That's one way to put in chaos control effects. I like it.
I've accepted sonic adventure
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Fair points. I can honestly say I just don't keep up with the Sonic community, so I have no fucking idea what they're into. I'm getting old and out of touch.
By anyone online who isn't a Sonic fan for over a decade? Like...I don't think saying Shadow is a divisive character is a fucking stretch, unless that shit has changed in the last 10 years, or everyone is this thread is a teenager?
Reading this thread would apparently give you the opposite impression.
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I'm still mixed on extra third party reps from the same series. If they do it, then they have to go hard to fulfill my need for roster balance. So if we get Shadow, we might as well get Jeanne, Ms. Pac-Man, Zack Fair, Ken/Akuma and MGS 2 Raiden.
Shadows moves are mostly yellow though, for whatever reason. I guess because Knuckles was red. But Tails is yellow.
Maybe at one point Shadow's fur was more yellow? And they just kept the effects I guess?
Weirdly enough, android 17 is a much better comparison. Since shadow and a lot of his backstory is influenced by that arc.
Sonic Team isn't uh...subtle about their references.
Shadow is easy to hate but the Sonic series is still a fucking huge deal and Shadow wouldn't be around if he didn't have a significant following. I really don't see him being divisive in the slightest, especially since Echo Fighters are now being more transparent about the fact that these aren't wastes in character slots but cool bonus characters that appeals to the fans of the characters they are an echo of. Sonic gets a lot of hate being in Smash already, especially in his modern iteration (it was extremely common during Brawl for extremely snide people to go "wow Sonic is actually in a good game and it's not even his"). People will be none the wiser to Shadow being included.
Also on the topic of self seriousness; nothing about Shadow and Sonic up until the Pontac/Graff era was approached with a tongue-in-cheek inclination. The games were extremely campy because they bought into it's own delusions of grandeur - part of the reason why I still think the Adventure series holds up given that it was before they got too full of themselves. Shadow the Hedgehog is such a legendarily terrible written game because the people working on it actually thought the game was a good idea, and going into 06 it became clear that the writers were not in the least cognizant or self-aware of their straightfaced pomp. Sonic 06 goes for "epic" but in the process they jettisoned so much of the characters' colorful idiosyncrasies and personalities that it's just a morose and serious game that has even less "fun" than Shadow's own game. Unleashed might have pumped up on the colorful presentation in response but the writing of the game was extremely unmemorable and the characters were still more mundane and archetypical.
It wasn't until Colors, the shift in writing team, and the second shift in voice cast, that they emphasized more self-awareness. Sonic is now more of a cheeseball who Tails frequently has no qualms making fun of, Eggman is even more of a charismatic villain, and those elements became all the more obvious with Boom, compounded as well by the stellar Sonic comics. Nowadays Sonic is definitely self-aware, but during his signature Dork Age, make no mistake, the Sonic games wanted to be taken seriously.
Also on the topic of self seriousness; nothing about Shadow and Sonic up until the Pontac/Graff era was approached with a tongue-in-cheek inclination. The games were extremely campy because they bought into it's own delusions of grandeur - part of the reason why I still think the Adventure series holds up given that it was before they got too full of themselves. Shadow the Hedgehog is such a legendarily terrible written game because the people working on it actually thought the game was a good idea, and going into 06 it became clear that the writers were not in the least cognizant or self-aware of their straightfaced pomp. Sonic 06 goes for "epic" but in the process they jettisoned so much of the characters' colorful idiosyncrasies and personalities that it's just a morose and serious game that has even less "fun" than Shadow's own game. Unleashed might have pumped up on the colorful presentation in response but the writing of the game was extremely unmemorable and the characters were still more mundane and archetypical.
It wasn't until Colors, the shift in writing team, and the second shift in voice cast, that they emphasized more self-awareness. Sonic is now more of a cheeseball who Tails frequently has no qualms making fun of, Eggman is even more of a charismatic villain, and those elements became all the more obvious with Boom, compounded as well by the stellar Sonic comics. Nowadays Sonic is definitely self-aware, but during his signature Dork Age, make no mistake, the Sonic games wanted to be taken seriously.
Damn some of ya'all have insane demands lol
This is why we can't have nice things
I meant because of Chaos Control stuff. That's generally portrayed either green (when he has an emerald) or dark red/burgundy.
Nah. He was a much more apparent(and somehow edgier) Sonic clone before his final design.
The earliest known design of Shadow (that we're aware of, anyway) was basically Black Sonic with a scar on his eye:
There are shades of yellow in there, so with Knuckles already taking the red effects, this was probably the best choice?
Oh I have as well, the cost of those games would be uh...rather large in the modern day , and the time spent making them. And Sega don't want spend too much of both on sonic.
I'm not saying everyone loves him, that ain't true. He certainly represents the adventure era and some people don't like that.
I am saying however, he works for the demo sonic is aimed at, and has been working for that demo since he was created. And I think for the most part with sonic shit in general it works for who its for, and a lot of the memery doesn't really effect the bottom line, Segas lack of quality control does that.
Shadow is kind of a mood ring?
He had yellow attacks?
He also has red attacks, then his yellow attacks turned red
He also had and has purple attacks
He has attacks where he turns blue
And he has green energy represented in official art of him that he has never used in game
I guess it depends on the mood he's in
Nah. He was a much more apparent(and somehow edgier) Sonic clone before his final design.
I find it amusing that both Mephiles and Infinite have taken cues from these designs lol.
Totally agreed with this read on things. I actually only bought Colours because of the writing.
Fragrant smell of a new smUsh thread.
Nice.
https://www.resetera.com/posts/9704207
"Alright, alright
We need to make a forum wide bet. It'll come down between 2 viewpoints:
1) Those who think Dixie will be an echo fighter
2) Those who think she'll get in, but not as an echo fighter
Losers all have to wear this avatar for at least a month:
If Dixie doesn't make it in period, nothing happens
Who's down"
Put me down for the Dixie will not be an echo camp!
Nice.
https://www.resetera.com/posts/9704207
"Alright, alright
We need to make a forum wide bet. It'll come down between 2 viewpoints:
1) Those who think Dixie will be an echo fighter
2) Those who think she'll get in, but not as an echo fighter
Losers all have to wear this avatar for at least a month:
If Dixie doesn't make it in period, nothing happens
Who's down"
Put me down for the Dixie will not be an echo camp!
Shadow is post-ironic cool, I'm sorry. He's like Waluigi for adults.
Sega has this thing where they keep wanting to make shadow over and over and failing.
Another interesting thing about those concepts.
So like there are two, buff shadows. Shadow has super strength , so apparently it was going to be more emphasized in his design. It isn't though. I guess it makes since because knuckles is strong too but they didn't make his arms any bigger. Until boom happened anyway
I don't even know how to reply to this. My mind is fucking reeling right now.
Let my help you by highlighting this piece of Sonic universe canon:
Sort of ? In all seriousness, Sega litterally just made a game where you get to make your own sonic character, and they are probably gonna make another.
The deal from the outset is that they wanted to make easy to draw, easily identifiable characters. And they did, and people made their own, apparently they get a lot of like letters and fan art of kids characters
It works
I'd rather more nintendo all-stars get repped before secondary characters from third parties. Besides, metal sonic would be a preferable echo
#TeamWhenCranky
Factual Information.
Shadow never lied. He told the audience he was and they listened.
Sonic got his dash attack changed
Maybe so it would look better when used after roller blading?
Maybe so it would look better when used after roller blading?
Exactly where I'm at. I'd prefer more Nintendo characters to secondary guest characters, especially ones from series already with a rep. It's a Nintendo game first.
During the GCN years, Shadow WAS (basically) a Nintendo All Star. Sonic Adventure 2: Battle, Sonic Heroes and Shadow the Hedgehog were major Gamecube titles back in the day. Shadow became as popular as he is because of the Gamecube.
In my mind, Shadow would basically represent the Gamecube and Sega's new friendship with Nintendo in the early 2000s.
Maybe Waluigi could be kind of like Charade from Soul Calibur 2 or Mokujin from Tekken where he has no distinct playstyle of his own and instead just copies the movesets from the other fighters on the roster, which changes randomly each time you select him.
This game, along with Melee, pretty much defines my early experience with the Gamecube. They were the only two games I played (I owned Luigi's Mansion, but was too scared to play it!) for an entire year
My birthday is in February when I got my GCN at the ripe old age of 12 (Feb 2002). I wouldn't get my next GCN game until Christmas the next year, so I had to make due with Melee, Sonic and Luigi's Mansion (didn't play it, I was a scaredy kid)
My birthday is in February when I got my GCN at the ripe old age of 12 (Feb 2002). I wouldn't get my next GCN game until Christmas the next year, so I had to make due with Melee, Sonic and Luigi's Mansion (didn't play it, I was a scaredy kid)
If I could have one third party echo it'd be Ms. Pac Man
She deserves it for being a historical female in gaming
She deserves it for being a historical female in gaming
What if Waluigi was everyone's echo? Like one of those Soul Calibur copycat characters.
Edit:
Edit:
Great idea! *wink*
Possibly, but there's also the fact that Sonic doesn't really "roll" in his games anymore. it resembles his slide attack a bit more.
On the topic of Sonic, curiously enough, ESAM noted in his 1 hour long character breakdown video that Sonic's specials (spindash specifically) were nerfed but that his normals overall have been buffed. Despite being the fastest character in previous Smash games he was notorious among top competitive players for being one of the most frustrating characters to go up against because he had an extremely "hit and run" playstyle due to his normals being pretty bad and spindashing being really strong. Going into Ultimate that seems to be completely reversed, and with changes like being able to use tilts out of dash etc., Sonic is probably going to be a much more different character at a competitive level.
No, Waluigi should have a comedic moveset.
His jab is his signature foot stomp. Down special puts down a Junkrat trap. Side special is tennis ball attack; both ball and tennis racket hits. Neutral b is like Wii Fit Trainer's focus but it continuously heals and Waluigi stands in a goofy yoga position. Up special lets Waluigi swim through air like in old cartoons. Aerial moves all use his legs in goofy ways.
Sonic Adventure 2 is best on Gamecube. GBA Chao gardens + all kinds of little bonuses like connectivity to PSO2 to get Tails Chao!This game, along with Melee, pretty much defines my experience with the Gamecube. They were the only two games I played (I owned Luigi's Mansion, but was too scared to play it!) for an entire year
My birthday is in February when I got my GCN at the ripe old age of 12 (Feb 2002). I wouldn't get my next GCN game until Christmas the next year, so I had to made due with Melee, Sonic and Luigi's Mansion (didn't play it, I was a scaredy kid)
Sonic Boom is really self aware, just look how much Shadow contrasts with the tone of the show:
One summer, during a car ride on vacation, I maxed out a Chao using the Tiny GBA garden in Sonic Advance.
Like, I probably played Sonic Advance for 4 hours straight that ride, doing nothing but grinding rings for Chao fruit.
This is such a huge stretch to find a reason for Shadow to be worth more on the roster than he actually would be. Again, outside of the Sonic fanbase bubble, Heroes and the Shadow game are remembered as poor to average games and little else. And multiplatform games at that. They should rep the GameCube with a fucking Odama level before Shadow.
"You know Waluigi, we really are the Wario Ware" - Ashley, 1945 (colorized (mental image))
It's funny how much they actually killed Spin Dash, but it's okay cuz Sonic got buffed normals else on top of system changes being good for him.
I think he'll def be a more interesting character than how polarizing he was in 4.
I think he'll def be a more interesting character than how polarizing he was in 4.
Were you a kid around the GCN years?
Shadow was a Gamecube rep as much as any other character from that era. You're seriously downplaying what was going on with Sega and Nintendo in the early 2000s and how amazing Sonic games on a Nintendo console was, as a concept. Kids at that time loved Shadow, and if you wanted Shadow, you needed a Gamecube (Sonic Adventure: Battle was a Gamecube exclusive).
Middle school me didn't care that Sonic Heroes was a garbage game. I was HYPED for it, and played it to death when it came out.
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