 10 wildly different answers.
The people running this show have never had any idea how to show the passage of time.
If you asked 10 different people how much time had passed from X event to Y event, you'd get 10 wildly different answers.
Because Stannis is at his most unlikeable in the prologue.
He's turning more heroic as the story progresses.
I mean just check this out:
Literally one of the most triumphant moments in the series is when Stannis recognizes Davos' value and sees beyond his low birth or his criminal past and thinks that Davos should be his Hand. This is Law and Order Stannis that we're talking about.
But that's also one of Stannis' greatest virtues. He can see beyond a person's birth and see the wisdom behind what they say. It's why he listens to Melisandre(a former slaver), Davos(a smuggler) and Jon Snow(a bastard).
He's got the determination levels of a Shonen protagonist:
He's got good intentions despite his bad methods:
Stannis is like Bran in that he doesn't want to be king but it's his duty to be king so he'll do it and take his job seriously:
Stannis is also a pretty insecure figure that doesn't want to be Messiah either:
I think they just didn't know how to write Bran without GRRM so they did the absolute minimum.
Hell, Robo Bran might actually be their invention so they didn't have to deal with Bran's character too much.
That's literally what you are supposed to think until the character reveals more about himself and changes through his arc is ASOS. If you still feel the same way about Stannis by the end of that book that you missed the point of Davos's chapters.
On adaptation changes, all the characters got significant aspects of their characters amputated from them in order to simplify them enough for TV:
Jon Snow got his intelligence, pragmatism and ambition chopped off and turned into an honorable action hero.
Daenerys Targaryen got most of her vulnerable moments adapted out. The house with the red door is an extremely important aspect of Daenerys' psychology and how the thing she wants most in the world is a place to belong to and her childhood back.
Arya's depression and self-worth issues aren't present in the show.
Sansa's biggest strengths are her kindness, her warmth and her charm. In the show, she's presented as this cold, bitter lady that acts like a mini-Cersei.
Tyrion's villainy and his misanthropic hate for the world is also missing in the show. Instead, he's this saint-like figure that only wants to do good. Rather than being the devil on Daenerys' shoulder, he's the angel.
Bran Stark's own self-worth issues, his place in society and his misery at his condition are barely present after the first 2 seasons. The show hardly actually delves into Bran. His dream to become a knight is hardly even referenced too. And he stops being a character after season 6. Not to mention that the lore aspects that would make Bran king believable are missing.
Jon Snow got his intelligence, pragmatism and ambition chopped off and turned into an honorable action hero.
Daenerys Targaryen got most of her vulnerable moments adapted out. The house with the red door is an extremely important aspect of Daenerys' psychology and how the thing she wants most in the world is a place to belong to and her childhood back.
Arya's depression and self-worth issues aren't present in the show.
Sansa's biggest strengths are her kindness, her warmth and her charm. In the show, she's presented as this cold, bitter lady that acts like a mini-Cersei.
Tyrion's villainy and his misanthropic hate for the world is also missing in the show. Instead, he's this saint-like figure that only wants to do good. Rather than being the devil on Daenerys' shoulder, he's the angel.
Bran Stark's own self-worth issues, his place in society and his misery at his condition are barely present after the first 2 seasons. The show hardly actually delves into Bran. His dream to become a knight is hardly even referenced too. And he stops being a character after season 6. Not to mention that the lore aspects that would make Bran king believable are missing.
People wanted Jon or Dany because they were the only characters whose development built them for consideration.
Had they executed properly, people would have been more open to other choices.
Bran somewhat makes sense of you follow behind-the -scenes. But for the average person, it comes across as a reach for the sake of subverting expectations. The writers don't even feel like they earned it - which is why they had Tyrion deliver that Hamfisted speech. "If Tyrion tells the audience that Bran had the best story, maybe they'll kinda forget that we didn't story at all"
I guess the subreddit that started the position have raised over 50,000 pounds for Emilia Clarke's charity: https://streamable.com/u6ggd
I agree, I don't post in here that much because a lot of it is just shit memes. The only one I liked was professor Drogon.
Ah remember the days of Littlefinger teleporting in Westeros back in S2. Such simpler times back then.
Leave it to Stephen King to give me a new good term for this sort of situation
"It wasn't yknow, BOSS"
And now those toxic bastards just raised over $35,000 for Kit Harrington's charity in less then a day!!