Oct 25, 2017
33,070
Atlanta GA
As a non American I just hope to see the day that America stops regressing in my lifetime.

Christian Conservatives in America will never be satisfied until they have the ethno-state of their dreams.

Don't worry, everyone in this thread saying "voting doesn't work" and "burn it all down" is definitely driving to DC to overthrow the Supreme Court right now. They are absolutely not just sitting at their computer wondering what video game to play this afternoon.

sad but true
 

TrueSloth

Member
Oct 27, 2017
6,082
In a few weeks, we'll all be placated by the next nextflix/videogame/meme/social media outrage/etc.
This is a vicious cycle that is only enabled by people who only shout "Vote!".
We don't live in a democracy. If we did this wouldn't have slid through the system as effortlessly as it had.
 

andymcc

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,556
Columbus, OH
Oh but i do have empathy and I think there some good even in the united states just not the majority. The US have brought a lot of suffering to themselves but even worse to others and mostly just for greed and a lust for power. So yeah i'm sorry for the good people who are suffering but that country is rotten to the core and still has too much influence on the global scene.

you're a clown.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,544
I'd also like to add that the GOP and other right-wing groups are working to subvert the voting process across this country. I worry a lot of people are severely underestimating how far the right are going with ensuring that PoCs and progressives aren't allowed to vote. Voting is just ONE avenue, and the left will need to think bigger about ways of getting their point across.

Obviously voting is not the be all end all

But again real talk, the atmosphere is often that staying home is a better idea, that's what's being pushed back against
 
Where is this violent backlash against progress coming from? Like, why now? Roe v. Wade stood for nearly 50 years! Is there a theory for why this rabid anti-progressive base has grown so powerful in the past decade?
Bluntly, Roe only lasted this long because Reagan and H.W. Bush bungled 3 of their 5 Supreme Court appointments from 1981 to 1991. But for that, there would have been an anti-Roe majority as a result of the conservatives realignment of the electorate after the 1970s and the precedent wouldn't have seen its 20th birthday.

As to why it's happening now, because certain people died at certain times and lots of people didn't vote at the right times.
 

Desi

Member
Oct 30, 2017
4,220
She's not saying anything incorrect here. This is absolutely the case.

She's not saying "vote harder" and this consistent mantra downplaying the importance of actually voting will be the death of millions.
exactly. I am trying to find the right words here but not voting because "what's the point" just pushes us to the extreme right at an accelerated pace. I mean we are at 40k slowly dying as is but it is possible to pull back. Not getting involved because "what's the point" or it "doesn't affect me...yet" is what got us in this place we are at.
 

Riddler

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,796
Republicans do something evil --> "Here's why the Democrats are actually at fault."

Like clockwork, ugh.

Because they don't do everything they could to prevent evil (get rid of the filibuster)or the once in awhile democrat voter who feels like going to vote(oh Hilary is just as bad as Trump so fuck her mentality).
 

Jer

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,238
The "fuck the Dems" mentality ITT could not more perfectly encapsulate why the right was able to succeed at this.

Conservative evangelicals and Republicans have been on the anti-abortion crusade for *50 years*. And across those five decades, did they ever say fuck the GOP? Did they blast both parties as the same? Did they seriously threaten to vote third party or form a new party or not vote at all? Did they say they would flee the country or burn the system down?

No. They spent 50 years mobilizing voters, electing as many anti-abortion Republicans as they could, kicking those who weren't sufficiently anti-abortion out of the party. They played an extremely long game and won it because they never took their eye off the ball: that the key to making policy is winning elections. No politician was too odious to ally with. Donald Trump should've been the most obvious candidate to run away from; instead they pledged their full support to him and had it pay off dividends. Meanwhile, so many progressive and other left-of-center voters basically spend every two years looking for an excuse not to vote.

Voting doesn't not work; it works extremely well! What doesn't work is this constant attitude of trying to take yourself out of the equation. And it's frustrating that so many on the left still can't learn this lesson when the right is teaching it to us all the time.

Yeah it's almost silly to quote this yet again, but it's just so perfect. The "voting changes nothing" mentality is so infuriating and depressing. Everyone should read this post.

I'm just seething with rage at the people that sat out the 2016 election with a Supreme Court vacancy because Hillary wasn't perfect enough. It's not a productive emotion, but man, tough to get over it.
 

idonteven

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
2,631
been hearing that they also want to go after birth control ? no fun allowed in america it seems

BE BABY MACHINES WOMEN OF PLANET EARTH
 

LCGeek

Member
Oct 28, 2017
5,906
That's not what they've been doing though. In recent rulings they've been very surgically going after rules that haven't been codified and norms that relied on the spirit of the law instead of the letter. Most of the rulings they've handed down, including overturning Roe, could be fixed by something (technically) as easy (though not practically) as just passing the law that states it instead of relying onperceived rights, like privacy. Which coincidentally is also how they'll dismantle gay rights and even things as unthinkable as contraception and interracial marriage.

What is unthinkable for some of us, rarely is for them. Just a few months back a moron in the party let it in slip on CNN that interracial marriage should be left up to the states or maybe we can play coy and call it a silly mixup.
 

Proxy

Member
Oct 27, 2017
213
And then vote for the RINO every time.

If enough Dems switched party to vote Liz Cheney in the Republican primary and then all voted Dem in the general, do you know who wins that election?

Liz Cheney. Because she's a Republican and Republicans vote for Republicans even when they hate them.

They've successfully radicalized their party. Meanwhile the left of the Democratic party gets instantly shit on whenever it attempts to even poke its head above the parapet.
 

excelsiorlef

Bad Praxis
Member
Oct 25, 2017
73,544
Its pretty united on abortion! Bans on abortion poll terribly. Support for abortion access is broadly high. Make no mistake: this is not about a "divisive issue tearing the country apart", its about 30% of people holding the rest of us fucking hostage
The question becomes will people vote specifically for abortion

You can support something but still vote Republican because hey taxes or some dumb shit
 

SirNinja

One Winged Slayer
Member
Knew this was coming since at least 2016 and it doesn't make it any easier to stomach.

Hopefully this galvanizes Democrats to — at the very very least — vote like hell this year in the midterms. If not: this backwards slide is going to get much worse.
 

PSOreo

Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,260
Absolutely disgusting. You all better do something about this. What a fucking dark day. "Land of the free" hardly.
 
Oct 25, 2017
6,411
YEP

literally arguing with my friend rn

What's the point of discussing how Republicans are evil? They are, end of. You're not winning them over, there's no magic debate that will mean they change their views, all it comes down to is aesthetic resistance.

Whereas there are actual problems to solve in how ineffective democratic strategy (and Centrist liberalism in general) is at resisting fascism, to the point where Roe Vs Wade just got overturned and was visible from miles away. I promise you, discussing that as a problem isn't going to increase apathy.

I agree not voting is fucking pointless. I agree 'Both sides are the same' is a fucking pointless and lazy view. Discussing how ineffective so called 'political leaders' isn't going to make anyone turn on them that weren't already apathetic. You need to accept that those ineffective leaders are part of the problem. And that apathy has grown because in the last 20 years, the few charismatic leftist figures who could bring change a broad audience could get excited about were kneecapped by those same ineffective leaders who have achieved the sum of Jack Shit.
 

Fhtagn

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,615
The "fuck the Dems" mentality ITT could not more perfectly encapsulate why the right was able to succeed at this.

Conservative evangelicals and Republicans have been on the anti-abortion crusade for *50 years*. And across those five decades, did they ever say fuck the GOP? Did they blast both parties as the same? Did they seriously threaten to vote third party or form a new party or not vote at all? Did they say they would flee the country or burn the system down?

No. They spent 50 years mobilizing voters, electing as many anti-abortion Republicans as they could, kicking those who weren't sufficiently anti-abortion out of the party. They played an extremely long game and won it because they never took their eye off the ball: that the key to making policy is winning elections. No politician was too odious to ally with. Donald Trump should've been the most obvious candidate to run away from; instead they pledged their full support to him and had it pay off dividends. Meanwhile, so many progressive and other left-of-center voters basically spend every two years looking for an excuse not to vote.

Voting doesn't not work; it works extremely well! What doesn't work is this constant attitude of trying to take yourself out of the equation. And it's frustrating that so many on the left still can't learn this lesson when the right is teaching it to us all the time.

Many many many of us have been voting for dens for our entire voting lives, I've been voting in primaries and every local election for decades… voting can't fix this (and neither can not voting) while the dems at the federal level do nothing but punch left at people who want things to be better.

The right wins not just because they vote, but because they actually want this evil shit to happen. The center doesn't win because they don't really believe in anything that would rock the boat.

This isn't an argument for not voting, I always vote in every election, but we have to get past the "please vote even harder!" as the only message we hear from democrats, it feels at best pathetic and at worst deeply cynical.
 

Lord Fanny

Member
Apr 25, 2020
26,274
People tout out this whole 'it took Republicans 50 years' to do this shit as if one day conservatives all hunkered down and decided they were going to pull up their boot straps and one day in the far future all their dreams would come true.

That's not what happened.

What happened is that very power and rich people lost a small amount of power and decided they were going to get that power back and more no longer how long it took and they did it the way the rich and powerful have always done it: using their vast wealth and resources to power to do everything they could to redirect the course of power back to them and the easiest way to do that was by using the racism, sexism, queer phobia and religious obsession to radicalize conservatives/Republicans and pursuing ways that conservatives will have more voting power, which they now do by a significant margin.

Like Christ, even when some of you can recognize part of the problem, it's like you're walking on the right road with a massive blindfold.
 

CesareNorrez

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,562
This is such a dark time in American history and, as much I want to think positively, it's hard to not see things becoming much worse.

Everyone will be negatively affected by this, whether they can become pregnant or not, but right now being a woman in this country is brutal. So sorry to those losing bodily autonomy. I stand with you and will do what I can to support the right to control your own body.
 

MrKlaw

Member
Oct 25, 2017
33,431
Bluntly, Roe only lasted this long because Reagan and H.W. Bush bungled 3 of their 5 Supreme Court appointments from 1981 to 1991. But for that, there would have been an anti-Roe majority as a result of the conservatives realignment of the electorate after the 1970s and the precedent wouldn't have seen its 20th birthday.

As to why it's happening now, because certain people died at certain times and lots of people didn't vote at the right times.

why is the supreme court even politically nominated? Why no checks and balances to try and ensure its relatively neutral and not too left or right?
 

Dekim

Member
Oct 28, 2017
4,343
This. This is why I'm angry at the democratic party. Among other things There is no urgency at all. No fire. No drive. I'll vote for them. I will continue to vote for them. But they don't give me any reason too.

A Republican can say vote for me. We will over turn roe vs Wade. And by God. They make it happen. Laws. Courts. Full throated, they go for it

The democratic party gives me a hearing next month to talk about it. Why? Swing for the fences. Tell me you are writing a bill to guarantee abortions rights. I don't care if it's pointless or hopeless force the issue. Tell me you just called Joe Manchin to talk about how you can fix this. Fucking do something to justify the votes I'm going to give you
The simple fact of the matter is that the GOP fear and respect their voter base and Dems don't.
 

yogurt

Member
Oct 25, 2017
7,140
If I recall correctly, 5 of the justices were nominated by Presidents that lost the popular vote but I'll make sure to vote harder next time.
Did I not acknowledge that the systems are broken? Yet electing Dems instead of GOP at ANY level can prevent harm. City, county, state, federal. We're stuck living within this system for the time being, so we just have to do the best we can with it while we work to change it. There is no logical or moral argument to submitting to more suffering and hell for vulnerable populations when voting takes a few hours per year (at most) and is not mutually exclusive with literally any other type of action.

This. This is why I'm angry at the democratic party. Among other things There is no urgency at all. No fire. No drive. I'll vote for them. I will continue to vote for them. But they don't give me any reason too.

A Republican can say vote for me. We will over turn roe vs Wade. And by God. They make it happen. Laws. Courts. Full throated, they go for it

The democratic party gives me a hearing next month to talk about it. Why? Swing for the fences. Tell me you are writing a bill to guarantee abortions rights. I don't care if it's pointless or hopeless force the issue. Tell me you just called Joe Manchin to talk about how you can fix this. Fucking do something to justify the votes I'm going to give you
This hyper focus on one tiny, footnote of a response by the dems in one specific comittee has a real "bitch eating crackers" energy about it.

Like the Dems suck for a whole bunch of reasons but come on y'all, this is nothing.
 

Nothing Loud

Literally Cinderella
Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,043
This means Lawrence and Obergefell are on their way to tumbling down. Time to plan my emigration.
 

SilkySm00th

Member
Oct 31, 2017
4,853
It's too bad that the utter garbage fire that this decision actually is won't sink in for these religious fruit cake psychopaths across the country until their daughters start showing up dead af in back room attempts to abort a "mistake" those same families would disown them for.

If i'm ever given a chance to deface a grave - i know four that will be at the top of my list.

Staying in Oregon that's for fucking sure.
 

ostrichKing

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,493
As terrible as democrats are at governing...it continues to be vitally important to get out and vote in every election from local to state to federal level. It's better to have an inefficient party running things than a party that ACTIVELY is trying to hurt people. I don't think some people seem to understand how much more you fuck things up by staying home and not voting at all.
 

red_shift_ltd

Member
May 24, 2019
794
US
I remember Clarence Thomas being afraid that the leaks would cause people to lose faith in the Supreme Court. This guaranteed that I've lost faith in them.

Thomas is interesting because he believes that America will never work for Black people so he might as well make things worse until they rise up. Never depend on him to be the voice of reason.

"Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas is hardly the quietest member of the bench. In hundreds of opinions authored during his tenure — longer than any of his present colleagues' — Thomas has elaborated upon a vision first instilled in him by a stern, business-minded grandfather and later cemented during a turbulent undergraduate education, spent protesting racial injustice, debating Black nationalist principles, and memorizing passages of Malcolm X. And despite a deliberate post-college turn toward capitalism and political futilitarianism, his original comprehensive view of America persists: our national government is incapable of bettering the lives of Black Americans, just as white Americans are forever incapable of dismantling their own racism."

https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/otm/segments/supreme-court-justice-most-say-repeat
 

Drachen

Member
May 3, 2021
6,055
This country is fucking draconian. I wish nothing but the absolute worst for every old ghoul who helped make this happen.
 

rucury

▲ Legend ▲
Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
1,389
Puerto Rico
The "fuck the Dems" mentality ITT could not more perfectly encapsulate why the right was able to succeed at this.

Conservative evangelicals and Republicans have been on the anti-abortion crusade for *50 years*. And across those five decades, did they ever say fuck the GOP? Did they blast both parties as the same? Did they seriously threaten to vote third party or form a new party or not vote at all? Did they say they would flee the country or burn the system down?

No. They spent 50 years mobilizing voters, electing as many anti-abortion Republicans as they could, kicking those who weren't sufficiently anti-abortion out of the party. They played an extremely long game and won it because they never took their eye off the ball: that the key to making policy is winning elections. No politician was too odious to ally with. Donald Trump should've been the most obvious candidate to run away from; instead they pledged their full support to him and had it pay off dividends. Meanwhile, so many progressive and other left-of-center voters basically spend every two years looking for an excuse not to vote.

Voting doesn't not work; it works extremely well! What doesn't work is this constant attitude of trying to take yourself out of the equation. And it's frustrating that so many on the left still can't learn this lesson when the right is teaching it to us all the time.

Don't worry, everyone in this thread saying "voting doesn't work" and "burn it all down" is definitely driving to DC to overthrow the Supreme Court right now. They are absolutely not just sitting at their computer wondering what video game to play this afternoon.

Just quite tweeting so more people read them.
 

gig

Prophet of Regret
Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,291
Was that ever officially a thing anyway? I always thought it just came from same random letter Jefferson wrote and was never actually codified into law.

The first amendment has been interpreted to mean that numerous times

By the Supreme Court, of course, so... you know...
 

thecouncil

Member
Oct 29, 2017
12,423
This. This is why I'm angry at the democratic party. Among other things There is no urgency at all. No fire. No drive. I'll vote for them. I will continue to vote for them. But they don't give me any reason too.

A Republican can say vote for me. We will over turn roe vs Wade. And by God. They make it happen. Laws. Courts. Full throated, they go for it

it took them 50 years though. lol.