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Persona 6 needs to have nothing short of LGBT dating options.
- Thread starter WarpSpeedMolasses
- Start date
They don't need to do it, the people making the game have no interest in doing it, so what good is there in forcing them to do it? You should look into devs/games that are interested in this topic and play those games. Otherwise you'll end up in a few years making a thread "Atlus messed up representation" when they have no intention of conveying a more inclusive representation.
In short, let devs make what they want, play or don't play.
In short, let devs make what they want, play or don't play.
Nah, fuck that.
As fans we must pressure them to make shit we want to see, especially when it's something as normal as a homosexual relationship. If they don't listen and want to be conservative as fuck, it is their right. But we can still complain and apply pressure to see representation.
Saying "they were homophobic in the past, so they might screw up representation so better not try" is ridiculous ethranes.
While it's true that FORCING people to be progressive rarely results in them doing a good job at it, we still need to make it clear to them that what they're doing isn't acceptable in the modern sphere. They need to hire more diverse writers and account for more tastes than just the one particular demographic of anime fans they've been catering to consistently for the last three Persona titles.
And the only way they'll do that is if they know that's what consumers want.
If the Persona team can't be arsed to do a proper LGBT person, they deserve the flack they get.
Gay people ain't some enigma that's impossible to write. The Persona team writes about aliens and demons full of mythology and symbolism, but the moment anyone says "make a good LGBT character" suddenly it's "don't FORCE them!"
The hell!? Persona is literally a series about teens facing societal stigmas, and you're telling me their games DON'T tackle queer relationships!?
Gay people ain't some enigma that's impossible to write. The Persona team writes about aliens and demons full of mythology and symbolism, but the moment anyone says "make a good LGBT character" suddenly it's "don't FORCE them!"
The hell!? Persona is literally a series about teens facing societal stigmas, and you're telling me their games DON'T tackle queer relationships!?
Well they are already putting LGBT characters in their games and they are doing it, for the most part of the time, in a very bad and offensive way so...
I don't like at all how ATLUS handle LGBT characters, I would prefer that they directly avoid the thing.
Being offended by a videogame? No thanks, the real life is already a pile of s*it from that point of view.
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- For those saying, they'll fuck it up, I'm not arguing for just LGBT inclusion. Onviously I want *competent* and well written queer characters in 6. Particularly because how poor the previous attempts were. It'd be a hugely positive gesture to right some wrongs.
- I'm honestly amazed at all the "organic/justification" arguments. Whatever "justification" exists for the straight and waifu chatacters is enough for LGBT characters too. (Do people who subscribe to "justification" arguments also hold this barometer for offensively implemented LGBT themes too? Cause Atlus took the intiative to do that all on their own.)
Sweet. Filled it out, and noted LGBT inclusion and Adult/College-aged cast for future Persona as far as interests go.
This kind of gatekeeping is not helpful. Yes, it needs to be handled in a non-homophobic manner, but if we hold gay representation/relationships hostage to a flawless standard, we'll never get much of it. That rhetoric, while sounding enticing at face value, only contributes to gay erasure. Whether well written, poorly written (but not homophobic), or anything in-between, representation is important — straight characters and their relationships run the gamut, and gay ones should too.
BioWare's gay relationships are certainly respectful, and perfectly fine for what they are. BioWare as a company is one of the most inclusive and progressive in the entire industry. Removing their efforts because they're imperfect would be hugely harmful, considering Dragon Age especially is a bastion for LGBT+ fans.
As for Persona: it has a history of poor representation — of LGBT people, of women, etc. It needs to improve, ideally with both positive LGBT representation and a female MC option.
User Banned (3 Days): Hostility towards another member
lol literally nothing of what I'm saying is homophobic you dweeb. How do you function in the real world? Convince me why Persona 6 needs homosexual relationships, especially with how poorly Atlus has treated them in the past. I don't know why anyone would speak as behalf of a population as if they're a monolith.
Do I welcome it? Fuck yeah. Does it matter? No.
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I think what they're trying to say is that whatever justification was set to let straight chatacters happen, is equally ample justification to greenlight LGBT characters.
Stuff like "they're ill equipped/they'll fuck it up" is no excuse. It reads a bit like the inclusivness version of "HD towns are hard".
No it doesn't, it's not like there aren't Japanese media, including games, that already tackled this properly.
I'd like that. I'd like a FeMC, too. Personally, I don't like the dating aspect but I get that others do.
I'd really like to shake things up at the top and get that one guy off the brand altogether. That feels like job one. Atlus really ought to get their shit on straight with this and other properties
I'd really like to shake things up at the top and get that one guy off the brand altogether. That feels like job one. Atlus really ought to get their shit on straight with this and other properties
If you notice, there are so few Atlus games that have female protagonists. I'd say many people inside Atlus share the same views as Hashino.
Sure, but again, speaking on behalf of a sexuality like it's a monolith is never a good strategy.
That being said, I'm all for inclusivity, because it's always fantastic seeing people represented.
I agree, behavior and decisions over several years & several titles suggest a corporate perspective
Name calling doesn't make you look smarter or more reasonable.
"Do I welcome it? Fuck yeah" bullshit, you are there arms crossed asking to be convinced this is a good idea.
You're the dude who called me homophobic, but yeah, my pot's definitely blacker than yours.
Your position of expecting same-sex couples to justify their equivalence to heterosexual couples in a video game is definitely homophobic. I don't know if you yourself are a homophobe, or just disfussing things from an angle you don't fully understand how shitty it is.
But seeing your attitude, I am starting to get a better picture of what you are that is for sure.
Man P5 is disappointing and it's not even the LGBT thing just in general
It never fails to boggle my mind how much they wasted such an interesting initial concept pitch on such blandness.
I honestly have never felt super thrilled by the dating stuff anyway; if anything, I'd rather not have dating in the game if it doesn't have a real impact on your stats/abilities.
Now, having a real substantial "social link level 11" thing tied to it (and not just different dialogue and cutscenes) would be cool.
Now, having a real substantial "social link level 11" thing tied to it (and not just different dialogue and cutscenes) would be cool.
Can you imagine if fans of all types of media had the same "pressure them to make shit we want" mentality? Imagine putting that same kind of pressure on artists, musicians, film makers, designers, inventors etc. Imagine that same pressure had been put on creators throughout history. What would we have ended up with?
We should let creatives do what they do best and either enjoy their work or move along if we don't like it. Some of the best games have been made thanks to publishers giving developers all of the creative freedom they need. Putting pressure on a creative process yields poor results.
Saying "pressure them to make shit we want" is ridiculous, Kurdel
It's the year 2019. Making games about teenagers going through Social Issues and ignoring the fact that gay people are a thing that exists in the world and not just the butt of jokes shows that their creative freedom is not yielding positive results.
Oh, you think they don't get pressure to include waifus and all that other shit? They are one of the companies the most guilty of fan service, why is my request ridiculous, again?
Saying same-sex relationship representation would upend creative freedom is what's ridiculous smh
What's kind of funny is Yusuke was about 3 lines away from being a gay romance option in 5. Should've went all the way because he was clearly bi.
While I like self inserts and romantic options, I genuinely believe that from a story perspective, there is no game that has both of those things that wouldn't benefit from having an actual main character with either a "canon" romance with someone or none at all.
I can 100% assure you Persona 5 has 9 'waifus' to choose from due to Atlus wanting to sell tons of figures and merch. Do you think Hashino and Soejima just pulled them from thin air?
I don't think they'd be able to write it well. I mean I don't think Kenji's storyline was done well in P4 and while it can be interpreted as about him coming to terms with his sexuality I think it's equally arguable (and based on the rest of it, what the writers intended) that it's about him coming to term with his "effeminate" tastes and how that contrasts with his societal role.
The pressure they're under may very well be the problem to begin with. Having more pressure put on them from fans isn't going to help anything.
Japan's culture is also very different than that of the US, so there's a good chance that pressure is just going to fall on deaf ears.
I'm all for having any type of relationships we want in the next Persona, but I'll never agree with putting pressure on creatives. Maybe because I've been in that situation myself.
I think personally I'm just done supporting Persona Team games until they start making significant changes to their writing and representation.
Not being homophobic is universal dude. Unless you're calling Japanese culture inherently homophobic.
Because Atlus has been notoriously bad at this.
Ubisoft has actually made good efforts for diversity on their games and game studios.
I guess I should have written 'should be universal', i.e. why does it seems that people think that you're tearing apart a culture when you're asking them to stop being bigots.
Now that's just outright false, some of if not all of your favorite video games, movies, and anything were made from a result of continuous pressure and limitations be it in the form of technology, peer demands or fan demands. This game made from complete creative freedom you speak of doesn't exist.
What an absolute fucking failure of a creator someone must be if "treating LGBT+ people like human beings" is such a fucking insurmountable hurdle. Like, they may be awful at what they do if that is something they can't overcome in their game about social rebellion, and that thought somehow never even comes to fucking mind. And nevermind making something out of outright ignorance, but to look at the years of criticism since, and to make something actively worse like they're doing with Catherine.
Hashino and the people that contributed to/approved those shitty decisions may be genuinely shit at their social commentary if that's the fucking trash response they come up with.
You should finish his arc because it's not bullshit at all.
Yeah, that's not what happened.
Agree with this post 100%.
In a series that lets you fuck a teacher, wish fulfillment seems to be a heavy part of Persona's branding. Thus, arguments against LGBT people wanting to be treated as people/dating inclusion holds a lot less water for me.
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but was he not relieved once he realized Naoto wasn't a boy but a girl - thus, his attraction could no longer be considered "gay"? Or did I miss something lol
Like, his arc wasn't just confined to liking girly things like sewing and being treated as gay as a result of liking these feminine items. He literally crushed on Naoto when he was under the impression that she was a boy, no?
