I just don't see it being adopted, gender is soo ingrained into the language and Spanish people are PROUD of Spanish, many of them have the mentality that it's a superior language to English.
I'm Latinx, a Spanish speaker, and every time "my people" go on their rants about how I can't use a word that -finally- makes me feel at home among my ethnic community for the first time in my life after decades upon decades of enduring homophobia and abuse from my family and friends for daring to be a little different, I die a little inside. Thanks to everyone in this thread for their contributions, and for always being so quick to forget that this isn't all just about white English speakers and their thoughts. Plenty of us in this shit just want to be seen - but with the way this conversation always goes, we never will be until we're six feet in the fucking ground.
Exactly. If someone explicitly says they're latinx I will use it for them. I would also ask what they think about latine out of curiosity and if that's okay too.On topic - I'll call people what they want to be called. This term seems manufactured, so I was always a bit confused by it, but if someone asked me to use it in reference to them that's fine. It clearly has not met widespread use, so likewise I would not default to it.
Exactly. If someone explicitly says they're latinx I will use it for them. I would also ask what they think about latine out of curiosity and if that's okay too.
FWIW, the ire seems reserved for (largely) white politicians and activists pushing it in the media as the default term for all Hispanic/Latino people. I don't think anybody has a problem with as a term of self-identification.
i don't remember exactly which video that gif comes from, but the guy's name is amrit bains. He has an extensive filmography, and it's all lovely.Three different answers lol, but the latter two sort of coincide with each other. I'd like to see this video, just for curiosity's sake.
You really should read the thread before dropping nonsemse like this.Always seemed like an unnatural, manufactured term made up by someone with no actual appreciation for the spanish language or its people.
And don't get me wrong, the intent may have been good, but the execution was terrible. Glad people are starting to see the term for what it is.
Too many responses read like they either don't know the term was created by and for trans and non binary community members or they do know and they don't care.
How the fuck are you supposed to say out loud "joto" or "puto" or "Maricón" and not sound stupid?Count me on this one. Its just such a damn stupid word to say and even hear which gets worse when you try to apply it to other words. How the fuck are you supposed to say out loud "Todxs" or "nosotrxs" and not sound stupid?
Very good point, and thank you. At least in the US, we know LGBT people aren't all that much of the population - so to the extent it is primarily LGBT Latinx people who use that word, of course the polling is going to reflect not much use. But nope nope nope, folks here are eager to erase us and say that such data means no one ever uses Latinx, and therefore no one ever should.I've constantly wondered about who they're polling with this kind of stuff, since I'm sure we'd see the same type of opinions with the population at large with the use of pronouns, and I always think, "Why should I care what the majority think when the people who need this aren't a part of that population?"
I appreciate you speaking on this.
All I desperately want is to be part of my own people. Latinx is the only word that lets me do that. Fuck right off.Always seemed like an unnatural, manufactured term made up by someone with no actual appreciation for the spanish language or its people.
And don't get me wrong, the intent may have been good, but the execution was terrible. Glad people are starting to see the term for what it is.
I'm really fucking sorry you have to deal with this shit.
I've asked the mods to look into enforcing a rule about how we speak about this term, it's really gross how conversations happen in these threads.
fuck those people caring so much about their precious "language"
fuck that.
you are seen
I am really sorry for this. I think anyone who identifies and feels represented by latinx should be respected in their preference. I think the experiences of some queer Hispanic Americans are so fundamentally different to the rest of Latin American queer people where Latinx makes more sense so I think the term has its value, but I also understand how some other Latin American queer people feel the usage of x as culturally invasive. We can use both e and x!
Doesn't matter what the intent is when the impact is making people feel like alvmew expressed above.
I still don't understand why people keep trying to "ungender" Spanish, It's not happening. You would have to change so many words/gramatical rules that you would end up with a new language.
It's one thing trying to add a couple of words, but trying to change the language at a fundamental level like that is not happening.
Maybe English speakers don't see the big deal, but there's no Spanish word that combines those 3 phonemes and it's therefore challenging to pronounce for native Spanish speakers who don't speak English (in other words, most people in Latin America).
Backlash against the word is not backlash against any identity, you never see "latine" being targeted like this.
I think the term should be used with those who identify with it. Same with Latine. But I agree with you, trying to "ungender" Spanish is not going to happen without the language being fundamentally different. I think the issue at the heart of the pushback is the term being used to identify general groups instead of individuals, that was always going to end in a quagmire.
I don't have a problem with latinx or Latino. Everyone has a right to the label that they feel best identifies them, and everyone else should respect that.The large amount of posts saying things like "get rid of it, it's just white people nonsense, etc...".
If only a small amount of people identify with it, the rest should just stfu and respect the term.
And guess what? YOU DO NOT HAVE TO USE IT.
You don't have to use Hispanic. You don't have to use Latino or Latina or Latinx or (please let this win out) LATINE.
You can be Chicano or Mexican American or Boricua or WHATEVER THE HELL you want to be.
But, get this, friend. You don't have the power / authority to stop others from using WHATEVER THE HELL they want for themselves or to refer to the nebulous collective we [mostly] mestizo folx from Cemanahuac make up.
That's fair I guess. Respect their term and leave it at that. Thought it was a fair question but can see how my tone could be off. 👍
Another shit post. Jfc...
I don't have a problem with latinx or Latino. Everyone has a right to the label that they feel best identifies them, and everyone else should respect that.
What I do have a problem with is when people use latinx as a catch-all label. People have a right to identify with whatever label they like, but that doesn't extend to a right to force everyone else to identify with any particular label; especially one that 98% of us don't identify with. It is the opposite of inclusivity. If you really want to be inclusive, say any permutation of "latino, latina and latinx".
Yeah the gif was too much, I deleted it and cleared it up.
It's still a terrible post mocking a term someone ITT has expressed is important to them.Yeah the gif was too much, I deleted it and cleared it up.
Latinx I know was made for NB and yet, I think NB use Hispanic
I'd like to take a minute to remind folks here that the term was originally coined by Latin@ trans activists, not white people.
I don't know what to tell you, people who are not fans of the word are proposing "latine" in this very thread. I'm one of those, and for what is worth I'm gay and I have no intention of "protecting" the sanctity of gender or the Spanish language.Nah, it's absolutely infused with a larger backlash against acceptance of certain identities, so-called political correctness, efforts to make language more gender inclusive, and so on. You don't see "latine" being targeted as much because the backlash is fundamentally visceral, unexamined, and that particular word just isn't infused with the sort of baggage "Latinx" has been.
The pronunciation thing is overstated. For one thing, language isn't that rigid: we absorb words with foreign pronunciations all the time, including Spanish, which has borrowed a large number of English words, and pronouncing Latinx perfectly is hardly essential to its utility. Either way, I think it's totally okay if Latinx is a term that mostly has currency in bilingual Hispanic American communities. That doesn't make it inherently offensive.
Yes it is.
Sadly, that's the case.I still don't understand why people keep trying to "ungender" Spanish, It's not happening. You would have to change so many words/gramatical rules that you would end up with a new language.
It's one thing trying to add a couple of words, but trying to change the language at a fundamental level like that is not happening.
If you're telling me to call someone "latinx" - I can do that, I speak English.Yes it is.
You do not yet to propose other words for people to use when they have one they idenify with. It doesn't matter, at all, about the way you think language should be.
You're never going to fully "ungender" any language. That doesn't have to be the end result to make it useful to add gender neutral terms.
FWIW, the ire seems reserved for (largely) white politicians and activists pushing it in the media as the default term for all Hispanic/Latino people. I don't think anybody has a problem with as a term of self-identification.
No? We can't all pronounce words perfectly that are required to be respectful, we do our best.If you're telling me to call someone "latinx" - I can do that, I speak English.
Would it be problematic if my mother mispronounces it?
Based on polling 2% of people, and their choice should be respected. Which posts here are disappointing?
It's still a terrible post mocking a term someone ITT has expressed is important to them.
You can ask to not be called it, but mocking it the way you did "sounds like we''re X-Men" is shit.
I'm not coming up with any word myself, latine is already way more common with Mexican LGBT YouTubers.No? We can't all province words perfectly that are required to be respectful, we do our best.
The issue is was highlighting, that you sidestepped there, was that you do not have the right o people alternatives.
I'm going to have to disagree with that. You really think there is no issue with homophobia or transphobia in the entire Spanish speaking community.FWIW, the ire seems reserved for (largely) white politicians and activists pushing it in the media as the default term for all Hispanic/Latino people. I don't think anybody has a problem with as a term of self-identification.
Then they need to learn to listen to trans people and those who identity with the term.I apologize. I took it down.
It's just I just know the Hispanic community has violently rejected it and it's just a battle that will sadly never be won. The latin community still can't comprehend the non binary spectrum.
They just see it as a term white folk made up.
Another terrible post.Never heard anyone use it who isn't white, female, extremely educated, and painfully conscientious. A solution for a problem that never was.
It doesn't fucking matter.... You do not get to propose another identify for those who already have one.I'm not coming up with any word myself, latine is already way more common with Mexican LGBT YouTubers.