Who will finish second in delegates?

  • Williamson / Haley

    Votes: 75 32.6%
  • Williamson / DeSantis

    Votes: 5 2.2%
  • Philips / Haley

    Votes: 36 15.7%
  • Philips / DeSantis

    Votes: 3 1.3%
  • Chaos

    Votes: 111 48.3%

  • Total voters
    230
  • Poll closed .
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Fnor

Member
Nov 7, 2023
509
I mean the right won't stop trying, but hopefully people on the left stop falling for it now. If Trump debates Biden and Biden performs like last night then they might drop it, but we shall see.

Anyone on the left who was hanging on to that isn't going to be convinced by anything Biden does because their media bubble will keep feeding them carefully tailored videos to poison the well.

If they were in acting in good faith. Which most of them aren't, anyway.
 

Maxim726x

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
13,172
I mean the right won't stop trying, but hopefully people on the left stop falling for it now. If Trump debates Biden and Biden performs like last night then they might drop it, but we shall see.

I really want to see Biden publicly challenge Trump to a debate.

I don't think he'd accept. At least that way it paints Trump as a pathetic coward who isn't up to the task of debating the person he's been arguing is an invalid for the last 4 years.
 
Nov 27, 2020
4,347
I really want to see Biden publicly challenge Trump to a debate.

I don't think he'd accept. At least that way it paints Trump as a pathetic coward who isn't up to the task of debating the person he's been arguing is an invalid for the last 4 years.
A year ago I would have said that Trump just sees any airtime during a debate as a positive, regardless of the outcome, but I'm pretty certain that there won't be debates this year. I'd actually love to be wrong, because the direct comparison would paint Biden in a positive light…but that's also why I don't think they'll happen.

I saw some analysis that suggested that it was Trump's constant anger that makes him seem more "with it". Biden channeled quite a bit of that anger last night, but Biden also is smart on issues, policies, and the way government works. Anger only covers for stupid so much.
 

rjinaz

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
28,527
Phoenix
Yeah I am conflicted whether Trump actually debates or not. He could just play the victim about all his court appearances and blame Biden for not debating.

Or maybe he actually wants to. My gut says he won't. After tonight's performance he can't go out there expecting a weak Biden. Not sure he has anything to gain by debating. It is better for Donald Trump to appear as little on camera as possible going forward. Will he avoid the spotlight though?
 

Volimar

volunteer forum janitor
Member
Oct 25, 2017
39,470
Trump will claim he wants a debate and then pull out over some rules issue. It wouldn't matter though. I don't think you get anything out of debating Trump. He'll refuse to answer questions and just rant about what he wants and no one will hold him accountable for it. Biden should just do town halls.
 

Chaos Legion

The Wise Ones
Member
Oct 30, 2017
16,991
Trump just challenged Biden to debates this week and Doocy hounded KJP about whether Biden is capable of debating.

The only way there won't be debates is if Trump's current lead expands and he is just walloping Biden in the polls by the fall. There's no universe his ego does not make him think he would destroy Biden in a debate.
 
Nov 27, 2020
4,347
Yeah I am conflicted whether Trump actually debates or not. He could just play the victim about all his court appearances and blame Biden for not debating.

Or maybe he actually wants to. My gut says he won't. After tonight's performance he can't go out there expecting a weak Biden. Not sure he has anything to gain by debating. It is better for Donald Trump to appear as little on camera as possible going forward. Will he avoid the spotlight though?
After last night, and the reactions from Trump and the right, it seems like they know there's no upside to debating Biden.

Trump will claim he wants a debate and then pull out over some rules issue. It wouldn't matter though. I don't think you get anything out of debating Trump. He'll refuse to answer questions and just rant about what he wants and no one will hold him accountable for it. Biden should just do town halls.
I can easily see a poison pill like "we agree to a debate, but Hannity has to moderate" or something like that.
 

Lump

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
16,335
My full $7500 EV tax credit just hit my account today so I can confirm it was real. Thanks Biden.
 

rjinaz

Avenger
Oct 25, 2017
28,527
Phoenix
Trump just challenged Biden to debates this week and Doocy hounded KJP about whether Biden is capable of debating.

The only way there won't be debates is if Trump's current lead expands and he is just walloping Biden in the polls by the fall. There's no universe his ego does not make him think he would destroy Biden in a debate.
Yeah but Trump says a lot of things. Not sure him saying that this early means anything when he knows debates would be far off still.

There were people confident Trump would debate in the primaries as well for the same reasons and he didn't
 
Oct 29, 2017
13,470
Trump will claim he wants a debate and then pull out over some rules issue. It wouldn't matter though. I don't think you get anything out of debating Trump. He'll refuse to answer questions and just rant about what he wants and no one will hold him accountable for it. Biden should just do town halls.

I agree. Town halls and speeches are the way to go forward this year, painting himself as the obvious choice against Trump. After last night in think it's clear he's got this. Trump will continue to get angrier and angrier that the farce he, and the GOP, has built up over Biden's supposed physical and mental frailty is not actually true. That anger and hate will be a stark contrast to Biden's messaging and style, and independents and on-the-fence-Dems will see that.
 

Sheepinator

Member
Jul 25, 2018
28,184
Trump will claim he wants a debate and then pull out over some rules issue. It wouldn't matter though. I don't think you get anything out of debating Trump. He'll refuse to answer questions and just rant about what he wants and no one will hold him accountable for it. Biden should just do town halls.
Agreed. Not only are they a waste of time with Trump, I don't think Biden should share a stage with him as equals. The guy is a criminal and a a traitor, and he's still pushing traitor rhetoric (NATO). So long as Biden is seen out and about and seeming to be fine, that's enough.
 

Rag

Member
Oct 30, 2017
3,905
He nailed it.

If he can effectively dispel the notion that he's no longer up to the job, cognitively, then I have every confidence he's going to be fine in November.
Let's dispel this notion that Biden doesn't know what he's doing. Joe Biden knows exactly what he's doing.

*fumbles water bottle and slurps on it*
 

Maxim726x

Avenger
Oct 27, 2017
13,172
They're criticizing him for being too loud?

We're way, way past the point that the right's criticisms are grounded in reality. If nothing exists, they'll make it up.

My concern has always been how objective observers (few though that there are) were going to see him last night.

And my fears have been allayed for now. If he can keep up that level of vigor and sharpness, he's going to persuade most of the people on the fence that he can be an effective POTUS.
 

BWoog

Member
Oct 27, 2017
38,650
So what attack angle will the media take now that "Dottering old man" is no longer viable? They really gonna try to say Biden is divisive against Trump?
 

Becks'

Member
Dec 7, 2017
7,746
Canada
Good to see, but it is just WILD that the before numbers looked the way they did. Clearly propaganda was doing the same number on Biden as it did Hillary for those stats to be that low.

Can't speak for other platforms but TikTok was full of "Senile Joe" clips for the last year where he would make a minor gaffe or mispronounce something. It definitely affected Biden's reputation. It also does not help that corporate media also ran with that.
 

Dark Knight

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 25, 2017
19,533
Good to see, but it is just WILD that the before numbers looked the way they did. Clearly propaganda was doing the same number on Biden as it did Hillary for those stats to be that low.
Almost like the only "sleepy" ones are the general public themselves! It's because it takes a national television event for them to pay any attention to the man himself.

Any other political news they absorb is filtered through multiple layers of propaganda and talking heads.
 

Otnopolit

Member
Oct 28, 2017
1,607
Glad to hear all the positive press after the SOTU last night! I remain hopeful about November. Tap the signnnnnnn!
 

Sho_Nuff82

Member
Nov 14, 2017
18,632
So what attack angle will the media take now that "Dottering old man" is no longer viable? They really gonna try to say Biden is divisive against Trump?

The Atlantic preemptively wrote an editorial before the SOTU even aired to pivot away from the Biden-is-old criticism into bitch-eating-crackers territory.

www.threads.net

The Atlantic (@theatlantic) on Threads

“There might be more to voters’ acrimony toward Biden than just his age,” @MarkLeibovich writes. “In speaking with Democrats about the president’s reelection chances, I often pick up a sharp tone that goes beyond resignation. It sounds more like rage.” https://theatln.tc/1tDKNH5g

NYT after included a blurb that DT Jr was not impressed on social media:


View: https://www.threads.net/@aguinz/post/C4PaopssApN/?xmt=AQGzYIYbhY6F5VJyZ-zKygRtLK1oLNp_8BG2nbOlKna9Wg

It's almost as if they have a stake in this narrative.
 

KtotheRoc

One Winged Slayer
Member
Oct 27, 2017
56,900
TLDR on these? I'm not going to click on twitter stuff.

The first one is the hot-mic moment from around the time the ACA was signed where Biden was caught saying it was a "big (bleeping) deal" and then cuts to him at last night's SOTU where Biden says the ACA, Obamacare, is still a big deal.

The second is about how Biden thinks the press isn't talking enough about Trump's dangerous rhetoric and how the reporter notes that Trump's first real big campaign event was in Waco, Texas on the 30th anniversary of the raid that has become a BIG MEME for dangerous right wing anti-government extremists and playing audio of the insurrectionists on January 6th singing the national anthem. Seth is right that this is disturbing shit. (Whether he was high or not, I do not know.)
 
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