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Who did the most damage of the last 6 Republican Presidents?
- Thread starter Deleted member 31923
- Start date
So once in a while I like to update this thread. Seems like one of the main reasons for Trump not being consistently voted worst republican president is that "well at least he hasn't killed that many people". What about now?
Yes. Reagan is still the worst. He let the AIDS pandemic run wild, the started the enormously damaging war on drugs, he wrecked the lives of millions in the US and LatAm through installing genocidal right wing governments, Iran-Contra, he gutted mental health in the US causing at least 125000 people with mental illness to become homeless, he supported the Mujahideen coup in Afghanistan which created the Taliban, he rigged elections with taxpayer money, his administration put NELSON MANDELA on a terrorist watchlist and may have aided South Africa in his arrest, he supported apartheid.
As bad as Trump is he does not hold a candle to Reagan.
Reagan was a symptom I think. The Republican party was moving in that direction with or without him as it best served their stakeholders' interests.
Bush didn't have to invade Iraq. It didn't have to happen at all. Bush wins.
Bush didn't have to invade Iraq. It didn't have to happen at all. Bush wins.
Still Reagan or Bush Jr IMO but timely of you to bump, Trump's certainly catching up to them for sure
Neither Reagan nor Bush undermined nearly every government institution, flagrantly disregarded the Constitution, or was so brazenly corrupt and willfully inept and narcissistic as Trump. Neither of them pitted Americans against each other.
There has never in US history been a president anywhere near as damaging as Trump.
It's not even fucking close.
There has never in US history been a president anywhere near as damaging as Trump.
It's not even fucking close.
Honestly I think it's hard to determine the depth of the problems Trump has actually caused. He's set about a lot of chaos but it's hard to know what that means in the long run especially internally. It's easy to say Reagan or Bush but a lot of Trump's influence is still just burgeoning and he's already really bad.
I voted Trump
He's anti-science
He's corrupt and shameless about it
He stokes divisions
He's so incompetent and unqualified
He undermines people more knowledgable than him, he shows no respect to other world leaders.
He's isolationist
He's a puppet
His anti-science stance will have long-lasting consequences. We're already seeing some of those consequences, he's politicised everything.
He's anti-science
He's corrupt and shameless about it
He stokes divisions
He's so incompetent and unqualified
He undermines people more knowledgable than him, he shows no respect to other world leaders.
He's isolationist
He's a puppet
His anti-science stance will have long-lasting consequences. We're already seeing some of those consequences, he's politicised everything.
Maybe if you only consider the damage done to your own country.
Otherwise it's Bush.
To think that Bush didn't undermine things is hilarious.
Trump doesn't happen without all of the damage Reagan, Nixon and Bush did before him.
Reagan was the blueprint. Or the redprint, if you will.
Trump is the crumbling decayed house built from those plans.
Trump is the crumbling decayed house built from those plans.
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Reagan's still the worst because all of the wounds that America is seeing have a spotlight on them stemmed from the vision he entrapped America within. The fact we don't have universal systems of compassion - healthcare, housing, even UBI - all stem from the push he made on "welfare queens." Or to put it another way, he solidified the idea that black people would be an anchor in this country and made that the out-and-about conservative position. Almost every single attack on decent, all-encompassing programs and projects go back to the "obstacle" that they would cover non-whites. In case people have forgotten, and I apologize for quoting the word he has used, but Ronald Reagan referred to such people as "monkeys," and laughed about it. What is so different from that when Trump calls Mexicans "rapists?" This act of subhumanity, to infer people as unpeople, is central to the conservative movement, and in fact is the whole point of it now. This is a cornerstone to nearly half of the belief in our political system. Trump is a literal, living manifestation of those beliefs.
All Trump's done is remove the dog whistles and grandeur around that central vision of individualism as isolationism and really said the real goals and issues conservatism has without the spoiler tags around it. Openly wanting to abolish healthcare rulings in the middle of a pandemic. That protesters aren't "his supporters" in a way that disregards them in full. His response to the pandemic is appalling, but he won the ticket in a party that has been trying to sabotage the concept of government for decades. Him having a dogshit response, and let us not forget it, has been something Republicans have wanted to make as the default response to any single situation facing America. It all must be done better, or even "decently," in private hands. Katrina was the same thing. Flint was the same thing. It's almost as if it's the Republican thing.
"The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I'm from the government and I'm here to help." - Ronald Reagan
Trump took that statement and made it a vision to manifest as the government. The worst thing we can hear is how this dogshit government is ""helping"" by actively attacking all channels of genuine aid. It helps by harming, by isolating, by suggesting private, unaccountable hands are the only ones that can really solve it anyway, and that's the point of it in the current conservative vision. Better for Walmart to chip in and do the government's job, it seems. His Republican worshippers contributed because the idea has always been to make the government seem massively inefficient to do any fucking thing, so this was a hellish shared vision. Unless it's to bomb non-white in the middle east, or to do something with transferring that equipment to police, the plan has always been one of direct sabotage.
All the COVID pandemic has done, to be quite honest about it, is to manifest Reagan's quote as genuine policy. Never forget that Republicans straight up argued that "blue states" should be left to suffer, for this goes deeper than an egotistical con man who can never do anything right holding the Oval Office as a stage to advertise fucking Goya beans. It goes right back into seeing specific people as unpeople, that they don't deserve compassion, and any plan to confront that must be sabotaged. The same vision manifests in how it's dragged its feet, now to the back half of a month where meager benefits are drying up, and is going to argue on some level no more help is needed for regular people, but the real help is to protect companies from COVID-related lawsuits. This is, to hammer the point home here, to emphasize that companies always know best: the government can't help because the government is the villain.
What I concluded my post in this thread a few months ago still rings true. You do not get a Donald Trump without a Ronald Reagan. You don't get Trump's "run America like a business" without the neoliberal commodification of the public good, that business is always the answer to all questions, and to reference the Reagan quote directly, how the government is made to be seen as the worst option always and forever. What this means for the long-term that's dangerous is that Trumpism will create an entire generation of conservatives who adhere to him as the gold standard, only for yet another famous senior citizen TV personality to run for office while their brain turns into toothpaste. Reagan gave us Trump. And we've yet to have recovered from Reagan.
Reagan and GWB had 8 years to fuck shit up, so that gives them an edge. I don't want to see what 8 years of Trump brings us.
Edit: that said, I pretty much agree with Foffy's post above when we're looking at the long term, and far reaching effects their presidencies have had on this country and the world..
Edit: that said, I pretty much agree with Foffy's post above when we're looking at the long term, and far reaching effects their presidencies have had on this country and the world..
There's damage done to America and Americans and there's damage done to foreigners.
Bush Jr still " wins "
Bush Jr still " wins "
Reagan. He permanently moved this country to the right. It may be impossible to ever see an FDR-style Democrat in the White House ever again because of him.
This thread has given me some extra information about Reagan I wasn't previously aware of. Not American/born in 1991. He was a miserable sack of shit.
That's a bit of an answer steeped in privilege. He killed a lot of people in the lgbtq+ community. And yes he did so on purposes to gain popularity. And not just in the USA, Reagan's foreign policy shaped the policy of those after him, including his policy on HIV. Reagan's responsible for millions of deaths, yes millions!
And yes it's an answer steeped in privilege as without knowledge of these events one is shielded from them. Like how drugs were pumped into black communities in the USA and how the war on drugs combined with the Monroe doctrine and communist fear mongering screwed over South and Middle America.
It's stuff most people are shielded from, even gay people in western nations as they were born after the Reagan presidency. But if you talk to older lgbtq+ people they can tell you about this, and there is quite a bit of reading material on the matter.
Same btw with the other examples. Minorities were really screwed over under Reagan.
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Trump by far. I think he's done foundational damage to the country in only 4 years. He's actively trying to destroy this country and his selfishness is beyond the pale.
you can say Reagan is the beginning but trump is the super sayan of dog shit.
Nixon,Bush and Reagan were terrible but they all at least did one good thing during their time.
If I would blame one man though I would pick Rupert Murdoch. Seriously you can trace a lot of this shit to his media empire all the way back to the early 80s
you can say Reagan is the beginning but trump is the super sayan of dog shit.
Nixon,Bush and Reagan were terrible but they all at least did one good thing during their time.
If I would blame one man though I would pick Rupert Murdoch. Seriously you can trace a lot of this shit to his media empire all the way back to the early 80s
Trump no contest honestly. The damage he has done in not even 4 years will be felt for decades.
This is my view. With or without Reagan the party was in that direction, they found a good actor in Reagan to make those views palpable to the masses. Bush destabilized an entire region and crashed the global economy through the continuation of de-regulation. Add into that rampant corruption in his own administration and a fragrant disregard of the Constitution and its hard pressed to find a worse President.
Bush still has more bodies on him. Frankly, it's not just bodycount for me. Bush starting wars, invading and killing civilian foreigners and toppling two other countries is morally worse than Trump allowing his own citizens to die. All of our secret prisons over there was just an excuse to sexually abuse and torture non-whites.
At the end of the day it's up to us to handle Trump. He's our homegrown problem.
Well our current one's inaction lead to 135,000 dead. Sooooo... gonna be kinda hard to top that
This thread was made in February...good god a lot has changed since this thread was made. I had voted for W. Bush, but found Trump to be pretty close overall. Now I'd say it's even closer given everything that's happened since then:
- George Floyd and Trump's handling of that, effectively attempting to start a civil war, backing and refusal to do anything about the police, and of course being bunker bitch.
- His handling of the COVID pandemic is straight up dangerous.
- Telling people to take hydroxychloroquin when it's literally harmful if you don't actually have a condition you're supposed to be taking it for.
- Telling people to inject/ingest bleach.
- Getting hospitals so send the WH data directly rather than to the CDC
- Undermining his own officials with organizations like the CDC
- Refusal to wear a mask for a long time, being partially responsible for the thousands of Americans that refuse to wear masks and think it's the government controlling them or whatever.
- Commuting Roger Stone's sentence.
W. Bush destabilized Iraq and the middle east which led to the creation of ISIS, but the thing is I would argue what Trump did on American soil is just as bad if not worse. Tons of Americans have died or are currently dying because of him. Many Americans still refuse to wear masks because of him. Distorting the data makes it harder to end this pandemic. Siding with government-sponsored gangs (aka the police) murdering people of color. Hiding in a bunker whenever his constituents are furious and protesting, rather than addressing the reason for the protests. Attempting to incite a civil war. Telling people to do things that will almost certainly kill themselves.
- George Floyd and Trump's handling of that, effectively attempting to start a civil war, backing and refusal to do anything about the police, and of course being bunker bitch.
- His handling of the COVID pandemic is straight up dangerous.
- Telling people to take hydroxychloroquin when it's literally harmful if you don't actually have a condition you're supposed to be taking it for.
- Telling people to inject/ingest bleach.
- Getting hospitals so send the WH data directly rather than to the CDC
- Undermining his own officials with organizations like the CDC
- Refusal to wear a mask for a long time, being partially responsible for the thousands of Americans that refuse to wear masks and think it's the government controlling them or whatever.
- Commuting Roger Stone's sentence.
W. Bush destabilized Iraq and the middle east which led to the creation of ISIS, but the thing is I would argue what Trump did on American soil is just as bad if not worse. Tons of Americans have died or are currently dying because of him. Many Americans still refuse to wear masks because of him. Distorting the data makes it harder to end this pandemic. Siding with government-sponsored gangs (aka the police) murdering people of color. Hiding in a bunker whenever his constituents are furious and protesting, rather than addressing the reason for the protests. Attempting to incite a civil war. Telling people to do things that will almost certainly kill themselves.
Yeah COVID has made it hard for me to hang onto my prime-mover-Nixon vote.
And Trump isn't just responsible for US COVID deaths (...and descent into fascism..) but also all the deaths that the US would typically help prevent worldwide. The US helped prevent an Ebola pandemic under Obama by providing tons of aid and rallying the international community. Even if the US could have no additional effect on China, the international response led by the US could've saved so many more lives.
And Trump isn't just responsible for US COVID deaths (...and descent into fascism..) but also all the deaths that the US would typically help prevent worldwide. The US helped prevent an Ebola pandemic under Obama by providing tons of aid and rallying the international community. Even if the US could have no additional effect on China, the international response led by the US could've saved so many more lives.
Still George W Bush without a doubt. The lives lost because of him and his administration's decisions was absolutely horrific.
I still don't think "total body count" is the only factor for judging a president. Because then that makes Lyndon Johnson worse than Nixon, Ford, Reagan, HW Bush, W Bush, and Trump, and that's just not an argument that I'm willing to accept.
Also I'm interested in the 9 people who think that Gerald Ford did more damage than Richard Nixon.
Also I'm interested in the 9 people who think that Gerald Ford did more damage than Richard Nixon.
I think the legacy of Reagan's policies and attitudes put him on top. As for immediate damage, I gotta go with Trump.
And caused the shift of the Democratic party to the right leading to the neoliberalism practiced post-Carter and Dukakis embarrassments to the point you have Bill Clinton being lauded for stating, with enthusiasm, "the era of big government is over."
Dude, Republicans ruin our country, wtf. When you put them all in chronological order like this it becomes extremely clear.