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Jul 19, 2020
1,131
Magic: the Gathering also did the "faction of highly honourable people who don't wear armor on their backs" thing like a decade and a half ago with Bant in the plane of Alara and didn't feel the need to use it as an excuse to objectify its warrior women's asses (though it's still not perfect and you'll find some instances of boobplate and so on)

In fact it's probably the only example of the trope (is it common enough to call it one?) I'm aware of that doesn't just use it to feature a lot of ass shots.

4flxnqp5qnz31.png

deft_duelist_by_davepalumbo_d2g0khq-fullview.jpg

latest

4535-knight-of-the-reliquary.jpg

3529-bant-battlemage.jpg

Like in general the knights wear capes or cloaks so their backside is entirely obscured, and the mages and rogues and so on who aren't (half) covered in steel are at least wearing something cool looking that fits with the high fantasy look.
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,180
It's natural for her to wear that in the context of the story! I can't help it that in the game I wrote, it's the culture of all the characters to wear g-strings! I'm really just a helpless bystander!
 

crienne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,180
It's natural for her to wear that in the context of the story! I can't help it that in the game I wrote, it's the culture of all the characters to wear g-strings! I'm really just a helpless bystander!

No, don't you understand? She has her own agency as a person in that world so it's HER decision to bare her ass. We certainly didn't force her to do it.
 

Deleted member 8257

Oct 26, 2017
24,586


I can't complain a whole lot, but that little struggle exposure is out of place. Also not the biggest fan of the skin tight pants tbh.
 
Feb 24, 2018
5,254
Been re-playing all of the Batman Arkham games, halfway through Arkham Knight and just got to THAT bit (I won't go into detail because it involves suicide) and it's really hard no to notice how much these games have issues with women.

Harley has this in spades throughout the games; I'm not going to de-rail this post by talking about comics but to keep it short, Paul Dini despite her creator is since post the original BTAS (pre-New Batman Adventures) been one of the worse when it comes to writing her. He flanderizes her to an extreme, treats her a joke, constantly has Batman belittle her and KO her in one punch and makes her obsession with Joker her sole thing, all of which is ramped up in the Arkham with an added dose of heavy sexualisation (remember, it's these games fault we can't have in her classic costume anymore).
It's kind of baffling looking back that in a mere 6 years, Harley has gotten WAY more positive treatment in fiction that the Arkham games feel so out of touch in hindsight.

But even outside of Harley, none of the women in the Rocksteady games really get it well, either heavily sexualized, die, kidnapped etc. Out of all the Arkham games, WB Montreal Origins is the best when it comes to this though still not the best. And it's also uncomfortable knowing that while Rocksteady was pulling this, they were also abusing their women employees, something that's sadly been forgotten about.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,406
(remember, it's these games fault we can't have in her classic costume anymore).
Frankly the classic costume looking like this when rendered realistically is probably a much bigger reason for that than the arkham games, because they did just that:
jocelyn-jocz-zeller-harleyquinn-dlc-halfbody-unreal.jpg



Suicide Squad is what really led to DC basically abandoning this as her look outside of references.

Out of all the Arkham games, WB Montreal Origins is the best when it comes to this though still not the best.
Still not the best is uh...putting it mildly.
QQjPQ8j.gif

Arkham even back at the beginning always felt weird at the best at of times and a perfect example to point to when it comes to sexist character design at the worst.
 

Keiriks

Omicron Persei 8 Logic
Member
Aug 19, 2021
6,180
Reykjavík, Iceland
Speaking of Harley, I'm gonna take a moment to appreciate her Birds of Prey look. The Fortnite version specifically, because that is a video game and thus on topic.

sGiQaBz.png

In terms of coverage it's really not any more modest than her Suicide Squad outfit but it goes to show how far thoughtful character design can go. It looks like a funky outfit she would wear because she wanted to.
 

spman2099

Member
Oct 25, 2017
10,893
I came in this thread after my previous play session of Tales of Arise, in my opinion it's not a spoiler or anything and I don't remember exactly when it happened but when you're comfortable you can read this.

So this thread has "her ass is part of her character" as part of the title because of how weird it sounds when people talk like that. Turns out with Kisara, it's kind of actually literally being used BY THE GAME as an excuse for the attire!

You see, Menancian guards take pride in the fact that they NEVER show their back to the enemy! So they don't wear armor in the back!
It is Kojima making us ashamed of our words and deeds all over again...
 

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,924
Been re-playing all of the Batman Arkham games, halfway through Arkham Knight and just got to THAT bit (I won't go into detail because it involves suicide) and it's really hard no to notice how much these games have issues with women.

Harley has this in spades throughout the games; I'm not going to de-rail this post by talking about comics but to keep it short, Paul Dini despite her creator is since post the original BTAS (pre-New Batman Adventures) been one of the worse when it comes to writing her. He flanderizes her to an extreme, treats her a joke, constantly has Batman belittle her and KO her in one punch and makes her obsession with Joker her sole thing, all of which is ramped up in the Arkham with an added dose of heavy sexualisation (remember, it's these games fault we can't have in her classic costume anymore).

It's kind of baffling looking back that in a mere 6 years, Harley has gotten WAY more positive treatment in fiction that the Arkham games feel so out of touch in hindsight.

But even outside of Harley, none of the women in the Rocksteady games really get it well, either heavily sexualized, die, kidnapped etc. Out of all the Arkham games, WB Montreal Origins is the best when it comes to this though still not the best. And it's also uncomfortable knowing that while Rocksteady was pulling this, they were also abusing their women employees, something that's sadly been forgotten about.
I didn't even know about the Rocksteady allegations. Thank you for bringing them up again.
 

crienne

Member
Oct 25, 2017
5,180
So there's this free third-person zombie shooter called Deathly Stillness: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1727650/Deathly_Stillness/

It's mechanically pretty good and a nice quick easy "pop in, shoot zombies, pop out" experience.

Well I still have it installed and they just added female character models: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1727650/view/4941001585207960268
Many players want me to add female characters, so it took 1 day to modify all the functional logic.
Now it can support switching between males and females
Although there are still many flaws and molds in the animation, it is generally playable. I wish you all a happy game!

  • Added male and female switching function
  • Added 6 survival female characters and 5 sexy female characters

And if you want to see them, click the spoiler.
6c0b5c35173cd202411daa2e0fcb71f28ec6368c.png

Now obviously they're just basic "game dev store" models, but this is just so tiring.
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,045
Been replaying Sly Cooper and it has not aged well

Objectification:

TjVt1Um.png


TptbnJJ.png


9HkR8gi.png


Sexualization:

KTlGhEJ.png


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Damsel'd:

CrUGG43.png


And everything about the ending:

1i0TKMC.png


u6q0uzX.png


uSRN5GD.png



And that's not even getting into the racial stereotypes. So much of the early naughts are filled with garbage like this.
 

Crossing Eden

Member
Oct 26, 2017
53,406
Was planning on replaying Fallen Order soon and decided to look up mods and uh...

znU2Qmr.gif

279-1607815805-1770562145.png



realitycanbewhateveriwant.gif

I love the actor, story, and all that but there's a timeline out there where we hypothetically got this instead and that would've been really great to see because looking back on SW games there's a really discernible lack of women leads especially outside of the obscure titles.
 

RecLib

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,365
I was never really saw sly cooper for myself, but I was very aware of it having existed from being in online gamer circles like Era. Its interesting to note with games how pretty overt sexism is never a recognized part of what they were. How I'd never seen this mentioned before now.
 

Scrappy-Fan92

Member
Jan 14, 2021
8,924
The Sly Cooper games have always had some weird stuff, mostly but not exclusively with Carmelita. From what little I've seen of the game, Thieves in Time doubled down on it in some respects (see Carmelita's redesign), but the issues were there from the start. I definitely didn't remember the weird newspaper headlines until I watched SnapCube's fan dub of the first game earlier this year.
 
Oct 27, 2017
39,148
Been a while since I played Sly but I would argue most of the sexualization was missed by most cause they probably played it as kids (I know I did).

Now Sly 4 which came years after... That's a game that is constantly talked about when it comes to that topic. Well that and the awful story.
 

RecLib

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,365
Saw this pointed out in a very chud heavy subreddit, but the main thing being pointed out still stands.
You know that blizzard artwork they removed from even the classic wow servers?

This one:
m5m7sp9DAvb52GStWrN5pV-970-80.jpg
\

Turns out its kind of hard to dial back sexism in your game by editing some artwork when it is hard designed into so many of the armor/clothing options and the npcs. Case in point...
mw6t1f3dtwo71.png


Oh whoops. Literally the exact same model as in the painting is an npc still walking around in the game.
 

BossAttack

Member
Oct 27, 2017
43,036


I can't complain a whole lot, but that little struggle exposure is out of place. Also not the biggest fan of the skin tight pants tbh.


Me starting to watch: *sigh* what bullshit am I going to see now?

Me a quarter way: yep, what I expect.

Me half-way: YO WTF?! This is Bloodborne?!?!?

Was planning on replaying Fallen Order soon and decided to look up mods and uh...


279-1607815805-1770562145.png



realitycanbewhateveriwant.gif

I love the actor, story, and all that but there's a timeline out there where we hypothetically got this instead and that would've been really great to see because looking back on SW games there's a really discernible lack of women leads especially outside of the obscure titles.

Anything else would've been better than boring Cal we got. I personally use the Mandalorian mod to hide his stupid face.
 

timedesk

Member
Oct 27, 2017
4,937
Was planning on replaying Fallen Order soon and decided to look up mods and uh...

znU2Qmr.gif

279-1607815805-1770562145.png



realitycanbewhateveriwant.gif

I love the actor, story, and all that but there's a timeline out there where we hypothetically got this instead and that would've been really great to see because looking back on SW games there's a really discernible lack of women leads especially outside of the obscure titles.

Yeah, this just reminds me how bummed I was with Fallen Order's lead. I think the game is solid, but I spent most of the story thinking any of the other three major female characters would have made a more interesting main character. If we get a sequel I hope

Cere and Merrin are playable.

Also yeah, Sly really hasn't aged well as a franchise. A lot of the platformers of that era are pretty bad in regards to their female cast. Jak and Daxter definitely liked to sexualize most if not all of the female characters.
 
Oct 27, 2017
2,852
Columbus, OH
Been re-playing all of the Batman Arkham games, halfway through Arkham Knight and just got to THAT bit (I won't go into detail because it involves suicide) and it's really hard no to notice how much these games have issues with women.

Harley has this in spades throughout the games; I'm not going to de-rail this post by talking about comics but to keep it short, Paul Dini despite her creator is since post the original BTAS (pre-New Batman Adventures) been one of the worse when it comes to writing her. He flanderizes her to an extreme, treats her a joke, constantly has Batman belittle her and KO her in one punch and makes her obsession with Joker her sole thing, all of which is ramped up in the Arkham with an added dose of heavy sexualisation (remember, it's these games fault we can't have in her classic costume anymore).

It's kind of baffling looking back that in a mere 6 years, Harley has gotten WAY more positive treatment in fiction that the Arkham games feel so out of touch in hindsight.

But even outside of Harley, none of the women in the Rocksteady games really get it well, either heavily sexualized, die, kidnapped etc. Out of all the Arkham games, WB Montreal Origins is the best when it comes to this though still not the best. And it's also uncomfortable knowing that while Rocksteady was pulling this, they were also abusing their women employees, something that's sadly been forgotten about.
Even a decade ago it really stuck out to me how much the random enemy barks had NPCs calling Catwoman a bitch. They certainly didn't call Batman an asshole every other line.
 

Toxi

The Fallen
Oct 27, 2017
17,550
Magic: the Gathering also did the "faction of highly honourable people who don't wear armor on their backs" thing like a decade and a half ago with Bant in the plane of Alara and didn't feel the need to use it as an excuse to objectify its warrior women's asses (though it's still not perfect and you'll find some instances of boobplate and so on)

In fact it's probably the only example of the trope (is it common enough to call it one?) I'm aware of that doesn't just use it to feature a lot of ass shots.

[ART EXAMPLES]

Like in general the knights wear capes or cloaks so their backside is entirely obscured, and the mages and rogues and so on who aren't (half) covered in steel are at least wearing something cool looking that fits with the high fantasy look.
Wow, this is cool. I never noticed that about Bant. It's even present in the original style guide for Shards of Alara.

4_02.jpg
 

Deleted member 55524

User requested account closure
Banned
Mar 31, 2019
693
Been re-playing all of the Batman Arkham games, halfway through Arkham Knight and just got to THAT bit (I won't go into detail because it involves suicide) and it's really hard no to notice how much these games have issues with women.

Harley has this in spades throughout the games; I'm not going to de-rail this post by talking about comics but to keep it short, Paul Dini despite her creator is since post the original BTAS (pre-New Batman Adventures) been one of the worse when it comes to writing her. He flanderizes her to an extreme, treats her a joke, constantly has Batman belittle her and KO her in one punch and makes her obsession with Joker her sole thing, all of which is ramped up in the Arkham with an added dose of heavy sexualisation (remember, it's these games fault we can't have in her classic costume anymore).

It's kind of baffling looking back that in a mere 6 years, Harley has gotten WAY more positive treatment in fiction that the Arkham games feel so out of touch in hindsight.

But even outside of Harley, none of the women in the Rocksteady games really get it well, either heavily sexualized, die, kidnapped etc. Out of all the Arkham games, WB Montreal Origins is the best when it comes to this though still not the best. And it's also uncomfortable knowing that while Rocksteady was pulling this, they were also abusing their women employees, something that's sadly been forgotten about.

I finished up Knight recently and Harley and Catwoman were both treated horribly. I rushed thru Catwoman's missions because I thought she would take on a more interesting role once she was free from Riddler (ugh). But then she just...leaves...
 

Rouk'

Member
Jan 10, 2018
8,155
So there's this free third-person zombie shooter called Deathly Stillness: https://store.steampowered.com/app/1727650/Deathly_Stillness/

It's mechanically pretty good and a nice quick easy "pop in, shoot zombies, pop out" experience.

Well I still have it installed and they just added female character models: https://store.steampowered.com/news/app/1727650/view/4941001585207960268


And if you want to see them, click the spoiler.
6c0b5c35173cd202411daa2e0fcb71f28ec6368c.png

Now obviously they're just basic "game dev store" models, but this is just so tiring.
6 survival and 5 sexy, huh
Interesting split considering what I'm seeing. "Survival" can really mean a lot
 

Servbot24

The Fallen
Oct 25, 2017
43,180
Was planning on replaying Fallen Order soon and decided to look up mods and uh...

znU2Qmr.gif

279-1607815805-1770562145.png



realitycanbewhateveriwant.gif

I love the actor, story, and all that but there's a timeline out there where we hypothetically got this instead and that would've been really great to see because looking back on SW games there's a really discernible lack of women leads especially outside of the obscure titles.
I still have not played FO because of how goddamn boring the main character looks
 

grand

Member
Oct 25, 2017
25,045
I was never really saw sly cooper for myself, but I was very aware of it having existed from being in online gamer circles like Era. Its interesting to note with games how pretty overt sexism is never a recognized part of what they were. How I'd never seen this mentioned before now.
A lot of the early 00s' objectification & sexism gets forgotten about since the boys club mentality was accepted as the status quo of gaming (even more so then nowadays). Though it being so blatant even in a supposed kids game says a lot.

Many in this thread were also surprised by all the gross Elder Scrolls lore from that era. It might be worth the time to keep bringing up games from that era to shine a new light on them.

Been a while since I played Sly but I would argue most of the sexualization was missed by most cause they probably played it as kids (I know I did).

Now Sly 4 which came years after... That's a game that is constantly talked about when it comes to that topic. Well that and the awful story.
I imagine another small part of it is how the game is basically an anthropomorphized version of Lupin the 3rd, which also objectifies its sole female character. Doesn't make it any better though

The Sly conversation reminds me of the shitty magazine ad for the first game.



That is such a terrible but unsurprising ad for that time period. 90s/00s print ads were all like that:

 
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Oct 27, 2017
39,148
I imagine another small part of it is how the game is basically an anthropomorphized version of Lupin the 3rd, which also objectifies its sole female character. Doesn't make it any better though
Good point.

The good thing though is is the series do return, it should be better considering Sony is trying to move away from sexualization.
 

ConVito

Member
Oct 16, 2018
3,097
I still have not played FO because of how goddamn boring the main character looks
Maybe it's just because I remember the actor from Malcolm in the Middle so I enjoyed the novelty of seeing him in a Star Wars game, but I never had an issue with Cal as a character (aside from being just a bit boring). Before anybody says anything, I absolutely 100% agree he shouldn't have been cast since this would have been a perfect chance to add more diversity to the franchise. But for what it's worth, it's still a very enjoyable game and his performance is, in my opinion, pretty solid.

(Plus it introduces several much more interesting characters, even if it stumbles a bit on them a few times.)
The Sly conversation reminds me of the shitty magazine ad for the first game.

eoUABYS.png
Thing is, if all it showed was the page on the right, this could have been a much more tasteful and clever ad. The page on the left isn't even all that titillating compared to other ads of the time, but it's still unnecessary and almost feels like the advertising people felt obligated to include some objectification.
 

Paroni

Member
Dec 17, 2020
3,422
The Sly conversation reminds me of the shitty magazine ad for the first game.

eoUABYS.png

It was the same era where game (and computer/tech) magazines regularly had dedicated sections just for photos of booth babes whenever they were covering any industry trade fair/exhibition. "Our only relevant audience are teenager and early 20s boys" sure was their guiding marketing principle both for the magazines and the industry in general.
 

Kinanza

Member
Jun 25, 2018
577
still wild that one of the best female FF designs to date is from the fuckin DS remake of III.

latest
That's actually a really cute outfit

What could inspire some of FFX's fashion?

Again, I feel the need to point this out about Rikku's outfit when you first meet her

442

First time I saw this I was like in junior high or something, I was seriously both intrigued and uncomfortable at the placement of the belts and the fact that the yellow portion of her suit looked like it was her skin to the point where I thought she was almost nude and her nipples are nowhere to be found

Still gets gets me off guard when I look at this, like

What, how can you design this and not think for a moment
 
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