ive apparently misinterpreted the playfulness of this conversation
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People who sing the N-word in songs while not black
- Thread starter Stooge
- Start date
ive apparently misinterpreted the playfulness of this conversation
Lmao yup.
My condolences lol. Must be annoying as hell.
And that's all it boils down to.
I mean, that's usually how y'all do it lol.
He is mixed.
The type of people you unreasonably cross the street in fear of anytime you go outside, Johnathan.
So long as black folks in general remain oppressed, my ability to recite the N word can remain forfeit. In relation to their oppression, this isn't hard for me at all.
I'm güero (light skinned) latino.
This scene is what sealed the deal for me. I don't wanna participate in some creepy detached zoo-like interest in black culture. Dropping N bombs to vicariously adopt some black hipness or feel some kind of personal rush.
I'm güero (light skinned) latino.
This scene is what sealed the deal for me. I don't wanna participate in some creepy detached zoo-like interest in black culture. Dropping N bombs to vicariously adopt some black hipness or feel some kind of personal rush.
On the N-Word and White Culture
No worries children, I have descended to assuage your concerns. So lets talk about it...
hmm where to begin? Like a lot of Black American culture, Hip-Hop stems from oppression and exclusion. Black People not allowed to partake in mainstream white entertainment therefore having to create their own similar to HBCUs or Jazz Music. Hip-Hop is the product of a Disco industry that loved to prop up black entertainers as popular acts regarding the music/culture, but had far more contempt and exclusion in regards to black audiences actually participating within Disco Culture or in Nightclubs of the sort.
The core base of Hip-Hop has always been and always will be open expression. The voice of the unheard. The voice of the ignored. Its the foundation of the art form, for black people to express themselves without scorn and to foster a culture that belonged to them wholly.
This is why posters look absolutely foolish to come and try to tell artists what they should and shouldn't put in their music. It goes against the entire ethos of the art form, unbridled self expression. Not only that, its just ignorant as fuck coming from a white person in regards to US history (White America loves telling us what to do)
But lets get into 'The N Word' and its nebulous history and relationship with Black Culture.
Plain and simple, Not all black people even agree on the usage of the word. And that simple reason alone is a big reason why non-Black people shouldn't even think to be using it. Black People have reclaimed the slur, a slur that was used for generations as an act of dehumanization. Lets really think about this for a sec, I know black people claim the word as 'ours', but we didn't originate it. We didn't come up with it. That was a word used by White People against us to justify their inhumane and evil treatment.
"You aren't human, you are a nigger and that gives us the right do whatever we want with you". You can easily say such a sentence was the reigning sentiment of American History, and shit still rings true to this day.
If we get really based, Nigga is just the southern dialect of saying Nigger. Southerners didn't finish their words due to their regional dialect. When it came to reclaiming the word, Black People chose to go with Nigga probably because it sounds less harsh, and it can be differentiated from the original slur, which sounds ugly and is so rooted in hatred.
But again.... Think about the psychology behind this.... Think about why reclaiming such a word would even be necessary... Because its usage was so damaging and stigmatizing, it creates an almost Stockholm Syndrome effect that easily evolved into a vain attempt of power dynamics. Of restoring confidence and establishing Black Pride. Sometimes, i see the usage of Nigga to be somewhat of an ironic statement in a sense.
"Well, you call us niggas, so okay ill be that nigga. Ill be a nigga and still be successful. I'll still be worthy. I'll still be human. I'll still be great. I'll still be dignified"
End all be all, There is a different relationship with the word between blacks and whites. The time White People had with the word is over. There is no positive way such a word can be expressed from white people. To whites, it will always be an attacking slur. Only remaining a facade of camaraderie until the anger shows up and then the tone switches to be used as a weapon. And while blacks can used the word negatively as well, there is undoubtedly an equal and arguably even stronger bond of camaraderie involved with its usage. Its a bond, a recognition of struggle and oppression that we share while navigating life and the world around us. Acknowledging the history that set the foundation of our current world and just how much hasn't changed at the same time.
White People will never share that. They will never have that. And as a result, the word is simply posh. Its window dressing. They don't recognize the struggle thats uniquely coded into our culture and treat it lightly as a characterization of blackness. Hip-Hop Culture is popular, its World Wide and its cool so saying Nigga should be cool too? Right?
But there's no bond there, its empty... To them its as vain as turning your hat backwards, curling your fingers up, and saying "yo yo yo nigga yo". Its a caricature.
I have a second thought that deals with respectability. With any diverse society comes with a social contract on how we all interact with each other. We all recognize our cultural differences and with that we choose to be sensitive to ignorance in an effort to create harmony
When you speak with Asian people, I doubt you throw on a Karate Act. I doubt you start using your half ass Japanese words you picked from anime. I doubt you go into an ignorant "ching chong" chinese language mockery performance...
When you speak with Latino people, I doubt you say Ese to close your sentences. I doubt you assume their Mexican despite the vast amount of Latino countries present in the world, I doubt you assume their fav food is tacos...
When you speak with Arabic people, I doubt you make a terrorism joke to break the ice. I doubt you wax poetic about hijab and freedom. I doubt you put on some idiotic "hurkadurka" performance
So... can anyone explain to me.... why oh why... is the expectation that when you speak and interact with Black People that you should be able to call them Nigga? Why is the exception of common decency always targeting Black People? Why is it so difficult to ask non-black people to respect a social contract and not disrespect black people in their lives? We are always the exception for common daily social treatment. Clearly an example of lasting White Supremacy that we don't deserve respect or for our sympathies to be taken serious.
Damn anything we ask for because we're clearly being unreasonable.
In conclusion, A white person who means well and wants to have meaningful relationships with black people is not going to have interest in saying the word. They aren't going to get huffy about it. They not gonna look for examples to prove points. That doesn't mean they can't listen to Rap Music. It doesn't mean they are being divided ( thats some bullshit Bliman was talking bout) . And it damn sure doesn't mean they're being oppressed or discriminated against.
I will def be posting my list again so people can have more understanding
hmm where to begin? Like a lot of Black American culture, Hip-Hop stems from oppression and exclusion. Black People not allowed to partake in mainstream white entertainment therefore having to create their own similar to HBCUs or Jazz Music. Hip-Hop is the product of a Disco industry that loved to prop up black entertainers as popular acts regarding the music/culture, but had far more contempt and exclusion in regards to black audiences actually participating within Disco Culture or in Nightclubs of the sort.
The core base of Hip-Hop has always been and always will be open expression. The voice of the unheard. The voice of the ignored. Its the foundation of the art form, for black people to express themselves without scorn and to foster a culture that belonged to them wholly.
This is why posters look absolutely foolish to come and try to tell artists what they should and shouldn't put in their music. It goes against the entire ethos of the art form, unbridled self expression. Not only that, its just ignorant as fuck coming from a white person in regards to US history (White America loves telling us what to do)
But lets get into 'The N Word' and its nebulous history and relationship with Black Culture.
Plain and simple, Not all black people even agree on the usage of the word. And that simple reason alone is a big reason why non-Black people shouldn't even think to be using it. Black People have reclaimed the slur, a slur that was used for generations as an act of dehumanization. Lets really think about this for a sec, I know black people claim the word as 'ours', but we didn't originate it. We didn't come up with it. That was a word used by White People against us to justify their inhumane and evil treatment.
"You aren't human, you are a nigger and that gives us the right do whatever we want with you". You can easily say such a sentence was the reigning sentiment of American History, and shit still rings true to this day.
If we get really based, Nigga is just the southern dialect of saying Nigger. Southerners didn't finish their words due to their regional dialect. When it came to reclaiming the word, Black People chose to go with Nigga probably because it sounds less harsh, and it can be differentiated from the original slur, which sounds ugly and is so rooted in hatred.
But again.... Think about the psychology behind this.... Think about why reclaiming such a word would even be necessary... Because its usage was so damaging and stigmatizing, it creates an almost Stockholm Syndrome effect that easily evolved into a vain attempt of power dynamics. Of restoring confidence and establishing Black Pride. Sometimes, i see the usage of Nigga to be somewhat of an ironic statement in a sense.
"Well, you call us niggas, so okay ill be that nigga. Ill be a nigga and still be successful. I'll still be worthy. I'll still be human. I'll still be great. I'll still be dignified"
End all be all, There is a different relationship with the word between blacks and whites. The time White People had with the word is over. There is no positive way such a word can be expressed from white people. To whites, it will always be an attacking slur. Only remaining a facade of camaraderie until the anger shows up and then the tone switches to be used as a weapon. And while blacks can used the word negatively as well, there is undoubtedly an equal and arguably even stronger bond of camaraderie involved with its usage. Its a bond, a recognition of struggle and oppression that we share while navigating life and the world around us. Acknowledging the history that set the foundation of our current world and just how much hasn't changed at the same time.
White People will never share that. They will never have that. And as a result, the word is simply posh. Its window dressing. They don't recognize the struggle thats uniquely coded into our culture and treat it lightly as a characterization of blackness. Hip-Hop Culture is popular, its World Wide and its cool so saying Nigga should be cool too? Right?
But there's no bond there, its empty... To them its as vain as turning your hat backwards, curling your fingers up, and saying "yo yo yo nigga yo". Its a caricature.
I have a second thought that deals with respectability. With any diverse society comes with a social contract on how we all interact with each other. We all recognize our cultural differences and with that we choose to be sensitive to ignorance in an effort to create harmony
When you speak with Asian people, I doubt you throw on a Karate Act. I doubt you start using your half ass Japanese words you picked from anime. I doubt you go into an ignorant "ching chong" chinese language mockery performance...
When you speak with Latino people, I doubt you say Ese to close your sentences. I doubt you assume their Mexican despite the vast amount of Latino countries present in the world, I doubt you assume their fav food is tacos...
When you speak with Arabic people, I doubt you make a terrorism joke to break the ice. I doubt you wax poetic about hijab and freedom. I doubt you put on some idiotic "hurkadurka" performance
So... can anyone explain to me.... why oh why... is the expectation that when you speak and interact with Black People that you should be able to call them Nigga? Why is the exception of common decency always targeting Black People? Why is it so difficult to ask non-black people to respect a social contract and not disrespect black people in their lives? We are always the exception for common daily social treatment. Clearly an example of lasting White Supremacy that we don't deserve respect or for our sympathies to be taken serious.
Damn anything we ask for because we're clearly being unreasonable.
In conclusion, A white person who means well and wants to have meaningful relationships with black people is not going to have interest in saying the word. They aren't going to get huffy about it. They not gonna look for examples to prove points. That doesn't mean they can't listen to Rap Music. It doesn't mean they are being divided ( thats some bullshit Bliman was talking bout) . And it damn sure doesn't mean they're being oppressed or discriminated against.
I will def be posting my list again so people can have more understanding
Entire post is the truth, but this in particular is a salient bit and is always on my mind: Why are black people always the target of these respectability discussions? Why do non-black people want to say nigga so badly? And why is there an insistence that we make others understand basic in-group dynamics that they already engage in (sometimes with an implicit threat that our wishes will be ignored if we don't do a good enough job)?
I don't get it. I have no desire to step on the toes of cultures I don't belong to.
Aside from the racist fucks who use it for racist reasons, I think a lot of wypipo want to be able to get a pass to say it because it makes them cool? The everybody wants to be black but nobody wants to be black sort of thing. I see a lot of white folk think they get a pass because they are into hiphop culture or have a ton of black friends who let them get away with it. Like, none of their black friends tell them to shut the fuck up when they say it so they feel like they are down with their black friends on such a deep level that its ok use the term with an "a" at the end.
I always tell any white person I hear saying it who think they are cool to shut the fuck up. I don't even care if they get a pass in their circle of friends. You look and sound like a tool. stfu
But yeah, even when it comes to lyrics in a song. You still look like a tool when you say that shit out loud.
I always tell any white person I hear saying it who think they are cool to shut the fuck up. I don't even care if they get a pass in their circle of friends. You look and sound like a tool. stfu
But yeah, even when it comes to lyrics in a song. You still look like a tool when you say that shit out loud.
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I'm shocked this is 9 pages ( not that shocked actually, Era on their idiocy once again when it comes to Black issues). Should have been like the " partner " thread from yesterday, a bunch of " nope never ok to say" responses, followed by a mod closure because of the unanimous replies
We're always going to have this stupid fucking conversation because some of you donkeys just can't restrain yourselves.
Season 6 episode 1 of Black Mirror, John Hamm should make a copy of sentient code then subject the cloned copy to 400 yrs of enslavement. The clone then gets out and is allowed to say "nigga".
Goddamn lol what did White people ever do to you? Great post.
.... How is partner more unanimously off-limits than nigga????
You know what? I don't need this headache. I caught a Dragonite in Let's Go Pikachu and I will not let this nonsense ruin my day.
i think he means being allowed to say it was unanimous in that thread
and this one should be unanimous in the other direction
Whoa whoa yea I meant it should have been 100% responses of " you cant say the n word" here. I only used that example from yesterday because that's the first time I really ever saw a mod close something because all the responses were pretty much the same . Sorry for the confusion
I see tons of white people singing along and saying it at concerts and stuff so apparently the message isn't getting out there to the youths.
I went to go see Vince Staples a few months back, you better believe my white ass never said it.
I was thinking of Vince Staples.
All these white folks chanting when I asked 'em where my n***s at?
Goin' crazy, got me goin' crazy, I can't get wit' that
Wonder if they know, I know they won't go where we kick it at
Can't agree with that at all. Why can't people just listen to it and censor themselves if they aren't black? Is it some extremely difficult task?
You realize you're basically saying "the black people are the problem" right
What I find strange is, as someone who could get a pass using the word, now and back in the day, I didn't use it then and I don't use it now.
I remember one time using it in front of a close black friend of mine, and it didn't feel right at all to me, this was in like 93'-94'.
Thing is I would easily get a pass given the usage context, on top of being brown and that hip-hop is in my entire frame of my being, as a person born in 78' who grew up in Flatbush Brooklyn.
But I always felt that word was wrong and off limits. I thought kids of today would feel even more off saying that 'ish. It's really bewildering to me that where in this kind of regression phase with some of the youth.
I have 2 daughters, both under 12, they go-to a predominantly white school as we live in New Hampshire. I have had to start reviewing certain race related issues with them just to keep things clear, they most def fully understand about the n word and when they hear it, you can see they view it as a curse word.
However I did have to explain a few other race related things. Something's I was surprised were even fuzzy to begin with.
They were minor issues, but nonetheless, it's crap that there's any of it. I've been encouraging both of them to check and correct any friends who come with any kind of that BS.
I try to make sure they understand the "why's" of things clearly so they can explain it to others. So far so good, but will see as they get older.
I remember one time using it in front of a close black friend of mine, and it didn't feel right at all to me, this was in like 93'-94'.
Thing is I would easily get a pass given the usage context, on top of being brown and that hip-hop is in my entire frame of my being, as a person born in 78' who grew up in Flatbush Brooklyn.
But I always felt that word was wrong and off limits. I thought kids of today would feel even more off saying that 'ish. It's really bewildering to me that where in this kind of regression phase with some of the youth.
I have 2 daughters, both under 12, they go-to a predominantly white school as we live in New Hampshire. I have had to start reviewing certain race related issues with them just to keep things clear, they most def fully understand about the n word and when they hear it, you can see they view it as a curse word.
However I did have to explain a few other race related things. Something's I was surprised were even fuzzy to begin with.
They were minor issues, but nonetheless, it's crap that there's any of it. I've been encouraging both of them to check and correct any friends who come with any kind of that BS.
I try to make sure they understand the "why's" of things clearly so they can explain it to others. So far so good, but will see as they get older.
I watched American Honey a few weeks ago and was a bit taken aback when a white female character says "nigga".
What's this from?
What's this from?
I made peace with the fact that Black people's humanity will always take a backseat, cause it is the path of least resistance, easy just go with the flow. Think about it, it's one word and people pretend like asking them not to say it is infringing on their civil rights. It's not even a inconvience, they don't lose antyhign from it, they don't gain anything from it, but still to some folks it is like asking for their first born. White sumprancy is more powerful than the infinity gauntlet. With a snap it can unfy everyone to shit on black people.
Honest question: why not just have the word be taboo for everyone? The history of the word is drenched in a racist past, so why still use it? Also, wouldn't "reclaiming" the word for it to not be a bad word anymore mean it can then be a normal word, in turn allowing more people to use it(if it's not used as a slur anymore)?
Also want to make clear I've never said the word before, even in songs. It makes me uncomfortable to say due to its history.
Also want to make clear I've never said the word before, even in songs. It makes me uncomfortable to say due to its history.
Thats not how reclaiming works. Its an effort of the affected group to take something and reappropriate with their discretion. If the origin of the word is a slur towards another racial group, why would it ever be appropriate for the original group to continue using it? Who does that help?
Here's a deal Im sure people would make, Lets stop discriminating against Black People for job opportunities, start paying them equal wage compared to White counterparts, and stop us getting killed from Police. Then maybe we can look at people using nigga for everybody!
yeah, not happening.
Also this shit got clamped down on a lot more than in the past ever since we saw the rise of Clown man take the presidency. So its highly ironic that now... of all times ever, white people would think that the black community cares about anything they have to say regarding our culture and our community.
Because it is both a reclaimed word, and a hateful word with an unforgettable hateful past. It is both of these things. It just is. And it always will be. You can complain that this is the case all you want, you can talk about how things should be, who should and shouldn't say it, whether certain people should have a "pass", none of that fucking matters. The word is what it is.
If it was somehow decided that Black people would stop using the word, then it would just be White people using it in racism, and you'd still have the same problem, you'd just hear the world less from Black people, sure. Unless you are implying that the White racists that let it rip learned it from rap music. It's staying around regardless.
The word is reclaimed though so it's not going away with Black people, White people like me are just going to have to accept that. Super easy for me to do, I think the word is ugly and have no desire to use it, and I'm also not a racist or willfully ignorant to the racism behind the word in pretty much any context when used by a White person.
Does the work "cracker" have 1000+ years of oppression and exploitation behind it?
The answer is no, by the way.
That look on someone's face when they first hear "Rednecks" by Randy Newman. Sublime. Or when they listen to the words and figure out the story of "Sail Away"...
More on topic - I skip it like FM radio. But I don't sing along to many songs that feature the word anyway, besides the previously mentioned Rednecks.
More on topic - I skip it like FM radio. But I don't sing along to many songs that feature the word anyway, besides the previously mentioned Rednecks.
Because shitbags are going to use it to degrade black people no matter what, so why not turn it into our own thing?
it's not like non black people don't realize what they're doing when they use it as an epithet. they just don't care.