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There are few perfect movies in the world. Terminator 2: Judgment Day is one of them.

Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,150
I re-watched this tonight with my daughter. This was her first time seeing it. Last night we watched the first one-and she had the same opinion as me that it's a good movie-but not fantastic.

T2 on the other hand? Cinematic perfection. My God watching it in 2020 is as exciting as when I saw it in theaters on opening day as a kid.

Linda and Arnold are fucking incredible in this. The score is absolute bliss. Some of the scenes-like the mall and Miles's very 80s house-look dated but everything else is just perfection. The entire breakout sequence from the hospital. From when they break into Cyberdyne to the last scene is a relentless roller coaster that peels your face off.

It's an incredible incredible movie and I love it so much.
 
Gangster Gastino

Gangster Gastino

Member
Mar 21, 2018
2,299
Yes...as long as we're talking about the theatrical cut. The director's cut adds unnecessary scenes that only weakens the film.
 
Mekanos

Mekanos

▲ Legend ▲
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Oct 17, 2018
44,413
In my top 10 favorite movies of all time easily. Plus I'll always remember it as the movie that played the first time I ever had - whoa, hey, are there kids reading this thread?

Gangster Gastino said:
Yes...as long as we're talking about the theatrical cut. The director's cut adds unnecessary scenes that only weakens the film.
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Can't agree. Definitely prefer the director's cut.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,258
One of the few truly perfect sequels that takes the character(s) from the first film, and escalated their personal stories and the plot in a believable way in the context of the defined universes.

Aliens does this, too. 2049 more recently.
 
OP
OP
Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,150
astro said:
One of the few truly perfect sequels that takes the character(s) from the first film, and escalated their personal stories and the plot in a believable way in the context of the defined universes.

Aliens does this, too. 2049 more recently.
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Linda's performance in T2 compared to T1 is awe inspiring.
 
strife85

strife85

Member
Oct 30, 2017
1,487
Agree with OP, it's one of the greats. Part 1 is great too, but not as great. Also, fuck the new one. People who saw the first minutes know why.
 
Hero_of_the_Day

Hero_of_the_Day

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
17,464
Gangster Gastino said:
Yes...as long as we're talking about the theatrical cut. The director's cut adds unnecessary scenes that only weakens the film.
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Yep. I like the T1000 staying invincible 'til death. Him glitching out adds nothing. I just feel like most of the cut scenes are pointless. But, the smile is straight bad. And I prefer the Terminators simply learning, as opposed to the chip setting stuff.
 
jph139

jph139

One Winged Slayer
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Oct 25, 2017
14,449
I remember the first time I saw it - I rolled out of bed on a lazy morning in the summer, flipped through the channels, and saw the initial chase scene (truck vs. motorcycle). Literally couldn't stop watching until it was all over. Like, damn, what a movie.
 
Bishop89

Bishop89

What Are Ya' Selling?
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Oct 25, 2017
35,134
Melbourne, Australia
I cannot find a single flaw in it, so you're not wrong OP.

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Deleted member 29691

User requested account closure
Banned
Nov 1, 2017
1,883
That fucking Guns n Roses track when they're on the dirt bike gets me so damn hype. The spillway chase with the semi and Arnie's lever action shotgun. Holy shit. Truly the best action movie out there.
 
Bor Gullet

Bor Gullet

Member
Oct 27, 2017
12,399
On my last rewatch of the first two I was surprised at how much I preferred T1. It's tighter, leaner, and more efficient in it's storytelling.
 
KtotheRoc

KtotheRoc

One Winged Slayer
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Oct 27, 2017
56,819
One of the best action movies of all time. It's been a long time since I've rewatched it.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,258
Bor Gullet said:
On my last rewatch of the first two I was surprised at how much I preferred T1. It's tighter, leaner, and more efficient in it's storytelling.
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People like to say this, but T2 is just as tight as T1. It just has a slightly larger scope. It is also just as efficient in its storytelling as 1 considering this.
 
DinoBlaster

DinoBlaster

Member
Feb 18, 2020
2,780
ADR on the child actor was a bit over the top, it stuck out to me in every conversation between him and Arnold. That's the only flaw I can think of.
 
Bor Gullet

Bor Gullet

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Oct 27, 2017
12,399
astro said:
People like to say this, but T2 is just as tight as T1. It just has a slightly larger scope.
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Not really, at least for me. Some of the action scenes in T2 overstay their welcome (I'm thinking of the final helicopter chase before they enter the steel mill), and there's a few moments with some of that Jim Cameron cheese that T1 didn't have.

Still a cool movie, I just think T1 is better.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,258
Bor Gullet said:
Not really, at least for me. Some of the action scenes in T2 overstay their welcome (I'm thinking of the final helicopter chase before they enter the steel mill), and there's a few moments with some of that Jim Cameron cheese that T1 didn't have.

Still a cool movie, I just think T1 is better.
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I honestly can't see it. The helicopter scene is really lean and so well shot... every action scene in the film has strong pacing, no wasted shots...

I get preferring the original more as it has a completely different feel, but just because the sequel has more scope doesn't mean it isn't just as lean and efficient for the type of movie it is.

This is partially why I find the battle between the two so frustrating, they are both masterclasses of their genres.
 
Strings

Strings

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Oct 27, 2017
31,608
Cameron is just stupid good at sequels. It's hard to come up with so many cool new twists on ideas while not overly repeating the original or betraying what made it cool.

T2 has sooooo much of this, from the T-800 having a body count of 0, to the father-son dynamic, Miles being a friendly family man, etc.

EDIT: Like, all of those ideas make the film so much harder to write and shoot lol...

You have to come up with awesome action scenes where your badass hero is entirely non-lethal.

You have to take your emotionless robot and give him a convincing arc and a believable dynamic with a child actor.

You have to take the guy who instigates the events of the film - who your characters are going to go and kill - and make him relatable to the point where it's horrible to watch.

Shit is like running a marathon with weights.
 
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Mr Swine

Mr Swine

The Fallen
Oct 26, 2017
6,083
Sweden
As I get older I start to hate how whiny John Connor is. Yeah he is a teen but I wish the movie didn't have him
 

lucablight

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,566
It's one of the best movies of all time but it blatantly ignored the continuity of the first film. Kyle Reese literally says "Nobody else comes through. It's just him and me". Can a movie be perfect if it has to ignore established plot points to exist? I'd rate the original Terminator as the superior film.
 
OP
OP
Dalek

Dalek

Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,150
Mr Swine said:
As I get older I start to hate how whiny John Connor is. Yeah he is a teen but I wish the movie didn't have him
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Nah-I like John. The fact that he's The moral center that keeps Sarah from basically becoming a Terminator herself Is great. He grows up to be the great military leader but he programs his Terminator to be PG-13.
 
astro

astro

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Oct 25, 2017
57,258
lucablight said:
It's one of the best movies of all time but it blatantly ignored the continuity of the first film. Kyle Reese literally says "Nobody else comes through. It's just him and me". Can a movie be perfect if it has to ignore established plot points to exist? I'd rate the original Terminator as the superior film.
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I never bought Kyle,'s intel as airtight, he has no idea how it really works.
 

lucablight

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,566
astro said:
I never bought Kyle,'s intel as airtight, he has no idea how it really works.
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That's a rather adhoc explanation. We all know that the real reason is that the original Terminator was envisioned as a standalone film and that Cameron wrote in that line to raise the stakes so that if Kyle failed it was all over. The events of the original Terminator are supposed to occur in an endless loop but they were retconned when Cameron decided to do a sequel.
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,258
lucablight said:
That's a rather adhoc explanation. We all know that the real reason is that the original Terminator was envisioned as a standalone film and that Cameron wrote in that line to raise the stakes so that if Kyle failed it was all over. The events of the original Terminator are supposed to occur in an endless loop but they were retconned when Cameron decided to do a sequel.
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And it fits because of the fact that Kyle's explanation could easily be incorrect.

It doesn't present a problem once the sequel establishes itself, and Kyle's clear statements that he doesn't get the "tech stuff" help it fit.

I just don't think it does what you claim, even if the original intent was different. The retcon working in hindsight was lucky, though.
 
BobLoblaw

BobLoblaw

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Oct 27, 2017
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Agreed. It's very rare that you have a 2 hour+ movie and can't nitpick even the smallest thing.
 

lucablight

Member
Oct 27, 2017
2,566
astro said:
And it fits because of the fact that Kyle's explanation could easily be incorrect.

It doesn't present a problem once the sequel establishes itself, and Kyle's clear statements that he doesn't get the "tech stuff" help it fit.

I just don't think it does what you claim, even if the original intent was different. The retcon working in hindsight was lucky, though.
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There's nothing to suggest Kyle's explanation is incorrect at the time. He even goes out of his way to say they blew the whole place once they sent him through. It's a contradiction. You can reconcile anything if you try hard enough but it's clearly a retcon.
 
iori9999

iori9999

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Dec 8, 2017
2,352
I think my favorite part of the movie is Sarah Conner transforming from regular girl in part 1, to badass in part 2. Holy shit was she scary!!
 
astro

astro

Member
Oct 25, 2017
57,258
lucablight said:
There's nothing to suggest Kyle's explanation is incorrect at the time. He even goes out of his way to say they blew the whole place once they sent him through. It's a contradiction. You can reconcile anything if you try hard enough but it's clearly a retcon.
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It's a retcon yes, but that fits for many reasons and doesn't do to the sequel what you claim imo.

Kyle says he doesn't get the tech stuff, the fact the machines could easily have had other time chambers, etc... the fact Kyle is suffering from severe PTSD could also make his recall of the details imperfect.

The second film works as a recton and establishes itself because of the lucky choices the original made with this.
 
alundra311

alundra311

Member
Oct 25, 2017
2,234
I really should re-watch this movie one of these days.

Also, Terminator 2 was the first movie I watched at the theater.
 
Keldroc

Keldroc

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Oct 27, 2017
12,037
Except for the part where the characters verbally contradict the time travel rules, leading audiences to not realize that they're wrong and the future is set. The first two Terminator films depict a closed time loop that cannot be altered. The weirdest thing is how T1 establishes that, but T2 could have ignored it and changed the premise...but instead doubles down on the unchangeable future by making Skynet's existence dependent on the 1984 terminator's arm and CPU chip.

Also the main villain vanishes from the film for 45 minutes, which is rather strange.

At any rate, I love both of them, but the first one's better. The second one is just a remake of the first with a gigantic budget.

Gangster Gastino said:
Yes...as long as we're talking about the theatrical cut. The director's cut adds unnecessary scenes that only weakens the film.
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Completely wrong. The added scenes enhance the themes of the film tremendously, and in particular restoring the need for the humans to activate the learning CPU, thus making them (specifically John's belief in his ability to change, stopping Sarah from smashing the chip) responsible for his gained humanity by the end of the story, is a massive improvement. The inclusion of the glitching T-1000 in the steel mill also makes that whole sequence a lot more coherent. I see no reason I would ever watch the theatrical again.
 
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