These sound like things that have been a part of action games for ages, just with fighting game terminology...
Why button mashing doesn't work (in fighting games) - Core-A Gaming Analysis
- Thread starter Omar310
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Very good video.
I would only add to it, for people interested in learning a fighting game, that you still have to learn by playing, not studying. (And that would be a lot more fun anyway, right?)
The knowledge in this video gives you the conceptual background necessary to understand what you are doing right and wrong and what you should think about in order to improve.
I would only add to it, for people interested in learning a fighting game, that you still have to learn by playing, not studying. (And that would be a lot more fun anyway, right?)
The knowledge in this video gives you the conceptual background necessary to understand what you are doing right and wrong and what you should think about in order to improve.
Core-A remembering that they have an audience that isn't just made up of dudes that have played SF for 28 years will always be appreciated.
The true secret to learning fighting games is getting a buddy around/slightly better than you, and going at it regularly. You'll learn together and keep each other invested.
Finally I understand what Okizeme means. I even read a description once on Shoryuken and it never came across as cleanly as this video.
I didn't care as much to learn what meaty actually meant but it is good to know now what it is supposed to mean.
I didn't care as much to learn what meaty actually meant but it is good to know now what it is supposed to mean.
Just recently rediscovered FIghting Games with the release of MK11, and now I'm enjoying that, Smash Ultimate, and SFV with my kids and solo. I haven't loved the genre since SF2/MK2. I'd been catching up on this dude's stuff but noticed he hadn't posted in a long time, I'm glad to see new stuff from him! Lots to learn.
Probably the best, most succinct, video on fighting mechanics and terminology on the web.
Why is that? If you don't mind me asking.
Why is that? If you don't mind me asking.
It's just the very technical and skill focused gameplay that relies on both players understanding a very specific set of rules in the context of a 1v1 competition. It is literally the opposite of the reasons why I enjoy the games I enjoy, which are immersion, atmosphere, story and role playing. Obviously with MK and similar games you can have those elements as well, but they exist outside the actual fighting game gameplay experience for the most part.
That's too bad that the beginning of the video is flawed. The equivalent of buttons mashing in a RTS would be making a lot of units to overflow your enemy (that's what I did back in the days in Command & Conquer); in a driving game, that would be ramming the other cars and wall riding (that's also what I did in the first Gran Turismo). And as a beginner, that was enough for me to have fun.
Those things still requires you to input specific actions to execute a specific goal.
Button mashing in the context of the video has no plan whatsoever- It's literally just hit any and every button in the hopes of doing something.
Yeah, that's true, my impatience spoke before me. Button mashing is just doing what you think of just to move, but I think it concerns only people who do not know the basic rules of a fighting game, or just the basic rules of a video game.
When I first tried Street Fighter 2 as a child, I was curious enough to go look at the manual to know how to do a special move, but I had already a little bit of experience about video games. When someone play a fighting game for the first time, even moreso a video game for the first time, you can't expect that person to know how to use a pad, so they will just do whatever they can to play.
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lol, these guys are hilarious. Perfectly showing that button mashing works and it's entertaning as fuck!
it technically answers the question, though:
"Button mashing doesn't work when your opponent knows how their moves actually work. HERE'S HOW EVERYTHING WORKS."
Honestly, this was just a really great video at describing fighting game mechanics.
And also made me hop back into tekken
And also made me hop back into tekken
The video isn't flawed just because the creator isn't familiar with what are noob mistakes in other game types. The part about RTS I immediately knew he didn't get but it doesn't undermine the entire body of his work.
Nah. He framed his point that beginners can't get away with button mashing in those games. Specifically for RTS he said beginners wouldn't be able to control their units.
That isn't not the sort of issue typical for newbies. In fact newbies have to learn how to mash buttons with purpose otherwise they will fall behind another player with higher APM (actions per minute). Yet even building up APM isn't a noob mistake. That's what you train your body to do after you get down the basics such as keeping your economy going within the limits of your weak APM while pumping out units.
When someone starts out playing an RTS they usually aren't clicking enough because they are paralyzed between the decisions on what to build or are so focused on one aspect of the game they neglect another aspect that sustains the rudimentary strategy they are using.
Right, because no one actually plays those games like that as it's obvious from the get go that doing so leads to undesired results. Since it's not so obvious wth fighting games, they're easier to be approached that way.
Well this video assumes the person has at least a partially functioning brain, which is more credit than Birdie players deserve.
Says the Alex player lmao
That's a good video, I'm actually kinda surprised. Maybe it went a bit too deep into the mechanics but the basic explanation why button mashing won't work is very good. Also I remember that Gandhi match and it's awesome!
This is also true lmao
I want a video explaining the psychology of fighting game casuals not understanding that forward is always forward and back is always back no matter which direction you're facing. I guess the "Why Fighting Games are Hard" video probably covers it and it has to do with the daunting moves list that fighting games have. Still, to this day I can't get my friends and family to understand that forward is always forward and back always back.
that's not mashing though.
I've never heard of this before, wow.
To directly answer the title... it kinda depends on the game? I know in Soul Calibur you can do some cool shit by mashing because lots of different moves are tied to combination inputs and sometimes self-combo. In some games you can end up doing cool supers or EX moves by accident. But in lots of other fighters it's almost completely useless.
Back when I played stuff like MvC3 super casually I'd teach people the basic launcher and air combo stuff just so they have something to latch on to. In another case, one of my friends got much better at the basics of SF4 after a little bit of coaching (sweep punishes, how to block properly, even shoryu against jump-ins as an option). It's really cool when people start to see what the game being played looks like under the hood.
I think this video is great! I've been meaning to share this one around with folks who play fighters casually.
Back when I played stuff like MvC3 super casually I'd teach people the basic launcher and air combo stuff just so they have something to latch on to. In another case, one of my friends got much better at the basics of SF4 after a little bit of coaching (sweep punishes, how to block properly, even shoryu against jump-ins as an option). It's really cool when people start to see what the game being played looks like under the hood.
I think this video is great! I've been meaning to share this one around with folks who play fighters casually.
Honestly, now I've developed the opposite problem, where my brain struggles with games that flip the input like MK11.
Of course it is. "Hold back and mash kick" is not any less "mashing" just because you're holding a direction.
When said like that it sounds stupid, but what they really mean is how in move lists, "->" doesn't actually mean "Right", but "the direction your character is facing towards", which is not exactly intuitive for people not used to fighting games.
Then of course, some modern fighting games "fix" this by actually reversing the displayed input if you happen to check the list while your character is facing left, which completely fucks me over. :D
The reason I don't see it that way, is that you're using a viable strategy. If your opponent refuses to block low, then constantly sweeping or using the same low attack repeatedly doesn't really seem mindless like "button mashing" typically is.
The AI being terrible enough that you can beat it by mashing doesn't make what you're doing anything other than mashing. :D It's still 100% mindless; you don't need to anticipate, react, or even look at the screen.