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Neoxon

Spotlighting Black Excellence - Diversity Analyst
Member
Oct 25, 2017
85,426
Houston, TX
As I mentioned in a previous thread, Street Fighter V alone has quite a bit of people of color in its current roster, especially compared to most other fighting games. Plus, from the perspective of black/brown characters, Capcom has quite a few both in SFV & in the vault. Hell, we even have a transgender character in the form of Poison & a gay character in the form of Eagle. But in many other ways, Street Fighter has a ton of potential to be more progressive & inclusive than it already is for both women & people of color. And given Capcom's Redemption Arc that's going on right now between Resident Evil 7, Resident Evil 2 Remake, Devil May Cry 5, Monster Hunter World, & Mega Man 11 (more so on the quality of these games, not so much the representation....something I'd like to see positive change for all these IPs), I'd like to believe that there's reason to be hopeful for positive change at Capcom. To be more specific, these are some of the things I'd like to see changed with Street Fighter going forward so the series can live up to its potential from a socially progressive standpoint.


BRING MORE BLACK/BROWN CHARACTERS TO THE FOREFRONT

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I think the man who inspired this thread put it best, at least with regards to Sean Matsuda.
Eh, he's mostly not known.

Folks out here making super hero films with black leads and shit and winning awards. Read the room, make him less of a joke understand you have an audience that might not appreciate that almost every black character street fighter makes is kind of a joke, kinda racist or an idiot and evolve your design philosphy.

Having a genuinely cool afro lantino shoto would be really good fucking press for SF6
Sean is literally the personification of the untapped potential Capcom has on this front. In a world where Black Panther & Miles Morales have made it big in the eyes of the general public, bringing Sean Matsuda to the forefront as an actually good & relevant character (yes, I know he was good in 2nd Impact, but still) would be a big win for Capcom & the Street Fighter franchise. Of course, I'm not saying just Sean, I'm also arguing for more black/brown newcomers as well as other people of color to be brought into the roster (Laura is a step in the right direction, aside from her design.....which I'll mention next). Credit where it's due, there's already quite a bit of racial diversity (even if they're mostly marred with stereotypes, which I'll mention later). But like with most topics in this thread, a lot more can be done.


TONE DOWN THE SEXUALIZATION (at least for the default designs)

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While this issue has existed prior to Street Fighter V, the problem has become more prevalent in SFV. This is unfortunate because SFV made a number of strides with regards to updating certain designs, especially for Sakurai & Karin. But for every Menat & Karin, there's also a Rainbow Mika & Laura situation. And in the case of Rainbow Mika, her design was even more sexualized than she was in Alpha 3. It's gotten to the point where certain default designs (namely Cammy, Rainbow Mika, & Laura) can't be used at major tournaments that are aired on TV (Ex: EVO). That's not to mention the sexualization of under-aged characters like Menat with regards to their alternate costumes. At the very least, Capcom should tone down the fan service for the default designs (& please, give Cammy pants for her default design) since that's what most people are gonna see when they first play the game or when they watch tournaments (since Capcom can easily just restrict TV-broadcasted tournaments to just the default costumes). The track suits are fantastic, but more options for the ladies that aren't sexualized would be nice (plus avoid sexualization altogether for any characters under 18). Though concerning the breast sizes, that actually goes into my next topic...


HAVE MORE BODY TYPE DIVERSITY, ESPECIALLY AMONGST THE LADIES

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Obviously this isn't representative of all the ladies in SFV, but it should give you an idea of my general argument.

For one, I'll commend Capcom for making the women of Street Fighter well-toned from a muscular standpoint, especially in SFV. It's refreshing to see amongst a sea of thinner female fighters in other fighting game franchises, so credit where credit is due. However, one of the things that stuck out to me in SFV it that, outside of a few differentiating factors (Ex: Chun-Li's thighs, Cammy's leg muscles, etc.), the women of SFV have more-or-less the same body type. The most different of the lot is Menat thanks to her smaller frame & breast size, and even she isn't that much different compared to the other women in the game. Speaking of breast size, it seems like (Menat aside) everyone has large breasts in Street Fighter V (even Karin, which is more evident with her swimsuit). I'm not saying that big breasts are bad or that the existing body types are terrible, I'm just saying that it would be nice if Capcom did more to make the body types of each of the ladies different from one another. For example, Karin can be a bit thinner since she's more of a technical fighter (but keep her decently toned in terms of her muscles), while Rainbow Mika can have way more muscle on her by virtue of her being a pro wrestler. Though I'd imagine that this is a problem that would be better solved with giving potential new female fighters radically different body types (Ex: a plus-sized female fighter). Just don't lose the muscles on the ladies, that's one thing that I like.


UPDATE SOME OF THE MORE PROBLEMATIC CHARACTERS

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To Capcom's credit, they have moved away from adding anymore racial stereotypes with their recent newcomers (Ex: Rashid, one of Street Fighter's best newcomers in a while). But there still stands the fact that some of the previous additions may have veered too far into their respective racial stereotypes. This is especially true for Dee Jay, who can easily be seen as a racial stereotype. While true, changing characters like him that radically may be a bit tough since Dee Jay has been around for a good long while, that hasn't stopped Capcom from re-desigining a good chunk of the Street Fighter V cast's veterans. So maybe they could do the same for Dee Jay & a number of others. Granted, I wouldn't lose any sleep if Dee Jay never came back, but I understand that he has his fans. The same applies to T. Hawk with regards to the Native American stereotypes that can be found with his character & his design, especially after how Iron Galaxy revamped Thunder's design to be culturally-appropriate. But what irks me the most is how Capcom handled Santamu.
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As someone who's Eritrean-American (yeah, she's Ethiopean, but both nations are Habesha in terms of ethnicity), it breaks my heart that the first Habesha character in the Street Fighter series (albeit an NPC, but still) is another racial stereotype. My only hope is that now that she & the other Dolls are free, they can do a total course-correction with her character should Santamu make the jump to being a playable character in a future Street Fighter game.


To paraphrase Village, Capcom's other franchises are paying more attention to the world around them (to varying-but-decent degrees), while Street Fighter is progressing much slower compared to the rest. Even within the fighting game genre as a whole, we have games like Mortal Kombat (Sonya's VA aside) & (more recently) ARMS that are being more progressive with its characters. That's not to say that there's no progress at all within Street Fighter, as Rashid & Menat prove. But there's a lot Capcom can do to make Street Fighter more progressive as a whole that they simply aren't taking full advantage of, & I hope that they do more in Street Fighter VI & beyond.

Special thanks to Village for inspiring the topic of this thread.
 
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DanteMenethil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,062
How would they redesign DeeJay? His whole character is Jamaican stereotype. His friggin name is DJ lol
 

Lant_War

Classic Anus Game
The Fallen
Jul 14, 2018
23,594
Street Fighter has consistently gotten better with representation. If I had to guess, we're going to see more of what you talk about in the post (different body types, origins, and characters that respect a culture without mocking it) in Street Fighter 6, the fanservice will probably stay (it sells) but chances of getting another R.Mika or Laura are pretty slim.

With that said, I feel like counting Poison as good representation is kinda cheating, considering the reason she's trans :p
 

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 17, 2018
44,208
Street Fighter's whole brand has been built on stereotypes since SF2, so I would be curious to see how Capcom would address that going forward.
 

Joe2187

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,521
BRING BACK THE ORIGINAL RUFUS CONCEPT YOU COWARDS!

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THIS MAN TURNED INTO THIS SOMEHOW

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NSESN

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,332
As someone who's Eritrean-American (yeah, she's Ethiopean, but both nations are Habesha in terms of ethnicity), it breaks my heart that the first Habesha character in the Street Fighter series (albeit an NPC, but still) is another racial stereotype. My only hope is that now that she & the other Dolls are free, they can do a total course-correction with her character should Santamu make the jump to being a playable character in a future Street Fighter game.
OP as someone that doesn't know about the stereotype can you explain this one?
 

Ferrs

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
18,829
Capcom's Redemption Arc that's going on right now between Resident Evil 7, Resident Evil 2 Remake, Devil May Cry 5, Monster Hunter World, & Mega Man 11, I'd like to believe that there's reason to be hopeful for positive change at Capcom. ]

If we look at MHW and DMC5... I don't think there's any hope to be positiva for improving representation of female characters and minorities.
 

DanteMenethil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,062
Ki's Thunder character was just a native american steretype they redid him to be more respectful

I don't know if that example applies to DeeJay though. They redid Thunder with advice from actual natives on what clothes he should wear and so on, there's no such authority on Jamaican wear and visual styling I think.
 

sibarraz

Prophet of Regret - One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
18,117
Is kinda funny how some people trash games like DOA or Soul Calibur for their female designs while praising something like Street Fighter where we are supposed to believe that a female MI6 commando uniform would be something that you would find in an strip club.
 

i-hate-u

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,374
How will Capcom justify including different shaped women when like the only reason SFV is still alive is because people buy up female alt costumes?
 

Jobbs

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
5,639
How about just not have all the characters look stupid and ugly? That'd be a good first step. Yikes.
 

Leviathan

Banned
Oct 28, 2017
2,065
Is kinda funny how some people trash games like DOA or Soul Calibur for their female designs while praising something like Street Fighter where we are supposed to believe that a female MI6 commando uniform would be something that you would find in an strip club.
DOA only falls short in DLC and marketing. I'd argue the actual substance beneath all that, and even many of the most iconic costumes are far less problematic than its competitors.
 
Nov 18, 2017
2,932
The brand is built around stereotypes as has been stated multiple times.

But they could still do better.

The sexualisation in V is horrible and needs to go.
 

OG_Thrills

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,655
Has anyone else noticed that the winning comments to Balrog are always about his misuse of money or aggression? I picked him up as my main relatively recently and I couldn't help but think the responses tailored towards him are the most negative stereotypical comments I've seen.

One comment is something like "What do you do with your money?" And I'm thinking, "what?"
 

NinjaGarden

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,550
SFV going for the boob fighter audience was so disappointing. Hopefully they dial that back big time for 6.
 
Apr 16, 2018
1,760
All Street Fighter characters are caricatures of the cultures/ethnicities they represent.

For what you want to really happen, they'd have to scrap the whole series and try again without the parodies and stereotypes.

Might be better for Capcom to just do what you ask with a series whose identity isn't specifically tied to the portrayal of the characters.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,810
I don't know if that example applies to DeeJay though. They redid Thunder with advice from actual natives on what clothes he should wear and so on, there's no such authority on Jamaican wear and visual styling I think.

That don't mean you can't go out and actually talk to people. One of the most famous examples of this is rockstar going out and actually talking to old gangbangers to try and present them properly in san andreas

It doesn't hurt to get different perspectives

Has anyone else noticed that the winning comments to Balrog are always about his misuse of money or aggression? I picked him up as my main relatively recently and I couldn't help but think the responses tailored towards him are the most negative stereotypical comments I've seen.
Because he's the agressive money minded guy, he's that steretype.
 

NSESN

▲ Legend ▲
Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,332
Also, as a Brazilian ,I don't like Sean much because he goes the total opposite direction, and has nothing to do with being brazilian.
 

sibarraz

Prophet of Regret - One Winged Slayer
Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
18,117
DOA only falls short in DLC and marketing. I'd argue the actual substance beneath all that, and even many of the most iconic costumes are far less problematic than its competitors.

If you only compare characters using static pictures, then DOA is less problematic, but in actual gameplay, you still find some unnecesary panty shots with some characters like honoka (I know that sakura have them too, but they are not THAT prominent) or the stupid boob jiggling.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,810
All Street Fighter characters are caricatures of the cultures/ethnicities they represent.

For what you want to really happen, they'd have to scrap the whole series and try again without the parodies and stereotypes.

Might be better for Capcom to just do what you ask with a series whose identity isn't specifically tied to the portrayal of the characters.

That's false because not only are there plenty of characters who aren't stereotypes

Arguably all the most popular ones, aren't. actually. Even back to street fighter 2

What stereotype is cammy
What stereotype is sagat?
 

Cordy

Member
Oct 25, 2017
15,354
Man they need to do something, some of these characters still feel like they're straight outta Stereotype Fighter 2 given they haven't received any updates.

How will Capcom justify including different shaped women when like the only reason SFV is still alive is because people buy up female alt costumes?
Damn.
Damn.
Damn.
 

Ferrs

Avenger
Oct 26, 2017
18,829
DOA only falls short in DLC and marketing. I'd argue the actual substance beneath all that, and even many of the most iconic costumes are far less problematic than its competitors.

heh the gap is getting closer for sure and I agree that SC6 got for the most part free of comments compared to DOA6, but DOA still have some of the stuff like the losing poses where you can ogle (dunno if 6 have them too)
 

DanteMenethil

Member
Oct 25, 2017
8,062
All Street Fighter characters are caricatures of the cultures/ethnicities they represent.

For what you want to really happen, they'd have to scrap the whole series and try again without the parodies and stereotypes.

Might be better for Capcom to just do what you ask with a series whose identity isn't specifically tied to the portrayal of the characters.

Yeah SF2 was subtitled The World Warrior, representing countries was at the forefront. They don't need to scrap the whole series regarding the caricature issue though they just need to be mindful and respectful of what they are trying to represent
 

OG_Thrills

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
4,655
Because he's the agressive money minded guy, he's that steretype.

Every Character is aggressive. Sure some can be used in defensive playstyles but it's a fighting game. Secondly, ever character comments directed at Balrog and his misuse of money is a really negative stereotype. It seems lazy in my humble opinion. He's a character in a video game. The negative stereotype goes beyond that.
 

Silky

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
10,522
Georgia
I honestly think Balrog has improved a lot since SF4. No more bulging eyes and lips like in his old designs.
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,810
Yeah SF2 was subtitled The World Warrior, representing countries was at the forefront. They don't need to scrap the whole series regarding the caricature issue though they just need to be mindful and respectful of what they are trying to represent
Being aware of the world around them would help that. I think Rashid is the result of this, talking to people to produce a character thats actually cool.

And maybe not unironically introducing two characters that are basically neo nazi's but the good guys
 

Jaded Alyx

Member
Oct 25, 2017
35,395
Has anyone else noticed that the winning comments to Balrog are always about his misuse of money or aggression? I picked him up as my main relatively recently and I couldn't help but think the responses tailored towards him are the most negative stereotypical comments I've seen.

One comment is something like "What do you do with your money?" And I'm thinking, "what?"
Because that's his entire personality and attitude. He is an overly aggressive, money-hungry dude. He literally yells out "my fight moneyyyyyyyyy!!!!!!" when he loses in IV
 

Village

Member
Oct 25, 2017
11,810
I honestly think Balrog has improved a lot since SF4. No more bulging eyes and lips like in his old designs.
Oh yeah, even as a character. He actually like feels things and shit. Raising ed made him more interesting . Also he's like the only one who see's the shadowloo ship sinking and is already trying to get off.

Every Character is aggressive. Sure some can be used in defensive playstyles but it's a fighting game. Secondly, ever character comments directed at Balrog and his misuse of money is a really negative stereotype. It seems lazy in my humble opinion. He's a character in a video game. The negative stereotype goes beyond that.
I'm not defending this I agree with what you are saying. I'm just stateting that steretype. Like if balrog was made today, he wouldn't be a boxer or rather he would also be a rapper.

He's that guy. Some of his alts reflect that. He's " Money all the time, money on my mind " black guy
 

Joe2187

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,521
Cobra's design was neat, but do we really need another shoto at this point?

Compared to what we got?

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Also he wasnt designed as a shoto

his fighting style was chinese style martial arts mixed with break dancing type flourishes, called break-fu marrying hard hitting strikes and kicks, more like Yun, yang, Julia from tekken and what not