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GearDraxon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,786
So guys I'm picking up one of these new TCLs for my (tiny) game room. It just barely has the space to cram a 65" in there so that's what I'm getting. If all goes well I'll upgrade next year to an OLED once we get VRR and all the other new buzzwords and send this TCL to the bedroom. But before I start painstakingly looking at a billion reviews I have a few general questions. I've never really set up a proper "game/movie room", I've just used PC monitors in my bedroom to watch movies and play games.

  • I really really don't have the space for a 5.1 or 7.1 or any fancy Atmos things. I am cramped enough that I don't even know for sure that I'll be able to fit a 2.1 setup unless I legit put the speakers below my TV on whatever desk contraption I end up getting for the media devices. Between a good soundbar and a 2.1 speaker setup - is the difference huge? I'm looking at an ELAC UNI-FI B5 + Sub vs. some nice $700ish soundbar.
  • Will whatever receiver I buy now end up being obsolete next year when the new HDMI standard comes out with VRR support? Also I know literally nothing about this - what's a reasonable "Watts per channel" to drive those ELAC speakers if I end up going for those rather than a soundbar?
  • I don't wanna go all out this year on the TV (hence why I'm skipping OLED until next year), but is there an "upgrade pick" above the TCL where I can get something better without going, say, past $500 above its MSRP? I can do $1,500 max and I really want it to be 65". If it's like "nah you either spend 1k on the TCL or double that for the next level" I'll just stick with the TCL.
Regarding the audio:
1. As someone who owns the Uni-Fi floorstanders (and has a dim view of soundbars in general), DO IT. This goes double if you're planning to listen to music on the setup at all.
2. AVRs will likely need specific VRR support, probably not until next year or so. Regarding power, quoting myself from the audio thread (so ignore the bulleted numbers, as I cut some non-relevant stuff out)
2. Wattage is tricky, inasmuch as receiver makers want to have the biggest number to put on the box, so that their product looks more powerful than the rest. The problem is that there many different ways to measure wattage - if I want my AVR to look really beefy, I'll measure the wattage at "1k, 1 channel driven, .9% THD." Let's break this down:
2a. The human range of hearing is usually given as 20kHz (really high frequencies) to 20Hz (really low frequencies.) 1kHz is right in the middle, and can be less difficult to drive than the two extremes, so by measuring my AVR there, the measured wattage is higher.
2b. Modern receivers have at least 5 channels. By measuring my AVR while driving only one speaker, I'm giving it a far easier task than if it were trying to power all 5. Again, wattage number goes up.
2c. THD stands for Total Harmonic Distortion, and can be summed up as "how much of what I'm playing is distorted from the original." Therefore, a lower number is better: we want as little distortion as possible! .9% sounds pretty low, but better receivers will be measured at .09% or even lower. By not worrying about the distortion as much, the wattage number is higher.
2d. The wattage rating on speakers is a range of the least and most amount of power they can handle. Here's Klipsch's data sheet on them, it's listed under "Power Handing." But as we see above, it's hard to know how "honest" a given watt is, right? Luckily, this leads us to...

3. All of this is largely academic at this level of gear - most receivers will power most speakers in this price range, and will do so pretty well.

5. Resistance or impedance is a measure of how much resistance (!) the speaker gives to the power being fed to it. The lower the number, the more resistance, and the tougher the speaker is to drive. The majority of speakers in this range are 8ohm. Note that this number doesn't necessarily have to match with the AVR: impedance changes based on the frequency in question, and so the "8ohm" number is a nominal measurement, usually referring to the lowest impedance needed. My speakers are rated at 4ohm, so they are tougher to drive...but they play just fine on a Denon AVR that is "only" rated for 8ohm.
 

Stiler

Avenger
Oct 29, 2017
6,659
So guys I'm picking up one of these new TCLs for my (tiny) game room. It just barely has the space to cram a 65" in there so that's what I'm getting. If all goes well I'll upgrade next year to an OLED once we get VRR and all the other new buzzwords and send this TCL to the bedroom. But before I start painstakingly looking at a billion reviews I have a few general questions. I've never really set up a proper "game/movie room", I've just used PC monitors in my bedroom to watch movies and play games.

  • I really really don't have the space for a 5.1 or 7.1 or any fancy Atmos things. I am cramped enough that I don't even know for sure that I'll be able to fit a 2.1 setup unless I legit put the speakers below my TV on whatever desk contraption I end up getting for the media devices. Between a good soundbar and a 2.1 speaker setup - is the difference huge? I'm looking at an ELAC UNI-FI B5 + Sub vs. some nice $700ish soundbar.
  • Will whatever receiver I buy now end up being obsolete next year when the new HDMI standard comes out with VRR support? Also I know literally nothing about this - what's a reasonable "Watts per channel" to drive those ELAC speakers if I end up going for those rather than a soundbar?
  • I don't wanna go all out this year on the TV (hence why I'm skipping OLED until next year), but is there an "upgrade pick" above the TCL where I can get something better without going, say, past $500 above its MSRP? I can do $1,500 max and I really want it to be 65". If it's like "nah you either spend 1k on the TCL or double that for the next level" I'll just stick with the TCL.

For a 65" the new TCL is probably your best bet as far as features and things go since it literally just came out. There's the X930E which is capable of getting brighter (You can find them for around 1200'ish) but it's edge lit vs the TCL's FALD. You can grab oled's for around 1200-1300 but they'd be the 55" version rather than the 65" inch size which you said you didn't want to go to.

As far as sound, at this time I'd REALLY recommend you go with a cheaper route rather then "splurging" atm, with HDMI 2.1 coming around the corner you'll have to buy an A/V receiver and things for that so there's not a lot of point in blowing a lot of money on an a/v receiver now just to turn around and need a new one in a year or two.

So get the tcl and then in a year or two splurge on hdmi 2.1 tv/av receiver would be a wise choice.

I'd recommend just getting a simple affordable set of Bookshelf speakers and a reasonably priced receiver for them and a sub that fits in your budget.

Some reasonably decent speakers that aren't super expensive:
https://www.amazon.com/Pioneer-SP-B...1520397086&sr=1-3&keywords=Pioneer+SP-BS22-LR
https://www.amazon.com/Debut-Booksh...e=UTF8&qid=1520397047&sr=1-3&keywords=ELAC+B6
https://www.amazon.com/Acoustics-30...d=1520397027&sr=1-2&keywords=Q+Acoustics+3020

And a good place to buy receivers:
https://www.accessories4less.com/ma.../receivers-amps/home-theater-receivers/1.html

For subs I'd recommend the SVS sb12-nsd it's one of the best bang for the buck subs you can find out there. However they stopped making it a while back so you have to look for it on ebay/amazon from third party sellers, usually pop up around 300-350'ish.
https://www.svsound.com/products/sb12-nsd

The HSU VTF-1mk3 is another good sub for a smaller budget at $399.
http://www.hsuresearch.com/products/vtf-1mk3.html

Then when HDMI 2.1 drops you can splurge on a new receiver/higher end speakers if you want (or just expand what you have).

Also if your room is small you can always wall mount speakers if you don't have a lot of floor space to sit them on a stand or such, they make wall stands you can mount and put speakers on fairly easy.
 

DOTDASHDOT

Helios Abandoned. Atropos Conquered.
Member
Oct 26, 2017
3,080
The Samsung QE65Q9FN has got a steller review on AVForums. https://www.avforums.com/review/samsung-q9-qe65q9fn-review.14868
I mean, yeah, a part of me thinks I should have got that instead of my C8. It's definitely better for gaming I think. And I like the HDMI Hub that lets putting cables in and out so easily is a great idea. Still, no complaints for my C8. I do think for PC use and browsing the Samsung is the better deal.

If you like dark room viewing, there is only one option..

But for a lit room, sure the Q9FN is a good buy.
 

Ocean

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,694
Thanks for the replies guys. If the new VRR-compatible HDMI spec will require a new receiver I'll just leave the receiver + speakers + OLED purchase for next year.

I'll go for a "stopgap" solution this year with just a TCL and a soundbar. Now for the next question:

I have a PS4 Pro, an Xbox One X, a Switch, a cable box and now apparently a soundbar I'll want to plug in. Then there's stuff I'd like to plug in occasionally (NES / SNES Mini or a laptop). These all use HDMI. The TV doesn't have enough HDMI ports and I don't wanna splurge on a receiver just to act as an HDMI switch.

How do you guys deal with this without some janky ass cable inferno?
 

Bumrush

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,770
RedlineRonin how was the movie???

A moment of your time? I have this short pamphlet, might be of interest to you all. It's called "Projectors and You: Painting Your Spare Bedroom Carbon Black Totally Doesn't Make It Look Like a Murder Box" and- hey! Come back! The pamphlet has pictures!

The pictures aren't very good, I had to remove all the lighting in that room. :(

Lol you're the best!!
 

molnizzle

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,695
Thanks for the replies guys. If the new VRR-compatible HDMI spec will require a new receiver I'll just leave the receiver + speakers + OLED purchase for next year.

I'll go for a "stopgap" solution this year with just a TCL and a soundbar. Now for the next question:

I have a PS4 Pro, an Xbox One X, a Switch, a cable box and now apparently a soundbar I'll want to plug in. Then there's stuff I'd like to plug in occasionally (NES / SNES Mini or a laptop). These all use HDMI. The TV doesn't have enough HDMI ports and I don't wanna splurge on a receiver just to act as an HDMI switch.

How do you guys deal with this without some janky ass cable inferno?
I'd go for a soundbar with HDMI passthrough for ARC (audio return channel). Your TV will send the audio back to the soundbar through HDMI, regardless of which input you use. Nice thing about this is you can control the soundbar volume with your TV remote. Many of these soundbars will have an extra HDMI input as well. Not all of these will be HDMI 2.0 though (so no HDR or 4K there), so that would be the optimal port to connect the Switch.

Other than that, HDMI splitter from monoprice or something.
 

aspiring

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,545
My E8 had areived and is being mounted as i type! First impressions are aesthetically it is the most beautiful TV i have ever seen in my life.
 

molnizzle

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,695
Where are the videos showcasing the Game Motion Plus on the 2018 Samsung's?

I feel like that is by far the most important and groundbreaking thing on these new sets.

I wanna see what God of War looks like at 4k60 with in-game motion blur turned off!
 

DangerMouse

Member
Oct 25, 2017
22,402
Off screen Sony OLED AF8/A8F GOW

OH MY FUCKING DAYS!!!

22 MINUTES IN AND ONWARDS


Yup, game is looking ridiculously good on my last year's A1E as well so far, and as a 2018 it might be even a little better. They do such a good job on trying to mitigate banding in content with their processing.
Like he said I absolutely love the look of their screens with the tiny bezel. It's like the picture is floating especially with OLED blacks and colors.


Awesome, seems to be great in those theaters. Hopefully some day they'll spread out to even more theaters so I can see something in one eventually.
 
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Jeremiah

Jeremiah

Member
Oct 25, 2017
774
I ordered the LG OLED77C8PUA 77" display today from Cleveland AV. They gave me a price of 8k out the door and it's an extra $550 for 5 year extended warranty that includes in home service. Best deal I could find especially since it's brand new.

When's your delivery date? If you get yours before mine, ohhhhh boy. I really want to play GOW. I hope this years 77's dont have goal post banding, shit would drive me crazy. Of all things, that's what i am most paranoid about.
 

aspiring

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,545
Just run some youtube 5% 10% and 20% slides on my E8 and saw no banding whatsoever the wife even picked over and was nothing. Got a keeper!

This was standard settings however out of box so no idea if anything will change. Will it? Comfort me era!!!
 
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Deleted member 36086

User requested account closure
Banned
Dec 13, 2017
897
Where are the videos showcasing the Game Motion Plus on the 2018 Samsung's?

I feel like that is by far the most important and groundbreaking thing on these new sets.

I wanna see what God of War looks like at 4k60 with in-game motion blur turned off!

4k 30fps interpolated to 60fps at ~20ms seems way too good to be true. If it can really do that, then I'm in for $4k or whatever these things cost.
 

Gatti-man

Banned
Jan 31, 2018
2,359
When's your delivery date? If you get yours before mine, ohhhhh boy. I really want to play GOW. I hope this years 77's dont have goal post banding, shit would drive me crazy. Of all things, that's what i am most paranoid about.
It's shippig tomorrow but who knows when the actual drop shipper will get it to me. I'm guessing I'll have it in 10-14 days.

Im saving the end of god of war and can't wait for UHD movies on it.
 

CQC

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,713
Alright, so I am not very savy with 4k and HDR stuff, but other than the panel type, what's the difference between LG's B7A (55) and SJ8500 (55)?

I'm looking to use this more for gaming purposes than movie/TV consumption. They both seems to have low input lag which is good. So the only obvious difference to me is a $600-$700 price difference.
 

jordn613

Member
Oct 25, 2017
389
Question about Airplay 2 and an Apple TV connected to a B7. So with Airplay 2, I'll be able to stream music to my Sonos devices, in addition to my Apple TV 4K, which is connected directly to my B7 and then put to an amp and 2.1 speakers.

The Apple TV isn't connected to the receiver because it's a 2014 Marantz and doesn't support HDR.

However, it makes it viable to use this setup without buying the $300 Sonos equipment that lets you use your own amp and speakers.

My question is, what will be the most ideal way to have the Apple TV play music with the tv screen on, without risking burn-in? The tv will have to be on for the Apple TV to send a signal to the receiver and speakers. I guess maybe an Apple screensaver would be ideal but not sure if that's how it works.
 

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Got my B7 today. All I can say is holy shit!

Now I know what I was missing out on with the HDR from the x800d.

God of War looks absolutely ridiculous. Watched uhd br It, also absolutely stunning.
 

Deleted member 17092

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
20,360
Alright, so I am not very savy with 4k and HDR stuff, but other than the panel type, what's the difference between LG's B7A (55) and SJ8500 (55)?

I'm looking to use this more for gaming purposes than movie/TV consumption. They both seems to have low input lag which is good. So the only obvious difference to me is a $600-$700 price difference.

You're better off getting a TCL p series unless you specifically want an IPS panel.
 

Liquidsnake

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,994
For sure! Should I make a video? What kinds of tests should I do?

I planned to do basic calibration type stuff I do for video production work but HDR is kind of a beast I'm still getting to grips with!

Cann probably compare it to a Samsung HDR 4K and regular HD Sony.

Just your opinions on the panel itself:

Banding
Clouding
HDR

What ever you feel like.
 

CQC

Member
Oct 25, 2017
1,713
You're better off getting a TCL p series unless you specifically want an IPS panel.
Yeah, I currently am using an ASUS MX279H as my gaming monitor and it's got an IPS panel.

I'm curious as to why you'd suggest TCL over any of the two options I've mentioned. I've heard that they're great gaming displays due to low input lag.
 

molnizzle

Banned
Oct 25, 2017
17,695
4k 30fps interpolated to 60fps at ~20ms seems way too good to be true. If it can really do that, then I'm in for $4k or whatever these things cost.
Rtings measured 20ms with interpolation — but I need to see what that interpolation looks like! If it's the same effect that has been in previous Samsung models... yeah. $4k, $5k, whatever they want. That's a true disruption for console gaming.
 

oneils

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,136
Ottawa Canada
Got my 65 inch xbr x930e today. Have a x1x, ps4 pro, and apple 4k with it. Been watching stuff like lost in space in the tvs netflix app and dolby vision is amazing. Forgot to switch to "enhanced format" but fixed that pretty quick.

It looks like any device connected by hdmi doesn't yet support dolbyvision in this yet?

what about hdr 10? When i watch ultra 4k content like the netflix show troy, is that hdr?

Anyway, the set is amazing. Played fallout 4 on the x1x and it looks great.
 

aspiring

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,545
Soory can anybody help me. After coming from years of Dony im lost on LG. Is there a featire such as smooth gradation?

And what about OLED lights? Could someoneplease share some settings? ATM im using the rtings ones but would like to see some others!
 

GearDraxon

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,786
Got my 65 inch xbr x930e today. Have a x1x, ps4 pro, and apple 4k with it. Been watching stuff like lost in space in the tvs netflix app and dolby vision is amazing. Forgot to switch to "enhanced format" but fixed that pretty quick.

It looks like any device connected by hdmi doesn't yet support dolbyvision in this yet?

what about hdr 10? When i watch ultra 4k content like the netflix show troy, is that hdr?

Anyway, the set is amazing. Played fallout 4 on the x1x and it looks great.
The current tvOS (11.3) allows for Dolby Vision to Sony TVs, as long as the TV has the needed update (which yours does, since the built-in app is showing the DV badge.) Check to make sure that your ATV is up to date, and that you're using "premium certified" or equivalent HDMI cables. Then go into the video settings to enable it.

Also, if you're piping it through a receiver, make sure *it* supports DV. That's where I'm stuck now: ATV is ready, X930E is ready... Denon AVR is waiting on a DV update.

To check if your TV is getting any HDR, hit the Action Menu button, and go down to Picture Settings. If you're receiving HDR, it'll say so in the top right of the screen.
 
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Deleted member 14649

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 27, 2017
3,524
My question is, what will be the most ideal way to have the Apple TV play music with the tv screen on, without risking burn-in? The tv will have to be on for the Apple TV to send a signal to the receiver and speakers. I guess maybe an Apple screensaver would be ideal but not sure if that's how it works.

The screensavers come on automatically as they would normally when no moving images are displayed. The track name just pops up in the corner of the screen every time it changes, but the screensaver isn't interrupted.
 

Turnpulse

Member
Apr 9, 2018
131
Thanks for the replies guys. If the new VRR-compatible HDMI spec will require a new receiver I'll just leave the receiver + speakers + OLED purchase for next year.

I'll go for a "stopgap" solution this year with just a TCL and a soundbar. Now for the next question:

I have a PS4 Pro, an Xbox One X, a Switch, a cable box and now apparently a soundbar I'll want to plug in. Then there's stuff I'd like to plug in occasionally (NES / SNES Mini or a laptop). These all use HDMI. The TV doesn't have enough HDMI ports and I don't wanna splurge on a receiver just to act as an HDMI switch.

How do you guys deal with this without some janky ass cable inferno?

I use a ysp 2700 from Yamaha. It's a soundbar that simulates surround and has 3 HDMI in. After some tinkering it really does achieve a neat surround effect and the sound is really good. You can buy a better receiver in the future when you need higher HDMI standard and use the Yamaha till then. :-)
 

FrankNitty

Member
Oct 25, 2017
593
SoCal
I ordered the LG OLED77C8PUA 77" display today from Cleveland AV. They gave me a price of 8k out the door and it's an extra $550 for 5 year extended warranty that includes in home service. Best deal I could find especially since it's brand new.
8k out the door? He quoted me 8500. Wonder if he adjusted price since he has them in vs when he had pre order pricing
 
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