RM8

Member
Oct 28, 2017
7,922
JP
Speaking of these two games - I have never been a fan of most shooters (recently I've been trying Crysis, Halo, Gears, Black and others on gamepass), but both Doom 2016 and Eternal really do it for me. I played the very first Doom and I also liked that, but not as much. I couldn't get into Doom 3 or 64.

What else should I play now that I discovered I like -some- shooters?
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,554
Criticism =/= hate, it's a sentiment I don't like because it feels so much like fans being missive about any criticism of their work, even from people liked it but had some issues (see reviewers who get harassed for reviews where their critical of aspects despite giving the works overall positive reviews like 7-9/10).

Hate to me is a intense dislike for something which I've not seen much here, even on this thread, most of what I've seen is saying it's not as good as the 2016 game, been constructive about their criticism or say the did like it. There is nothing wrong to hate something, I hate the movie Rain Man for popularizing and perpetuating negative stereotypes about autistic people and contributed heavily to the bullying I recieved or slowly growing dislike of the DOA for it's flagrant sexism and objectification, but doesn't mean all if not most criticism comes from hate (or isn't valid).

For me, yes Doom Eternal simply didn't feel as fun as Doom 2016. I personally didn't have that big of an issue with the marauders but it felt like the game relied to much on platforming, especially in it's later levels where huge sections were nothing but that, their is a ton lore and story and the game seems to want to tell it but instead expects you to read a novels worth of text rather then properly explain much and overall I felt the level design wasn't as fun as Doom 2016. I didn't hate it, same with Resident Evil 3 Remake but like that, I can't say I wasn't disappointed.
 

Dr. Doom

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,509
Doom Eternal is a great game but I did not enjoy the platforming, buff totems, and spirit enemies. Furthermore, it is extremely easy to run out of ammo in Eternal compared to 2016. I know the chainsaw exists but I found this hugely problematic in the DLC.
 
Last edited:

laxu

Member
Nov 26, 2017
2,788
My main beef with Doom 2016 was its structure of locked arena -> corridor -> arena. Eternal is better in this regard. I don't feel the platforming sections necessarily add much to the game but they are not bad and overall I enjoyed playing it a lot.

I really hated the Marauder enemy design so I haven't picked the DLC up because that seems to just ramp up the difficulty even more and throws more of that bullshit at you.
 

Morlas

Looking for a better cartoon show.
Moderator
Oct 25, 2017
73,369
I played Doom Eternal earlier this year and liked it about as much as 2016, but coming back and replaying it on Nightmare in anticipation of The Ancient Gods was a revelation, it honestly makes 2016 feel slow and simple in comparison. Seriously pulling yourself to a demon and blasting them with the super shotgun followed by a quick swap to the ballista before you dash back and finish it off with a rocket only to hook over to the next one is like poetry in motion.
 

BigTnaples

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,752
It's an amazing game.

Doom Eternal
TLOUPII
Star Wars Squadrons VR
Half-Life Alyx
and Miles Morales

Are all great contenders.
 

BabyMurloc

Member
Oct 29, 2017
1,890
In Doom Eternal the mechanics and map design felt like I was in some hellish game show, and the story was just awful straight to dvd shit.

Doom 2016 was beautiful because of its simplicity and clarity of purpose.
 

Version 3.0

Member
Oct 27, 2017
11,660
I wasn't aware of this hate bubble. Every game gets it haters, even the best-loved games around here. Breath of the Wild just won Era's Game of the Decade, and yet any BotW thread has haters coming out of the woodwork. It's often hard to tell what the consensus is.

Now I'm curious to see how Eternal does in this year's GOTY vote, here. It'll be my #1, I'll tell you right now.
 

JJD

Member
Oct 25, 2017
4,572
I like both, but I prefer 2016 mostly because of the story. How could they fuck up something so simple??

The new lore of Eternal just sucks IMO.

As far as gameplay goes both are great. I also prefer 2016 level design.
 

Dr. Doom

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,509
I like both, but I prefer 2016 mostly because of the story. How could they fuck up something so simple??

The new lore of Eternal just sucks IMO.

As far as gameplay goes both are great. I also prefer 2016 level design.
Doom Eternal simply expands on all the lore in 2016. The night sentinels, argent energy, makyr angels - they were all woven in the game and codex entries. The approach was more subtle of course.
 

CaptainKashup

Banned
May 10, 2018
8,313
If it has a campaign, dialogues and delivers its story outside of vague "environemental storytelling" and uninteresting logs/journals, then Era hates it
 

Plasma

Member
Oct 25, 2017
6,708
I'm sorry that I didn't like it as much as 2016, I just think it went in completely the wrong direction with it's systems and for me it made the game less fun to play.
 

elenarie

Game Developer
Verified
Jun 10, 2018
10,213
Well everyone here is wrong, as it is the game of this year and the best FPS game ever made. :p
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
The most hilarious posts are the "oh you're forced to play this way". No you're not. The only thing you're forced to do is using the chainsaw for ammo, but that's like complaining about having to reload in COD.
 

lazygecko

Member
Oct 25, 2017
3,628
If you think Era is the only place that has a largely divisive opinion on Eternal, then I'd say you're the one in a bubble. The sentiment is most certainly common enough in the Doom community at large, Youtube critics, etc.
 

Deleted member 1589

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
8,576
bubble? From what I've seen it's just one of those games that some disliked compared to the previous game.

Doesnt change the fact that it has its share of fans.
 

Dever

Member
Dec 25, 2019
5,397
Which tools are those? Eternal's gaming loop is plain as rice, what are there to use beyond the chainsaw?

Chainsaw, flamethrower, frag grenade, ice grenade, meat hook, and obviously all the different weapons with their different mods... Ever watched a top player clear Ultra-nightmare? It's nuts.



The problem isn't in quantity, it's in quality. Eternal's story is just bad.

Sure, but I've skipped the entirety of it on subsequent playthroughs so I barely remember it at this point. What I will agree with is that the tone of 2016 was a lot more grounded and "cooler", and Eternal shifts the tone towards a saturday morning cartoon. I don't mind it though, I think the cartoon vibe fits the over-the-top gameplay really well. The way new guns are just floating mid-air has that kind of gamey, "We don't give a fuck, here's a gun for you" vibe, and the cartoony "Plop!" sound effect that plays when you get a headshot is endlessly satisfying to me.
 

Navidson REC

Member
Oct 31, 2017
3,475
Thats due to Bethesda pushing the Multi over the SP so Press reviews were the first positive news about it. I played the hell out of 2016. I got to the norse? area of Eternal and really dislike the direction of the story and not following up on Samual Haiden (S. Haiden, Satan) and going with this strange ass origin for Doom Guy being a super Viking as opposed to a Soldier jailed for opposing war crimes.
:O mind blown at the bolded!

... rest assured though that he has a part to play in this game. However, I agree with those saying that VEGA and Hayden felt like better characters in DOOM 2016, and there's some weird disconnect overall. But once I had accepted this, I've been having a blast. Just finished the Nekravol levels, holy shit those were awesome. The locations in this game are so dope.
 

Soap

Member
Oct 27, 2017
15,860
This is one of the few times I'm confident enough in saying this is not a bubble, especially if you played on consoles.
 

Martinski

Member
Jan 15, 2019
8,460
Göteborg
Well maybe it is much better on PC but i played it on console with controller when i got it from Gamepass, game was impossible for me on any higher difficulty than easy for me after like the first 2-3 levels. Also the dashing and bunny hopping constantly even on easy was too 'sweaty' for me to be enjoyable. With a controller it was way too hard to hit weak points on enemies, i am just bad with controller aim full stop. Doom Guy in Doom Eternal is as squishy as a wet noodle.

The platforming was wack too.
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
To expand on my other post, the story in the sequel is horrible and so in your face. This is made apparent in the dlc. It feels so cartoony and way less Doom.

Doom 1-4 were always about humanity messing up and opening a portal to hell so Doom guy goes and kills hell. In Doom Eternal they introduce heaven, God, Angels and the worst part is the take all of that seriously. Doom 3 took it's story seriously but even that one fit the tone of Doom and the game itself worked.

The dlc goes even furthur and destroys characters like Hayden and implies that Doom guy's origins are not "human too angry to die". The final cutscene of the DLC was so disappointing and laughable.

I think this is what people mean about the story being "forced" on you. It is not that you can skip it but it is the fact they don't trust you to figure it out by yourself anymore. Rather than Doom guy destroying argent cells or doing what he wants against UAC wishes he instead stands and listens to lore dumps by the enemies or side characters. There are still some parts where Doom guy is still like 4 but they are far and few.

Gameplay wise the game is perfect. The game is a blast from start to finish and all the platforming and stuff like that are great because they let you breath after each encounter. The game felt like GOW3 in a weird way. That game was paced just as well as Doom 5 and you felt like a badass.

The dlc does introduce some bad stuff though. The last boss fight in particular was so bad. The blood angels could be fine as long as they are used sparingly but the last boss just spams them and this sucks. You will constantly be hit by their slower movement attacks if you try to kill the boss. The spirits too have issues and that is they tried to make the microwave useful so they added the spirits and the only way to kill them is using it.
 

Aeroucn

"This guy are sick"
Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,378
I finished the game yesterday and at least for me it's one of the best games this generation. I found Doom 2016 pretty boring and gave up like 5 hours into the game but gave a shot to Eternal on nightmare difficulty and it's was an absolute blast, every encounter was crazy especially the last 2 hours of the game.
I agree with other users about the story, they tried too hard with the lore and at least for me it was a miss.
 

Soj

Member
Oct 27, 2017
10,867
Speaking of these two games - I have never been a fan of most shooters (recently I've been trying Crysis, Halo, Gears, Black and others on gamepass), but both Doom 2016 and Eternal really do it for me. I played the very first Doom and I also liked that, but not as much. I couldn't get into Doom 3 or 64.

What else should I play now that I discovered I like -some- shooters?

Try the Shadow Warrior games. Doom 2016 and Eternal were clearly influenced by them in certain aspects.
 

Dr. Doom

Banned
Oct 29, 2017
1,509
Chainsaw, flamethrower, frag grenade, ice grenade, meat hook, and obviously all the different weapons with their different mods... Ever watched a top player clear Ultra-nightmare? It's nuts.





Sure, but I've skipped the entirety of it on subsequent playthroughs so I barely remember it at this point. What I will agree with is that the tone of 2016 was a lot more grounded and "cooler", and Eternal shifts the tone towards a saturday morning cartoon. I don't mind it though, I think the cartoon vibe fits the over-the-top gameplay really well. The way new guns are just floating mid-air has that kind of gamey, "We don't give a fuck, here's a gun for you" vibe, and the cartoony "Plop!" sound effect that plays when you get a headshot is endlessly satisfying to me.

Holy fuck at that gameplay.
 

Type VII

Member
Oct 31, 2017
2,352
Didn't have the same impact as Doom 2016 but it was a good game. Except for the Marauders, ruined the game for me.
 

Tomasdk

Banned
Apr 18, 2018
910
What I saw people complain the most about, here and elsewhere was that
1) Doom Eternal had a lot more stroy and it was bad. The story was not good, yes, but the notion that Doom 2016 went with "fuck story" is mindboggling since it was everywhere and cutscenes were unskippable, whereas in Eternal, you can pretty much skip everywthing and not even know there is a story at all.

2) no ammo - I saw people surprised by the fact that the chainsaw regenerates, which is the typical "user fails to read basic short text and then blames the programm" scenario. The game has pretty much infinite ammo, the second I learned to use the chainsaw was the second any and all ammo problems dissapeared. The fact that you can't just SSG your way through the game as you could in 2016 ties also here, while the SSG in 2016 was great, there was little reason to use anything else. Eternal is designed so that weapon cycling is encouraged, I can't see that as an disadvantage.

3) Doomguy in Eternal is not a power fantasy - This I don't understand at all since Doomguy wrecks shit even harder than in 2016. The one difference is that you have to move and can't stand around tanking all the damage, which I consider a good move.

4) You have to use certain weapons on certain enemies - Another one I don't understand since the only enemy you sort of have to use specific weapons on is the Marauder (in the base game, the dlc adds an enemy you have to use one certain weapon mod on), and the Marauder became easier the more one played. In the DLC they became a non issue. As for other enemies, some of them have weakpoints, yes, but I don't understand why some people act like it's mandatory to shoot them, I never bothered, except for the begining of the game, but a few levels in, when you have more options, it's a completely optional feature, depending on if it fits a playstyle.

I'm sure there was more, this is just top of my head. One funny complaint that came up from time to time was that the ammo showers are too colorful and you can't see anything. I wonder how many of those people bothered to go to the game options and reduce the color intensity on those.

My personal strong complaint is that the Battlemode sucks and I wanted the game to have normal deathmatch. I guess they didn't include it so that Quake Champions can still exist but it's a shame either way. But outside of that, there's little I can see as a negative. The story got weird, but it's Doom in the end I don't care, I still have Doomguy who wrecks demons, that's all that's needed really. As I see it, the took Doom 2016 and made everything evolved and better. I hope they can do the same in the next one.
 

dgrdsv

Member
Oct 25, 2017
12,268
Chainsaw, flamethrower, frag grenade, ice grenade, meat hook
Riiiight. So what I've called a chainsaw basically, which you are forced to use because the gameplay design is limiting you in ammo/health/etc pickups otherwise.
Personally I've found this to be extremely tedious and something which has actually taken the strategic approach to encounters out of gameplay.

Sure, but I've skipped the entirety of it on subsequent playthroughs so I barely remember it at this point.
Which is exactly why I think that it's a step back compared to 2016 where you don't have to skip anything and the plot is easy to follow and remember.
 
Oct 27, 2017
5,398
I love DOOM ETERNAL, but the game had a couple of wtf mechanics that prevented it from entering god tier.
The resource management was tedious for me, as I was more worried about nobodies suckerpunching me while I was trying to fight the big monsters, and they need to be there because they provide most of the ammunition.
Then the marauders, it wasn't something to pull your hair out, but they were obnoxious and stopped the pace completely
 

Kewlmyc

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
26,963
I just like the original more for some reason. The new one just left me exhausted. I'd never call it a bad game though.
 
Jul 28, 2020
694
I nearly didn't play DE because I didn't love Doom 2016 and saw DE was getting a lot of hate.

Turns out it's great and should be celebrated, imo.

An fps with it's own personality, a gameplay loop that both works and is different to other games, is fun, and has a high skill ceiling in single player doesn't come along often. It looks insane on series X too - I assume because it's not dropping the resolution anymore.
 

Djalminha

Alt-Account
Banned
Sep 22, 2020
2,103
I didn't like the heavier focus on story, it just didn't do anything for me. I found it uninteresting to collect the same weapons and, even worse, same weapon mods as in the previous game with almost no exceptions. The exploration felt less interesting and cut the flow of the game. The combat was great but the platforming was a few times annoying. I didn't appreciate that the game told me how to defeat bosses and enemies right of the bat.

Those are the reasons why it disappointed me.
 

spman2099

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,940
Almost the EXACT same thing happened with Wolfenstein II: New Colossus. Another great game which received a lot of praise from critics (it actually has the exact same metascore as Eternal), but seems to be utterly despised here. For the record, I think both New Colossus and Eternal are great. *shrug*
 

Tpallidum

Member
Oct 28, 2017
2,191
Story in the first one was better and I feel like that's all everyone talks about.

But I enjoyed playing the new one a lot more. The gameplay is a lot better in every single way. Doom Eternal is one of the best games this year without question.
 

FelixFFM

Member
Nov 7, 2017
347
The criticism regarding the lore and story is warranted IMO but I can't for the life of me understand how people think 2016 has better combat and gunplay. It's so hard to go back to 2016 once you've played eternal.
I guess 2016 isn't as demanding on the player and feels more like comfort food.
 

Deleted member 2809

User requested account closure
Banned
Oct 25, 2017
25,478
Almost the EXACT same thing happened with Wolfenstein II: New Colossus. Another great game which received a lot of praise from critics (it actually has the exact same metascore as Eternal), but seems to be utterly despised here. For the record, I think both New Colossus and Eternal are great. *shrug*
Problem being new colossus' gameplay and balance are much worse than TNO's
 

NightShift

Member
Oct 25, 2017
9,203
Australia
I don't get it. The game was better in every way other than the writing and presentation to me. The character action-like enemy design, resource management and all the new mechanics (hook-shot, dash, light parkour) are my jam.
 

Deleted member 46948

Account closed at user request
Banned
Aug 22, 2018
8,852
Problem being new colossus' gameplay and balance are much worse than TNO's

Yeah, this. And also the story.
And it's not just Era bubble - just go look on user reviews at Metacritic, TNC scored around 6.5 average on most platforms, while TNO is above 8. Plenty of people were disappointed in that game.
 

Greywaren

Member
Jul 16, 2019
10,256
Spain
I'm shocked every time I see someone say Eternal was a step down from 2016 because I can't think of anything at all that I thought was worse*

*aside from writing, which, you know, who cares in a game like DOOM?
 

Pyro

God help us the mods are making weekend threads
Member
Jul 30, 2018
14,781
United States
I wanna give it another chance but I felt like that game was way too restrictive and inundated me with weapons/tools without really teaching me how to use them.
 

Santar

Member
Oct 27, 2017
5,400
Norway
Hate?
I did not think the game was nearly as good as DOOM 2016 but I didn't hate it, I just didn't much care for it.
Why must everything be so extreme all the time?
 

leng jai

Member
Nov 2, 2017
15,163
Almost the EXACT same thing happened with Wolfenstein II: New Colossus. Another great game which received a lot of praise from critics (it actually has the exact same metascore as Eternal), but seems to be utterly despised here. For the record, I think both New Colossus and Eternal are great. *shrug*

Colossus is a straight up bad game to me while Doom Eternal is just divisive due to being very different from 2016.
 
Jan 10, 2018
6,927
How many forums do people really visit when they say "Era is the only place where I've seen...."?

And why is it an issue that a particular forum has its own way of drawing conclusions? I was totally in love with Bioshock Infinite for instance and so were the critics, but Era didn't really like it and that was fine. The forum does not have to represent the general audience in every regard or least of all my own personal opinions.
 

leng jai

Member
Nov 2, 2017
15,163
How many forums do people really visit when they say "Era is the only place where I've seen...."?

And why is it an issue that a particular forum has its own way of drawing conclusions? I was totally in love with Bioshock Infinite for instance and so were the critics, but Era didn't really like it and that was fine. The forum does not have to represent the general audience in every regard or least of all my own personal opinions.

Anyone that uses the "Era bubble" argument likely just goes here mostly. This place isn't special, any common complaint here will also be repeated on Reddit, social media and various podcasts. People even claim RDR 2's detractors here were a bubble but a quick look around and you'll see the exact same complaints everywhere else.

The irony is the people complaining about the "Era bubble" mostly just want their favourite game to have an echo chamber which is just the opposite type of bubble.
 

Messofanego

Member
Oct 25, 2017
26,750
UK
With the reveal of it being one of GOTY nominees and getting a decent amount of other recognition recently, I've noticed here a renewal of a lot of people basically being shocked or disappointed about how it's critically praised. Personally it's probably my second favorite game this year, but this is the only place where I see it considered inferior to Doom 2016 or even just not good in general. I see tons of praise for it everywhere elese. It's just one of the weirder bubble things here I've noticed.
I don't agree that it's hate or localised here. More dislike and criticism. Which is good. Or do you want to be in bubbles of effusive praise and no room for improvement?
 

Scousefury

Member
Oct 28, 2017
680
Loved it until the last two boss fights, by the time they were over, i never wanted to play the game ever again. Utterly terrible pieces of game design.