LTTP: Black Panther: Everything is better in black
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Funny, I said the same thing to the guy in our friend group who said "That was the worst movie I have ever seen in my life" coming out of the cinema.
Yes, I did. I suppose I just have trouble when people refer to things in any medium of entertainment as "overrated". It not resonating with you or appealing to what you're seeking is understandable, but I don't think that just because Black Panther received universal critical acclaim, awards nominations and was spoken of in somewhat hyperbolic terms and lavished with laudatory proclamations means that the film was overrated. It's a somewhat semantic argument but I feel people who claimed it was Citizen Kane were a vocal minority on the extreme end in those who were positive towards it.
Personally speaking that judgement can be made but opinion isn't fact. The fact is Black Panther was graded highly across the cinematic community... so were they judging the film on merit alone, against other offerings in the genre or grading on a scale? Citizen Kane or a masterpiece it is not, that is hyperbole and only a handful of films throughout history can lay claim to that designation. I'd argue based on the offerings last year and the films that were selected for best picture, Black Panther wasn't out of place however.
The Ant Man films do nothing for me but I would put the original Iron Man, Guardians 1, Civil War (as well as Winter Soldier) at the top of the MCU along with Black Panther.
I agree with you that the majority of the MCU don't qualify as great speaking strictly from a cinematic perspective. They simply lack the well written narratives, structure and ambition to do so. For me, when it comes to the genre of comicbook movies, Black Panther offers something (and maybe it was only a glimpse to some) that pushes the envelop forward when it comes to these types of films and the types of stories they can put forth on the big screen from a thematic perspective. I hope that, from the perspective of being a great film first and foremost, Black Panther 2 can further push that envelop forward and distance itself from typical MCU and CBM tropes.
Don't agree at all. The only thing I would see an argument for is production design. In my opinion the score of Black Panther and certainly the acting is a far cry above GOTG.
That's fair and well said
Note that I did not mean Ant-Man 2. Just the first. It wasn't great, but I had a good time watching it and had more fun than with most of the MCU. Paul Rudd is a treasure.
Walton Goggins, mediocre writing and the like made Ant-Man 2 the lesser of the two, with ease
I mean, he's not wrong. Thanos is a one-note villain whose entire motive is devoid of any depth. And not exactly well thought through, honestly.
I enjoyed it. Nice to have some variety in the MCU films. Wish they could have thought up a better ending than the cliche "villain is a mirror of the hero" fight.
It frustrates and irritates me to no end that the aspirational idealized progressive nation in the MCU is governed by a dynastic monarchy, with the sole potential exception of challenge by single combat. That shit is absurdly regressive and just plain fucking awful, and I can't get past it enough to enjoy the story.
Killmonger was a good villain but I wish they did not make him so blatantly evil. Even Magneto was not this bad. Both he and T'Challa made fair points. I would rather the movie be about these two conflicting ideas than having to save the world from yet another psychopath.
I also wish they did not kill him. He would have made a good Loki.
Yea it's my favorite of the MCU. It has its issues, but it gets beyond the typical superhero fantasy stuff and offers some challenging themes, like the African American ancestral void (Killmonger's ancestral plane scene is the best scene in entire MCU), abandonment of children (for political reasons, woo boy is that relevant), violent and toxic masculinity, colonialism, and so on. And the superhero power stuff that is there is re-contextualized with an all black cast, allowing us to see them as the strongest and smartest and most capable people in a massive blockbuster film. It's good shit.
Does the movie pretend that Wakanda is an "ideal" society? The entire narrative is about how a core component of their national policy is a complete and total moral failure, a failure that has created a grave existential threat.
Does the movie pretend that Wakanda is an "ideal" society? The entire narrative is about how a core component of their national policy is a complete and total moral failure, a failure that has created a grave existential threat.
OP
OP
He doesn't even get a chance to become a superhero or even "redeem" himself. He was there, made a big impact, then he's gone. He actually prolly deserves a real origin film.
It's a technological utopia positioned as a bastion of progressive advancement shrouded from the rest of the world. The entire point of that foreign policy narrative is that Wakanda represents something of incalculable potential value to all of humankind... and yet it's a monarchy in which continuity of governance is determined by blood. It's fucking disappointing. It didn't have to be this way.
It doesn't even make for good storytelling. The "anointed prince cast out and striving to reclaim his birthright" is among the most well-trodden and uninteresting storytelling tropes. For a film that excels in so many other ways, the domestic politics of Wakanda remain a baffling stumbling block.
And there are so many obvious ways to improve that stuff. Decouple the role of Black Panther from head of state. It makes no fucking sense for the two of those to coincide to begin with. Make Killmonger a prodigal son who returns and wins supporters on the strength of his ideas alone, not because he outpunched the king. Force T'Challa to fight for the throne by appealing to truths that speak to the essence of universal humanism without invoking some infuriating notion of destiny by divine birthright.
But whatever, the film clearly resonated with people and I'm apparently well into the minority. I just wish such a culturally resonant story conveyed a more democratic message.
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I'm pretty sure that the narrative shows how shitty this system is by quickly showing how Erik ended up being a king and how Mbaku and it's people we're outcasts in their own country because of it.
I hope they steal this aspect from Coates's run.
I'd be more inclined to agree with that assessment if the movie didn't end with T'Challa comfortably ensconced upon the throne once more with not a whiff of change in the air for Wakanda's system of government.
Like can you name a single progressive nation in the real world in 2019 in which the chief executive is a hereditary monarch? What the fuck are we doing here?
Like How Cap goes toe to toe with the Red Skull? Or any of the Thor movies?
I'm sorry, was Cap fighting for the presidency of the United States?
He was fighting to end nazi's trying to blow up the world. You tell me what was more important.
Same thing in Ironman 1 and 3. Battle for dominance.
I am specifically critiquing the asinine notions of hereditary governance and of ordinary people being governed by whichever asshole can punch hardest. This has nothing to do with the moral case for just war.
Probably too 5 MCU for me. One thing I don't think it gets enough credit for is having the best representation of woman in pretty much any superhero movie (yes including captain marvel in that).
I did have a few complaints. I wish Kilmonger didn't end up being quite so evil. They had a really complex situation where in so many ways you could actually side with killmonger. I wanted to see how that played out. They basically took the heap way out by making him far too evil and turning it into a typical saving the world against the big bad plot. The awful cgi fight as the climax certainly didn't help.
I also which we got more of klaw. Loved his character and how he was portrayed and would have liked to see more of him but that's more of a nitpick.
Otherwise my complaints are more minor quibbles.
I did have a few complaints. I wish Kilmonger didn't end up being quite so evil. They had a really complex situation where in so many ways you could actually side with killmonger. I wanted to see how that played out. They basically took the heap way out by making him far too evil and turning it into a typical saving the world against the big bad plot. The awful cgi fight as the climax certainly didn't help.
I also which we got more of klaw. Loved his character and how he was portrayed and would have liked to see more of him but that's more of a nitpick.
Otherwise my complaints are more minor quibbles.
Not discounting what you're claiming but, the movie isn't perfect, it has flaws (really spotty CGI, pacing was eh, lackluster action sequences) but even with those shortcomings, it pretty much excelled at everything else; Is still one of the Best top-tier, S-Class MCU films? No Doubt!
Bring Killmonger back though! Great fucking Villain!
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My favorite MCU film I just wished it had a non-typical MCU action climax, Oh well. I loved the villains and all the female characters were great in this film. The movie had Shakespearian feel to it.
My top 5 MCU films
1. Black Panther
2. GoTG1
3. Winter Soldier
4. Thor Ragnorak
5. Endgame
4 and 5 can switch depending on how I feel.
My top 5 MCU films
1. Black Panther
2. GoTG1
3. Winter Soldier
4. Thor Ragnorak
5. Endgame
4 and 5 can switch depending on how I feel.
You know when Killmonger was dying in front of the sunset was like no don't fix me so you can lock me up. T'challa should have slit his throat right then.
the 3rd act falters into generic superhero shit with some of the worst CGI in the MCU
Coogler could of had a masterpiece but he missed it
Coogler could of had a masterpiece but he missed it
Black panther cheated on the succession fight against Killmonger and he didn't have the right for a rematch.
I liked it but I think I heard too much hype before seeing it, sort of came in below my expectations. I'd probably put it maybe mid-pack in the MCU list of movies. I thought Boseman and Jordan did great jobs in their roles and were good choices.
how so?
I don't think it was ever thought of a "rematch" anyway. Technically, the fight never ended.
Can't wait for the sequel. Sequels in the MCU are exciting since they've already established the character and their world so they can pretty much go anywhere now.
Dude, what kind of a fair fight is it if one of the participants who by all means should be dead already is allowed to be nursed back to full health by others mid-fight? Not to mention even before the referee intervened directly onto the match.
The movie only came out a year ago as you mentioned. Why wouldn't it hold up?
But OP I agree it was great!
Lol at those "brace youselfs" posts, since every criticism so far has been very justified and explained. Embarassing
Anyway, good movie. Top tier MCU.
Not that it says a lot, since I find those movies to be pretty meh, but I would rank it at third place behind Endgame and Winter Soldier.
Anyway, good movie. Top tier MCU.
Not that it says a lot, since I find those movies to be pretty meh, but I would rank it at third place behind Endgame and Winter Soldier.
But they had to fight in an underground railroad
...
It's a good movie that is great whenever it is dealing with the Killmonger plot.
Lol the only thing aspirational about Wakanda is it's a safe haven to black folk (when they actually let outsiders in) and that it's so technologically advanced.
Wakanda isn't meant to be some utopia though. The country has big issues. It's not supposed to be idealized, that's a projection you're placing on it.
Isn't the ruler of Wakanda also its protector? I guess in that sense it can make sense why they want a powerful warrior.
Isn't the entire thing about Wakanda that they have never had a war or even a conflict since its founding? Why would they value a forgeign warrior king over someone who actually knows diplomacy, Wakandan technology, etc? They hardly even need warriors.
The one gripe I had against BP was the action scenes. They never connected with me for some reason.
I know its been posted 348938749238 thousand plus times
how do you actually defend this? seriously? to fans of BP and everyone else.
i mean its not just a small part of the movie its the final fight/conclusion....it really ruined the whole movie for me.the whole 3rd act soured the experience
how do you actually defend this? seriously? to fans of BP and everyone else.
i mean its not just a small part of the movie its the final fight/conclusion....it really ruined the whole movie for me.the whole 3rd act soured the experience
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Incorrect.
They've avoided large-scale wars (till the present, in comics and film), but they've had to ward off the occasional attempted invasion in the past, from types like Klaw who discover the existence of the country and it's vibranium.
And in the event that they are finally discovered by the world at large, yeah, probably a good idea to have warriors ready.
The method with which they choose their monarch is outdated as hell, but they definitely still need the Black Panther and warriors in general.
Wife and I both loved it. Literally only rewatched it 2 days ago.
At no point during it did I have any issue with the cg.
I have noticed that older relatives that otherwise enjoy the MCU films didn't seem to enjoy it as much. I can't imagine why.
At no point during it did I have any issue with the cg.
I have noticed that older relatives that otherwise enjoy the MCU films didn't seem to enjoy it as much. I can't imagine why.