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Shenmue III is timed exclusive to Epic Games Store, backers PC code redeemed on EGS & no refund (See Threadmark) [READ STAFF POSTS BEFORE POSTING]

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Detail

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Dec 30, 2018
2,948
Violet said:
Yeah I mean, Epic sucks shit, Valve sucks shit, the PC market is in a bad way right now because everything has become an arms race of screwing over the consumer. It really sucks.
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I don't understand what Valve are doing (or any other company for that matter) which is making this an arms race? There is only one company involved here that is indulging in anti-consumer practices and it's Epic.

Tim Sweeney is the one buying exclusives, Tim Sweeney is the one purposefully pulling games from Steam and no other service, Tim Sweeney is the one making it difficult for PC Gamers to purchase games and removing choice from consumers.

It's Epic that are doing this, nobody else.
 
Cipherr

Cipherr

Member
Oct 26, 2017
13,439
Violet said:
I don't get how saying "man this discourse is really toxic but people should really get refunds for this" is somehow worse than "GO POST YOUR LIES SOMEWHERE ELSE" lmao
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You didnt say shit like that in your first post. And thats even considering you edited it and STILL didn't post anything like that. Don't even try to pretend you didnt deserve the reaction you got. You didnt empathize with people losing out on something they ordered nor suggest they should get refunds. You jumped into the thread, said everyone was overreacting then topped it off by suggesting they were all valve fanboys.

Kick rocks bruh, that was a terrible post.

Edit: And the double down. So yeah. Whatever dude, like someone else said, learn to use the ignore thread button if you cant scroll past a thread for whatever reason.
 
m_dorian

m_dorian

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,403
Athens, Greece
Violet said:
GoG is bad too.............. all storefronts matter buddy.


(derailing very real complaints with storefront wars is exactly the issue that I have with a lot of PC gaming threads, and sorry if i contributed to it which is exactly why i edited and thought the better of my first post haha)
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No, haha.
You persist on trolling people that have legitimate concerns about this situation and at the same time fail to be informed about the rules of this discussion with not reading the threadmarks.
Show some empathy and be nicer to people, think long and hard before posting on sensitive threads.
 
Lakeside

Lakeside

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,223
I was really, really happy to see that I never backed this. I'm officially out of any possible future Kickstarter funding for PC games. The Steam to Epic bait and switch is a big deal to me so gotta wait them out to make sure I don't get stuck with a key that I won't use.
 
AlteredBeast

AlteredBeast

Don't Watch the Tape!
Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,768
Chose PS4 physical release and I am glad I did so. I don't even own a PS4 yet, but obviously will buy when I receive my game.

Too bad about the Steam/EGS thing. It wouldn't be a big deal to me if I had chosen that option, but I don't really play PC games.
 
Demacabre

Demacabre

Member
Nov 20, 2017
2,058
Lakeside said:
I was really, really happy to see that I never backed this. I'm officially out of any possible future Kickstarter funding for PC games. The Steam to Epic bait and switch is a big deal to me so gotta wait them out to make sure I don't get stuck with a key that I won't use.
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This is really the worst part of this.There will be many people who will remember this in the future when it comes to a crowdfunded PC game now, and there will be genuine and hardworking studios that may never realize their max potential in getting crowd funds because Epic has poisoned the well.

Way to go helping the small devs, Tim...
 
Madjoki

Madjoki

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,230
Looks like this has been in works for sometime:

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Deleted member 29237

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
803
Fuck this, not even refunding is just shameless. Gonna have to switch to a PS4 key and sell it day 1 to get my money back I guess.
 
Gelf

Gelf

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,314
Checking my Kickstarter account said I'd ordered a PS4 copy but going to fangamer it was actually set to Steam. So if any one else couldn't remember which they went for be wary of that. Switched to PS4 for now, would much rather use that than Epic and at worst at least I can give away my copy.
 
StereoVSN

StereoVSN

Member
Nov 1, 2017
13,620
Eastern US
So, backers are not getting early access/beta, physical version or DLC that came out of nowhere. We do get our awesome EGS code though... I would say there is a case for legal action here. Plus slacker backer specifically stated steam key during purchase for add-one.
 
StereoVSN

StereoVSN

Member
Nov 1, 2017
13,620
Eastern US
Thinkdifferent said:
I don't understand what Valve are doing (or any other company for that matter) which is making this an arms race? There is only one company involved here that is indulging in anti-consumer practices and it's Epic.

Tim Sweeney is the one buying exclusives, Tim Sweeney is the one purposefully pulling games from Steam and no other service, Tim Sweeney is the one making it difficult for PC Gamers to purchase games and removing choice from consumers.

It's Epic that are doing this, nobody else.
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Deep Silver and Ys.net are just as guilty. Sweeney didn't hold them at a gunpoint to take that Tencent/Fortnite cash.
 
Danj

Danj

Member
Oct 26, 2017
651
Cambridge, UK
How do you go about switching from PC to PS4? It's been ages since this was kickstarted, I was having trouble finding the emails relating to it.
Also, it seems like (regardless of any terms and conditions or EULAs or whatever) this should be in violation of anti-bait and switch advertising laws here in the EU?
 
bell wood's jet cola

bell wood's jet cola

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,147
StereoVSN said:
So, backers are not getting early access/beta, physical version or DLC that came out of nowhere. We do get our awesome EGS code though... I would say there is a case for legal action here. Plus slacker backer specifically stated steam key during purchase for add-one.
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Where did they say we're not getting a beta? Well, I think they actually promised a demo, not a beta.
 

Deleted member 48897

User requested account closure
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Oct 22, 2018
13,623
Kyougar said:
immense backlash from people who kickstarted this game who try to get their money back from Kickstarter, who report the kickstarter page as fraud. With this and the decline of PC Kickstarters, this could be the nail in the coffin of big Kickstarted games because the loss of trust from the people who pledge on Kickstarter.
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I honestly think that's great. People shouldn't be backing big projects on kickstarter and shouldn't be trying to overfund projects to send a message either. Kickstarter is awful for anything except seed funding for small stuff because there's otherwise no way to give small creators the cash they need to support their projects. I feel about Kickstarter the way I feel about using these funding sources for things like necessary medical expenses which is that they wouldn't fucking matter in societies that actually put money toward things in the public interest / providing for all citizens.
 
Bowl0l

Bowl0l

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Oct 27, 2017
4,608
muteKi said:
I honestly think that's great. People shouldn't be backing big projects on kickstarter and shouldn't be trying to overfund projects to send a message either. Kickstarter is awful for anything except seed funding for small stuff because there's otherwise no way to give small creators the cash they need to support their projects. I feel about Kickstarter the way I feel about using these funding sources for things like necessary medical expenses which is that they wouldn't fucking matter in societies that actually put money toward things in the public interest / providing for all citizens.
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Do we have a guide line on what not to back?
 
Hucast

Hucast

alt account
Banned
Mar 25, 2019
3,598
So my plan If refund is impossible i'll receive the PS4 version, sell it and buy panzer dragoon instead.

I used to be a huge fan of shenmue and yu suzuki but honestly this soured me off the whole thing. Screw the whole game and screw yu suzuki as a scam artist
 
Reticon6

Reticon6

Banned
Oct 19, 2018
177
10,000m under surface level
First impression always counts - this - being my first Kickstarter and by far the most I have spent on a video game definitely soured me on an already questionable industry (loot boxes, progression grind, etc).

Kickstarter was supposed to be a statement - a means to bring games that would not make it a abusive capitalist environment. And now, it is under that same shadow that affected a product outside their corporate boundaries. FUCK. FUCK. FUCK THIS INDUSTRY!!!!

So now they expect me - a backer of $500 to wait it out for the platform of choice I wanted too be in? Their audacity to go on their way to screw the very people - against all the odds of supporting an extremely niche product is a slap to the face, I would ever experience as a backer.
 

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Bowl0l said:
Do we have a guide line on what not to back?
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I would say anything large enough to possibly get Epic's attention, especially if they are using Unreal Engine. That's the high risk area right there.

Thing is though, Epic are clearly expanding out. They recently made deals with Untitled Goose Game and What the Golf. 2 fairly low budget Unity games. Anything seems to be on the table now.
 
Demacabre

Demacabre

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Nov 20, 2017
2,058
Bowl0l said:
Do we have a guide line on what not to back?
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Honestly, it is now a gamble. Idk what to tell you. Read the pitch and if they seem extremely forth coming, have a detailed plan, and nothing vague. I suspect this will have ripples for crowdfunded pc games moving forward with either the team addressing this or people asking from the start. But, the well has been poisoned.
 
Veliladon

Veliladon

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,559
Epic Games: You will buy from us come hell or high water because no games will come out on Steam ever again!

Fuck Tim Sweeney. Not going to kickstart a game again unless there's something ironclad that it won't be money hatted.
 
TAJ

TAJ

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
12,446
Fisty said:
They delayed the game during polishing and then conveniently announced a big cash injection from Epic, come on it's not calculus. Its a lot more reasonable than saying they are just taking money... just because? Because they WANT to fuck their PC fans? Like what is Yu's motivation here? To purposely tank this IP hes poured his life into?
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Some people were speculating earlier that the delay was to remove Steam.

Violet said:
actually not worth it valve fans are obsessed with getting people banned
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I haven't touched a PC game in the last three years except a copy of FFXI that I bought from Gamersgate, (what a retroactively unfortunate name) but ok.
 

Deleted member 19218

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I guess it's a good thing I backed two copies, one for the console and one for the PC.

I don't have a problem with EGS, I have it installed on my computer but I just like having all my games consolidated in one location so unless it is on Steam, I won't be playing it. The only exception I make is for Blizzard games which has their own launcher because that WoW game just sucks me in.
 
Kei-

Kei-

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Mar 1, 2018
1,041
I'm fully in support of the EPIC game store and them "moneyhatting" exclusives, but this is not reasonable as backward were explicitly given the option of a Steam version. If a Steam version can't be provided, a refund should be issued.

However all the anger should be towards the publisher, not Epic, they accepted the conditions.

If they will be provided a Steam key at a later date, that soothes it a bit I guess.
 
BMW

BMW

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
2,703
Y'all should just do a chargeback - bam problem resolved. Don't make it harder than it needs to be.
 
AHA-Lambda

AHA-Lambda

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Oct 25, 2017
11,812
MrLuchador said:
I'm no expert, yet I feel this falls firmly within bait & switch within the EU/UK Consumer Protection laws.




Good luck with the 'no refunds' policy adopted with EU Citizens.
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Anywhere to report this to then for UK/EU citizens?
BMW said:
Y'all should just do a chargeback - bam problem resolved. Don't make it harder than it needs to be.
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It was 4 years ago, almost certainly not possible
 

Deleted member 10726

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ResetERA
Given it's timed exclusivity, I'll just wait for the Steam release.

I've waited this long for Shenmue 3, I'm in no rush to get it into my hands now.
 

Deleted member 3208

Oct 25, 2017
11,934
Kei- said:
I'm fully in support of the EPIC game store and them "moneyhatting" exclusives, but this is not reasonable as backward were explicitly given the option of a Steam version. If a Steam version can't be provided, a refund should be issued.

However all the anger should be towards the publisher, not Epic, they accepted the conditions.

If they will be provided a Steam key at a later date, that soothes it a bit I guess.
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Epic either accepted to give them money, or tried to bribe them. Epic is not innocent and they deserve to be blamed, just like Ys Net.

Not that they care. Sweeney seems to love the bad PR.
 
Cpt-GargameL

Cpt-GargameL

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Oct 27, 2017
7,024
Nappael said:
I generally like GOG, and if they did something like this I guarantee that I would be up in arms about it. Just as much as others are in here. Especially since this goes completely against everything they have claimed to stand for, and have backed up for years.

I am really fucking tired of all the problems being handwaved away as just "steam fans" causing a ruckus.Epic are enforcing walled gardens on a previously open platform. They are poisoning the well of crowdfunding campaigns, damaging people's trust in future projects. Shenmue 3 backers expected something they are not getting and are not getting a refund for it.

There are so many legitimate reasons to be mad that have nothing to do with steam. And yet ignorant people keep flooding these threads with "oh it's just another launcher, why do people care?", "People are just angry steam fanboys", and other stupid shit. Even after having staff in here giving a warning to stop that stupid shit.




This is both sides nonsense. Epic are doing much, much worse than Valve have ever done. In fact, if you have been paying attention, Valve have basically done absolutely nothing in this "arms race" (???) you are talking about. It's only Epic, and guess who people have the problems with
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.
 
Veliladon

Veliladon

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Oct 27, 2017
5,559
Gaming as a hobby is looking pretty shit. By 2025 every publisher is going to have their own client, you'll have Balkanized exclusivities all over the place, all your friend lists might as well be scattered to the quantum fucking winds, and there's going to a dozen subscription services ready to nickle and dime IPs for all that they are worth.

I'm just about done with this hobby. Bar some Switch games (since Nintendo seem to have not lost their fucking minds) I might just stop pouring money into it completely.
 
MrLuchador

MrLuchador

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Oct 25, 2017
2,486
The Internet
AHA-Lambda said:
Anywhere to report this to then for UK/EU citizens?
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Your local trading standards!

UK: https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/consumer/get-more-help/report-to-trading-standards/

What should you report to Trading Standards
You should report a company to Trading Standards if, for example:

  • they misled you into buying their products or services
  • they sold you unsafe or dangerous items
  • they didn't carry out the work properly, for example, their work left your home in a dangerous state
  • they sold you fake or counterfeit items
  • they pressured you to buy something you didn't want to buy
  • they sold you a car that wasn't 'roadworthy' (it would cause danger if it was on the road)
How to report a trader to Trading Standards
Call the Citizens Advice consumer helpline and tell them you want to report a trader to Trading Standards. The consumer helpline will assess your problem and pass it on to Trading Standards if it's appropriate.
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Deleted member 45765

Banned
Jul 10, 2018
1,050
The thing about doing things for money, is that you'll eventually spend that money. Then, all you're left with is the thought of what you did for that money.

Microsoft stealing US Shenmue II was a moneybags play, and here we go again.
 
Border

Border

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
14,859
I think this will have no real effect on Kickstarter. Every time some Kickstarter game turns out to be a dud somebody claims that it is going to kill the crowdfunding platform, but they just keep chugging along.

Like, there's Kickstarter games that never even shipped. People who had their money taken and received nothing in return whatsoever. Developers who completely admit that they ran out of money and have basically stopped working on their Kickstarter projects. By comparison, Shenmue is still a pretty highly successful project. If all the the games that never even got made didn't tank Kickstarter.......if all the cancelled WiiU/Vita ports didn't matter.....then Shenmue flipping to Epic probably won't either. People are still getting the game they backed, even if they refuse to use the distribution platform it is on.

At worst, creators may have to doubly-emphasize their commitment to Steam, GoG, or DRM-free downloads just to get people on board. Going forward people will not be able to assume a guaranteed Steam copy unless the KS page explicitly and emphatically states it.
 
Kei-

Kei-

Member
Mar 1, 2018
1,041
inner-G said:
I disagree. They made this deal knowing how it may be received by the fans. EGS is not ignorant of its own reputation.
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They can offer anything they want, no deal is made until it is accepted by the other party. Are you saying it was "too good to resist"

Linkark07 said:
Epic either accepted to give them money, or tried to bribe them. Epic is not innocent and they deserve to be blamed, just like Ys Net.

Not that they care. Sweeney seems to love the bad PR.
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It is not a bribe in any way. Perfectly legal to try to secure exclusive distribution rights. As I've said, I fully support their business practice and find nothing wrong with "moneyhatting".
 
Ebullientprism

Ebullientprism

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Oct 25, 2017
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Not giving people a refund is genuinely awful. And I say that as someone who has a decent number of games on his EGS account.

Like, I have no problems with EGS and I genuinely think most complaints about it are stupidly overblown or extremely inconsequential. But if you promise people something and dont deliver, they have every right to ask for a refund.
 
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