Mini Mafia VI: Unboxing The Truth

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

If vere and zipped are town:

Maol was voted by Soneji and Confirmed Town exodus

Soneji was only prod voted by Confirmed Town Alexem but I don't think he was at risk in any moment...

I think that between them I would go for Maol but Soneji is worryingly flying low

Chuggs just following fanto to the vere lunch worries me, as does canto

Fuck me this is the game I have feel the most uncertain, the not-claim claims don't help sorting my head either

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Maolfunction what is PoE? I think it has been mentioned already

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Process of Elimination

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Thanks

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

I still just think a Vere lunch today answers a lot of my questions and gives me the best Scum hunting opportunities moving forward. He's set on me or Zipped being Scum, and I know he's wrong about me. I agree with what Turmoil said above, I honestly feel really unsure in this game, I'm kind of just latching onto my reads and hoping I'm right for today because I've done a lot of examining of things already and this is just where my mind ends up every damn time. I can't really find anything else that makes sense for now, this is just where I'm at and I can't see outside of it yet.

To reiterate my feelings once again:

TOWN
Chugg
Turmoil
Ketkat
Brian
Soneji
Mao
Zipped
Stan
Vere
SCUM

That's my list, I can't sort it in like any other ways yet. I would have to be completely wrong on my Town, or else everyone in my Middling Zone of Nullishness is Scum and my Scum reads should be there instead. It's hard to say right now without seeing at least one more flip.

empressdonna · Nov 11, 2019

==== DAY 2 VOTES ====
Day Start

Verelios (3 votes)
Fantomas - #489
TheChuggernaut - #503
~~turmoil7 - #568~~ #625
Stantastic - #710

Zippedpinhead (3 votes)
Ketkat - #628
turmoil7 - #654
Verelios - #671

Stantastic (1 votes)
Maolfunction - #571

turmoil7 (1 votes)
언이라브 - #619

Ketkat (0 votes)
~~Stantastic - #617~~ #710

Fantomas (0 votes)
~~turmoil7 - #625~~ #654

Not voting: Zippedpinhead, Soneji

Post Counts:
Fantomas: 38 Verelios: 36 Stantastic: 34 turmoil7: 31 TheChuggernaut: 24 언이라브: 19 Zippedpinhead: 15 Maolfunction: 13 Ketkat: 10 Soneji: 5

Current Countdown:

Click here to go to the Vote Tool!

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

That vote count doesn't seem to be up to date? It doesn't have Soneji's vote on Vere listed.

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

so do we want my claim? I'm still ready to give it

empressdonna · Nov 11, 2019

==== DAY 2 VOTES ====
Day Start

Verelios (4 votes)
Fantomas - #489
TheChuggernaut - #503
~~turmoil7 - #568~~ #625
Stantastic - #710
Soneji - #721

Zippedpinhead (3 votes)
Ketkat - #628
turmoil7 - #654
Verelios - #671

Stantastic (1 votes)
Maolfunction - #571

turmoil7 (1 votes)
언이라브 - #619

Ketkat (0 votes)
~~Stantastic - #617~~ #710

Fantomas (0 votes)
~~turmoil7 - #625~~ #654

Not voting: Zippedpinhead

Post Counts:
turmoil7: 45 Fantomas: 43 Stantastic: 42 Verelios: 39 TheChuggernaut: 24 언이라브: 20 Zippedpinhead: 20 Maolfunction: 15 Ketkat: 10 Soneji: 6

Current Countdown:

Click here to go to the Vote Tool!

Ketkat · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
so do we want my claim? I'm still ready to give it

Sure? I'm not sure why you're asking us, if you feel that you want to give it then go for it

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

I still kinda want the zipped flip

I feel that fanto is protecting zipped, that argument for going for Vere seems like playing for the sake of his reads than town's

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

turmoil7 said:
I still kinda want the zipped flip

I feel that fanto is protecting zipped, that argument for going for Vere seems like playing for the sake of his reads than town's

Ok, so let's just stop beating around the bush then.

Zipped is claiming as a Roleblocker obviously, he knows Alexem didn't kill Reki because he roleblocked Alexem last night.

Roleblocker can be either a Town or Scum role in this setup.

Vere is saying you are wrong about what you thought he was soft claiming.

Therefore, we have Zipped claiming as a Roleblocker and Vere claiming as nothing, both of which are NAI. My read and my curiosity still points me to Vere, but if we want to see whether Zipped is a Town or Scum Roleblocker, then we flip him.

Is that about it here for today?

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

So Vere is claiming vanilla?

fucking non claim claims

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

Zipped, why did you target Alexem last night?

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

I think its very convenient that zipped was unlucky enough to target Alexem who died

And he said he didn't breadcrumb that. Did he mention a SK before his claim(he would know there is one if telling the truth)? I don't remember

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Fantomas said:
I still just think a Vere lunch today answers a lot of my questions and gives me the best Scum hunting opportunities moving forward. He's set on me or Zipped being Scum, and I know he's wrong about me. I agree with what Turmoil said above, I honestly feel really unsure in this game, I'm kind of just latching onto my reads and hoping I'm right for today because I've done a lot of examining of things already and this is just where my mind ends up every damn time. I can't really find anything else that makes sense for now, this is just where I'm at and I can't see outside of it yet.

To reiterate my feelings once again:

TOWN
Chugg
Turmoil
Ketkat
Brian
Soneji
Mao
Zipped
Stan
Vere
SCUM

That's my list, I can't sort it in like any other ways yet. I would have to be completely wrong on my Town, or else everyone in my Middling Zone of Nullishness is Scum and my Scum reads should be there instead. It's hard to say right now without seeing at least one more flip.

All I have to say is that I sincerely hope I'm right about you not being town, because you're really feeling yourself in this post and seem ready to push town to a chain.

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

If I was wrong about Vere, I have to reconsider my position, so far I thought he was the most valuable role between the people in contention so I leaned zipped, now? I don't know anymore. Zipped's claim still feels bad tho

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

I'm not a good Town leader, this is known. See Mafiera, Maple Street, Image Mafia, etc. I just talk so much that everyone calls me one. My reads are consistently trash.

Ok, so let me set up a different thought experiment:

Vere is Town now.

Stan is Town too.

Zipped is now a Scum Roleblocker.

Who else is Scum with Zipped?

Is Chugg a Godfather or an investigation-immune SK? Possible, but I think he's Town though.

Remaining players: Turmoil, Mao, Soneji, Ketkat, Brian.

Ket and Turmoil are voting for Zipped, probably not bussing behavior given the context unless they were really sure that Vere was going to go away today and their votes didn't matter.

Soneji, Brian, Mao. I would say Mao could be Scum with Zipped here. There's a chance that Brian is in on it and just fooling us with his newbie lines to stay in Town's good graces. That's a world I can see.

Would Mao and Soneji ever be on the same team? Was that D1 playstyle argument faked? I doubt it, pretty good performance if it was though.

-----

There, now I can see through some of this Vere fog finally.

Maolfunction · Nov 11, 2019

Vote: turmoil7

That latest line of questioning from him feels scummy as fuck.

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

Maolfunction said:
Vote: turmoil7

That latest line of questioning from him feels scummy as fuck.

Can you be more specific?

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

Fantomas got it right!

I am town Roleblocker, and I chose to block Alexem last night. I based it on the weak defense for the potential vote flip at the end of day. I'll be completely honest, I didn't even entertain blocking anyone else at the time.

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

turmoil7 said:
I think its very convenient that zipped was unlucky enough to target Alexem who died

And he said he didn't breadcrumb that. Did he mention a SK before his claim(he would know there is one if telling the truth)? I don't remember

I had three hours, I was going to worry about breadcrumbing my role today, and the fact that I blocked a vigilante on the day that we had two deaths, one of which was the vigilante? blew my mind...

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
I had three hours, I was going to worry about breadcrumbing my role today, and the fact that I blocked a vigilante on the day that we had two deaths, one of which was the vigilante? blew my mind...

That's a good point, at the start of D2 you were in the game for barely more than a irl day to have everything figured out...

Maolfunction · Nov 11, 2019

Fantomas said:
Can you be more specific?

turmoil7 said:
I think its very convenient that zipped was unlucky enough to target Alexem who died

And he said he didn't breadcrumb that. Did he mention a SK before his claim(he would know there is one if telling the truth)? I don't remember

This post specifically. He's both sowing doubt about a perfectly reasonable town claim, implying that it's unlikely for multiple players to target the same person in a game where there's potentially a ton of PRs and he's ignoring that Zipped subbed in with barely any time left in the day, but pushing doubt on him for not breadcrumbing.

That's quite a bunch of concerns all popping up in one post.

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Zipped has been playing mafia for years(and is very good at it)

I think he would understand that a blocked vig can't shoot and then something is going on there, even subbing in late

Ketkat · Nov 11, 2019

Maolfunction said:
This post specifically. He's both sowing doubt about a perfectly reasonable town claim, implying that it's unlikely for multiple players to target the same person in a game where there's potentially a ton of PRs and he's ignoring that Zipped subbed in with barely any time left in the day, but pushing doubt on him for not breadcrumbing.

That's quite a bunch of concerns all popping up in one post.

It's a pretty common scum strategy to say that their fake claim power targeted someone who has already died as it allows them to not be contested. It is a reasonable town claim, but it's also not really guaranteed to be true

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Maolfunction said:
This post specifically. He's both sowing doubt about a perfectly reasonable town claim, implying that it's unlikely for multiple players to target the same person in a game where there's potentially a ton of PRs and he's ignoring that Zipped subbed in with barely any time left in the day, but pushing doubt on him for not breadcrumbing.

That's quite a bunch of concerns all popping up in one post.

That's not an accurate representation. Zipped had an at most 2/11 chance of hitting the same target as mafia or the potential SK, so being surprised he did shouldn't be shocking. It's possible, sometimes odds just work like that in games where events occur in an order that would be absolutely insane to speculate about, but I do find your insistence weird.

Maolfunction · Nov 11, 2019

Ketkat said:
It's a pretty common scum strategy to say that their fake claim power targeted someone who has already died as it allows them to not be contested. It is a reasonable town claim, but it's also not really guaranteed to be true

Good thing I never said it was guaranteed true. But it's reasonable to believe right now. Zipped didn't need to claim he targeted Alex, which is where most of the suspicion lies if he's scum because he targeted a player who died. There's no roles in the game that could counter a lie. Gives his claim more credibility for me.

Maolfunction · Nov 11, 2019

This in addition to switching off the exo wagon to Vere on D1 just downright feels townie as fuck.

Soneji · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
Because being town, it's in my best interest to be open with whatever I have, and people blaming reki on alexem have a vested interest in keeping that information wrong (i.e they could be scum or the serial killer)

Do you think anyone in particular is trying to push this angle? I only remember some getting that initial impression because they forgot about the potential for an SK/didn't think Alex would shoot Reki but didn't discount the YOLO angle.

Soneji · Nov 11, 2019

turmoil7 said:
So since the town leader is on sick leave I think it's out to me now

👨👑

Let's lunch zipped

turmoil7 said:
Your not-claim is just awfully convenient...

Do you think he's outright lying here? Scum can rand a role blocker so he can be telling the truth about his and possibly also the target and still be scum. While them targeting a dead player doesn't help in verifying their target it isn't that out there in a small game to match targets.

Zippedpinhead : Why didn't you roleblock say Vere who you were willing to wagon late?

turmoil7 said:
If vere and zipped are town:

Maol was voted by Soneji and Confirmed Town exodus

Soneji was only prod voted by Confirmed Town Alexem but I don't think he was at risk in any moment...

I think that between them I would go for Maol but Soneji is worryingly flying low

Chuggs just following fanto to the vere lunch worries me, as does canto

Fuck me this is the game I have feel the most uncertain, the not-claim claims don't help sorting my head either

Was kind of getting wary of you with the Zipped push but I like this paranoia.

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

Soneji said:
Zippedpinhead : Why didn't you roleblock say Vere who you were willing to wagon late?

This was mainly because I felt that the game would continue focus on Vere today, rightly so. And with potentially three scum teammates to submit moves/kills I figured someone else on that team would try something.

Soneji · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
This was mainly because I felt that the game would continue focus on Vere today, rightly so. And with potentially three scum teammates to submit moves/kills I figured someone else on that team would try something.

So you thought Vere had too much heat on them to be the likely faction killer? Sounds reasonable.

Soneji · Nov 11, 2019

Maolfunction said:
Good thing I never said it was guaranteed true. But it's reasonable to believe right now. Zipped didn't need to claim he targeted Alex, which is where most of the suspicion lies if he's scum because he targeted a player who died. There's no roles in the game that could counter a lie. Gives his claim more credibility for me.

If he is scum and they have no role blocker, or they do and targeted someone else that would be hard for Zipped to explain that can be reason to lie. If he lies about blocking a townie he risks them having a role they know didn't get blocked. Could claim he roleblocked a scummate but that can also come with justification problems and just not wanting that association between scummates.

I'd say what gets me feeling okay with the claim is that the motive for revealing was in part to reveal the likelihood of an SK, but they haven't gone the route of pushing to find the SK. Mafia like to divert town away from them by trying to steer attention towards indies, especially SKs which pose a threat to their own lives.

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
This was mainly because I felt that the game would continue focus on Vere today, rightly so. And with potentially three scum teammates to submit moves/kills I figured someone else on that team would try something.

Did you know the game's setup yesterday? C9++?

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

Vere, you have no claim to give us, correct?

Zipped is claiming as a Town RB who blocked Alexem on N1, indicating that Alexem did not kill Reki, indicating that there is likely a SK out there which is how one of those two died.

I still want to lunch Vere out of the two. Call it a fucking tunnel, I don't care, I have been seeing him as the most likely Scum player all damn day, I want that flip.

Why should we think Vere is Town here today? Does anyone have a Town read on Vere? I really feel like even though people are pushing elsewhere, no one has spoken up to say "This is why I think Vere is Town and why we shouldn't vote for him today." Is there a reason why we should want to check whether Zipped is lying or not right now instead of going for Vere or someone else?

If we're going outside of Vere, Stan still looks like not a bad option to me. Vere says he thinks Stan is Town though and a bad idea to vote for. Ok, does anyone else think Stan is Town, or at the least, a bad vote today?

Stuart444 · Nov 11, 2019

==== DAY 2 VOTES ====
Day Start

Verelios (4 votes)
Fantomas - #489
TheChuggernaut - #503
~~turmoil7 - #568~~ #625
Stantastic - #710
Soneji - #721

Zippedpinhead (3 votes)
Ketkat - #628
turmoil7 - #654
Verelios - #671

turmoil7 (2 votes)
언이라브 - #619
Maolfunction - #769

Ketkat (0 votes)
~~Stantastic - #617~~ #710

Stantastic (0 votes)
~~Maolfunction - #571~~ #769

Fantomas (0 votes)
~~turmoil7 - #625~~ #654

Not voting: Zippedpinhead

Post Counts:
turmoil7: 51 Fantomas: 47 Stantastic: 42 Verelios: 42 TheChuggernaut: 24 Zippedpinhead: 24 언이라브: 20 Maolfunction: 19 Ketkat: 12 Soneji: 10

Current Countdown:

Click here to go to the Vote Tool!

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

Verelios said:
Did you know the game's setup yesterday? C9++?

I know it is right there on the first page, but mafiascum is blocked at work, so I didn't try to review it while the day was underway. To be honest, I never look at them, and didn't give it a second thought until someone mentioned that the setup prevented the possibility of a switcher.

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Hm, yeah, I'm a box.

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

Zippedpinhead said:
I know it is right there on the first page, but mafiascum is blocked at work, so I didn't try to review it while the day was underway. To be honest, I never look at them, and didn't give it a second thought until someone mentioned that the setup prevented the possibility of a switcher.

I see. So you didn't have an idea of PR distribution?

Zippedpinhead · Nov 11, 2019

Verelios said:
Hm, yeah, I'm a box.

corrugate or Solid Bleached Sulfate? N-Flute or E-Flute Corrugate? (a little packaging humor)

not a joke, but I am a packaging engineer, it has been my job in the past to design new boxes... we do a lot more than that but sometimes it really is design a new box.

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Right now my biggest reason to think vere is town are huge scum feelings for zipped, other than that vere hasn't done a lot to help his case, me catching that false positive was mostly the reason I wanted to keep him

Right now I would pick him over zipped if there was a tie but it doesn't look like it would be necessary

turmoil7 · Nov 11, 2019

Stan and Vere's read on him? WIFOM if Vere is scum

As Stan is voting for him, vere must want to murk the waters if scum

Soneji · Nov 11, 2019

turmoil7 said:
Right now my biggest reason to think vere is town are huge scum feelings for zipped, other than that vere hasn't done a lot to help his case, me catching that false positive was mostly the reason I wanted to keep him

Right now I would pick him over zipped if there was a tie but it doesn't look like it would be necessary

Given that there's likely an SK around, they could be opposing scum. Zipped's play wouldn't make much sense from an SK though, so in that scenario the one without partners to save them is in the lead, and is the more immediate danger to thinning towns numbers as an extra kill at night.

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

turmoil7 said:
Right now my biggest reason to think vere is town are huge scum feelings for zipped, other than that vere hasn't done a lot to help his case, me catching that false positive was mostly the reason I wanted to keep him

Right now I would pick him over zipped if there was a tie but it doesn't look like it would be necessary

Well, let's not get retroactively selective. I still don't understand what case I'm supposed to be debating besides feelings.

Fanto · Nov 11, 2019

So no one has anything to say?

Raise your hand if you think we shouldn't vote for Vere, now's your last chance.

Ketkat · Nov 11, 2019

This is a weirdly quiet end of day. I think you're right that there isn't much defense of Vere, but I'm still not sure about him

TheChuggernaut · Nov 11, 2019

I don't know if other scum could defend him without looking super sus. Probably better to hope town just towns it up if he is scum

Verelios · Nov 11, 2019

The non-silence is deafening. Just a bunch of people mucking about until dismissal time.

Ketkat · Nov 11, 2019

TheChuggernaut said:
I don't know if other scum could defend him without looking super sus. Probably better to hope town just towns it up if he is scum

I feel like they could be making a case for an existing train like Zippeds if they were looking to save Vere

Mini Mafia VI: Unboxing The Truth

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